The Edge | 32-Story Mixed Use + SunRail Station [Proposed/Demo Underway]

[popsiclebrandon]

3 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

Maybe I'm the only one who thinks converting this space for long-term residential use is a weird idea. I could understand using the space for micro Airbnb units/short-term rentals, but condos??

Any plans to add balconies? Otherwise, that's a huge con, IMO. Part of the allure of living on the main strip would be its walkability and access to events/parades at one's doorstep, but not having a balcony (even if rarely used) tends to make people feel like trapped/claustrophobic. Will it also include a pool, gym, event space, etc.? These are typical amenities that people expect in downtown apartments/condos. Just not sure if a basic structure w/no amenities will attract very many buyers... unless it's super affordable - then that would change everything lol.

I believe there is already a gym for tenants there so they could expand that. Definitely a lot would needed to be done but I think anything but office space would be smart from a landlord perspective. Lot of companies realizing they don't need to pay for office space anymore after this.

[JFW657]

3 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

Wow, Thiefoncé strikes again.

 

Andy's bringing a master class on rap lyrics to UP! I couldn't resist the opportunity to rag on JFW since he contemplated bringing soy sauce and onion powder to burger places, but I didn't want to delve too deep into my explanation so I just left it at that. But since you brought it up... I always thought the swag in Bey's context of "I have hot sauce in my bag/swag" was more so referring to her creole-country aesthetic/swagger/lifestyle that goes along with bringing condiments out to eat everywhere rather than literally referring to a swag bag. But what do I know, that song is a mess lol.

While I very much appreciate Andy's efforts to explain the context and meaning of the term in question, I have in the process. learned more about rap lyrics and Beyoncé than I ever wanted to know.  

[nite owℓ]

9 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

I thought it was condos, but who knows at this point. They are also creating an amenities deck on the top floor. No pool though. Converting to 192  "residential units" total. Seems a bit desperate to me. 

I think this might have potential as an alternative to a hotel, such as a boutique Airbnb or a really unique hostel, etc., but not long-term residential where people would feel cooped up all day. This is an interesting idea, but they have a few oddities to reconcile first - it will take a non-traditional buyer, someone willing to overlook the quirks if they pursue the condo route. Short-term residents are more willing to overlook annoyances like weird parking configurations, sharing common elements w/complete strangers, etc. than someone who is looking to live there full time. Hopefully there will be plans to address the big blank wall along Church St - maybe add balconies and windows because without any modification interior ambient lighting will be an issue.

7 hours ago, popsiclebrandon said:

I believe there is already a gym for tenants there so they could expand that. Definitely a lot would needed to be done but I think anything but office space would be smart from a landlord perspective. Lot of companies realizing they don't need to pay for office space anymore after this.

I remember you said you were in the market for a condo a while back - would you buy a "luxury" condo in this building at market rate? Or... if it were super affordable (w/no change in luxury finishes), could you see yourself making an exception? Just curious.

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by nite owℓ

[dcluley98]

As said previously, they are renovating the entire building, which includes adding windows  on Church St. Facade as well as an amenities deck on top. The original article and renderings are in OBJ here: https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2018/08/13/downtown-orlando-office-building-to-be-renovated.html

I don't have login anymore so can't get the photos to show you all. 

I had some Baker Barrios renderings of the Re-skin, but am unsure if they are the final design because they are in the middle of pricing and selecting the options proposed. I wouldn't share those anyway as the project is not finalized and I don't know if they would want the options renderings released to the public. Once they finalize the design, I am sure that they will show the exterior renderings to the press. 

Edited April 9, 2020 by dcluley98

[spenser1058]

https://www.google.com/search?q=1960 first national bank at orlando building photo&tbm=isch

[gibby]

40 minutes ago, nite owℓ said:

but not long-term residential where people would feel cooped up all day

Why would they feel cooped up?

[spenser1058]

If you look at the photo of the building before it was integrated into Sun Bank Center in the mid-80’s, the side facing Church Street had that blank wall from the beginning (as I recall walking around in the halls of the upper floors, that makes sense as it was like a series of enclosed warrens not unlike Parker Center in 1960’s “Dragnet”).

In fact, before the bank changed its name in the mid-70’s, the old 1st National logo was on the blank walls up around the 7th or 8th floor.

Anyway, it’s interesting that in the ‘80’s reskin they didn’t address the blank wall (I think the south wall was the same) but 30+ years later they’re going to.

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by spenser1058

[popsiclebrandon]

3 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

I remember you said you were in the market for a condo a while back - would you buy a "luxury" condo in this building at market rate? Or... if it were super affordable (w/no change in luxury finishes), could you see yourself making an exception? Just curious.

You know I probably wouldn't. I wouldn't want to live right there on Orange. I guess it would depend on how they make them. If it was a cool historic building like 1 Orange then I could def be persuaded into it.

[spenser1058]

52 minutes ago, popsiclebrandon said:

You know I probably wouldn't. I wouldn't want to live right there on Orange. I guess it would depend on how they make them. If it was a cool historic building like 1 Orange then I could def be persuaded into it.

The only time I ever seriously considered living west of Rosalind was when they proposed making apartments of the Angebilt (fun fact: the price floated was $1/sf and people were shocked!) Sadly, it wasn’t to be and truthfully, I like Eola better than downtown proper. Especially since the things we thought would happen with the historic district died and haven’t been talked about since the night the bulldozers ran.

Edited April 10, 2020 by spenser1058

[nite owℓ]

21 hours ago, gibby said:

Why would they feel cooped up?

FOMO?

General feedback I've heard in the past from tenants who rented an apartment without a balcony. When I pressed one of the tenants further (since he knew in advance about the lack of a balcony prior to renting), he scrunched his face up and basically said it made him feel cooped up. Might be more of a psychological thing... just knowing that you cannot have access to the outdoors in your home, regardless if you would use the space on a regular basis or not. Personally I would not buy a condo in downtown Orlando without a balcony, would you?

I've also read several articles in the past stating the majority of condo buyers will require a balcony or terrace, even if they live in cold climates (https://www.thestar.com/business/2018/08/19/all-those-unused-condo-balconies-most-of-us-wont-buy-without-them.html). In NYC, one developer explained that most of his buyers required a balcony - despite living in a skyscraper and being too afraid to use them.

 

[spenser1058]

Oliver Douglas had a lovely Manhattan penthouse terrace and STILL felt cooped up:

https://youtu.be/umS3XM3xAPk

 

[gibby]

2 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

Personally I would not buy a condo in downtown Orlando without a balcony, would you?

Yes, of course I would.

[JFW657]

2 hours ago, gibby said:

Yes, of course I would.

I would never live in a really high condo with a balcony.

I don't like the idea of living in a place where I could fall off my patio and end up as sidewalk pizza a couple of hundred feet below.

I think the highest up I'd be willing to live with a balcony would be about 5 floors.

Fifth floor of Reeves House would be nice.

[Jvest55]

On 4/10/2020 at 2:24 PM, nite owℓ said:

FOMO?

General feedback I've heard in the past from tenants who rented an apartment without a balcony. When I pressed one of the tenants further (since he knew in advance about the lack of a balcony prior to renting), he scrunched his face up and basically said it made him feel cooped up. Might be more of a psychological thing... just knowing that you cannot have access to the outdoors in your home, regardless if you would use the space on a regular basis or not. Personally I would not buy a condo in downtown Orlando without a balcony, would you?

I've also read several articles in the past stating the majority of condo buyers will require a balcony or terrace, even if they live in cold climates (https://www.thestar.com/business/2018/08/19/all-those-unused-condo-balconies-most-of-us-wont-buy-without-them.html). In NYC, one developer explained that most of his buyers required a balcony - despite living in a skyscraper and being too afraid to use them.

 

"All those unused condo balconies? Most of us won’t buy without them"

"“I see a lot of stuff on the balconies but not a lot of people,” says Harrild, a partner in Condos.ca."

LMAO. The same could be said for "I see a lot of backyards, but not a lot of people in them". What a friggin idiot article, lol

Edited April 13, 2020 by Jvest55

[nite owℓ]

5 hours ago, Jvest55 said:

"All those unused condo balconies? Most of us won’t buy without them"

"“I see a lot of stuff on the balconies but not a lot of people,” says Harrild, a partner in Condos.ca."

LMAO. The same could be said for "I see a lot of backyards, but not a lot of people in them". What a friggin idiot article, lol

We'll have to agree to disagree then. I found the article to be pretty detailed actually, even going as far to explain the negative environmental impact by adding a balcony in cold climates is something I never even realized before.

I think the point the person was making was that most people aren't using their balconies on a regular basis like they initially thought they would-- despite requiring one. Backyards are a standard expectation to have when you buy a house, but even when using that example, how often do people use them? I rarely used mine. Most of the bungalows I've looked at in TP appeal more to me if they have a nice front porch, but I could care less about the backyard...actually the less outdoor space for maintenance the better lol. But that would probably kill resale value and makes me think twice.

“I’m not saying you need (balconies) to sell but the business is all about managing risk. So if you’re going into an unknown market and you know that most people would rather have a balcony than not, as long as you can provide it, it’s a lot less risky to sell that way,” said Young. “Most investors want to see some outdoor space. They don’t necessarily care how much it is, so whether it’s a full-wrapped balcony or a smaller 50 sq. ft. balcony, just the idea of having outdoor space is important. If you’re an end-user, like with anything else, you think in your head how you’re going to live and when reality comes in you might find that’s actually not how I’m living in the space,” he said.

[Jvest55]

And it begins...

One of Central Florida's most active contractors has filed a lien on downtown's newest skyscraper. Dallas-based contractor Austin Commercial Inc. claims it's owed $7.48 million out of its $68.3 million contract to build the 28-story SunTrust Plaza at Church Street Station northeast of South Street and Garland Avenue, according to Orange County documents. The property is owned by Church Street Phase 1 LLC — an entity related to Dallas-based developer Lincoln Property Co. and Atlanta-based real estate investment firm Mason Capital Partners.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2020/04/14/lead-contractor-files-7-4m-lien-on-downtowns.html

[codypet]

Good thing that's Church Street Phase 1's Problem and not Church Street Phase 2's problem.  Phew.

[orlandouprise]

Wasn't Austin building Phase 2?

[popsiclebrandon]

Isn't Phase 2 office space focused? If so it will be reworked or its dead.

[Jvest55]

The problem of #1 is surely the problem of #2. It's all connected (figuratively) 

Edited April 15, 2020 by Jvest55

[JFW657]

Personally, I wouldn't be at all upset if the project *in its current design* was delayed then scrapped and later on, we got something better looking.

 

[dcluley98]

Austin is not building Phase 2. They have not released an RFP or selected a CM for phase 2 yet. 

[Jvest55]

It's not about Austin, it's about lending markets in my view. All these projects grab money from the same source: Investors. 

[jack]

14 minutes ago, Jvest55 said:

It's not about Austin, it's about lending markets in my view. All these projects grab money from the same source: Investors. 

Investor money is first in. Banks fund last. It is most likely a dispute between Lincoln and Austin, 

[gibby]

I don't see that ballroom having any events for the foreseeable future.  It would be great if they fast-tracked the demo.