The State of Downtown Retail

[RestedTraveler]

^^^I was thinking about an IKEA in the middle with a Wal-Mart on the right and a K-Mart on the left.

Now you're just being plain sick, man. Sick.

[g-man430]

^^^Of course i'm kidding RT. The City would never let that happen.

[Greenville]

I can think of one thing that would really draw people downtown and could fit on the county square site. It's all in one word: IKEA.

That would be even worse than a Bass Pro Shops downtown.

I agree with RT. Downtown needs a good mix of national and local retailers - enough national retailers to bring more people downtown and give our urban core more legitimacy, but enough local retailers to keep it unique and original. The recent closings on North Main, combined with new projects like the old Woolworth's site and the City Hall plaza site, are a step in that direction.

Some key anchors like Borders, a 2-4 screen movie theater or IMAX, etc. will be great.

[goodbye]

...And other local retailers will, unfortunately, not make it. That's not OUR fault, though.

People seem so freaking upset about these stores closing, but honestly, how many of these stores did you guys frequent on a regular basis? How many were truly good stores that you absolutely loved? How many offered things you simply could not get elsewhere? The spaces will be filled, either due to better retail entering the downtown market or landowners lowering their rent rates. Based on some of the posts here, you would think that downtown Greenville is dead.

Someday you may feel the same way I do about losing these great shops. Yes, one or two closures would not be as bad, but to have so many leave in such a short amount of time is sickening to say the least. BTW, I did frequent and love several of the shops that no longer exist, and they were easily among my favorites in downtown. Shops like, The Map Shop, Earshot, Scarboro Heirlooms, and Bentley's Bookshop have a much greater impact on the overall charm and attractiveness than some people realize, not to mention the fact that they serve a relatively important purpose for the residents of downtown as well - more options. Even Diner on Main, though not exraordinarily different from most of the Main Street restaurants, it offered a unique and cozy atmosphere, a wide variety of great food, and was an instant fixture on Main Street, in my opinion. I am not upset simply for the sake of being upset. I am extremely disappointed in this city for allowing so many truly unique locally-owned shops to close down. No, downtown is definitely not dead, nor is it in danger of such, but this is certainly a phase worthy of regret and deep thought.

[g-man430]

Time for some good news. A new store called Iva, which I think is going to be a hair salon or something like that is going to open soon between Quizno's Subs and that other store at Wachovia Place on Main St.

[RestedTraveler]

Time for some good news. A new store called Iva, which I think is going to be a hair salon or something like that is going to open soon between Quizno's Subs and that other store at Wachovia Place on Main St.

Yea, Thanks for reminding us. It's an Aveda Salon...someone mentioned that some time back...it's been "coming soon" for a couple of months...I'm beginning to wonder if it's going to open.

[g-man430]

The sign on the window of the store when I walked by said "now hiring," so I would assume so.

[g-man430]

I went by O-Cha tea bar today and after seeing where they were located they deserve to close. How stupid are we getting in this country? What person puts a store in an area where nobody can see it? It's only upstairs, has a sign that you can hardly notice, and the entrance is very small and not noticeable at all. Without knowing it was next to Venti, I never would of found the place. I'm not trying to be mean about it, i'm just saying how can a company like this think they're going to make it when they locate in a place nobody can see them?

Edited January 26, 2007 by g-man430

[goodbye]

I went by O-Cha tea bar today and after seeing where they were located they deserve to close. How stupid are we getting in this country? What person puts a store in an area where nobody can see it? It's only upstairs, has a sign that you can hardly notice, and the entrance is very small and not noticeable at all. Without knowing it was next to Venti, I never would of found the place. I'm not trying to be mean about it, i'm just saying how can a company like this think they're going to make it when they locate in a place nobody can see them?

I don't follow you at all. The very location of this place is its most endearing character quality, in my humble opinion. I love places you have to "search" for. What do you feel a shop like this should look like? Anyone walking along Main Street with their eyes open should have little trouble finding O-Cha.

[g-man430]

I don't follow you at all. The very location of this place is its most endearing character quality, in my humble opinion. I love places you have to "search" for. What do you feel a shop like this should look like? Anyone walking along Main Street with their eyes open should have little trouble finding O-Cha.

Not suprising. I didn't think most to all people would understand me. I'm just one of those weird people who want to know where the store is, go there, buy what I want, then leave. I don't like wasting my time all day looking for it. I would rather go over to Woodruff Rd. and find it right away then go to Main St. and search for it. I'm not really sure what O-Cha could of done differently by being in that spot except for maybe putting up a better sign outside.

Edited January 26, 2007 by g-man430

[Greenville]

I went by O-Cha tea bar today and after seeing where they were located they deserve to close. How stupid are we getting in this country? What person puts a store in an area where nobody can see it? It's only upstairs, has a sign that you can hardly notice, and the entrance is very small and not noticeable at all. Without knowing it was next to Venti, I never would of found the place. I'm not trying to be mean about it, i'm just saying how can a company like this think they're going to make it when they locate in a place nobody can see them?

You will probably having trouble finding Brown Street Club then, because it's somewhat off the beaten path a block off of Main. That is the appeal of the place, especially a jazz club. As I have grown up more and been different places, I have discovered the value in having places that feel like "your own." Not to say that there's anything wrong with a place that's really popular that everyone knows about, but sometimes it's nice to go to one of "your places." The funny thing is that these places can do good business without being "discovered" by the masses. O-Cha had this, I think...and perhaps that wasn't enough. I will miss them.

[mallguy]

Not suprising. I didn't think most to all people would understand me. I'm just one of those weird people who want to know where the store is, go there, buy what I want, then leave. I don't like wasting my time all day looking for it. I would rather go over to Woodruff Rd. and find it right away then go to Main St. and search for it. I'm not really sure what O-Cha could of done differently by being in that spot except for maybe putting up a better sign outside.

I'm weird too in that I also like stores that sell normal, useful products.

No wonder I find it hard to buy much on Main Street.

A hidden store can work fine in Manhattan, where there are so many people that if 99.9% can't find the place it'll still do enough business, but Greenville is different!

[gs3]

Anyone walking along Main Street with their eyes open should have little trouble finding O-Cha.

I think many people walk around in this world with their eyes partially closed. It's a sad fact.

[RestedTraveler]

O-Cha is sorta the speak-easy of tea bars, that's for sure. If you haven't been told about it by word of mouth or happen to see it from across the street at night time due to the lighted sign in the window, you may not notice it.

I can sorta relate to what g-man is saying here guys and that's been my only concern with O-Cha, too. Put yourself in the shoes of an outsider or a local that rarely goes downtown. You're walking along Main Street. You're eyes are busy with all of the other eye candy that there is to see, especially in that general vacinity. There's O-Cha with it's rather obscure entrance...you notice Venti and all the perculiar things that there are there, but you don't see O-Cha's door off to the side becaue you're focused on Venti.

O-Cha does have a sign on the sidewalk, but most days it's shoved back flat against the building, so it does little to get your attention. I had e-mailed Mallie/Mike suggesting that they perhaps get a heavier wooden chalk board sign and stick it right in the middle of the sidewalk...something to disrupt pedestrian traffic and turn people on to the hotness that is O-Cha. I haven't received any kind of reply yet. I think they could possibly capitalize on a more bold decal in the window, too ... perhaps something with an arrorw pointing UP (people are naturally inclined to look up when they see up arrows, aren't they?)

Their products are so good, that I'm confident that their business could grow given enough word of mouth and enough of a reminder to the lay tea drinker that they are there. One of my flickr friends that recently moved into the area from Indiana to work at Furman says that O-Cha has the best vegetarian menu downtown. That's something I didn't know and wouldn't have known had she not told me. It's word of mouth on which O-Cha is currently relying.

I'd also like to see them establish some sort of street-vendor type sales in Piazza Bergamo for perhaps a "tea of the day" or something...that'd attract some attention to their products and business in general.

Sounds like they had a good weekend response to their pleas for support, so maybe they'll be able to stick around a while longer. All they've ask is that all their friends come in once a week for a tea...I think I can manage that.

[mallguy]

This is another reason why downtown Greenville needs coordinated marketing, with a mall-type website (perhaps http://www.shopdowntowngreenville.com?) listing the stores and restaurants downtown.

Before I visit a mall, I go to the website and like to run my mouse around the mallmanac to see what stores are there, as I might miss some if I just go straight to the mall and walk around. I then know for sure what I do not want to miss in the mall, and some out-of-the-way/relatively obscure stores get my business that way.

[vicupstate]

Has it occurred to anyone that a more 'visible' location would also be much more expensive? Meaning they have to sell more product ( or charge more) to make a profit. Someone just starting out their own business might need the break on rent.

Anyone that can't find it isn't looking very hard, IMO.

They need to invest in some advertising. The 'Chic-fil-a sample at the door' is the first order of business, IMO. Everyone on here talks about density, but then they are critical of something higher than ground level.

[vicupstate]

The Journal has an announcement that 734 S. Main has been leased for a retail outlet. It gave the name, but I didn't recognize it.

[RestedTraveler]

The Journal has an announcement that 734 S. Main has been leased for a retail outlet. It gave the name, but I didn't recognize it.

Zaidee Estella's...not a name I recognize either. That's definintely keeping Greenville weird.

[RestedTraveler]

The 'Chic-fil-a sample at the door' is the first order of business, IMO. Everyone on here talks about density, but then they are critical of something higher than ground level.

That's a great idea, too - kinda what I was thinking with the street vending, only better, I suspect!

I'm all for density and building up, not out, with respect to residential and office components. With respect to retail, especially downtown retail, I'd prefer to see it on the ground level, myslef. I'm sure anyone with young children and a stroller can relate. If something's not on the street, it had darned well better have easy access if it wants the business of folks of this nature. Fortunately, my youngest has become an excellent walker, so I no longer have to bring a stroller in tow when I go downtown.

As with O-Cha, they've announced that they're struggling and are trying to increase their business so they stay afloat. These criticisms on here, I don't feel, are necessarily of the fact that they're above the ground as much as they are subtle (or not so subtle, as is the case with g-man) complaints/suggestions that provide them with an opportunity to make changes which may improve their revenues.

[linkerjpatrick]

This is another reason why downtown Greenville needs coordinated marketing, with a mall-type website (perhaps http://www.shopdowntowngreenville.com?) listing the stores and restaurants downtown.

Before I visit a mall, I go to the website and like to run my mouse around the mallmanac to see what stores are there, as I might miss some if I just go straight to the mall and walk around. I then know for sure what I do not want to miss in the mall, and some out-of-the-way/relatively obscure stores get my business that way.

Thanks for the heads up. I just registered the domain. I was surprised it was available. Hopefully I can use this to appeal to downtown retailers as potential clients or advertisers for a new site. If any other local business person wants to help out with this let me know.

[DT-Gville]

I went by O-Cha tea bar today and after seeing where they were located they deserve to close. How stupid are we getting in this country? What person puts a store in an area where nobody can see it? It's only upstairs, has a sign that you can hardly notice, and the entrance is very small and not noticeable at all. Without knowing it was next to Venti, I never would of found the place. I'm not trying to be mean about it, i'm just saying how can a company like this think they're going to make it when they locate in a place nobody can see them?

I can think of another place DT that has an upstairs-only location, but is extremely successful...Chicora Alley. Perhaps it is the sign that is perpendicular to the building so you see it as you are walking.

[RestedTraveler]

I can think of another place DT that has an upstairs-only location, but is extremely successful...Chicora Alley. Perhaps it is the sign that is perpendicular to the building so you see it as you are walking.

That's a sign that's very noticable, indeed. You raise a good point here. Perhaps O-Cha simply needs to hang a big shingle sign out front if the land lord will allow them to do so? Hmmm....

[Greenville]

Does anyone at O-Cha read this forum? If not, I wish they would. I am not trying to overestimate our importance, but as a whole those of us who post here are informed, educated, involved in the community, and genuinely want to see O-Cha succeed. Perhaps this can be a UP project that results in them remaining open and ultimately succeeding.

[goodbye]

That's a sign that's very noticable, indeed. You raise a good point here. Perhaps O-Cha simply needs to hang a big shingle sign out front if the land lord will allow them to do so? Hmmm....

There may be something in the contract that prohibits such signage on this building, since Venti does not have one either.

[RestedTraveler]

Does anyone at O-Cha read this forum? If not, I wish they would. I am not trying to overestimate our importance, but as a whole those of us who post here are informed, educated, involved in the community, and genuinely want to see O-Cha succeed. Perhaps this can be a UP project that results in them remaining open and ultimately succeeding.

I was thinking the same thing. We brainstorm a lot on here and point out things that enterprising folks may be able to leverage to their advantage. I've sent the owners a message a couple of times (including earlier today) suggesting that they check out U.P. and this particular forum thread. I'm not sure if they've read it or not.

There may be something in the contract that prohibits such signage on this building, since Venti does not have one either.

That's exactly why I was wondering. One would think that a rational owner/land lord would make an exception for a business that is located above street level, surely.