Wealthy Street Mega Thread

[joeDowntown]

Looks nice. Now they just need a big neon sign (like the Public Market in Seattle).

 

Joe

 

Thanks.

 

BTW, for those interested, here are elevations and site plans for Founders' expansion:

 

Founders Expansion Elevations 3-13 (2).jpg

 

Founders Expansion Site Plan 3 - 13 (2).jpg

[GR_Urbanist]

I've been amazed at the discussions taking place on The Salon page regarding the attempt by the Wealth Market to regain a licence to sell liquor again.

 

I must say I cannot believe that people can be so thick to support such  a thing.

 

Wealthy Market was one of the variety of ghetto liquor stores that dotted the street between Fuller and Union. Back during the old days it was no different than the one right on Fuller that dished out junk food and bottom-shelf booze and served as a loitering point for the local wannabe street thugs. The owners of this place for years were all to happy to be part of the blight.

 

The ONLY reason why it "improved" was because it lost its liquor licence. They didnt do it for any charitable reasons or to be part of a "new" Wealthy street image. Even at that it still isn't much more than a party store. They have only acknowledged changing attitudes due to the fact that they could not make $$$$$ off of all of the hard booze anymore, so they had to try to sell something other than that and junk food.

 

Now they are looking to wind that clock back and reapply for another licence so they can start the bottom-shelf booze sales back up!

 

All one has to do is look at the other liquor store disguised as "markets" to know what WILL be coming if these guys get one. You've seen what Clark's looks like, have you? You've seen the "market" over by Logan and Eastern, have you? Fannie's market on Franklin? Miti Mini by Hall and Giddings?

 

Has anyone seen the former D&G liquor store across from the Wealthy Bakery, that even while basically falling into ruin and empty, is STILL a black hole?

 

Some of the Salon folks want to pretend that it's going to become Martha's Vineyard on Wealthy because increased booze sales will be funneled into building improvements? How dense can one get? Do they NOT know how liquor store owners operate? With a still rough Ghetto neighborhood to the south, this place is going to plug right back into the market they could not EXPLOIT over the past few years. If they still had a licence, they would have not even bothered to plant flowers in front of the place. Yes, upper income places have stores that sell booze, NO IT IS NOT THE SAME as the ones that sell it to primarily low-income neighborhoods.

 

And NO this is not the same as if a craft brewery or a place like Art of the Table or Martha's. To make such a parallel is just silly on its face, and not even worth taking seriously. It's like saying a payday loan dump is the same as Huntington Bank.

 

Liquor stores exist to exploit low-income neighborhoods. Only with stringent standards are they forced to maintain a level of quality that does not result in the degradation of the places they occupy. So far this is a no stings attached deal. Get the licence, sell the booze, ????, neighborhood improves? Really???

 

People have invested MILLIONS into pulling Wealthy street out of the fire. A fire in  LARGE part fed by these pits. Once the liquor stores were either closed or declawed did the street's image DRASTICALLY improve. but by no means has Wealthy permanently turned the corner with still too many building in a dilapidated state, and key businesses closing their doors. This will be a major step back. Yet another part of the bad old days trying to get a foothold again. This time helped by naive people.

Edited March 17, 2013 by GR_Urbanist

[GRDadof3]

I've been amazed at the discussions taking place on The Salon page regarding the attempt by the Wealth Market to regain a licence to sell liquor again.

 

I must say I cannot believe that people can be so thick to support such  a thing.

 

Wealthy Market was one of the variety of ghetto liquor stores that dotted the street between Fuller and Union. Back during the old days it was no different than the one right on Fuller that dished out junk food and bottom-shelf booze and served as a loitering point for the local wannabe street thugs. The owners of this place for years were all to happy to be part of the blight.

 

The ONLY reason why it "improved" was because it lost its liquor licence. They didnt do it for any charitable reasons or to be part of a "new" Wealthy street image. Even at that it still isn't much more than a party store. They have only acknowledged changing attitudes due to the fact that they could not make $$$$$ off of all of the hard booze anymore, so they had to try to sell something other than that and junk food.

 

Now they are looking to wind that clock back and reapply for another licence so they can start the bottom-shelf booze sales back up!

 

All one has to do is look at the other liquor store disguised as "markets" to know what WILL be coming if these guys get one. You've seen what Clark's looks like, have you? You've seen the "market" over by Logan and Eastern, have you? Fannie's market on Franklin? Miti Mini by Hall and Giddings?

 

Has anyone seen the former D&G liquor store across from the Wealthy Bakery, that even while basically falling into ruin and empty, is STILL a black hole?

 

Some of the Salon folks want to pretend that it's going to become Martha's Vineyard on Wealthy because increased booze sales will be funneled into building improvements? How dense can one get? Do they NOT know how liquor store owners operate? With a still rough Ghetto neighborhood to the south, this place is going to plug right back into the market they could not EXPLOIT over the past few years. If they still had a licence, they would have not even bothered to plant flowers in front of the place. Yes, upper income places have stores that sell booze, NO IT IS NOT THE SAME as the ones that sell it to primarily low-income neighborhoods.

 

And NO this is not the same as if a craft brewery or a place like Art of the Table or Martha's. To make such a parallel is just silly on its face, and not even worth taking seriously. It's like saying a payday loan dump is the same as Huntington Bank.

 

Liquor stores exist to exploit low-income neighborhoods. Only with stringent standards are they forced to maintain a level of quality that does not result in the degradation of the places they occupy. So far this a no stings attached deal. Get the licence, sell the booze, ????, neighborhood improves? Really???

 

People have invested MILLIONS into pulling Wealthy street out of the fire. A fire in  LARGE part fed by these pits. Once the liquor stores were either closed or declawed did the street's image DRASTICALLY improve. but by no means has Wealthy permanently turned the corner with still too many building in a dilapidated state, and key businesses closing their doors. This will be a major step back. Yet another part of the bad old days trying to get a foothold again. This time helped by naive people.

 

When Elk Brewing Co. requested a liquor license, did they run into any opposition? And why not?

[fotoman311]

When Elk Brewing Co. requested a liquor license, did they run into any opposition? And why not?

I don't know the answer to this, but it's also possible (likely) that Elk Brewing would have only requested a beer & wine license.

[GR_Urbanist]

When Elk Brewing Co. requested a liquor license, did they run into any opposition? And why not?

 A place that sells craft beer is not the same as a liquor store. All of the breweries in the area have a spotless reputation of being places that attract people for casual drinking and dining, not selling  small bottles of vodka in brown paper bags and junk food whose containers end up all over the neighborhood.

 

The Elk folks at least presented a plan to turn a shabby location into another attractive gathering spot to go along with the beer. The Market doesn't have anything concrete except a desire to sell hard liquor. If they spent the past few years really reforming the place into an actual grocery, I would be all for them having the licence because they would have demonstrated a real commitment to being something far more positive for both East Hills and Baxter neighborhoods. I simply dont see it yet, and therefore the risk of turning it back into a full-on liquor store is too great.

[Veloise]

I've been amazed at the discussions taking place on The Salon page regarding the attempt by the Wealth Market to regain a licence to sell liquor again.

...Wealthy Market was one of the variety of ghetto liquor stores that dotted the street between Fuller and Union. ...

Some of the Salon folks want to pretend that it's going to become Martha's Vineyard on Wealthy because increased booze sales will be funneled into building improvements? How dense can one get? Do they NOT know how liquor store owners operate?... And NO this is not the same as if a craft brewery or a place like Art of the Table or Martha's. To make such a parallel is just silly on its face, and not even worth taking seriously. It's like saying a payday loan dump is the same as Huntington Bank.

...Liquor stores exist to exploit low-income neighborhoods. Only with stringent standards are they forced to maintain a level of quality that does not result in the degradation of the places they occupy. So far this is a no stings attached deal. Get the licence, sell the booze, ????, neighborhood improves? Really??? ... This will be a major step back. Yet another part of the bad old days trying to get a foothold again. This time helped by naive people.

You don't need my permission to rein in the bright-eyed hipsters promulgating their great ideas; please go for it. Keep in mind that they weren't around during the bad ol' days, and perceptions might be filtered through the fun to be had at upscale taverns.

 

(Check out the "post your comments about Wealthy St Bakery South and we'll read them at the BZA meeting" thread. Um, quasi-judicial board. Does not operate on hearsay. "My friend says he likes this idea." Time's up, gents, please confine your testimony to your own opinion.)

[GRDadof3]

 A place that sells craft beer is not the same as a liquor store. All of the breweries in the area have a spotless reputation of being places that attract people for casual drinking and dining, not selling  small bottles of vodka in brown paper bags and junk food whose containers end up all over the neighborhood.

 

The Elk folks at least presented a plan to turn a shabby location into another attractive gathering spot to go along with the beer. The Market doesn't have anything concrete except a desire to sell hard liquor. If they spent the past few years really reforming the place into an actual grocery, I would be all for them having the licence because they would have demonstrated a real commitment to being something far more positive for both East Hills and Baxter neighborhoods. I simply dont see it yet, and therefore the risk of turning it back into a full-on liquor store is too great.

 

 

 

 

I don't think Elk Brewing had any positive business history in the neighborhood to back up their request, did they? In other words, they were given the benefit of the doubt and could very well have created a different kind of establishment, a nuisance to the neighborhood, with constant weekend calls to the police, fights, stabbings, etc.. But people took their "word" for it that they wouldn't. So why the double standard?

 

And why not bring up your concerns on the Salon page?

[joeDowntown]

I don't know. I think it is a pretty big stretch to say there is a double standard between a brewery/tap room and a party store. We all trumpet when projects rejuvenate a neighborhood. A party store does not do that.

 

For example, would Eastown have been better off if the trashy little liquor store re-opened instead of Harmony Brewing?

 

I'm sure some fairly accurate statistics exist. Sometimes, being too politically correct does the opposite of good.  

 

Joe

 

 

I don't think Elk Brewing had any positive business history in the neighborhood to back up their request, did they? In other words, they were given the benefit of the doubt and could very well have created a different kind of establishment, a nuisance to the neighborhood, with constant weekend calls to the police, fights, stabbings, etc.. But people took their "word" for it that they wouldn't. So why the double standard?

 

And why not bring up your concerns on the Salon page?

[GRDadof3]

I don't know. I think it is a pretty big stretch to say there is a double standard between a brewery/tap room and a party store. We all trumpet when projects rejuvenate a neighborhood. A party store does not do that.

 

For example, would Eastown have been better off if the trashy little liquor store re-opened instead of Harmony Brewing?

 

I'm sure some fairly accurate statistics exist. Sometimes, being too politically correct does the opposite of good.  

 

Joe

 

 

Okay, I'll say this: I think the Wealthy Market's intentions are being questioned because its clientele are predominantly African American, and a craft brewery's intentions aren't because its clientele is primarily white.

 

If it's not true, think of Wealthy Market's (and Clark's) clientele and what is the first thing that comes to mind? Now think of Harmony or Winchester or Martha's Vineyard for instance? Now why be worried about one and not the other?

 

Martha's Vineyard is essentially a "liquor store", with a cheese cooler.

 

Just sayin.

[joshleo]

When I see someone post things like this, it makes me sad:

 

that dished out junk food and bottom-shelf booze and served as a loitering point for the local wannabe street thugs.

Characterizing people as "wannabe street thugs" is troubling. Would you say the same thing if those people "loitering" had handlebar mustaches, plaid shirts, and rode around on fixies?

 

All one has to do is look at the other liquor store disguised as "markets" to know what WILL be coming if these guys get one

that is a big assumption, especially since the market's new owners have made a deliberate effort to include more produce, craft beer, etc.

 

With a still rough Ghetto neighborhood to the south

It so so much more constructive to talk about the concentration of households in poverty, racial/ethnic makeup of a community, etc instead of just calling it a "ghetto" 

 

All of the breweries in the area have a spotless reputation of being places that attract people for casual drinking and dining,

They have a reputation of being places that attract white, upper-middle class white people...

 

 

I live VERY close to the Miti Mini and I often think to myself why I have never gone in there. It is convenient, sells beer and liquor (I assume) but for some reason if I needed to get a bottle of Vodka for a party, I would probably end up driving to CVS in EGR or Eastown. Why is that? I think it is because I don't feel comfortable there. It's not the setting or clientele that I grew up with. But every time I go to Martha's Vineyard, I have to stop myself and think, why have I RARELY seen minorities in that place? Could it be the same reason I don't go to the Miti Mini? Maybe they don't feel comfortable shopping there because it is not what THEY grew up with. Who am I to say what kind of booze is good for a community? Why is it ok for me to stumble home after a night at Brewery Vivant but not someone who has drank "vodka in brown paper bag"? Why is it ok to have a business that sells whiskey and Gruyere cheese but not a business that sells whiskey and cheetos? If these are the differences that we are fighting against, we need to look a little closer at our REAL reasons and talk about the problems of different groups of people with different needs and different tastes living in the same community.

[wingbert]

Kameel Chamelly may be surprised to hear that he is apparently being considered a racist based on the perception that his customer base is predominantly "white". 

 

My take on the original argument was that (regardless of race), a store selling cheap hard liquor and junk food does not inherently provide a beneficial impact on the neighborhood in which it is located.  In fact, I would be more likely to accuse the party store owner selling cheap liquor and junk food who locates his store in an economically depressed area of racism because they are actively seeking to exploit a socio-economic situation where cheap alcohol and unhealthy food is easily sold despite its negative impact on the health of the customer base. 

 

GR_Urbanist could have made the same argument if a store wanted to sell cheap liquor and junk food in downtown Greenville - a town still struggling with low incomes and unemployment due to the loss of Electrolux and United Solar where the negative impact on the local population would also not be beneficial.  Would we be lobbing accusations of racism if the setting were not Wealthy Street?  A comment can say something negative and also involve the African American community and not automatically be racist.  I'm sorry, but a black person can make the same bad choices as a white person and to imply that it is OK to point them out for the white person but only a racist would say anything bad about the black person does a disservice to everyone.

[joshleo]

I would encourage you all to check out the salon page on facebook that is referred to in these recent posts and see that the owner of the store is actively participating in discussion about the recent plans. It is great to have people so passionate about our community and I am glad that they are involving the Baxter Neighborhood Association. I believe that many of the low-income residents of the neighborhood are greatly underrepresented in the online conversations about Wealthy street, so it is good to get them involved in other ways. 

 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/UrbanistSalon/

[GR_Urbanist]

Okay, I'll say this: I think the Wealthy Market's intentions are being questioned because its clientele are predominantly African American, and a craft brewery's intentions aren't because its clientele is primarily white.

 

If it's not true, think of Wealthy Market's (and Clark's) clientele and what is the first thing that comes to mind? Now think of Harmony or Winchester or Martha's Vineyard for instance? Now why be worried about one and not the other?

 

Martha's Vineyard is essentially a "liquor store", with a cheese cooler.

 

Just sayin.

 

 

And that would be wrong. I am not white. I am what is classified as "African-American" (I prefer just human).

 

And if this place was a Martha's, you are darn right that I would be supportive, because Martha's keeps it's place attractive, and clean....even to the point of knocking down adjacent buildings. 

 

Every establishment is not equal, no matter how PC it is to pretend.

 

 

 

If it's not true, think of Wealthy Market's (and Clark's) clientele and what is the first thing that comes to mind? Now think of Harmony or Winchester or Martha's Vineyard for instance? Now why be worried about one and not the other?

 

 

Clarks? a dump.  Wealthy Market? Slightly cleaner but still looks like a liquor store. Now wants to be a full liquor store again.

 

Harmony or Winchester or Martha's Vineyard? Clean, well-kept. Well lit

 

And why feel safer at one and not the other? Really? Because Those liquor stores are dim, shady and have dodgy people loitering around outside. The parking lots are strewn with garbage and no attempt is made to make them look attractive.

 

And notice that "dodgy people" does not imply a certain race. Goodness knows I would hope people are past having to have that spelled out.

 

It's like wondering why most of the people here likely dont get gas for their car on Franklin and Eastern. Or why that old gas station on W. Fulton by GVSU didnt let people in after 6pm. Or the Shell station by the Wealthy overpass locks the inside after a certain time, while the Circle K by the hospital does not. How about why does the cellphone store on Franklin and Eastern have metal shades that cover all of the windows at night, but the stores on Cherry have large, uncovered glass windows lit after dark?

 

 If a place looks shady and unsafe, then it's likely shady and unsafe. If a business is in a unsafe, or questionable place, they dont err on the side of being PC by not protecting the place.

[GR_Urbanist]

When I see someone post things like this, it makes me sad:

 

Characterizing people as "wannabe street thugs" is troubling. Would you say the same thing if those people "loitering" had handlebar mustaches, plaid shirts, and rode around on fixies?

 

that is a big assumption, especially since the market's new owners have made a deliberate effort to include more produce, craft beer, etc.

 

It so so much more constructive to talk about the concentration of households in poverty, racial/ethnic makeup of a community, etc instead of just calling it a "ghetto" 

 

They have a reputation of being places that attract white, upper-middle class white people...

 

First of all they were ""wannabe street thugs" and that is a mild way to put it. I wish I could get a TARDIS and take you back to Wealthy Street c.1995 and show you how COMPLETELY different it was from the place you see today. All of the places people enjoy in the area did not exist. It was run-down, very dodgy, crime-infested, and on a summers day it was, as my sisters would say, hood all the way to Division. My grandparents lived on Bates, directly behind this place, from the 50s until around 10 years ago, so I've know that area very well. When I was a teenager, I used to bike all the way through the Ottawa Hills neighborhood to L. Drive to get DT, rather then go up Fuller BECAUSE that stretch of Wealthy was so bad. And it wasn't because the guys that hung around there were to pretentious. If you want to equate that with some hipster stereotype on a fixie carrying a 900.00 Macbook, then I dont know what to say about that. I mean, really? Do you spend more time in Uptown or do you go down to Franklin and Eastern? Yeah, I dont venture down there either. Guys with handlebar mustaches tend to not be high on my list of characters to avoid. Should be, but not yet...

 

 

They have a reputation of being places that attract white, upper-middle class white people...

 

I'm not either of those, I would much prefer to be there. So no it's not just one racial group that desire quality places like that.

 

I live VERY close to the Miti Mini and I often think to myself why I have never gone in there. It is convenient, sells beer and liquor (I assume) but for some reason if I needed to get a bottle of Vodka for a party, I would probably end up driving to CVS in EGR or Eastown. Why is that? I think it is because I don't feel comfortable there. It's not the setting or clientele that I grew up with. But every time I go to Martha's Vineyard, I have to stop myself and think, why have I RARELY seen minorities in that place? Could it be the same reason I don't go to the Miti Mini? Maybe they don't feel comfortable shopping there because it is not what THEY grew up with. 

 

I didnt fill comfortable going there either, and I lived a a couple of  streets over from the time I was 7 until college. Walked past it on my way to school. It has always been a dump.

 

As to why more minorities dont go to Martha's? Pffft! Have no idea. I went there lots of times in the past because it was bright, clean, and inviting. If they dont want to go, then too bad.

 

Who am I to say what kind of booze is good for a community? Why is it ok for me to stumble home after a night at Brewery Vivant but not someone who has drank "vodka in brown paper bag"? Why is it ok to have a business that sells whiskey and Gruyere cheese but not a business that sells whiskey and cheetos?

 

Americans are free to drink what they want, but liquor stores are not a right, and people in the area are correct to measure the impact places like this have on their neighborhoods. And Wealthy street knows all to well how those places were prime magnets for negative elements back in the recent past.

 

Like I said before, not all places that sell booze are equal just because they sell booze. Not all places have the same history that give people pause. If Martha's was nothing but a run-down establishment with boarded-up windows and a cold exterior, I would not have gone there no matter how many types of cheese they sold (I dont like cheese btw). If Vivant was a place with rowdy patrons that threw bottle of really expensive beer at passing cars, and the owners didnt care, or they vandalized homes in the area, I would hate the place too.

 

 

 If these are the differences that we are fighting against, we need to look a little closer at our REAL reasons and talk about the problems of different groups of people with different needs and different tastes living in the same community.

 

There are no secret "real reasons".  I mean is it always some matter of race? I'm not sure, but are you implying that blacks somehow "need" liquor stores? If that's the case, then wow.

 

 

I really hate to break this to people, but people with brown skin DO like nice places. It is really ok to assume that.

 

 

Now I will grant you I was not aware that these are new owners that are applying for the licence. Makes things less doubtful to me, but not by much. I hope that these guys arent like too many liquor store owners that live off somewhere else and couldn't care less about how bad these places look.

 

If they do get one, I hope there are lots of strings attached. LOTS of them. If I'm ultimately wrong, then I will eat my words gladly.

[joshleo]

In the end, I want the businesses to appeal to both the people who live in the neighborhood who are there out of necessity and those who are there by choice. I want businesses that appeal to all races, ethnicities, and backgrounds and are comfortable places to frequent for people from many different walks of life. I think Sandmanns did a good job of bridging some of those gaps and I hope more businesses in the future can do the same (without the tax issues)

[arcturus]

So without liquor sales how does Wealthy Market make enough to do improvements?  They don't.  Guess it will just remain ugly and uninviting.

[GRDadof3]

Kameel Chamelly may be surprised to hear that he is apparently being considered a racist based on the perception that his customer base is predominantly "white". 

 

My take on the original argument was that (regardless of race), a store selling cheap hard liquor and junk food does not inherently provide a beneficial impact on the neighborhood in which it is located.  In fact, I would be more likely to accuse the party store owner selling cheap liquor and junk food who locates his store in an economically depressed area of racism because they are actively seeking to exploit a socio-economic situation where cheap alcohol and unhealthy food is easily sold despite its negative impact on the health of the customer base. 

 

GR_Urbanist could have made the same argument if a store wanted to sell cheap liquor and junk food in downtown Greenville - a town still struggling with low incomes and unemployment due to the loss of Electrolux and United Solar where the negative impact on the local population would also not be beneficial.  Would we be lobbing accusations of racism if the setting were not Wealthy Street?  A comment can say something negative and also involve the African American community and not automatically be racist.  I'm sorry, but a black person can make the same bad choices as a white person and to imply that it is OK to point them out for the white person but only a racist would say anything bad about the black person does a disservice to everyone.

 

 

I don't believe anyone said or was even inferring that Kameel was racist.

[GR_Urbanist]

So without liquor sales how does Wealthy Market make enough to do improvements?  They don't.  Guess it will just remain ugly and uninviting.

 

With them, what guarantee do you have that they will?

 

Today they need support to get that licence. After they get it, they may have a well-timed lapse in memory. Unless I missed something they haven't said anything about these sales are needed for improvements. That's just a conclusion that was made.

 

I hope that is the case, but I'm not counting on it.

[x99]

I don't know what to think about this.  The owner does not appear to have a ton of money, so I can see where he may have good intentions but no capital for improvements. Plus, the original purchase price for the Market was about $480,000.00, probably inflated by the Ren Zone status.  Frankly, that seems like a lot of money for a dumpy store with a few token grocery items.  So he paid too much in the first place, and now that the Ren Zone status appears to have run out, the owner has an $11,000 a year tax bill to contend with.  I would be having fits and scrounging for money, too, were I in his shoes.   So, do I buy the whole "we need liquor sales in order to sell groceries" bit?  I don't doubt that the intention is there, but I can't recall the last time that I saw a liquor store reinvent itself into a decent grocer and make a litany of improvements with liquor sale money.  That isn't to say it can't happen, but I would have my doubts. 

 

I think the bigger concern here is really whether the property is being used to its potential.  This is a relatively large store that does not effectively use its space.  Granted, it is not nearly as bad as Clark's, which is just sad, but there is nevertheless a lot of unrealized potential.  Now, is it anyone's business whether the owners are using the property up to its potential?  Probably not.  The owners have had seven years to do something meaningful with the place, and they really haven't.  The store is just too big to be a liquor store, which is what I suspect it will become.  Unfortunately, I suspect no one will be paying half a million for the place to take a run at a Rite-Aid, Walgreens, or CVS.  So, the biggest concern I would have is that a liquor license will likely ensure that this location never develops into something truly appropriate for its footprint, since it will likely keep the current owners afloat in a very large, over-sized liquor store boat.  Unless, of course, the owners carry through....which is sadly doubtful.  If you don't even have enough pride in the place to replace stained drop ceiling tiles for a couple bucks apiece, well....

[jas49503]

I don't think Elk Brewing had any positive business history in the neighborhood to back up their request, did they? In other words, they were given the benefit of the doubt and could very well have created a different kind of establishment, a nuisance to the neighborhood, with constant weekend calls to the police, fights, stabbings, etc.. But people took their "word" for it that they wouldn't. So why the double standard?

 

And why not bring up your concerns on the Salon page?

 

I wouldn't consider it a double standard. the lack of history should not be equated with a history of creating trouble.  I would have doubts as well regarding wealthy street market. it looks like it is one fifth of Popov away from turning into another Clarks.  the rational that they need Liquor to make upgrades to the store is preposterous.  plenty of nice stores don't sell liquor and have no problem maintaining and upgrading their facilities. 

[GRGridGirl]

Wow, there is some really rude language and untrue statements being thrown around about the Wealthy Market and the Baxter neighborhood in this thread... For those of you interested in bringing your concerns to the owners of the Wealthy Market, they are more than willing to meet with you. They will be at the East Hills neighborhood office at 131 Eastern Ave SE next Monday at 9am for those of you who would like to participate in the discussion, please let me know.  

[GRDadof3]

I wouldn't consider it a double standard. the lack of history should not be equated with a history of creating trouble.  I would have doubts as well regarding wealthy street market. it looks like it is one fifth of Popov away from turning into another Clarks.  the rational that they need Liquor to make upgrades to the store is preposterous.  plenty of nice stores don't sell liquor and have no problem maintaining and upgrading their facilities. 

 

I think when it comes to requests like this, the burden is on the city to come up with a reason NOT to do it, then it is for the business owner to come up for a reason TO do it. If it fits within zoning, and the neighbors aren't against it, then it should be approved, bottom line. We ain't Russia or China here folks. And Michigan's liquor laws are FAR too restrictive and archaic, many of which date back to prohibition.

 

My guess is, when the city of Hudsonville approved Sunday alcohol sales, there was a collective cheer amongst UrbanPlaneteers. So again I ask, why the double standard?

 

If it fits zoning, It should be up to the neighbors and the business owner, and no one else.

[arcturus]

I wouldn't consider it a double standard. the lack of history should not be equated with a history of creating trouble.  I would have doubts as well regarding wealthy street market. it looks like it is one fifth of Popov away from turning into another Clarks.  the rational that they need Liquor to make upgrades to the store is preposterous.  plenty of nice stores don't sell liquor and have no problem maintaining and upgrading their facilities. 

 

Preposterous?  Who made you an expert on running a neighborhood market?  The owner wants a license to improve sales.  Increased sales increase the chance the owner will make improvements.  No guarantees and like any private business he is under no obligation to do so.  

[GRDadof3]

All this fighting over one little liquor license request. Sheesh.

[joeDowntown]

Can someone announce something new and shiny so we can move on to a new topic?

 

Joe

 

All this fighting over one little liquor license request. Sheesh.