The Good News Report

[carolinagarnet]

The most attractive options in terms of talent are probably Washington and Southern California- both of which force Boeing to deal with unions. In my opinion, Huntsville, Alabama has the most compelling case. The NASA facility there attracts top aeronautical engineering talent from across the country (I believe it has the highest percentage of PhDs nationally) and given federal budget cuts, Boeing would probably be able to pick off some top talent from the facility there.

 

As was shown by the Hyundai and Mercedes deals, Alabama is more than willing to throw the kitchen sink at incentives. North Carolina's political climate may prevent it from truly competing in the bidding war that is likely to commence as the state is not as desperate as Alabama and South Carolina to land jobs at any cost.

[atlrvr]

^  I don't know about how these plants operate, but I believe they don't have a ton of engineers on-site.  Mostly machinist, welders, etc.

 

Though I agree that North Carolina might not have the best incentive structures, I do think they are going to want to be near a major metro for just large laborforce purposes.  My guess is this ends up in St. Louis, but if NC can compete with incentives, I think Charlotte could move into top 3 contenders.

[carolinagarnet]

Whichever state wins this is probably going to get more than just the assembly. North Charleston won the Dreamliner assembly as well as an IT center relocation and in time, it may get a few more administrative functions. Washington is very expensive and like many other companies, Boeing seems to be looking for ways to move its back office functions to lower cost environments. The incentive deals seem to be the method they are using to subsidize these moves and avoid greater scrutiny from the Washington unions. One thing is for sure: this is going to be a very expensive deal.

[cltbwimob]

nice big ole' plot of land just west of the airport. could also change gaston county's fortunes. 

 

hell, we'll even throw in a garden parkway

I was thinking that too...I am no fan of the Garden Parkway, but I think a plant such as this may very well justify the Garden Parkway.  Given the potential to land a Boeing plant, I think the Garden Parkway  (along with the hypothetical Asheville-Charlotte-Wilmington interstate) would actually help our case...if they existed.

 

Also, it's a shame Billy Graham isn't a full fledged freeway.  It is almost a freeway, but the few traffic lights and driveways that do exist along the road hinder us from being able to market it as such.

[15895]

How annoying... Greensboro also wants the Boeing plant...

http://m.bizjournals.com/triad/blog/2013/12/hoffman-confirms-triad-in-the-running.html?r=full

No wonder the state is being mum on this issue. It'd be annoying if we lost this because we can't get support from the state because of Greensboro....

"Mayor: Greensboro will 'aggressively' pursue Boeing"

http://m.bizjournals.com/triad/blog/2013/12/greensboro-officials-to-submit-boeing.html?r=full

Edited December 6, 2013 by AirNostrumMAD

[kermit]

^ There is no way that NC will outbid SC's $1.5 billion.

The Transpark is a joke, that will never happen due to poor interstate access, poorer rail access and horrendous labor supply.

Greensboro won't happen since it is more than 1 day from Charleston by rail (plus poor rail connections to the airport area) and a mediocre labor supply (no Siemans to train skilled machinists). Charlotte will have daily trans from the port of Charleston and Savannah thanks to the NS intermodal terminal.

Edited December 6, 2013 by kermit

[nowensone]

Wow, trying to back up a distance here, after all of the math I'm left with the feeling Boeing should both go to hell, and, they could be a major transformative factor, unknowingly, for any number of regions with this proposal.  Unknowingly because they are targeting cheap and somewhat desperate areas that after a decade of infrastructure buildup may mean they are trapped, and ultimately means relocation, unwittingly perhaps as the airline industry tightens yet again due to future travel/resource trends.  My only leg to stand on here is a human resource standpoint, and the Alabama one wins in my estimation, but, if CLT, or I shudder, GSO, somehow grabs this, these will be interesting times.  Our GOP legislature will completely bend over I think, forget our past history, party lines, budget concerns, etc., they will fight hard for this.  I hope CLT gets it, or, I hope Boeing is only forcing capitulation of the labor union and no news at the end of it all, live to fight another day.

 

I guess that airplane on [some of] our license plates has to mean something, or else be irrelevant.

[tozmervo]

^ There is no way that NC will outbid SC's $1.5 billion.

The Transpark is a joke, that will never happen due to poor interstate access, poorer rail access and horrendous labor supply.

Greensboro won't happen since it is more than 1 day from Charleston by rail and a mediocre labor supply (no Siemans). Charlotte will have daily trans from the port of Charleston and Savannah thanks to the NS intermodal terminal.

What's the transpark?

[kermit]

Its an airport oriented economic development node in Kinston NC. It has been mentioned as a possible location in several of the articles about Boeing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_TransPark. (Please dont tell anyone I linked to a wiki source)

It is (and always has been) a boondoggle.

Edited December 6, 2013 by kermit

[carolinagarnet]

kermit, where did you get $1.5B for SC? I haven't seen any numbers reported and a Reuters article I just read said they wouldn't reveal it publicly. I know Missouri authorized $1.7B incentive package and it wouldn't surprise me if Haley pushed for at least a matching package given how desperate she is for jobs. The Observer article today mentions the lack of coordination between the remaining regional and the new statewide economic development agencies hampering NC's chances for a successful bid. The fact that Greensboro and the Transpark are bidding is pretty telling in my opinion.

[kermit]

The number was from the traid business journal linked to by airnost on the previous page.

http://m.bizjournals.com/triad/blog/2013/12/greensboro-officials-to-submit-boeing.html?r=full

I agree that NC has taken itself out of the running by allowing three separate bids. I suspect that Commerce will have to throw its weight behind the Transpark bid since it is in a less developed region and favoring Charlotte above the east is a political non-starter. Unfortunately that bid will (IMO) certainly fail for the previously discussed reasons.

Its all academic, the state will never outbid SC or Missouri at the dollar amounts being discussed.

[cltbwimob]

The number was from the traid business journal linked to by airnost on the previous page.

http://m.bizjournals.com/triad/blog/2013/12/greensboro-officials-to-submit-boeing.html?r=full

I agree that NC has taken itself out of the running by allowing three separate bids. I suspect that Commerce will have to throw its weight behind the Transpark bid since it is in a less developed region and favoring Charlotte above the east is a political non-starter. Unfortunately that bid will (IMO) certainly fail for the previously discussed reasons.

Its all academic, the state will never outbid SC or Missouri at the dollar amounts being discussed.

That may not be entirely NC's fault...apparently Boeing sent an RFP to both the Triad and Charlotte. I doubt such a proposal was sent to NC GTP. Aside from runway length, and available land, GTP fails to meet much of the prerequisites for Boeing such as a major international airport, major highways, labor pool, etc.

Unfortunately for all sites in NC, proximity to a major seaport was a bonus listed in the RFP which none of the NC sites have. However, if Boeing were to build in Charlotte, lack of a seaport may necessitate that all production, including wing production and final assembly, take place on site due to the inherent difficulties in shipping the 114ft wing sections to or from Charlotte over land.

My guess is that the wing gets built in Charleston or Long Beach and final assembly is handled in Everret.

Edited December 6, 2013 by cltbwimob

[kermit]

The Seattle Times has a story on the 777X plant. The article has a bit of elaboration on site requirements and some interesting employment projections for the plant:

 

 

According to the Boeing documents, a site winning all the 777X work will gain 8,500 direct jobs at peak production in 2024. That would include 800 engineers, 6,750 production workers and 950 administrative and support personnel.

 

Its interesting that they do not list Charlotte in the list of top contenders for the plant (but it does cite the Observer article from yesterday as a source)

[Niner National]

Seems like location would matter to the company though beyond just what is given to them. Can you get engineers that would want to live in a place like Kinston, NC?

 

 

Most of the other locations I understand and I doubt they'd be hard to draw talent to, but living in Kinston....blech. Terrible.

[tozmervo]

Never underestimate the draw of Mother Earth Brewing

[Missmylab4]

Kinston is the least likely place of all in contention to get this. No way Boeing goes there. It's pure absurdity to even discuss it. No talent would want to go there. Ill be even more sick I voted for McCrory if they waste time trying to convince Boeing to go to Kinston over Charlotte. Just to appease the rural vote. Complete boondoggle!!!

[cityboi]

I dont see see NC at all in the national media reports. If Boeing comes to NC whether its Charlotte, Greensboro or Kinston, it would be the biggest economic manufacturing project in the state's history. Up to 10,000 workers, 4 million sq ft and a cost of $10 billion dollars. It would be a game changer for the lucky city that gets it. It think it would be between Charlotte and Greensboro in NC. I dont know if the Kinston area has the workforce for a project of this magnitude and there is poor highway connection. Both Charlotte and Greensboro have a major aviation cluster, plenty of land near their airports, good rail connection and good highway connections. Boeing has sent out RFPs to Charlotte, Greensboro and Kinston which is why these areas are aggressively trying to lure Boeing

Edited December 6, 2013 by cityboi

[kermit]

Kinston may not be in the running after all:

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/news/2013/12/06/why-isnt-the-global-transpark-on.html?ana=e_du_pap&s=article_du&ed=2013-12-06

[atlrvr]

While not 8-10k jobs, or $10b in investment, this is a nice win.

 

http://www.winchesterstar.com/article/120613rm

 

Rubbermaid Commercial Products announced Friday that it is moving its headquarters to Huntersville, N.C., a change that will result in the relocation of approximately 65 jobs...David Doolittle, a spokesman for Newell Rubbermaid, said the jobs being transferred primarily are in marketing, research and development, finance, sourcing and planning.

 

 

These jobs are currently at their factory in Winchester, VA.  They are moving them to the Irwin Tool headquarters already located in Hunterville.  Both companies are subsidiaries of Newell Rubbermaid.

[cityboi]

People forget that there will be additional jobs. Think of all the suppliers that would set up near Boeing. This is huge and you can see why cities will do anything to get Boeing. Boeing has contacted both Charlotte and Greensboro officials but from what I understand, some cities that have not been contacted are still putting in bids. I'm curious as to why Raleigh/Durham is not jumping into the game. Does RDU have enough land near its airport?

 

I agree Kinston is not likely. I doubt Boeing is going to put such a facility in a low populated area like that. Will 10,000 "qualified" workers drive to Kinston? The closest big city is Raleigh and thats still a good haul. A large pool of workers for this type of facility can only be found in a populated area. The transpark was a huge mistake and the biggest economic blunder in our state's history. Putting the global transpark in Kinston is like building a 1,000 room convention hotel in the middle of Albemarle.

Edited December 7, 2013 by cityboi

[Missmylab4]

I don't think NC is really in the running with our economic development teams influx and the GOP led state which dislikes incentives. I feel like we won't really be able to give it a real shot at this time.

My guess is Everett or Missouri

[southslider]

Missouri had McDonnell Douglas before Boeing bought them. Not sure if their Boeing plant is still operating. The St Louis airport also has excess capacity since American took over TWA. Obviously, Seattle has the labor force, as Boeing used to be headquartered there and still has plants there.

[cltbwimob]

Not nearly as sexy as an 8500 job Boeing assembly line, but jobs none the less...

Red Ventures is opening a Charlotte office and hiring an additional 200.

Kerr America will open a new textile plant in Indian Land and add 500 workers as well as a NA HQ.

[kickazzz2000]

Not nearly as sexy as an 8500 job Boeing assembly line, but jobs none the less...

Red Ventures is opening a Charlotte office and hiring an additional 200.

Kerr America will open a new textile plant in Indian Land and add 500 workers as well as a NA HQ.

 

Lol, Red Ventures hires about 200 every 6 months because 190 of the people they hired 6 months ago probably left.

[Niner National]

Lol, Red Ventures hires about 200 every 6 months because 190 of the people they hired 6 months ago probably left.

Or got fired.

 

They've also opened a new office in the University area so they can start to pull employees from different areas. Everyone in South Charlotte/Northern SC at this point has either worked at RV or known someone that has worked there.

 

Hell, I worked here. It was awful.