CONSTRUCTION THREAD: Magnolia Park Town Center

[GvilleSC]

Wish the whole Woodruff road area was more walkable. I live down town and personally would prefer to take the bus to that area and then walk, bike, or ride a tram (driving and parking on Woodruff road is no fun). If their was a series of tram-bike-and walk only sidewalks that connected Magnolia, Verda Greenridge ICAR and a light rail to DT I think that would help this area considerately. What impression a couple of artfully designed pedestrian bridges over I-85 would make (think Falls bridge).

a couple of pedestrian bridges over 85 from Verdae to ICAR/Millenium campus would be amazing and leave quite an impression. Something iconic with a cutting edge design...

[RestedTraveler]

^^I agree with this 100%. Not only would it tie the two developments together more for the pedestrian, but they could also be used to really make a statement to passers-through about Greenville.

Likewise, such a pedestrian bridge being used to tie Magnolia Park Town Center and Greenridge together and another between Greenridge and the Point could be useful. It'll never happen, but imagine how much more improved the walkability of that area would be.

There are a lot of great pedestrian bridges out there in the world and some that aren't so great. I've got a photo pool on flickr dedicated to these structures. Check them out. There are a few in this pool that I wouldn't mind seeing crossing I-85.

Edited July 23, 2006 by RestedTraveler

[mallguy]

Wish the whole Woodruff road area was more walkable. I live down town and personally would prefer to take the bus to that area and then walk, bike, or ride a tram (driving and parking on Woodruff road is no fun). If their was a series of tram-bike-and walk only sidewalks that connected Magnolia, Verda Greenridge ICAR and a light rail to DT I think that would help this area considerately. What impression a couple of artfully designed pedestrian bridges over I-85 would make (think Falls bridge).

I agree. Given how Haywood and then Laurens Roads have been poorly-planned sprawling masses whose traffic jams have been magnified by the impossibility of getting around any way other than by car, I wish local politicians had gotten the Woodruff Road area to be built with grid streets and in a pedestrian-friendly format. I'd guess that a decent amount of the road's traffic consists of people who are driving from one local attraction to another, such as from Greenridge to Whole Foods and then to lunch close by. A lot of that traffic could thus be avoided if people could just walk around the area instead of having to drive from one parking lot to another.

[g-man430]

Here is an email I received from John Cothran of Verdae Development about the possibility of a pedestrian bridge.

Mr. Sharp a pedestrian bridge is not planned at this time. There is an abandoned rail line under I-85 going through Verdae and ICAR what we have been working on having activated in some fashion for transportation between the two and into downtown as well. There will be signage on I-85 to announce your arrival at Verdae. There will be a press conference announcing the details of the first TND lot development Thursday July 27. Thanks for your continued interest in Verdae. John Cothran

Edited July 24, 2006 by g-man430

[Greenville]

This sounds like a GREAT start to our light rail transit plans in Greenville. I think this is very doable, and will realistically happen. This would be a logical first line to be built, and when people saw its value, others could be added as well (e.g., a line from GSP Int'l to downtown).

[tablrock]

u know for all those complaining about this project all i have to say is u sound like a bunch of BRATS. JEEEZ there is just no pleasing some people.

[RestedTraveler]

Can you really blame us for nitpicking though? Think about it for just a moment. This property is located on what is arguably the single most highly visible parcel for both people on I-85 passing through/by and people on I-385. It's right there for all to see. Most of them will never see Downtown Greenville and this will be the impression they're left with. Do we want to present the world with a memorable, lasting impression or do we want ho-hum?

[tablrock]

^^u do make a valid point RT however i'm just thankful were not stuck with a dead mall at this site.

[g-man430]

Can you really blame us for nitpicking though? Think about it for just a moment. This property is located on what is arguably the single most highly visible parcel for both people on I-85 passing through/by and people on I-385. It's right there for all to see. Most of them will never see Downtown Greenville and this will be the impression they're left with. Do we want to present the world with a memorable, lasting impression or do we want ho-hum?

You are absolutely correct. Also, this won't be the only site that will need to leave a good impression on Greenville. You also have CU-ICAR, Millennium Campus, Verdae, South Financial, The Point, Shops at Greenridge, etc that will need to leave a good impression on this city too, even though the Greenville Mall site is probably one of the more if not the most important one, due to its location.

Edited July 24, 2006 by g-man430

[g-man430]

This sounds like a GREAT start to our light rail transit plans in Greenville. I think this is very doable, and will realistically happen. This would be a logical first line to be built, and when people saw its value, others could be added as well (e.g., a line from GSP Int'l to downtown).

I'm wondering if CU-ICAR, Verdae, the city, and other parties will chip in some money to help get this thing started in the next couple of years, seeing how our federal government obviously doesn't have the money right now to pay for this.

[mallguy]

Federal gov't transit spending has increased substantially in recent years- the Bush Administration's yearly plan to kill Amtrak doesn't apply to local mass transit projects. I don't see that local politicians are pushing to get Congressional grants for local transit projects, though.

[g-man430]

Federal gov't transit spending has increased substantially in recent years- the Bush Administration's yearly plan to kill Amtrak doesn't apply to local mass transit projects. I don't see that local politicians are pushing to get Congressional grants for local transit projects, though.

Hopefully with rising gas prices, they'll push harder for more mass transit.

[RestedTraveler]

Are you kidding me? They love those high gas prices! It's more money in their pockets. Unfortunately, don't expect any major support for Mass Transit initiatives until after January, 2009...if even then.

Edited July 24, 2006 by RestedTraveler

[g-man430]

Are you kidding me? They love those high gas prices! It's more money in their pockets. Unfortunately, don't expect any major support for Mass Transit initiatives until after January, 2009...if even then.

The general public doesn't like those high gas prices though. Even though our Congress has their heads so far up their you know where right now, they'll do what the public wants especially after this November, so they can get reelected.

Edited July 24, 2006 by g-man430

[mallguy]

Are you kidding me? They love those high gas prices! It's more money in their pockets. Unfortunately, don't expect any major support for Mass Transit initiatives until after January, 2009...if even then.

I don't get it- look at federal budget figures and mass transit (non-Amtrak) spending has increased significantly in recent years. I'm no fan of Bush's (supported by John McCain) yearly kill-Amtrak crusade, but non-Amtrak mass transit has done OK recently. Clinton didn't do much better, if any better at all, measured in dollars spent.

[Spartan]

Here is an email I received from John Cothran of Verdae Development about the possibility of a pedestrian bridge.

Mr. Sharp a pedestrian bridge is not planned at this time. There is an abandoned rail line under I-85 going through Verdae and ICAR what we have been working on having activated in some fashion for transportation between the two and into downtown as well. There will be signage on I-85 to announce your arrival at Verdae. There will be a press conference announcing the details of the first TND lot development Thursday July 27. Thanks for your continued interest in Verdae. John Cothran

You should post this info in the Greenville Light Rail thread

[g-man430]

I will be sure to do that. Also, on a side note, I have emailed John Cothran of Verdae again to see if he knew when light rail might be implemented into the area.

[btoy]

The Movie Theatre is not being changed either, same goes with Sports Authority.

Thre will be changes to the Theater, the drawings show that some small retail space will be added to its front. And the the Sproting goods store will be changed as well. HAs to be considering its new front is currently in doors.

[g-man430]

Thre will be changes to the Theater, the drawings show that some small retail space will be added to its front. And the the Sproting goods store will be changed as well. HAs to be considering its new front is currently in doors.

Thanks for that info.

[distortedlogic]

Can you really blame us for nitpicking though? Think about it for just a moment. This property is located on what is arguably the single most highly visible parcel for both people on I-85 passing through/by and people on I-385. It's right there for all to see. Most of them will never see Downtown Greenville and this will be the impression they're left with. Do we want to present the world with a memorable, lasting impression or do we want ho-hum?

I wish there were more visibility for some of theses other projects. We all love trees, btu so many line I-85 that you can hardly see any of ICAR, or some of the othr projects going up. I would like to see soem of the trees moved from directly in front of these developments, then have the trees go away from the highway perpendicular to it, so as to create a "hallway" or entrance way through which a passerby could see each development. In the forground could be some well done gardens, fountains, and greenspaces so as not to take the green out og Gville. This would help leave passersby with an impression; of something other than trees and stripmalls.

[mallguy]

I wish there were more visibility for some of theses other projects. We all love trees, btu so many line I-85 that you can hardly see any of ICAR, or some of the othr projects going up. I would like to see soem of the trees moved from directly in front of these developments, then have the trees go away from the highway perpendicular to it, so as to create a "hallway" or entrance way through which a passerby could see each development. In the forground could be some well done gardens, fountains, and greenspaces so as not to take the green out og Gville. This would help leave passersby with an impression; of something other than trees and stripmalls.

Agreed- and Greenville has such a nice downtown and so many nice residential areas...and so many unsightly and inefficiently-developed commercial areas. For once, I'd like to get a nice commercial area done right. No more Pleasantburg Drives or Haywood Roads.

[breed]

A couple comments...

While Magnolia Town Park appears somewhat disjointed, the fact that multi-family is planned to be a component is significant. It begins to create a demand for real pedestrian-oriented amenities. While The Shops at Greenridge is a nice shopping center and it has pedestrian amenities... they are really just tokens. Very few people actually use them for their intended purpose. The Shops at Greenridge is really just a well-dressed big box strip center.

Does anyone know where on the site plan the multi-family space is supposed to be? From the site plans I've seen, it has been conspicuously absent.

For what it's worth though, I think traffic on Woodruff Rd is actually smoother since the completion of Greenridge. There are more lanes... and traffic tends to get backed up in the shopping center, rather than on the roads. Granted, it is still not ideal, but I think it is an improvement.

[btoy]

The Green is the Office Tower

The Blue is the Residential Tower

The Red "P's" are on Parking Decks.

Also, notice from the pciture I uploaded earlier that it appears that there is office or residential above some of the small shop space.

[Greenville]

It sure does look like a lot of surface parking. I guess it's not any worse than what we have now, though, and is to be expected in the 'burbs.

[Spartan]

It is a lot of surface parking, but there will be a lot of green stuff to break it up. Trees for shade, etc.

I really hope that the residential towers works out. But I can't say that I'd want to live in that particular location. That shopping strip would have to be the coolest place I've ever been.