CONSTRUCTION THREAD: Magnolia Park Town Center

[3rdParty]

OK, I am not adding any more items to this discussion, other than this: I was wrong. Due to that county government building and the 1,000 or so highly paid government employees, along with the other retailers already announced or already on the site, Neiman Marcus, Prada, Nordstrom, Tiffany, Cartier, Apple Store, Burberry, Louis Vuitton and the Cheesecake Factory are all coming to Magnolia Park. Oh, or was it the Rooms to Go that's coming that lured those other tenants, or was it the existing Shoe Carnival?

mallguy, what is it you don't understand about a hybrid center? I haven't seen one person say these retailers are going adjacent to Costco or Rooms to Go. In addition, is it really so difficult to believe that some of them would go near the top grossing theater in SC? Aren't theaters frequently found as lifestyle center anchors?

Perhaps you'd like to explain how Greenridge, which has Lowe's Home Improvement as its major anchor and a series of "power center" junior anchors, ended up luring Chang's, Ann Taylor Loft, Chico's, White House/Black Market, Harold's, etc. Kind of pokes a hole in your theory, doesn't it?

I will concede that the majority of those you mentioned above will not end up at Magnolia Park, but then again, they won't be coming to Greenville anytime soon either. However, based on the scuttlebutt I've heard, g-man appears to be a lot closer to the truth than you do.

[mallguy]

3rdParty, I'm not adding anything more to this discussion; just think about the following and you'll see some differences:

1. Where were some of the Greenridge stores you list before they moved to Greenridge?

2. Where were their customers? What other shopping centers could those stores have gone to in order to serve their existing customer base?

3. What stores are owned by the same corporate parents? Where do stores in the same corporate family tend to locate?

4. What are the demographics sought by those stores? (Lexis/Nexis and Internet searches will come up with some precise figures.)

5. For the Magnolia Park stores listed, where do those stores tend to locate? (Go to their websites and look at the shopping centers where they have stores.)

6. What are the demographics sought by those stores?

7. What are the typical co-tenants of those stores?

8. What type of co-tenants are most impacted by movie theaters (retailers or restaurants)?

Edited January 28, 2007 by mallguy

[gs3]

I can say with 100% certainty that Apple and Z Gallerie are in intense negotiations to be in the VILLAGE AREA of this development, NOT the big box end. (From a direct source) For anyone not familiar with this development, it's basically two developments within one....a big box area and an upscale village area.....separate areas.

It's PLAIN SILLY to even bring up Prada and Gucci and Tiffany, etc etc.....Greenville will NEVER see those stores.....at least probably not in our lifetimes.

However, if people don't realize Magnolia is smack in the middle of an excellent demographic, then they don't understand Greenville. Also, if people don't realize that retail has evolved from developing based on high end vs low end to developing based on what companies can pull shoppers vs those that don't pull, then they don't fully understand 2007 retail. Think of all the new developments around the nation that have both Target and Saks Fifth Avenue, or Costco and Bloomingdales. Hmmm, I frequent a mall in Dallas that has an IKEA just steps away from Neimans (and IKEA, while cool, is far, far, far, far, far from high end.....it was developed along the same philosophy as VW's.......for commoners.....cost effective and open to all).

Just a few months ago, people thought Pleasantburg at Laurens was dead, and suddenly, wow, Fresh Market is building a new store at that location! Greenville is full of surprises!

[g-man430]

The Cheesecake Factory and Ruth's Chris are also in intense negotiations with Magnolia Park Town Center. For proof that Ruth's Chris is coming to Greenville, read this: http://www.ruthschris.com/news/details.php?id=60

Edited January 29, 2007 by g-man430

[mallguy]

The Cheesecake Factory and Ruth's Chris are also in intense negotiations with Magnolia Park Town Center. For proof that Ruth's Chris is coming to Greenville, read this: http://www.ruthschris.com/news/details.php?id=60

The Ruth's Chris was announced on Urban Planet a while ago and there are already posts about it; the chain was looking at sites around Verdae Boulevard.

There is a Ruth's Chris in Greensboro. I like the chain fine, but it's not as picky in terms of demographics as the Apple Store.

[g-man430]

^^^Correct, but the Greenville News in an article last year said that they were looking at sites not only in Verdae, but also along Woodruff Road too.

Edited January 29, 2007 by g-man430

[Version70-8]

I can say with 100% certainty that Apple and Z Gallerie are in intense negotiations to be in the VILLAGE AREA of this development, NOT the big box end. (From a direct source) For anyone not familiar with this development, it's basically two developments within one....a big box area and an upscale village area.....separate areas.

It's PLAIN SILLY to even bring up Prada and Gucci and Tiffany, etc etc.....Greenville will NEVER see those stores.....at least probably not in our lifetimes.

However, if people don't realize Magnolia is smack in the middle of an excellent demographic, then they don't understand Greenville. Also, if people don't realize that retail has evolved from developing based on high end vs low end to developing based on what companies can pull shoppers vs those that don't pull, then they don't fully understand 2007 retail. Think of all the new developments around the nation that have both Target and Saks Fifth Avenue, or Costco and Bloomingdales. Hmmm, I frequent a mall in Dallas that has an IKEA just steps away from Neimans (and IKEA, while cool, is far, far, far, far, far from high end.....it was developed along the same philosophy as VW's.......for commoners.....cost effective and open to all).

Just a few months ago, people thought Pleasantburg at Laurens was dead, and suddenly, wow, Fresh Market is building a new store at that location! Greenville is full of surprises!

I agree. Despite what most people believe, Greenville is a very attractive area for retailers with an ever-growing level of spending capability. Having worked in retail for over 10 years, in both Greenville and Charlotte, I can vouch for the fact that several of the stores at Haywood are some of the best performing and/or one of the higher volume locations for their respective companies nationwide. This area's retail image has really exploded (positively) within the past 10 or so years due in large part to the influx of foreign companies relocating here.

From what I can remember (and I may be wrong about this?), at one time, if not still to this day, both Gap and Abercrombie & Fitch over at Haywood recorded annual sales of $5+ million, which in the world of retail is a very nice figure for that type/size of store, especially being in Greenville, SC. Also, for what it's worth, the Aerie (by American Eagle) was the very first freestanding location opened in the US...so Greenville's retail industry must be doing something right.

SO...I really think that with the significant changes going on in the retail world (ie. going away from traditional enclosed malls and more toward "lifestyle centers") that we cannot assume anything anymore in regards to what stores may open in this market. Honestly, who can say that 5 or so years ago they would have honestly imagined Greenville having a PF Changs, or being rumored to be landing The Cheesecake Factory, an Apple Store, or a Ruth's restaurant among others?

[Greenville]

I agree. Despite what most people believe, Greenville is a very attractive area for retailers with an ever-growing level of spending capability. Having worked in retail for over 10 years, in both Greenville and Charlotte, I can vouch for the fact that several of the stores at Haywood are some of the best performing and/or one of the higher volume locations for their respective companies nationwide. This area's retail image has really exploded (positively) within the past 10 or so years due in large part to the influx of foreign companies relocating here.

From what I can remember (and I may be wrong about this?), at one time, if not still to this day, both Gap and Abercrombie & Fitch over at Haywood recorded annual sales of $5+ million, which in the world of retail is a very nice figure for that type/size of store, especially being in Greenville, SC. Also, for what it's worth, the Aerie (by American Eagle) was the very first freestanding location opened in the US...so Greenville's retail industry must be doing something right.

SO...I really think that with the significant changes going on in the retail world (ie. going away from traditional enclosed malls and more toward "lifestyle centers") that we cannot assume anything anymore in regards to what stores may open in this market. Honestly, who can say that 5 or so years ago they would have honestly imagined Greenville having a PF Changs, or being rumored to be landing The Cheesecake Factory, an Apple Store, or a Ruth's restaurant among others?

Very well said, and I agree with you. I remember a Greenville News article within the last 4 or 5 years which stated that Greenville did not yet have the demographics to support a Ruth's Chris Steakhouse. Now, only a few years later, they are very eager to enter the Greenville market. I think that is so cool, and says a lot about Greenville's growth.

[gs3]

The demolition of Greenville Mall is moving right along:

[g-man430]

Great pics, gsupstate. Can you put them in color though? Also, the two story building you see in the first, second, and third pic that is being demolished is the back of the old Palmetto Home and Garden building.

Edited February 4, 2007 by g-man430

[Version70-8]

I am getting a very strong feeling that there will not be a Bass Pro Shops or Cabela's at Magnolia, BUT there might be an Orvis opening, which basically fills the same retail niche that both Bass and Cabela's would offer, to a certain degree. The nearest Orvis locations to Greenville are ones in Atlanta and Raleigh.

I also have a reallly strong feeling that a Sephora store, a Lucky Brand store, a Delia's store, a Sur La Table store, a Tommy Bahama store, and maybe even a Steve Madden store will be joining the mix possibly?

Why I have these sudden hunches beats me!?

[Version70-8]

One more thing...

IMO...a Trader Joe's would fit nicely into the development too! Hmmm?

[gs3]

I am getting a very strong feeling that there will not be a Bass Pro Shops or Cabela's at Magnolia, BUT there might be an Orvis opening, which basically fills the same retail niche that both Bass and Cabela's would offer, to a certain degree. The nearest Orvis locations to Greenville are ones in Atlanta and Raleigh.

I also have a reallly strong feeling that a Sephora store, a Lucky Brand store, a Delia's store, a Sur La Table store, a Tommy Bahama store, and maybe even a Steve Madden store will be joining the mix possibly?

Why I have these sudden hunches beats me!?

Insider information?

I had heard the possibility of Lucky Brand. Steve Madden is really growing, so that makes sense and the Tommy Bahama brand at Belk Haywood is in the top 4 or 5 for Belk stores within the entire company. Haven't heard about Sephora or Sur La Table, but both would be very welcomed additions!!!

[greenvilleguy]

Sephora recently sign a contract with JC Penney to open over 1000 "shops within a shop" inside JC Penney stores. Currently there are only about 34 stand-alone mall locations nationwide (if I read correctly) Since the JC Penney at Haywood is undergoing a complete store remodel which will most likely include one of these Sephora shops, do you think they will also locate 5 min away at Magnolia? I hope they do and the other stores you mentioned do to create the upscale shopping environment where the old Greenville Mall failed...Did you get responses from the other stores you mentioned??? That would be awesome!

[btoy]

I think it is pretty much a fact that their will not be a Cabela's or a Bas Pro Shop at Magnolia Park. There will be a Starbucks However.

[erm1981]

Wow another starbucks

[linkerjpatrick]

I think it is pretty much a fact that their will not be a Cabela's or a Bas Pro Shop at Magnolia Park. There will be a Starbucks However.

Well, that's pretty much a given. I heard they might even put one in the cul-de-sac of my neighborhood.

Sephora recently sign a contract with JC Penney to open over 1000 "shops within a shop" inside JC Penney stores. Currently there are only about 34 stand-alone mall locations nationwide (if I read correctly) Since the JC Penney at Haywood is undergoing a complete store remodel which will most likely include one of these Sephora shops, do you think they will also locate 5 min away at Magnolia? I hope they do and the other stores you mentioned do to create the upscale shopping environment where the old Greenville Mall failed...Did you get responses from the other stores you mentioned??? That would be awesome!

J.C. Penny is going to do a remodel huh? I wonder if it will actually look different this time.

[GvilleSC]

Well, that's pretty much a given. I heard they might even put one in the cul-de-sac of my neighborhood.

That's interesting. Either we live in the same neighborhood, or Greenville is getting TWO BASS PROSHOPS!

[crescentmoon]

That's interesting. Either we live in the same neighborhood, or Greenville is getting TWO BASS PROSHOPS!

I'm pretty sure he was referring to a Starbucks :-)

[Version70-8]

Sephora recently sign a contract with JC Penney to open over 1000 "shops within a shop" inside JC Penney stores. Currently there are only about 34 stand-alone mall locations nationwide (if I read correctly) Since the JC Penney at Haywood is undergoing a complete store remodel which will most likely include one of these Sephora shops, do you think they will also locate 5 min away at Magnolia? I hope they do and the other stores you mentioned do to create the upscale shopping environment where the old Greenville Mall failed...Did you get responses from the other stores you mentioned??? That would be awesome!

Yeah, I could see them opening both. At Southpark in Charlotte, the Belk store has a Kiehls "shop-within-a-shop" despite their being a free-standing Kiehls store right down the street.

[gs3]

Yeah, I could see them opening both. At Southpark in Charlotte, the Belk store has a Kiehls "shop-within-a-shop" despite their being a free-standing Kiehls store right down the street.

Now that would be great......either Kiehls or Fresh open a store at Magnolia. Dreaming here I know.....it wouldn't happen.

[g-man430]

I am getting a very strong feeling that there will not be a Bass Pro Shops or Cabela's at Magnolia, BUT there might be an Orvis opening, which basically fills the same retail niche that both Bass and Cabela's would offer, to a certain degree. The nearest Orvis locations to Greenville are ones in Atlanta and Raleigh.

I also have a reallly strong feeling that a Sephora store, a Lucky Brand store, a Delia's store, a Sur La Table store, a Tommy Bahama store, and maybe even a Steve Madden store will be joining the mix possibly?

Why I have these sudden hunches beats me!?

I have never heard of any of these stores except for BPS and Cabela's. Who are they?

Edited February 6, 2007 by g-man430

[goodbye]

Never heard of Orvis? Wow.

The rest are fairly standard in a development like Magnolia Park Town Center.

[g-man430]

^^^I looked at Orvis's website and I was suprised i've never heard of them either, seeing how I love the outdoors like fishing and hiking and I go on vacation a lot.

[mallguy]

I have never heard of any of these stores except for BPS and Caleba's. Who are they?

All of them are at SouthPark Mall in Charlotte.

I don't consider Steve Madden and Sephora upscale, and I've never shopped at Delia's, but the others are upscale and would thus be in upscale shopping centers, generally.