Soccer in Nashville

[TNinVB]

1 hour ago, titanhog said:

Ours is easily the most conservative and un-flashy.

I was thinking that as well. There are some really nice proposals on there. 

[arkitekte]

18 minutes ago, nashvylle said:

Disagree. What makes St. Louis' so great? Tampa Bay's stadium looks like a texas high school football stadium. 

St. Louis', IMO opinion favors a soccer specific stadium that one might find in Europe; doesn't matter now, for them anyways. 

Regarding Tampa's, that design is straight from the book of "Let's turn this baseball stadium into a venue for a Tuesday afternoon bowl game in December." It just looks forced. 

I think one thing that is influencing our opinion of the proposal for Nashville is the sheer lack in quality of the renderings. A fine line is drawn from architects when trying to convey a certain amount of unknown or undecided information when developing presentation documents. You don't want show too much because that's not what's going to really be there, but show enough to get the point across. Often times this is what happens and it gives a bad idea of the proposed product. I personally wouldn't have put forward those rendered elevations that are straight from Revit with little attention paid to the scale of materials that are rendered, but that's getting nitpicky on things that typically only architects or those who are familiar with Revit want to notice/criticize. 

Edited August 17, 2017 by arkitekte
Typos

[nashvylle]

While I doubt the renderings will change drastically, it has been stated by NashvilleSC that these images are preliminary.

[SumnerCountian]

Our initial proposal is as appealing as any of the other stadium proposals. I am curious as to how much angst at the stadium design is actually dislike for the location itself. I wonder if half the folks bashing the stadium design would be singing its praises if it were located on the east bank, maybe where the TOA property is. Just my thoughts.

[AUNash]

The infrastructure definitely needs to improve. Wedgewood dead ends here. Connect it to Fesslers and continue it into East Nashville which was talked about years ago. This and other improvements would improve traffic flow in this area.

Interesting thing if you look at the map and consider connecting Wedgewood to Fesslers ... it would pass within just a couple of blocks from Treveca. So then you can imagine the unified Fesslers/Wedgewood/Blakemore/31st/28th/Ed Temple tracing its way through the city connecting Treveca, Belmont, Vanderbilt, and TSU. I think it might be cool to do the Wedgewood extension to Fesslers, tie the whole thing together with some signature, uniform signage, and rename the whole stretch University Avenue.

[titanhog]

3 hours ago, nashvylle said:

Disagree. What makes St. Louis' so great? Tampa Bay's stadium looks like a texas high school football stadium. 

So...you're saying you see a stadium design proposal from another city that is more conservative and un-flashy that Nashville's?  Your idea of conservative and un-flashy must be different than mine.  Ours is TN red brick with an awning.  No design flares or anything that stands out as "look at me" like, let's say, Bridgestone Arena.  St. Louis and Tampa both look more flashy than ours.  

Now...if you think by me using those words I'm saying all of the other designs are better than ours...nothing could be further from the truth.  I think ours is better than both St. Louis and Tampa.

[Titans10]

Who cares about flashy, I think our classic look will still look good 30 years from now and the design has no bearing on whether we get a team or not. I'm glad we took the approach and went with 30,000 seats compared to many other MLS stadiums which are much smaller. 

[L'burgnative]

I guess I'm with Ingram on this; I hate modern "dropped from space" looking stadiums.  Give me a classic looking design with brick and arches any day over modern looking European soccer stadiums or the majority of the NFL stadiums that's been built in the last 15 years.  The only stadium I like better then Nashville's proposal is Charlotte's.

[titanhog]

5 hours ago, Titans10 said:

Who cares about flashy, I think our classic look will still look good 30 years from now and the design has no bearing on whether we get a team or not. I'm glad we took the approach and went with 30,000 seats compared to many other MLS stadiums which are much smaller. 

That's what I'm trying to say.  Ours is conservative and un-flashy compared to all of the others.  It really is more of Nashville's style.

[arkitekte]

4 hours ago, L'burgnative said:

I guess I'm with Ingram on this; I hate modern "dropped from space" looking stadiums.  Give me a classic looking design with brick and arches any day over modern looking European soccer stadiums or the majority of the NFL stadiums that's been built in the last 15 years.  The only stadium I like better then Nashville's proposal is Charlotte's.

I typically would agree and could agree with this if it were a Retro Classic baseball stadium located in an industrial neighborhood, but a soccer specific stadium (especially at this location), IMO, doesn't need to be reserved or classic. Nothing about the idea of soccer in Tennessee (or the US) should relate to a "classic" design. It's more or less a "dropped form space idea". Architecture alone influences people's idea of a product and a bland, brick facade isn't going to spark additional attention to the stadium and eventually franchise. The fairgrounds provides a blank slate for a design; nothing needs to necessarily coexist or complement existing, historic structures in the design. Outside of budget, the design shouldn't be restricted to what exists in other parts of the city. 

It's hard to admit at times, but many people go to games not simply for the on field/court/ice talent, but the overall atmosphere/environment/venue. I don't like soccer at all, but best believe I attended a Portland Timbers game just to check out Providence Park. 

[L'burgnative]

My opinion is the classic look should not be reserved for only baseball nor it's location.  I'd take a Doak Campball, Notre Dame Stadium (after renovations), Kinnick (Iowa) or Illinois Memorial Stadium any day over the eye sore they created with New Soldier Field, Jerry's World, the coiled snake looking thing in the Arizona dessert and even the new Mercedes Benz Stadium in Atlanta.  Charlotte went with a classic look (reminds me of BofA Stadium which IMO is the best looking stadium in the NFL) and I think it definitely works.

[Nash_12South]

I fall into the it shouldn't be traditional crowd. It needs to be unique and be a destination. The Fairgrounds need help.

[nashvylle]

If HOK somehow incorporated racetrack design into the stadium given The Fairgounds history, I think that could be cool. 

[tragenvol]

Appealing to MLS is a financed stadium with billionaire ownership.

[Pdt2f]

I think the stadium rendering is appropriate considering the MLS's status as a league far below the MLB, NFL, NHL, and NBA in viewership and money. Spending tons of money and achieving architectural nirvana for an MLS stadium is like building the Hagia Sofia to house an O'Charleys. Now if the English premier league for some reason decided to expand to Nashville, then build something magnificent. 

[NashvilleObserver]

13 hours ago, Pdt2f said:

I think the stadium rendering is appropriate considering the MLS's status as a league far below the MLB, NFL, NHL, and NBA in viewership and money. Spending tons of money and achieving architectural nirvana for an MLS stadium is like building the Hagia Sofia to house an O'Charleys. Now if the English premier league for some reason decided to expand to Nashville, then build something magnificent. 

The rendering is indeed, very appropriate. Not every new project in Nashville has to be an architectural marvel or visually mind-blowing. To me, the rendering looks like a picture of a functional soccer stadium.... which is exactly what it's supposed to be.

[markhollin]

Vandy to make decision about sharing in soccer stadium within next 6-8 weeks:

http://www.tennessean.com/story/news/2017/08/17/answer-vanderbilt-shared-stadium-major-league-soccer-expected-weeks/577077001/

[MidTenn1]

5 hours ago, markhollin said:

Vandy to make decision about sharing in soccer stadium within next 6-8 weeks:
 

Chris Lee of Vandy Sports.com was on 104.5 Sports talk radio this a.m. and said Vandy's participation in sharing the stadium is all but a done deal. He said Chancellor Zeppos has been supporting this deal from the beginning. The post interview discussion revolved around a few points.

• If Coach Mason goes to a bowl game this year and there is no facility (stadium) upgrade plan in place, he would most likely move on. Vandy would return to square one in rebuilding again.
• Vandy's administrators like the off campus solution because they want the land for growth.  Since land is hard to come by adjacent to the campus, let the city provide (and help build) the football stadium land and tear down the existing one for the land.
• There could be some drop off among students and alumni on game day, but a modern, 'state of the art' stadium might encourage more local people to attend games.State of the Art implying all chair seats, selling beer(?), ample tailgating space, better concessions, modern technical provisions for WiFi and etc., better game day experience ...basically, a modern 35,000 seat NFL stadium, but for SEC Football.

My question is...if Vandy makes the commitment, and Nashville is not awarded an MLS franchise, what's does Vandy do next? They've lost one to two years of progress toward improving their facilities. 

Still, I think it's the best option for Vanderbilt.

 

[nashvylle]

Are there any other SEC schools that have an off-campus stadium?

[markhollin]

David Boclair of the Nashville Post also thinks the Vanderbilt football games at the new soccer stadium are all but solidified:

http://www.nashvillepost.com/sports/commentary/blog/20972904/for-vanderbilt-football-talk-is-cheap-a-stadium-is-not

[MidTenn1]

1 hour ago, nashvylle said:

Are there any other SEC schools that have an off-campus stadium?

South Carolina's is two miles off campus. There are not many 'major, schools with off campus facilities, but Baylor, Miami, UCLA, Northwestern, Oregon, Pittsburgh, N.C. State, Temple, Connecticut and Memphis are a few.

Edited August 18, 2017 by PHofKS

[Pdt2f]

Alabama used to play many of their home games in Birmingham, and Arkansas still plays a few games per year in Little Rock. 

[L'burgnative]

So if Vandy goes bowling again this year they think they can keep Mason by moving from an almost 40,000 seat on-campus stadium to a 30,000 off-campus stadium?  Decisions like this no wonder why Vandy sucks; you still don't go backwards if your stadium is already the smallest in the conference.  This may have been asked but why not the huge parking lot southwest of Vandy Stadium? Definitely a larger foot print there then current Vandy Stadium.  Also if Vandy is to share a stadium with a soccer team the stadium needs to aim for 40,000-45,000 rather than 30,000 and yes I now what Vandy averages but still....

Edited August 18, 2017 by L'burgnative

[PruneTracy]

19 hours ago, PHofKS said:

South Carolina's is two miles off campus. There are not many 'major, schools with off campus facilities, but Baylor, Miami, UCLA, Northwestern, Oregon, Pittsburgh, N.C. State, Temple, Connecticut and Memphis are a few.

Arkansas also plays one game per year at War Memorial Stadium in Little Rock (in previous years, they would play two or three). Alabama, and to a lesser extent Auburn, regularly used Legion Field in Birmingham in the past.

I would argue that other SEC schools can get away with playing games off-campus or even crossing into neutral-site territory (e.g., Tennessee at the Car Hole) because they are public universities that, for much of the SEC, are the highest-level teams in the entire state. Vanderbilt doesn't have this built-in support and, also uniquely for the SEC, is located in a city that not only hosts a number of non-SEC expats but also has NFL representation.

The trend in college football now is to try to move teams back on-campus (c.f. Temple, Miami, etc.) and I think it would be a mistake for Vandy to take the opposite tack, especially under the assumption that it will increase attendance from locals who aren't otherwise connected to the university. They are basically competing with the Titans at that point, arguably not a difficult job but unnecessary nonetheless. Anecdotally I know a lot of Tennessee fans who didn't go to UT, Bama fans, etc. but not too many people who root for Vandy just because they live in Nashville.

In any case college football belongs on campus, there really isn't a substitute.

Edited August 19, 2017 by PruneTracy

[Pdt2f]

17 minutes ago, L'burgnative said:

So if Vandy goes bowling again this year they think they can keep Mason by moving from an almost 40,000 seat on-campus stadium to a 30,000 off-campus stadium?  Decisions like this no wonder why Vandy sucks; you still don't go backwards if your stadium is already the smallest in the conference.  This may have been asked but why not the huge parking lot southwest of Vandy Stadium? Definitely a larger foot print there then current Vandy Stadium.  Also if Vandy is to share a stadium with a soccer team the stadium needs to aim for 40,000-45,000 rather than 30,000 and yes I now what Vandy averages but still....

Maybe it has more to do with the state of the facilities than size or location. Like locker rooms, etc. I personally think that when he leaves it won't be because of Vandy's stadium. Those who succeed at Vandy try to get jobs at better programs, especially if they're young in their career.