Carolina Panthers

[Guest]

Cam has accuracy issues because he throws off his back foot.  This is because his offensive line is eating his breakfast a quarter second after the sack.  Cam Newton is expected to do more than any other quarterback in this league.  I'd argue there is no other team that leans so heavily on its quarterback to produce points, outside of maybe Brady and Manning.  

Imagine if Cam had the weapons Brady and Manning have had over the years. Hell imagine if he had the weapons that McCown/Mike Glennon has currently? Imagine if he had the weapons Matt Ryan has. There are plenty of great quarterbacks in the league, but how many of them can you honestly say that the most talented wide receiver they ever worked with was in their mid 30s? 

[MilZ]

Cam has been pretty successful behind bad/injured o-lines for 4 years. He had a poor o-line last year, leading us to a 12-4 record with several game winning drives where he put the team on his back, before loosing a pro-bowl left tackle entering this season. By the second quarter of last game, we had an all-undrafted o-line.

In the same number of starts, he is still on pace with Peyton Manning in total TDs.

He and Olsen are really the only constant on this team since week 2.

[AuLukey]

I'll begin by saying that I'll eat my words from the beginning of the season.  Not all of the calls made in this off season were for the best in the end.  Yes, cleaning house will bare new fruit in the future, but for the midterm, the Panthers will be fortunate to win their 5 remaining NFC South games and finish with a winning record (just to get obliterated in the post-season.)  I'd honestly be happy with finally breaking the winning record curse.  They do have the chance at it considering how terrible our division is playing this year.  You don't get many opportunities like that when Drew Brees is in your division.

 

Cam isn't elite, he is a shining example of the word "potential."  If given the proper offensive line and a healthy backfield, Cam could easily lead this team to the Super Bowl someday.  I just hope it happens before Olsen retires.

 

To say that too much is expected of Cam is laughable.  If Andrew Luck had entered the draft a year earlier, the Panthers would still be in the same boat they are now.  If we had drafted Andy Dalton instead that year, we'd be in last in our division.  The boy is making the best out of what he has.

 

I feel that we would have a better chance at a win with Anderson representing us.

 

Please don't get me started on the idea that Anderson has any shot to replace Cam.  It's not in the cards, nor should it ever be. 

 

First, Cam is a brand the Panthers can't afford to undermine right now.  Benching him for performance would destroy his image and devastate Panthers merchandising which was at an all-time high last year.  Unless he pulls a Ray Rice, starts vocalizing his frustrations to the media (a la Julius Peppers and Steve Smith,) or he starts putting up INT numbers like Jake Delhomme's last season as a Panther, Cam should be a Panther for a long time coming. 

 

Second, woe is the quarterback that performs well against second team defenses and a team (Bucs) who really should be win-less.  Don't compare Anderson's performance this year against Newton's.  Simple numbers don't tell the whole story.  Now, if Cam goes down and Anderson starts putting up huge numbers against elite teams' first string squads, then you'll have an argument.  With the offensive line in this condition, Cam is your man 25 hours a day.

[grodney]

Ugh. With Seattle having so many turnovers and penalties, this one was ready to be taken.  But the Panthers reciprocated with their own.  Ugly.  As we've said, the difference between 12-4 and 4-12 is a few plays here and there.  Sometimes you get them, sometimes you don't.  How does KB drop that TD pass?  How do the Panthers lose 7 yards on 3rd-and-goal from the 1?  How do you let Wilson scramble out of near-sacks for first downs multiple times (yes, he's good and I know it and it sucks -- must be what it feels like when Cam is doing it to opponents).

 

I know the offensive line is atrocious and banged up as well, but still so many unanswered questions.  Why not more Olsen?  Why not any slants to KB or anybody?  Can't somebody draw up some quick passes?  Oh, and the easiest thing in the world is to move the ball against a prevent defense in the last minute -- and the Panthers go from 1st-and-10 to 4th-and-25?  Really?  Not that they had much of a chance to score, but come on, can you complete one quick out for some yards?

 

Yes, the Saints can be horrible on the road, but I am dumbfounded that the Panthers opened as a 2.5-point favorite for Thursday.

[CLTProductions]

Good teams find a way to win........I could see it coming a mile away Carolina would blow that game on the last drive.

 

This game Thursday will be interesting. It's a battle of which terrible team sits on top of the worst division in the NFL.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Jayvee

[HopHead]

Shula has to go IMO... His play calling was horrendous yesterday (again). Cam made some bad decisions yesterday, but also bailed them out a few times with the Oline's short comings (most any other QB would have been sacked for a safety on that one play in the 2nd half). Offense overall is just in total disarray right now. I also think Rivera has become a John Fox part 2 this year. Little different this year now that he has his contract extension. Riverboat Ron seems to have disappeared. 

[CLTProductions]

 "I also think Rivera has become a John Fox part 2 this year. Little different this year now that he has his contract extension."

Usually par for the course. It is more common for quality to decline after a massive contract extension than improve.

[grodney]

I'm not an NFL coach or offensive coordinator, so I can only assume that Seattle was doing something scheme-wise that dictated some of this:

 

"

The Panthers ran 13 plays at or inside the Seahawks’ 20. Shula called 11 running plays and two passes

"

 

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2014/10/27/5271401/carolina-panthers-have-no-shortage.html#.VE-gjsnF_vc

 

p.s. The line for Thursday, which started at CAR -2.5 is now at NO -2.0.

 

Edited October 28, 2014 by grodney

[HopHead]

I'm not an NFL coach or offensive coordinator, so I can only assume that Seattle was doing something scheme-wise that dictated some of this:

 

"

The Panthers ran 13 plays at or inside the Seahawks’ 20. Shula called 11 running plays and two passes

"

 

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2014/10/27/5271401/carolina-panthers-have-no-shortage.html#.VE-gjsnF_vc

 

p.s. The line for Thursday, which started at CAR -2.5 is now at NO -2.0.

 

Take the Saints to win outright..

[caterpillar2]

When Delhomme was QB, we would be thrilled at the hail Marys or the last minute long pass to Smith, Mohammad, or whomever was the receiver. We don't see that witnb Newton. He can't throw an accurate long pass most of the time. He either throws it too far away or to the other team. He doesn't win games with his passing skills. In my opinion, if he didn't gain yardage from running the ball, he wouldn't be worthy of his position. It is a rare occasion that he is as good as the opposing team's quarterback. Watch carefully when we play the Saints for example.  We need to give Anderson more of an opportunity if he want is. 

 

Delhomme had one really bad season and was fired. Newton had one good one and he is "superman"  and still working.  Give me a break. 

 

Just my opinion and I apologize in advance if I piss you off.

[lewy2000]

Newton had one good one and he is "superman"  and still working.  Give me a break. 

 

Just my opinion and I apologize in advance if I piss you off.

 

How would Aaron Rogers, Drew Brees, etc perform with a terrible offensive line plus bad receivers? Probably wouldn't be doing this:

 

• Most passing yards by a quarterback in debut game (422), September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals
• Most passing yards by a quarterback in first two games (854), September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals and September 18, 2011 vs. Green Bay Packers^[82]
• First quarterback in NFL history to pass for more than 400 yards in first career start, September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals
• Sixth quarterback to throw for 400+ yards in back to back games
• First quarterback in NFL history to pass for more than 400 yards in first two career starts, September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals and September 18, 2011 vs. Green Bay Packers^[81]
• Fastest player to throw for 1,000 yards (at Arizona Cardinals, vs. Green Bay Packers, and vs. Jacksonville Jaguars)
• First player in NFL history with at least five rushing touchdowns and five passing touchdowns in his first five games^[83]
• Most rushing touchdowns in single season by a quarterback (14), achieved on December 4, 2011 vs. Tampa Bay Buccaneers
• Second player in NFL history with 20+ pass TDs and 10+ rush TDs in a season, joining Kordell Stewart ('97)
• First player in NFL history with 4,000+ pass yards and 10+ rush TDs in a season
• First player in NFL history with 4,000+ pass yards and 500+ rush yards in a season
• Had a passing touchdown and a rushing touchdown in the same game eight times, tying the NFL single-season record – previously accomplished by Steve Grogan of the New England Patriots in 1976 and Daunte Culpepper of the Minnesota Vikings in 2002
• Twenty-fifth NFL player (and first quarterback) to have 20 rushing TDs in first two seasons
• First QB in NFL history with at least 500 yards rushing in first two seasons
• First player in NFL history to have over 250 passing yards and over 100 rushing yards with a passing TD and rushing TD in a game (vs. Falcons on September 12, 2012 - 287 yards passing & 2 TDs, 116 yds rushing & 1 TD and vs. Bengals on October 11, 2014)
• First player to have 30 passing TDs and 20 rushing TDs in first two seasons
• Highest average yards of total offense, career (293.7)
• Second player in NFL history with 7,500+ pass yards and 40+ pass TDs in first two seasons, joining Peyton Manning ('99)
• Second most combined passing & rushing yards through his first 37 starts in NFL history (behind Kurt Warner)
• First player in NFL history with 50 passing TDs and 25 Rushing TDs in his first three seasons
• First player with 10,000 passing yards and 1,000 rushing yards in his first three seasons

 

Unlike haters, stats don't lie.

[CLTProductions]

How would Aaron Rogers, Drew Brees, etc perform with a terrible offensive line plus bad receivers? Probably wouldn't be doing this:

 

• Most passing yards by a quarterback in debut game (422), September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals
• Most passing yards by a quarterback in first two games (854), September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals and September 18, 2011 vs. Green Bay Packers^[82]
• First quarterback in NFL history to pass for more than 400 yards in first career start, September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals
• Sixth quarterback to throw for 400+ yards in back to back games
• First quarterback in NFL history to pass for more than 400 yards in first two career starts, September 11, 2011 vs. Arizona Cardinals and September 18, 2011 vs. Green Bay Packers^[81]
• Fastest player to throw for 1,000 yards (at Arizona Cardinals, vs. Green Bay Packers, and vs. Jacksonville Jaguars)
• First player in NFL history with at least five rushing touchdowns and five passing touchdowns in his first five games^[83]
• Most rushing touchdowns in single season by a quarterback (14), achieved on December 4, 2011 vs. Tampa Bay Buccaneers
• Second player in NFL history with 20+ pass TDs and 10+ rush TDs in a season, joining Kordell Stewart ('97)
• First player in NFL history with 4,000+ pass yards and 10+ rush TDs in a season
• First player in NFL history with 4,000+ pass yards and 500+ rush yards in a season
• Had a passing touchdown and a rushing touchdown in the same game eight times, tying the NFL single-season record – previously accomplished by Steve Grogan of the New England Patriots in 1976 and Daunte Culpepper of the Minnesota Vikings in 2002
• Twenty-fifth NFL player (and first quarterback) to have 20 rushing TDs in first two seasons
• First QB in NFL history with at least 500 yards rushing in first two seasons
• First player in NFL history to have over 250 passing yards and over 100 rushing yards with a passing TD and rushing TD in a game (vs. Falcons on September 12, 2012 - 287 yards passing & 2 TDs, 116 yds rushing & 1 TD and vs. Bengals on October 11, 2014)
• First player to have 30 passing TDs and 20 rushing TDs in first two seasons
• Highest average yards of total offense, career (293.7)
• Second player in NFL history with 7,500+ pass yards and 40+ pass TDs in first two seasons, joining Peyton Manning ('99)
• Second most combined passing & rushing yards through his first 37 starts in NFL history (behind Kurt Warner)
• First player in NFL history with 50 passing TDs and 25 Rushing TDs in his first three seasons
• First player with 10,000 passing yards and 1,000 rushing yards in his first three seasons

 

Unlike haters, stats don't lie.

While I applaud your efforts in getting these stats, doesn't change the fact they are in the worst division in the NFL and are still struggling to get it done. Obviously not even close to all Cam's fault but speaking as to the entire team, they are disappointing, which is honestly a lot more surprising to people than I imagined.

 

However, I will say that it is certainly lucky that they are in the worst division, they could still win it!

Edited October 28, 2014 by Jayvee

[MilZ]

Derek Anderson knows he is a backup. He is a good backup and signed a contract because that's what he wants at this point in his career. Sure, he could come into a game and play well enough to possibly get a win, but he is nowhere near the talent level or gives us the competitive edge that Cam Newton does. He also does not prepare us for a sustainable future as a consistent offense. If you want a consistent and dangerous offensive performance week in and week out, then you have to be able to give your quarterback 2-2.5 to go through his reads. The last time (and one of the only times) Cam had 2+ seconds to sit in the pocket during that game, he completed a very accurate jump ball to Kelvin at midfield from the end zone. DA cannot make that throw.

It's also not a good idea to bench your QB who was a pro-bowl starter last year.

[HopHead]

While I applaud your efforts in getting these stats, doesn't change the fact they are in the worst division in the NFL and are still struggling to get it done. Obviously not even close to all Cam's fault but speaking as to the entire team, they are disappointing, which is honestly a lot more surprising to people than I imagined.

 

He was pointing out Cam's stats because some people tend to think he's a bust, or that Derek Anderson should be starting (give me a break with that already). Everyone knows the NFC South is awful. That's nothing new. 

[ah59396]

He was pointing out Cam's stats because some people tend to think he's a bust, or that Derek Anderson should be starting (give me a break with that already). Everyone knows the NFC South is awful. That's nothing new. 

 

 

I actually laugh out loud (physically) when people suggest Derek Anderson should start.  Because QB is not our problem right now...

 

 

Cam is both our QB and RB, because we don't have a RB.    in the Cincinnati game, he ran the ball 17 times.  Most Running backs don't get that many touches in a game.  But lets not forget, after each of these exhausting plays, we expect Cam to hop back up and play QB on the next play, he doesn't get to take a break like every other running game by commission in the league.  He's also been working with a bum ankle and a broken rib since week 1.  But hey, that's his fault I guess?  He also has a rookie WR as his #1 (Kelvin has been great, btw).  But had Cotchery and Benjamin both caught late, pivotal touchdown passes that him them in the chest, we are 5-3 right now, with wins over Seattle and Cincy.

 

Cam overthrows his players when he throws off his back foot.  He throws of his back foot when he is either 1.  on the run or 2. stepping backwards as our cardboard O-line collapses into him.

 

There are few QB's in the NFL that can survive and win in the role we place Cam in.  He's never had consistency at WR, he has a terrible Oline made up of guys that could bag groceries if not for injuries and has zero run game to support him and take the heat off.  Let's not even pretend we can run play action to keep the D guessing.

 

So it's just a flat out joke that anyone would suggest this team is better off going with an aged journeyman like Derek Anderson, who would be a placeholder for the year and then put us right back where we were coming out of a 2-14 season when we drafted Cam, except with less talented options in the draft.

[CLTProductions]

He was pointing out Cam's stats because some people tend to think he's a bust, or that Derek Anderson should be starting (give me a break with that already). Everyone knows the NFC South is awful. That's nothing new. 

Oh I know, and I agree with ah59396 in laughing when people say that about Anderson. I know alllllll to well what he is (in)capable of as a Browns fan. The fact people even have that thought in their heads is mind blowing. He was horrible in Cleveland, yes he lead the browns to their best record since being back in the league, but that was NOT because of him. He somehow put up magical numbers that year, but was in no way a testament to his "skill" he's on the bench now, where he belongs.

[HopHead]

^Thank you, ah. While nobody will mistaken Cam for Peyton right now. Some people have this preconceived notion about Cam for whatever reason (they frequently say "Roll Tide", prefer traditional pocket passers, whatever) and that won't change. They fail to see what the Panthers have surrounded him with. As you mentioned the OL is a joke. Only one guy is really worth of starting int the NFL (Byron Bell for instance is a revolving door). Olsen and Benjamin are good weapons, but if your pocket is constantly collapsing,  throws won't be on target. The RB corp is constantly injured and Mike Shula couldn't pass for an offensive coordinator on a game of Madden. 

[ah59396]

Oh I know, and I agree with ah59396 in laughing when people say that about Anderson. I know alllllll to well what he is (in)capable of as a Browns fan. The fact people even have that thought in their heads is mind blowing. He was horrible in Cleveland, yes he lead the browns to their best record since being back in the league, but that was NOT because of him. He somehow put up magical numbers that year, but was in no way a testament to his "skill" he's on the bench now, where he belongs.

 

Plus, back up QB is the best job in the world.  Show up to work, put on your ball cap, make a couple million dollars.

^Thank you, ah. While nobody will mistaken Cam for Peyton right now. Some people have this preconceived notion about Cam for whatever reason (they frequently say "Roll Tide", prefer traditional pocket passers, whatever) and that won't change. They fail to see what the Panthers have surrounded him with. As you mentioned the OL is a joke. Only one guy is really worth of starting int the NFL (Byron Bell for instance is a revolving door). Olsen and Benjamin are good weapons, but if your pocket is constantly collapsing,  throws won't be on target. The RB corp is constantly injured and Mike Shula couldn't pass for an offensive coordinator on a game of Madden. 

 

 

Yep.  Best QB in the league?  No way.  He still has a lot to prove.  But Cam belongs in the conversation of the new class.  Guys like Cam, Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck and Kapernick are going to be the new elite.  Especially as we start to see Brady, Manning, Brees, Rodgers ect retire.

 

Just be glad we aren't starting Orton or Fitzpatrick.

[ah59396]

My God. I'm depressed I had to watch tonight live in the stadium. Can was awful, O Line was awful, receivers were horrifically awful. And the play calling...just wow. We are not even fun to watch. At least the defense showed up.

10-5-1...ugh.

[CLTProductions]

My God. I'm depressed I had to watch tonight live in the stadium. Can was awful, O Line was awful, receivers were horrifically awful. And the play calling...just wow. We are not even fun to watch. At least the defense showed up.

10-5-1...ugh.

Sucks you paid money to be at the game, that part is depressing for sure but I wasn't surprised in the slightest. Not only was it a nationally televised game, they just stink lol. It's a damn shame, last year was so much fun but it's becoming more and more clear it was a one off. Even the Browns went 10-6 once. Edited October 31, 2014 by Jayvee

[grodney]

My God. I'm depressed I had to watch tonight live in the stadium. Can was awful, O Line was awful, receivers were horrifically awful. And the play calling...just wow. We are not even fun to watch. At least the defense showed up.

10-5-1...ugh.

 

They clearly don't have the personnel at O-line or D-backs -- and that was *before* the various and repeated injuries.  With those two built-in weaknesses, it seems the other units need to play perfectly, and also take advantage when the other team makes mistakes.  None of that is happening.  Cam had some really good throws last night -- the ones dropped by Benji and Avatchery and Bersin (Saints interception as a bonus on that one) -- but he missed a lot of throws even when he seemingly had time.  

 

I would like to question play-calling too, but I generally assume it's a complicated thing, and they know way more than I do -- I mean it's their job after all.  Hell, if I were coaching this team, I'd D-up every receiver 1-on-1 and blast them at the line, and blitz like crazy with everybody else.  Ha ha, I'd probably get torched for multiple long TDs, but it's just so frustrating watching the opposing QB with all kinds of time, and the d-backs laying off the receivers 5-10 yards.

 

My wife and I were talking about it this morning -- with 5 games left against TB, ATL, ATL, MIN, and CLE, the Panthers could "easily" go 8-7-1, but nothing looks easy at this point.

Edited October 31, 2014 by grodney

[HopHead]

My God. I'm depressed I had to watch tonight live in the stadium. Can was awful, O Line was awful, receivers were horrifically awful. And the play calling...just wow. We are not even fun to watch. At least the defense showed up.

10-5-1...ugh.

 

And they get the Eagles next week. That won't be any fun to watch. I thought that Vegas line stunk... Should have put some cash down on the Saints. I'm not one to give up on a team, but it doesn't look very rosy. Only bright side is that after that MNF game, the schedule isn't as brutal. 

[ah59396]

And they get the Eagles next week. That won't be any fun to watch. I thought that Vegas line stunk... Should have put some cash down on the Saints. I'm not one to give up on a team, but it doesn't look very rosy. Only bright side is that after that MNF game, the schedule isn't as brutal. 

 

I'll never give up on them.  I've been through 1-15 and 2 separate 2-14 seasons.  But I booed them into the ground last night (the offense at least).  They earned every second of my anger.

[HopHead]

I'll never give up on them.  I've been through 1-15 and 2 separate 2-14 seasons.  But I booed them into the ground last night (the offense at least).  They earned every second of my anger.

 

This season will be a piece of cake by comparison to those..

[AuLukey]

At the very least the Panthers have a slightly better chance against the Eagles now that Nick Foles is out for the season.  Sure they have a decent backup QB in Sanchez, but at least he won't mesh quite as well with his offensive line.  Let's at least hope our QB can mesh with his this week...