Downtown Projects & Developments

[NotNotSanti]

2 hours ago, spartanburgh said:

I was thinking of all of the projects in the pipeline and it looks like the following:

Project Core         go

Fairfield Inn          go

Planetarium         go

New City County Administration building     go

Blue Wall Kennedy St. Apts      stop

John Montgomery offices         stop

M Peters E Main project     stop

Liberty St office    stop

109 E Main St mix use   ??

First Baptist expansion    stop

Danmor   dead

Cambria site   dead

Jimmy Gibbs hotel/office proposals dead

Convention Center at County Administration site ??

Blood bank renovation   dead

Smith's drug store apts  dead 

W Main road diet  go

Several months ago I heard the 109 E Main Street was on hold because of higher interest rates. I can't imagine all the increases by then have helped. 

Anyone know the status of the e-sports arena that was being examined? 

[westsider28]

1 hour ago, NotNotSanti said:

Several months ago I heard the 109 E Main Street was on hold because of higher interest rates. I can't imagine all the increases by then have helped. 

Anyone know the status of the e-sports arena that was being examined? 

I mentioned it in the Montgomery Building thread, but the fact that the theater space is being marketed for lease suggests the e-sports idea is dead (at least for the current owners, someone else could always come in and do it themselves).

[Spartan]

On 7/21/2023 at 8:52 PM, westsider28 said:

Interesting item in Monday's City Council agenda: the US Government desires to transfer ownership of the former post office site at the corner of Church and St John to the City, in exchange for the City performing maintenance on the United States Courthouse.  This is a key corner parcel, so it will be good to have it in the City's hands so that it's available for potential future development.

This is interesting! I didn't realize it was a former post office or that the federal govt owned the lot. 

On 7/25/2023 at 9:02 AM, spartanburgh said:

I hope they market the site immediately for development and not have another backdoor plan with "someone" to have an 

exclusive right with no opportunity for others.  This intersection has always been my vision for each corner to be developed

into the premier intersection of Spartanburg. I would love to see each corner with a 10 ish story building. 

A lot of the vertical potential depends on how they can account for parking, and which is in part determined by what the market will allow. Now, never mind that there are like 5 massive parking decks within 1/2 mile of this location, I'm sure somehow those won't be considered. I'm not sure what the market will or wont support, but what we can say for sure is that with interest rates being what they are, and the office market being what it is (real bad), my money would be on like a 3-4 story mixed use building. Ground floor commercial with a few apartments up top. Just my guess.

Personally I'll take any building at any height as long as its well-designed at the street level.

 

On 8/14/2023 at 9:16 PM, westsider28 said:

The biggest issue I've experienced in the decks are immature people loudly revving their car/truck engine and speeding/racing on the upper levels.  Also, being able to close the upper levels says something about the under-utilization of the decks...

 

Its a good thing we're building more parking decks that will sit empty lol

[westsider28]

Saw in the BZA minutes from last month that there's a retail strip planned for the former Wendy's and cell phone repair shop at Henry and Pine.  It would be 9200 SF of retail, with a 3000 SF (75-seat) restaurant/bar.  They went before the BZA to request eliminating a required parking lot tree for one extra parking space (their appeal was rejected, thankfully).  Hopefully it moves forward anyway (the board recommended adding bike racks).

[NotNotSanti]

Thanks for catching this! 

[MidtownSpartanburg]

On 9/6/2023 at 2:06 PM, westsider28 said:

Saw in the BZA minutes from last month that there's a retail strip planned for the former Wendy's and cell phone repair shop at Henry and Pine.  It would be 9200 SF of retail, with a 3000 SF (75-seat) restaurant/bar.  They went before the BZA to request eliminating a required parking lot tree for one extra parking space (their appeal was rejected, thankfully).  Hopefully it moves forward anyway (the board recommended adding bike racks).

From what I understand, this development is by Raj Patel, a serial entrepreneur in town. Originally the plan was to open a Keg & Cellar here. Not sure if that’s still on the drawing board, but it would certainly be a great, walkable watering hole for the converse heights crowd!

Edited September 7, 2023 by MidtownSpartanburg

[Sparkleman]

I was out riding around town on Saturday afternoon with a buddy of mine from out of town. We hit downtown then took Union St all the way back towards Country Club Rd. He said can't we just carpet bomb everything on Union St and start over. I agree in that almost nothing has changed over there in like forever and it has become the south sides version of Asheville Hwy. If nothing else whatever happened to the plans to put whatever "Nipseys" was in where the old Clancy's was?

[roads-scholar]

6 hours ago, Sparkleman said:

I was out riding around town on Saturday afternoon with a buddy of mine from out of town. We hit downtown then took Union St all the way back towards Country Club Rd. He said can't we just carpet bomb everything on Union St and start over. I agree in that almost nothing has changed over there in like forever and it has become the south sides version of Asheville Hwy. If nothing else whatever happened to the plans to put whatever "Nipseys" was in where the old Clancy's was?

Maybe we can start a "Union Street Corridor" forum someday 'cause I feel this street is ripe for new development.  The Fitzgerald, Fretwell, the rail trail, new plans for Duncan Park, and the new apartments (same developer as The Fitzgerald) could be the catalyst for improvement.  Agree that Union Street is pretty sad and not a welcoming southern gateway into the city.  A road diet would  be nice too but we all know what the obstacles are.

Edited September 11, 2023 by roads-scholar

[camtology]

3 hours ago, roads-scholar said:

Maybe we can start a "Union Street Corridor" forum someday 'cause I feel this street is ripe for new development.  The Fitzgerald, Fretwell, the rail trail, new plans for Duncan Park, and the new apartments (same developer as The Fitzgerald) could be the catalyst for improvement.  Agree that Union Street is pretty sad and not a welcoming southern gateway into the city.  A road diet would  be nice too but we all know what the obstacles are.

Union street is in need of so much development, and is ripe for it, that I would love to see it be used as a way for Spartanburg to experiment with streets leading out of downtown, it really could help do some of the "missing middle" that a lot of urbanists discuss

[roads-scholar]

H-J reports Piggly Wiggly on South Church is closing.  

[gman430]

1 hour ago, roads-scholar said:

H-J reports Piggly Wiggly on South Church is closing.  

Just like with the Morgan Square redesign, another waste of tax payer dollars down the drain. Not sure why they thought adding a different grocery store would have a better result. Can’t fix stupid I guess. Keep up the great work Spartanburg. 
 

“The city, in partnership with the Mary Black Foundation, dedicated a total of $900,000 to the Piggly Wiggly as a start-up loan, to be paid back over the store's first five years. Mary Black Foundation gave the lion's share, offering $600,000, and the city put forward $300,000.

Story said the investment would be a loss for the city and foundation, as the majority of the loan has not been paid back.”

Edited September 13, 2023 by gman430

[camtology]

3 hours ago, gman430 said:

Just like with the Morgan Square redesign, another waste of tax payer dollars down the drain. Not sure why they thought adding a different grocery store would have a better result. Can’t fix stupid I guess. Keep up the great work Spartanburg. 
 

“The city, in partnership with the Mary Black Foundation, dedicated a total of $900,000 to the Piggly Wiggly as a start-up loan, to be paid back over the store's first five years. Mary Black Foundation gave the lion's share, offering $600,000, and the city put forward $300,000.

Story said the investment would be a loss for the city and foundation, as the majority of the loan has not been paid back.”

this really adds to the evidence for Furman professor Ken Kolb's theory that Food Desserts are a poor theory at trying to understand the lack of high quality food in poorer communities (at least within cities). What these communities like southside Spartanburg need before a grocery will be able to stay open without constant backing capital is community investment. There are areas of most cities that are just ignored by the city as areas worth putting money into, but the city and outside investors actually putting in the effort to not only improve the area but improve the condition of the people already living there is what will ultimately determine the success of these parts of towns and possibly could be the deciding factor of whether Spartanburg becomes a major city in the future. (Of course all of this can not be done by a city alone, a federal and state government willing to help those in need get and stay on their feet is a huge determining factor)

 

https://www.furman.edu/news/2022/04/28/the-food-desert-concept-missed-the-mark-sociologist-argues/

Edited September 14, 2023 by camtology

[Spartan]

What sort of community investment would change things for the Southside?

[Sparkleman]

Economic development and more jobs would certainly change things. Perhaps the  90,000-square-foot manufacturing facility in the old Pepsi building can help with that.

[roads-scholar]

11 hours ago, Spartan said:

What sort of community investment would change things for the Southside?

A "Northside Development Group" for the Southside would be a good start...

If Piggly Wiggly and Sav-a-Lot can't attract foot traffic and sales then we shouldn't expect another grocer in this location for a long time.  My personal opinion (and this will offend some) is that southside residents (and others) perceived Piggly Wiggly as a less than quality shopping experience when in fact it was clean, reasonably stocked, and professionally managed.  Certainly better than Aldi where it seems everyone flocks to.  I shopped there a few times and never felt unsafe or uncomfortable.

Were prices at PW higher?  Maybe on some items but overall I didn't notice.

The hard truth is that neither Publix, Ingles, or Food Lion will put a store on South Church Streets unless the demographics change and there's retail synergy to support stores of that caliber.  

Edited September 14, 2023 by roads-scholar

[westsider28]

From what I read on social media, many people had issues with not being able to find items they were looking for, and thought that management didn't adjust to shoppers' needs.  I also heard that prices were somewhat high.  City Councilmember Erica Brown posted in a comment I saw that "many shopped there early on. And then they didn’t. The sales reports were really really bad. Like not even close to sustainable."  I think that, especially these days, you need the name recognition of a national chain to be sustainable (see the Co-op's failure, too).

There is a very strong community/neighborhood group in the Southside, but they seem to be fighting against many of the things that would improve the area.  While I am sympathetic to their concerns about gentrification, what the area needs desperately is more people with disposable income.  It also just needs more people (and businesses) in general.  The area still bears the scars of urban renewal in the built environment, with massive swaths of low-density non-profit offices, lots of senior and public housing, and a sprawling school campus.  It needs what it had before urban renewal: dense housing mixed with private commercial businesses.

It's a complex and difficult situation to address, for sure.  In the meantime, I'd like to see the City adjust SPARTA to provide a route through the Southside that goes out to Union/Pine, past the Ingles and Walmart Neighborhood Market (or maybe even subsidize rideshare trips if a bus route change isn't possible).  That would at least provide some grocery access for poorer/carless residents.

[camtology]

On 9/14/2023 at 12:58 PM, westsider28 said:

From what I read on social media, many people had issues with not being able to find items they were looking for, and thought that management didn't adjust to shoppers' needs.  I also heard that prices were somewhat high.  City Councilmember Erica Brown posted in a comment I saw that "many shopped there early on. And then they didn’t. The sales reports were really really bad. Like not even close to sustainable."  I think that, especially these days, you need the name recognition of a national chain to be sustainable (see the Co-op's failure, too).

There is a very strong community/neighborhood group in the Southside, but they seem to be fighting against many of the things that would improve the area.  While I am sympathetic to their concerns about gentrification, what the area needs desperately is more people with disposable income.  It also just needs more people (and businesses) in general.  The area still bears the scars of urban renewal in the built environment, with massive swaths of low-density non-profit offices, lots of senior and public housing, and a sprawling school campus.  It needs what it had before urban renewal: dense housing mixed with private commercial businesses.

It's a complex and difficult situation to address, for sure.  In the meantime, I'd like to see the City adjust SPARTA to provide a route through the Southside that goes out to Union/Pine, past the Ingles and Walmart Neighborhood Market (or maybe even subsidize rideshare trips if a bus route change isn't possible).  That would at least provide some grocery access for poorer/carless residents.

The new comprehensive plan will hopefully be able to address these concerns as growth is more focused towards creating more dense walkable areas throughout Spartanburg. We can build new and dense housing without inflicting gentrification upon areas like this, supply just has to grow while being able to anticipate future demand and always stay above it.

Edited September 15, 2023 by camtology

[westsider28]

Notice in the paper this morning about the October 3 DRB meeting, and it's not very exciting.  Request for monument sign approval at 544 North Church (Catholic church-owned building south of The Hub), which I hope is denied.  And request for final approval of conversion of 249 East Main (former McMahan Shoes) to residential, which is a bit odd and not ideal for a retail building so close to the core, but is allowed under the Urban Code.  Side note: it looks like there's now an art studio in 247 East Main next door.

[MidtownSpartanburg]

3 hours ago, westsider28 said:

Notice in the paper this morning about the October 3 DRB meeting, and it's not very exciting.  Request for monument sign approval at 544 North Church (Catholic church-owned building south of The Hub), which I hope is denied.  And request for final approval of conversion of 249 East Main (former McMahan Shoes) to residential, which is a bit odd and not ideal for a retail building so close to the core, but is allowed under the Urban Code.  Side note: it looks like there's now an art studio in 247 East Main next door.

The art studio next door has an apartment in the rear. I like the use of space for the rear, but I agree - not ideal for retail that close to the core where there isn’t much available retail space. 

[NotNotSanti]

Not quite downtown but near it. Please move to another post if more appropriate!

Conceptual plans for Seven Peaks Plaza. From designer:

"The 𝐜𝐨𝐧𝐜𝐞𝐩𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐛𝐮𝐬𝐢𝐧𝐞𝐬𝐬 is this...

Rental space for small businesses

Main Plaza area for music, food trucks, and just a great vibe.

Main Building for rent for a Restaurant"

They are looking for investors. 

[camtology]

5 hours ago, NotNotSanti said:

Not quite downtown but near it. Please move to another post if more appropriate!

Conceptual plans for Seven Peaks Plaza. From designer:

"The 𝐜𝐨𝐧𝐜𝐞𝐩𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐛𝐮𝐬𝐢𝐧𝐞𝐬𝐬 is this...

Rental space for small businesses

Main Plaza area for music, food trucks, and just a great vibe.

Main Building for rent for a Restaurant"

They are looking for investors. 

Would this be a redevelopment of the rundown area behind "Ann's Wigs", if so I would absolutely see that area get some improvement, it would be an amazing pair development with the west main street restreeting that is eventually meant to happen

[NotNotSanti]

I think it would be more what is to the building to the left of Ann's Wigs. I could ask for further clarification.

[NotNotSanti]

Per designer, it would only be the left most building, so, not Ann's Wigs or the area behind it, just beside it. 

[Sparkleman]

I am 59 years young and find it ironic that neither West Main St or Union St has changed one bit in my lifetime.

I hope this goes through and that other things change.

[roads-scholar]

34 minutes ago, Sparkleman said:

I am 59 years young and find it ironic that neither West Main St or Union St has changed one bit in my lifetime.

I hope this goes through and that other things change.

We're about the same age but I can remember when West Main was much more vibrant.  At one time it was a busy if unattractive hodgepodge of car dealerships (Vic Bailey, LP Pitts Toyota), grocery store (Community Cash), restaurants (Steeple, Varsity, Hardees), and the Coca Cola plant, etc.  With the exception of Kapasi Glass there's nothing along the corridor today that's a draw or destination.  I'm hoping the streetscaping that's planned along with what's happening at The Grain District will help revitalize this corridor.