NC Civil Rights

[rancenc]

1 hour ago, RiverwoodCLT said:

But the GOP says the  estimated of economic losses are not real losses.

 

 

 

Maybe going forward counties/cities need to withhold any sales, hotel, car rental tax etc etc that normally goes to the state coffers from these type of events. Then let the GOP leaders know what an real loss is!!

[DMann]

41 minutes ago, rancenc said:

Maybe going forward counties/cities need to withhold any sales, hotel, car rental tax etc etc that normally goes to the state coffers from these type of events. Then let the GOP leaders know what an real loss is!!

Pure case of Republican math.

[Dale]

Birds on a wire ...

[kermit]

From a political perspective it looks like Jennifer Roberts made the right decision today. Early absentee ballot stats for NC favor Dems pretty strongly. I think jayvee is right, might was well lever the economic misery into some political pain for your opponents. 

 

 

[CLTProductions]

YEah discussion of last night should continue here. Yes peaceful protests don't make the news anymore (worked in the 60s though. Just need to try). 

but no one can possibly think the appropriate reaction to an armed black dude being killed by a black cop is breaking into and looting a Walmart, throwing stuff at cops, breaking car windows, stopping traffic on the highway and unloading contents of semi to then set fire to them

I understand we don't know what actually happened, but to think that reaction is appropriate for any situation shows.... well it's just way off base

[Southernyank]

Bottom line is that the protesters were protesting and the looters were opportunists using the events as an excuse to get free stuff and wreak havoc. Even with having 90% of people justly protesting, that 10% of opportunists distract and detract from the message. Hooray for protesters exercising their rights. Boo to criminals taking advantage.

[kermit]

43 minutes ago, Jayvee said:

YEah discussion of last night should continue here. Yes peaceful protests don't make the news anymore (worked in the 60s though. Just need to try). 

but no one can possibly think the appropriate reaction to an armed black dude being killed by a black cop is breaking into and looting a Walmart, throwing stuff at cops, breaking car windows, stopping traffic on the highway and unloading contents of semi to then set fire to them

I understand we don't know what actually happened, but to think that reaction is appropriate for any situation shows.... well it's just way off base

After Tulsa the day before and the outcome of the Randall Kerrick trial the year before there is plenty of room to doubt if the person killed was armed (I am not saying he wasn't, just that I can understand people not believing what the police say). Given the lack of peaceful protest or political options available to the US underclass I do think a violent response is the only reasonable option available when you believe that your neighbors are being indiscriminately killed by the state.

[cltbwimob]

RE Kermit's post in "Perception of Charlotte":

According to news reports...

Black cop shoots black man (so it's not racism that motivated the shooting).

Alleged victim has a gun which the police department verified they recovered at the scene (so it doesn't look like general police brutality, but legitimate self defense).

Angry protestors erupt into a fit of rage, break into Walmart, stop traffic on I-85, start fires, rob trucks, destroy police vehicles, etc.

So let me get this straight: non-racist act of [ostensibly] self-defense justifies riots, robberies, arson, and vandalism against completely innocent bystanders? 

Kermit I gotta say that while I agree with a lot of what you have to say on many topics, I think you have tried to make an argument that is beyond nonsensical-it's plain ludicrous.  Even if the guy wasn't armed, even if the cop was white, and even if the killing was motivated by racist tendencies, in what alternate reality is it justified or appropriate to commit crimes against people who had nothing to do with the events in question?  I know it garners media attention, but it garners the wrong type of media attention.  These actions tend to polarize people; they tend to pour salt on an already open wound rather than help heal the wound.  Furthermore a substantial portion of the population will find themselves  ever less sympathetic to the cause of BLM as a result.  Perhaps I am just one of those people not smart enough to see the justification here.

[ES Charlotte]

13 minutes ago, kermit said:

After Tulsa the day before and the outcome of the Randall Kerrick trial the year before there is plenty of room to doubt if the person killed was armed (I am not saying he wasn't, just that I can understand people not believing what the police say). Given the lack of peaceful protest or political options available to the US underclass I do think a violent response is the only reasonable option available when you believe that your neighbors are being indiscriminately killed by the state.

Like I said... When that violence is forced on you, let me know if you'd still be a proponent.

[CLTProductions]

21 minutes ago, kermit said:

After Tulsa the day before and the outcome of the Randall Kerrick trial the year before there is plenty of room to doubt if the person killed was armed (I am not saying he wasn't, just that I can understand people not believing what the police say). Given the lack of peaceful protest or political options available to the US underclass I do think a violent response is the only reasonable option available when you believe that your neighbors are being indiscriminately killed by the state.

Echoing the comments, that's bonkers man. A violent response is NEVER the answer. Especially when you're a part of a group where the issue is they're stereotyped as violent. Its throwing gas on a fire hoping it'll put it out. Just insane. 

The media attention is black people get violent and riot. Not exactly the type of media attention that's gonna warrant change and flip the minds of existing racists. All trump supporters think now is just "blacks being blacks" this was the worst possible response by the "protestors" 

[kermit]

I am not saying it was right (and I nevwr brought up race)  but I can understand how a group of people can feel like they have no other options other than violent protest. Lots of people are wrongly killed by police, there is little to no evidence that the justice system takes that seriously (eg Freddie Grey). As long as a portion of America feels like the government is ignoring or abusing them there will be violent protest. It's just part of who we are as Americans, it's part of our DNA (the NRA exists for the sole purpose of reminding us that we have the right to be violent against an oppressive government)

 

 

 

 

[DavieNative]

46 minutes ago, guttersnipe said:

Bottom line is that the protesters were protesting and the looters were opportunists using the events as an excuse to get free stuff and wreak havoc. Even with having 90% of people justly protesting, that 10% of opportunists distract and detract from the message. Hooray for protesters exercising their rights. Boo to criminals taking advantage.

It started with protesters followed by a large mass of people that were throwing rocks and destroying police cars. The crowd was tear gassed and flashbanged by riot police because it was a riot. It only escalating after I left last night. I'm all for people's right to peaceful protest, but that is not what was taking place. 

[jednc]

Figured I'd reply to this here:

From KERMIT-

You guys are smarter than this. Peaceful protests get no real media attention so the only way to make the country safe for all its citizens is to have a dramatic enough protest to get people's attention. Otherwise the masses just shrug and move on (eg the collection of the 'it will blow over" remarks above). 

I certainly don't want to see anybody get hurt, but IMO I don't think what happened last night (the protest) was inappropriate given what happened to precipitate it (the shooting).

Edit: why aren't we having this discussion in the Civil Rights thread?

 

I personally think the police should have used rubber bullets and billy clubs on the rioters. If anyone thinks they couldn't have accomplished much that way, then Plan B should be watching video (there's plenty) and showing up at these people's homes and arresting them. There should def. be no amnesty or anyone daring to say that it's understandable because they were upset and felt marginalized. I want people held accountable for the damage done. Why should my tax dollars be wasted by a mob that was just looking for an excuse to act out?

[Crown]

Friends from Wells and Law firms uptown being sent home early... closed office at 4pm. 

[nonillogical]

55 minutes ago, Crown said:

Friends from Wells and Law firms uptown being sent home early... closed office at 4pm. 

Hell, I just had a haircut cancelled as they're shutting down for the day. This is by the Metropolitan nowhere near the planned protest. Pretty ridiculous IMO. 

[CLT2014]

2 hours ago, nonillogical said:

Hell, I just had a haircut cancelled as they're shutting down for the day. This is by the Metropolitan nowhere near the planned protest. Pretty ridiculous IMO. 

Yeah that's a bit far out. The protesters are in Marshall Park and the middle of the Epicentre now. They are also right in front of the Ritz Carlton... I'm sure they'll get some nice TripAdvisor reviews this week.

[Nashtitans]

9 hours ago, kermit said:

I am not saying it was right (and I nevwr brought up race)  but I can understand how a group of people can feel like they have no other options other than violent protest. Lots of people are wrongly killed by police, there is little to no evidence that the justice system takes that seriously (eg Freddie Grey). As long as a portion of America feels like the government is ignoring or abusing them there will be violent protest. It's just part of who we are as Americans, it's part of our DNA (the NRA exists for the sole purpose of reminding us that we have the right to be violent against an oppressive government)

 

 

 

 

Dude I agree. I'm gonna catch heat for this but i dont care. I support black lives matter. I dont like how the protests have to get violent and stuff it's unnecessary. But besides that, i support it. For example, in Nashville, the BLM protest was completely peaceful. People from all races were there. Even our police force supports them.  When these cops kill unnecessarily like this (black or white doesnt matter), they dont get jail time. They get paid leave/suspension. That's some bs. I know not all cops are bad (here in nashville we have one of the best police forces in the county), but these bad ones are making them look bad. I also the whole thing about black on black crime and all that and they're organizations to stop that. When black on black crime occurs, the killer goes to jail. These cops dont!!

 

I stayed in London for a year. I never (unlike here in America) have felt unsafe with a cop. They're totally different!! Same goes for Canada!!! It's an American problem, they let anybody put a uniform. And i hate when people say "comply or die" so if I do one thing incorrect (not counting pointing a gun at a cop thats a whole different situation), i deserve to die. Thats insane

 

And about another shooting, terrence crutcher. That was complete murder. There's no way you can defend this. Look up the video if you haven't. One thing that stuck out to me is the dude on the helicopter said "Oh that looks like a bad guy down there" How tf can you tell (from a thousand feet in the air in a helicopter) a person WHO HAS HIS HANDS UP COMPLYING is bad!!! Oh wait he's black. And no he wasn't reaching in the car YOU COULD CLEARLY SEE THE BLOOD ROLLING DOWN THE WINDOW. 

 

At the end of the day, nobody wins. The people getting violent are making BLM look bad and childish. And the people supporting cops killing unarmed/innocent people look idiotic. The real loss is gonna be on Charlotte. Look at Ferguson and Baltimore. This isn't a good look for the city. I already have people I know saying they're gonna avoid Charlotte for now on.

 

Sorry just had to rant. Not in a good mood right now Charlotte stay safe. Lovely city y'all got don't wanna ruin it.

[CLTProductions]

Things have turned violent uptown. Again, just a terrible look and no one is going to take this movement seriously now.

"heyyyy i know how we can get cops to stop shooting us, and white people to stop being racist. lets turn a peaceful and organized protest into chaos and violent!"

It's moronic. Just because people might "take notice" because it is violent doesn't mean anyone is going to take it seriously, change their opinions or react. If anything violence absolutely makes it worse. 

[gman430]

Crazy what is going on right now. Somebody got shot in the head and now the rioters are breaking into businesses at Epicentre. Send in the National Guard already I say. 

[Nashtitans]

Just now, gman430 said:

Crazy what is going on right now. Somebody got shot in the head and now the rioters are breaking into businesses at Epicentre. Send in the National Guard already I say. 

Damn I hate this. Just be peaceful like damn. Why it gotta be like this SMH

[CLT2014]

Was excited to try Essex Friday but my wife asked me to cancel :/ Back to South Park I go

[FrankNash]

I'm watching CNN now.  Are y'all ok?

[CLTProductions]

I just don't understand where there is even a semblance of "oh this will help":

• looting the hornets team store
• looting sundries shop at epi
• bricks through Aria and Kandy Bar
• freaking SHOOTING EACH OTHER
• throwing things at cops
• agitating cops
• everything else

It's all madness. I know its 10% of the whole doing this, but its those same 10% who complain about cops killing black people and everything else. How can you POSSIBLY expect change when you feed into stereotypes and look like animals on national tv? 

 

Kermit how is this violence working out? Got everyones attention, but in a truly awful, horrifying, embarrassing and degrading way. This won't do anything except make the divide bigger and worst of all, hurt this city. 

[Dale]

Charlotte Observer doing its best to fan the flames. But Charlotte's Police Chief acting like a boss, urging the 'silent majority' to stand up and show the nation that this senseless violence is not what Charlotte is about.

[kermit]

8 hours ago, Jayvee said:

Kermit how is this violence working out? Got everyones attention, but in a truly awful, horrifying, embarrassing and degrading way. This won't do anything except make the divide bigger and worst of all, hurt this city. 

Peaceful protests only work when the protestors have political power. We have spent the past six years watching policy be created that limits the ability of these protestors to vote (voter id, reduced early voting and gerrymandering), to influence politicians with contributions (Citizens United), or to monitor what the government does (McCrory's recent dash-cam video secrecy bill). Society as a whole has mostly just shrugged as we systematically marginalized a significant portion of society. What other viable options do the protestors have for making the urgency and importance of their concerns known? Keep in mind that a peaceful protest might get a one minute segment on channel 9 (and probably wouldn't even make it to the Agenda)-- it certainly wouldn't be national news. How would you respond if you saw your friends, neighbors and relatives being killed by the government and you were powerless to intervene? I sorta doubt that standing in Marshall Park with a sign would feel sufficient.

I am in no way advocating violence, I am merely sharing my opinion that its an understandable (and perhaps unavoidable) impulse in our current political climate.