Nashville as MLB Expansion/Relocation Market

[tragenvol]

These flew under our radar for the most part; Smartitechts:  please tell us again why First Horizon could or could not be expanded for MLB at Sulphur Dell.  I just can't see the Brewers leaving Milwaukee.

https://sportsnaut.com/milwaukee-brewers-relocation-cities/

https://sportsnaut.com/milwaukee-brewers-start-moving-process/

Edited August 15, 2023 by tragenvol

[nashville born]

19 minutes ago, tragenvol said:

These flew under our radar for the most part; Smartitechts:  please tell us again why First Horizon could or could not be expanded for MLB at Sulphur Dell.  I just can't see the Brewers leaving Milwaukee.

https://sportsnaut.com/milwaukee-brewers-relocation-cities/

https://sportsnaut.com/milwaukee-brewers-start-moving-process/

What is the shelf life for a stadium these days?  I feel like Miller Park or whatever it's called now wasn't built that long ago (relatively speaking).  Yet, I guess capabilities and revenue generating characteristics certainly could have changed.   Who knows anymore.  I hope Nashville gets an expansion club and not a transfer.

[Skyscrapergeek]

Could change the name to Craft Brewers IF they moved here. Nyuck Nyuck 

[smeagolsfree]

White Sox consider Nashville.

 

https://www.thetelegraph.com/news/article/chicago-white-sox-move-nashville-18309807.php#

 

[markhollin]

NRB with coverage of the Chicago White Sox announcement that Nashville may be a possible relocation option:

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2023/08/23/craings-chicago-white-sox-nashville-relocation.html

[Tim29tn]

I hope the White Sox relocation happens and they keep the name. That’s a very historical team and no offense to the Stars name because I love what they were trying to represent, but that’s a horrible basic name for a franchise. 

[tragenvol]

Yeah...stop playing second fiddle in Chicago!  Pardon the pun.

[bnacincy]

 

Stars is I believe a perfect name for Nashville's team. Not only because of the historical legacy but also because of the "stars" of the music industry residing in Nashville and the fact that the Tri Star flag represents all of Tennessee which an MLB team in Nashville would as well.

It's perfect. The White Sox have been in Chicago for too long and the name would always be associated with Chicago-the White Sox have been in Chicago for 123 years whereas the Dodgers were in Brooklyn for 73 years and have been in LA for almost as long so there is really no comparison.   A  professional team in Nashville needs to represent Nashville and Tennessee in general and it's name should reflect that. That's why I'm glad the Oilers became the Titans.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             

 Now if they would just get rid of the Oiler Columbia blue! Personally I would like to see the Titans adopt the Navy Blue and Gold colors like the Predators have and which are also the colors of Nashville's flag.                                                          

Edited August 23, 2023 by bnacincy
Content

[Teejr2824]

Is there any way First Horizon Park can be renovated? If answer already my bad. 

[Bark At The Sun]

I like the idea of the White Sox moving here, and keeping the name..........grew up watching the Knoxville Sox back in 70's at Bill Meyer Stadium and always loved the uniforms, colors.     Moving the White Sox here, the A's to Vegas and the Rays to Charlotte would (geographically) keep the teams in their current Divisions.   I know a lot of people like the idea of the Stars name, but MLB does not need expansion.    If they need a place to play for a few years until they get a stadium deal, let them play in Nissan Stadium until that gets done.

[henburg]

The current White Sox stadium lease does not expire until 6 years from now I believe, so there's a bit of time before something like this could even become reality. It still feels like a pretty textbook ploy from ownership for receiving public funds to support a new stadium development to me, but I also feel we've clearly become the number 1 choice on MLB's radar with the Las Vegas A's seemingly becoming a done deal.

Edited August 24, 2023 by henburg

[Argo]

1 hour ago, Bark At The Sun said:

I like the idea of the White Sox moving here, and keeping the name..........grew up watching the Knoxville Sox back in 70's at Bill Meyer Stadium and always loved the uniforms, colors.     Moving the White Sox here, the A's to Vegas and the Rays to Charlotte would (geographically) keep the teams in their current Divisions.   I know a lot of people like the idea of the Stars name, but MLB does not need expansion.    If they need a place to play for a few years until they get a stadium deal, let them play in Nissan Stadium until that gets done.

Naahh. Baseball probably wouldn't work in Charlotte. It doesn't have the drip like Nashville or Vegas.

Edited August 24, 2023 by Argo

[smeagolsfree]

11 hours ago, Teejr2824 said:

Is there any way First Horizon Park can be renovated? If answer already my bad. 

I think some of the guys have tried to answer this before with some mockups of the current stadium. It is way back in this thread or another one. In a word it would be difficult not to mention the ownership issues.

I also think all of the different entities involved in a future MLB team will make things quite complicated. I will guarantee you one thing, there will not be any Metro money after the soccer stadium and the new Titans stadium.

1 minute ago, Argo said:

Naahh. Baseball probablt wouldn't work in Charlotte. It doesn't the drip like Nashville or Vegas.

To be fair Charlotte is on the radar of MLB and does have a larger population and a larger TV market. They may get a team at the same time as Nashville. I would not count them out of the game. I will say the movement of the Nashville Stars is a lot more organized than anything in Charlotte.

[henburg]

My skepticism with some of these rumors aside, I will say that in regards to a potential stadium, my dream has now become First Horizon Park being renovated and expanded to support MLB as well. It's such a perfect location with the skyline view to the North, the proximity to downtown and the fact that it is already so nicely nestled in the urban neighborhood. Not to mention, it could result in an easier sell to Nashvillians as well due to the chance for reduced costs and infrastructure already being in place for the most part. You would be a bit more landlocked with Brooklyn Bowl, Third & Home, and the new Ballpark Village apartments being constructed around the North & East sides of the stadium, but I believe that there could still be some room for growth as well due to the rather barebones garage that currently sits behind right field and the currently very underutilized State property and parking lots on Rep. John Lewis Way. 

I realize that it would pose some unique challenges, but I guess this vision really originates from when I went to watch a game at Wrigley Field this summer. The surrounding area, the scenery, and the overall community feel of the Ballpark all combined together to create something truly unique and I had some of the most fun I have ever had at a sports game. Not to directly compare Wrigleyville to Germantown, but I think that there are similarities there in the Residential/Retail focus of the area that could really result in a more authentic Nashville experience than simply trying to start from scratch and create something entirely new like the Braves have done.

[Luvemtall]

First off if the White Sox decided to actually make the move to Nashville, wouldn’t the current owners still be ? They would have the resources and necessary capital to build a new stadium or renovate First Horizon, essentially the money component that’s lacking in Nashville’s current bid for MLB . I also believe First Horizon should be the number one contender for a MLB stadium, but understand that might not be possible due to physical limitations or other factors beyond control. If that doesn’t work, then the East Bank should be the second and obvious choice. Having both the new Nissan Stadium/ Entertainment Venue and a new MLB Ballpark sharing a new Neighborhood and supporting local businesses pretty much year round, along with a likely future TPAC relocation sounds like a recipe for success! Maybe the burden of building a new stadium shouldn’t fall onto the taxpayers, but what about a deal that utilizes Metro Sports Authority land ( current Nissan Stadium) leased to the baseball ownership and part of the overall revenue stream to offset the cost of building a the new Nissan Stadium and surrounding development. Any move to relocate the Sox wouldn’t be until after 2029 , so that gives about 2 1/2 years to build ballpark after the new Nissan ( or whatever its called) opens. Win, win situation.

[PruneTracy]

10 minutes ago, Luvemtall said:

They would have the resources and necessary capital to build a new stadium or renovate First Horizon, essentially the money component that’s lacking in Nashville’s current bid for MLB [...] Maybe the burden of building a new stadium shouldn’t fall onto the taxpayers

The reason all of these teams are threatening relocation is because they are not getting enough public money for new/renovated stadiums in their current locations. Whether or not they have the money to do so themselves is irrelevant; they want to be subsidized and believe they can negotiate their way into subsidies by putting relocation on the table.

If at any point they become serious about making the move, it will be because Metro and/or the state are offering them significant incentives to relocate. So the question that settles the possibility of a current team relocating to Nashville is: should Metro and/or the state provide these incentives and are they in a position to after providing the same for MLS, the NFL, et al.?

[Bos2Nash]

I support the Stars ownership looking at TSU, but I have been saying from the get-go that First Horizon should be the priority location. If Metro/State were to get involved with luring a relocation here, I would think (at from a Metro standpoint) utilizing First Horizon should be a stipulation of getting any bond funding from the city.

That being said, I agree entirely with PruneTracy about it is not about the ownership having money, it is about how much upfront funding can a group get from a municipality to reduce their risk for building/renovating a facility. On top of that, venue developers now know there is precedent in Metro to get something more to "sweeten" the deal in order to cover said bond financing. You either have to be a revenue power house (ie NFL), or get something in return to profit off of (ie 10-acres of land to develop). While MLB have improved their numbers this year, I presume they aren't close to the NFL in terms of revenue so they will be looking for something in return to cover any debt service. First Horizon really doesn't have anything around it to do that. East Bank has land, but that land is way to valuable to "give away" like that. TSU has a bunch of promise. 

[CandyAisles]

14 hours ago, Teejr2824 said:

Is there any way First Horizon Park can be renovated? If answer already my bad. 

Have to buy out the lease and the ballpark so someone would have to pay for it twice.  Not likely.

[Luvemtall]

There always needs to be “ Something in it” to  entice a perspective objective. Even the likes of Amazon and Oracle need enticing. That’s just business, and Municipalities are in fact businesses. Their capital and income are just called taxes, which is a word that nobody can conceivably understand is just the same as all other forms of expenditure. Don’t say raising taxes that’s a forbidden omen , but paying a little more for that car or house you really want or spending a little extra on those vacations is not an issue. Just saying for discussion sake, relocating a baseball team or any other business to be exact takes a good amount of subsidizing and incentivizing being used either voluntarily or through other sources such as Tiffs, Pilots , hotel and/or tourist taxes etc. I wasn’t implying that there’s any chance that even a billionaire would come and build anything without Metro or the State making some sort of deal to bring something to the table. Just was thinking out loud , that it would be possible to look at different options for a potential ballpark in Nashville without having to dip per se into the taxpayers wallet. But yes there Will always be incentives.

[samsonh]

1 hour ago, Bos2Nash said:

I support the Stars ownership looking at TSU, but I have been saying from the get-go that First Horizon should be the priority location. If Metro/State were to get involved with luring a relocation here, I would think (at from a Metro standpoint) utilizing First Horizon should be a stipulation of getting any bond funding from the city.

That being said, I agree entirely with PruneTracy about it is not about the ownership having money, it is about how much upfront funding can a group get from a municipality to reduce their risk for building/renovating a facility. On top of that, venue developers now know there is precedent in Metro to get something more to "sweeten" the deal in order to cover said bond financing. You either have to be a revenue power house (ie NFL), or get something in return to profit off of (ie 10-acres of land to develop). While MLB have improved their numbers this year, I presume they aren't close to the NFL in terms of revenue so they will be looking for something in return to cover any debt service. First Horizon really doesn't have anything around it to do that. East Bank has land, but that land is way to valuable to "give away" like that. TSU has a bunch of promise. 

First Horizon is already doing that for the Sounds stadium with TIF

[Andy20]

I would expect a 0% chance for Nashville to get a baseball team/stadium if and when Freddie becomes mayor.

Edited August 24, 2023 by Andy20

[go_outside]

As long as Metro or the State of Tennessee don't have to subsidize a new stadium, I welcome any team that wants to relocate here and build their own stadium (or use an existing stadium).

[Luvemtall]

1 hour ago, Andy20 said:

I would expect a 0% chance for Nashville to get a baseball team/stadium if and when Freddie becomes mayor.

Maybe it would be time for any perspective ballpark and/ or entertainment complex , to look into the options that other counties might have to offer. Metro isn’t the only choice they have, Wilson is only a stones throw away from BNA . And Rutherford isn’t out of contention having the second largest city in the MSA and growing at a good pace. 

Just now, Luvemtall said:

Maybe it would be time for any perspective ballpark and/ or entertainment complex , to look into the options that other counties might have to offer. Metro isn’t the only choice they have, Wilson is only a stones throw away from BNA . And Rutherford isn’t out of contention having the second largest city in the MSA and growing at a good pace. 

The Atlanta Braves don’t play in city or county limits, it’s not a requirement 

[Flatrock]

36 minutes ago, Luvemtall said:

The Atlanta Braves don’t play in city or county limits, it’s not a requirement

True, but Truist is only 10 miles from Midtown Atlanta and surrounded by densely populated areas in every direction.  It is for all practical purposes smack dab in the middle of a 6 million population metro. VERY different from a Wilson County or a (God forbid) Murfreesboro locale. Most people I know avoid I-24 between Nashville and the Boro like the plague, if they can. 

[Luvemtall]

Have you ever been on an Atlanta highway during peak hours, no different than 1-24 or any highway in or out of Nashville. And don’t know if you’re old enough to remember, but Atlanta wasn’t always the populace it is now. There was a time it wasn’t much more than what Knoxville is today. Times change and growth of the Nashville ring counties is taking place , just as Cobb County did a decade or so ago