GSP International

[apaladin]

8 hours ago, gman430 said:

They couldn’t wait until after New Years to do this when traffic is at the lowest of the year? Weird:

https://www.wspa.com/news/local-news/construction-to-change-traffic-pattern-again-at-gsp-airport/

 

Yep I asked the same question a while back. Crazy. 

[GreenvilleSucks]

Due to demand, AA to DFW has increased to three times daily seven days a week  with two 737-800 and one A320 mainline planes effective immediately. 

Edited December 5, 2023 by gman430

[GreenvilleSucks]

GSP to ILG with Avelo to return April 30th. Delay of arrival of new plane and maintenance on others is why it’s taking so long. 

Edited December 7, 2023 by gman430

[GreenvilleSucks]

Southwest has extended their schedule until October 2nd. Some notes:

-Last day for DEN weekend Saturday and Sunday seasonal service is August 4th.

-BWI goes from once daily to twice daily on Sundays starting March 10th. This lasts at least until the end of the schedule. All other days remain at once a day. 

-Weekend Saturday and Sunday service to HOU returns on January 13th. This lasts at least until the end of the schedule. 

-Saturday service to ATL goes from twice daily to once daily starting January 13th. Goes back to twice daily starting on April 13th. This lasts at least until the end of the schedule. 

-Sunday service to ATL remains at three times a day throughout the entire schedule. 

-Monday-Friday service to ATL goes from three times daily to twice daily starting on January 8th. It returns to three times daily on March 11th and lasts there at least until the end of July. 

-Sundays from June 8th until August 4th will be the busiest for Southwest at GSP with seven flights a day to all four destinations. 

Edited December 18, 2023 by gman430

[GreenvilleSucks]

Funny how some people don’t have an issue with tax incentives for companies expanding here but do an issue with tax incentives for an airport that pumps $4 billion into the local economy and supports almost 20,000 jobs. Just sayin…

https://www.greenvilleonline.com/story/news/local/2023/12/18/gsp-airport-supports-20000-jobs-pumps-4-billion-into-area-economy-upstate-economic-impact-study/71805515007/

 

 

• Activities generated from GSP Airport add $381.4 million in annual tax revenues, $81.7 million in municipal/county revenues, $103.3 million in state revenues; and $196.3 million in federal revenues.
• Visiting GSP passengers spent an estimated $841.1 million annually in the Upstate. The analysis does not include the spending of resident passengers.
• Spending by visiting GSP passengers support 11,612 total local jobs; 9,023 directly, 1,679 indirectly.
• An average GSP passenger generates $367.72 worth of additional local income and raises local output by $1,205.73. On average, tax revenues increase $139.71 per passenger.
• A 137-passenger round‐trip flight at 80 percent capacity flying out of GSP supports 1.73 local jobs, $80,603 in additional local income, $264,295 in increased output, and $30,625 in total tax revenues.

Edited December 18, 2023 by gman430

[motonenterprises]

24 minutes ago, gman430 said:

Funny how some people don’t have an issue with tax incentives for companies expanding here but do an issue with tax incentives for an airport that pumps $4 billion into the local economy and supports almost 20,000 jobs. Just sayin…

https://www.greenvilleonline.com/story/news/local/2023/12/18/gsp-airport-supports-20000-jobs-pumps-4-billion-into-area-economy-upstate-economic-impact-study/71805515007/

 

 

• Activities generated from GSP Airport add $381.4 million in annual tax revenues, $81.7 million in municipal/county revenues, $103.3 million in state revenues; and $196.3 million in federal revenues.
• Visiting GSP passengers spent an estimated $841.1 million annually in the Upstate. The analysis does not include the spending of resident passengers.
• Spending by visiting GSP passengers support 11,612 total local jobs; 9,023 directly, 1,679 indirectly.
• An average GSP passenger generates $367.72 worth of additional local income and raises local output by $1,205.73. On average, tax revenues increase $139.71 per passenger.
• A 137-passenger round‐trip flight at 80 percent capacity flying out of GSP supports 1.73 local jobs, $80,603 in additional local income, $264,295 in increased output, and $30,625 in total tax revenues.

GSP doesn't need tax incentives.

[GreenvilleSucks]

16 minutes ago, motonenterprises said:

GSP doesn't need tax incentives.

BMW doesn’t either but they still get them every year. If an airline wanted to come here and only would with tax incentives I would have no issue with that. 

[motonenterprises]

9 hours ago, gman430 said:

BMW doesn’t either but they still get them every year. If an airline wanted to come here and only would with tax incentives I would have no issue with that. 

BMW got incentives to locate here in the 90s and my understanding is it was set for a certain amount of years. That isn't today. Why the heck do you think GSP needs incentives? They are doing good. If an airline doesn't want to come on it's own volition then they just don't want to be here. And that's fine.

[PuppiesandKittens]

10 hours ago, motonenterprises said:

GSP doesn't need tax incentives.

Nobody “needs” them.  

If someone can’t find a way to run a business in a profitable way long-term, change the business plan.  And there’s no shortage of investment capital.  There are enough idiots who throw private capital at any harebrained project, even without government money involved.

[GreenvilleSucks]

3 hours ago, motonenterprises said:

BMW got incentives to locate here in the 90s and my understanding is it was set for a certain amount of years. That isn't today. Why the heck do you think GSP needs incentives? They are doing good. If an airline doesn't want to come on it's own volition then they just don't want to be here. And that's fine.

I didn’t say they needed incentives. What I am saying is that if GSP or an airline came knocking on the door asking for them, I would open it. We can give tax incentives to all of these other companies expanding in the area no questions asked. I don’t see why it would be an issue giving them to GSP or a new airline also. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by gman430

[motonenterprises]

55 minutes ago, gman430 said:

I didn’t say they needed incentives. What I am saying is that if GSP or an airline came knocking on the door asking for them, I would open it. We can give tax incentives to all of these other companies expanding in the area no questions asked. I don’t see why it would be an issue giving them to GSP or a new airline also. 

If they aren't getting them from the other airports they fly to, they don't need it from GSP either. When they want to fly out of GSP they'll make a plea to come to the airport.

[PuppiesandKittens]

13 hours ago, gman430 said:

I didn’t say they needed incentives. What I am saying is that if GSP or an airline came knocking on the door asking for them, I would open it. We can give tax incentives to all of these other companies expanding in the area no questions asked. I don’t see why it would be an issue giving them to GSP or a new airline also. 

I want tax incentives, too, for my personal and business travel.  If I got tax incentives, then I could fly more, and that would create jobs.  Actually, let’s give tax incentives to all of my family members and neighbors, which would have an even stronger positive effect on GSP revenues and airline performance.   We are all either CEOs or in senior management so the economic effects of giving tax incentives to us will be large.  I want tax incentives. Actually, I NEED tax incentives, and anyone who opposes giving them to me also thus opposes creating jobs and economic growth.

Edited December 19, 2023 by PuppiesandKittens

[motonenterprises]

57 minutes ago, PuppiesandKittens said:

I want tax incentives, too, for my personal and business travel.  If I got tax incentives, then I could fly more, and that would create jobs.  Actually, let’s give tax incentives to all of my family members and neighbors, which would have an even stronger positive effect on GSP revenues and airline performance.   We are all either CEOs or in senior management so the economic effects of giving tax incentives to us will be large.  I want tax incentives. Actually, I NEED tax incentives, and anyone who opposes giving them to me also thus opposes creating jobs and economic growth.

Heck yeah. Lol.

[rssgvegas]

18 hours ago, motonenterprises said:

If they aren't getting them from the other airports they fly to, they don't need it from GSP either. When they want to fly out of GSP they'll make a plea to come to the airport.

Not sure if you are aware, but the majority of the service  startups and route expansion done in the US to smaller cities is done by the airport courting airlines by giving  breaks in fees and incentives.  A lot of times once those incentives run out, the airline leaves too if the service they provide isn't super successful.  Airlines are really bullish on starting up new markets.  They need a reason to come and an assurance early on they can get help starting up to a certain point to see if the service is viable.  This happens almost everywhere.  So yeah, they are getting it from other airports they fly to.  I can promise you airlines aren't making pleas to come to GSP or any other airport.

[GreenvilleSucks]

2 hours ago, rssgvegas said:

Not sure if you are aware, but the majority of the service  startups and route expansion done in the US to smaller cities is done by the airport courting airlines by giving  breaks in fees and incentives.  A lot of times once those incentives run out, the airline leaves too if the service they provide isn't super successful.  Airlines are really bullish on starting up new markets.  They need a reason to come and an assurance early on they can get help starting up to a certain point to see if the service is viable.  This happens almost everywhere.  So yeah, they are getting it from other airports they fly to.  I can promise you airlines aren't making pleas to come to GSP or any other airport.

Yep. Just look at Lakeland, Florida. $6 million being spent to land and market Avelo announced today: 

https://www.theledger.com/story/news/local/2023/12/19/polk-county-to-spend-6-million-to-develop-demand-for-avelo-airlines/71970167007/

A city or county providing incentives to land an airline is nothing new or even rare. Happens all the time. 

Edited December 20, 2023 by gman430

[motonenterprises]

4 hours ago, rssgvegas said:

Not sure if you are aware, but the majority of the service  startups and route expansion done in the US to smaller cities is done by the airport courting airlines by giving  breaks in fees and incentives.  A lot of times once those incentives run out, the airline leaves too if the service they provide isn't super successful.  Airlines are really bullish on starting up new markets.  They need a reason to come and an assurance early on they can get help starting up to a certain point to see if the service is viable.  This happens almost everywhere.  So yeah, they are getting it from other airports they fly to.  I can promise you airlines aren't making pleas to come to GSP or any other airport.

The airport is fine.

2 hours ago, gman430 said:

Yep. Just look at Lakeland, Florida. $6 million being spent to land and market Avelo announced today: 

https://www.theledger.com/story/news/local/2023/12/19/polk-county-to-spend-6-million-to-develop-demand-for-avelo-airlines/71970167007/

A city or county providing incentives to land an airline is nothing new or even rare. Happens all the time. 

The airport is fine.

[GreenvilleSucks]

Yeah, I guess you’re right. I know we don’t have as many destinations as Asheville but at the same time it could be worse. Just look at Greensboro and Columbia. Yeesh. None of them have Avelo, Southwest, or Silver. June and July 2024 look to be the busiest months ever for GSP.

Edited December 20, 2023 by gman430

[rssgvegas]

Looks like Avelo has decided to give up on GSP-MCO.  Too much competition to Orlando.  Service to end completely March 6th.  Look for it to disappear from the booking site soon and passengers who have purchased tickets after that date will be refunded.

On the flip side, Avelo is very happy with HVN service.  That will continue.  No word if they will introduce a new destination for GSP.

 

[GreenvilleSucks]

33 minutes ago, rssgvegas said:

Looks like Avelo has decided to give up on GSP-MCO.  Too much competition to Orlando.  Service to end completely March 6th.  Look for it to disappear from the booking site soon and passengers who have purchased tickets after that date will be refunded.

On the flip side, Avelo is very happy with HVN service.  That will continue.  No word if they will introduce a new destination for GSP.

 

Not surprising. Frontier and Southwest both tried it and failed. Most people either drive to Orlando from here or fly with Allegiant into SFB. I wonder if Avelo is thinking of doing Lakeland instead of MCO to GSP. Who knows. 

I feel like ROC would work out really well for Avelo like HVN has out of GSP. There’s really no competition to that part of the country. You have Rochester, Buffalo, Syracuse, and Toronto all in that general area and lots of transplants that have moved here from there. 

Edited December 20, 2023 by gman430

[btoy]

I don't get the hang up on the number of destinations.  You can literally go anywhere in the world.  So what if it is not direct.  Quick 15 min flight to Charlotte or Atlanta and you can get to just about anywhere.

[distortedlogic]

42 minutes ago, btoy said:

I don't get the hang up on the number of destinations.  You can literally go anywhere in the world.  So what if it is not direct.  Quick 15 min flight to Charlotte or Atlanta and you can get to just about anywhere.

Yeah but the problem is it's not a quick 15 min flight. It's going to GSP, doing everything there, the taking a "15 min flight" that is really a lot longer when you count boarding, taxiing, getting off, then a layover at a much bigger airport, etc. Getting to LA from GSP would be a 5 hour flight. Getting there from GSP through CLT or ATL is likely to be more like 7-9 hours. Big deal? Maybe or maybe not.

Another consideration for me would be the fare. Just because we get a direct doesn't mean it's going to be affordable; ie United to Denver. AVL to Den on Allegiant was a fraction of the cost. To get the destinations we want at the cost that is competitive is going to be tough; again b/c of the ATL/CLT and even AVL issues.

Edited December 20, 2023 by distortedlogic

[PuppiesandKittens]

16 hours ago, gman430 said:

 

A city or county providing incentives to land an airline is nothing new or even rare. Happens all the time. 

That doesn’t mean that incentives are a good idea.

Smoking, overeating, stealing, lying, etc. are also nothing new or even rare.  They happen all the time.

[motonenterprises]

5 hours ago, btoy said:

I don't get the hang up on the number of destinations.  You can literally go anywhere in the world.  So what if it is not direct.  Quick 15 min flight to Charlotte or Atlanta and you can get to just about anywhere.

This! Thank you for that post.

3 hours ago, PuppiesandKittens said:

That doesn’t mean that incentives are a good idea.

Smoking, overeating, stealing, lying, etc. are also nothing new or even rare.  They happen all the time.

True. Lol.

[GreenvilleSucks]

5 hours ago, btoy said:

I don't get the hang up on the number of destinations.  You can literally go anywhere in the world.  So what if it is not direct.  Quick 15 min flight to Charlotte or Atlanta and you can get to just about anywhere.

You’re forgetting about one important thing: the price. 

Avelo appears to be cutting a lot of routes and not just out of GSP. Maybe they expanded too fast for their own good. They are leaving DAB and MLB for good. ILG has been gutted by at least half. MCO is completely gone now and I don’t see ILG anywhere for GSP. Only HVN remains here. Ouch. 
 

Edited December 20, 2023 by gman430

[motonenterprises]

2 minutes ago, gman430 said:

You’re forgetting about one important thing: the price. 

Things cost. You get what you pay for. It's worth it for me to leave from my own backyard.