Hampton Roads Transportation

[varider]

link?

https://test.veap.virginia.gov/vastimuluspu...rts/rdPage.aspx

[cpeakesqr]

https://test.veap.virginia.gov/vastimuluspu...rts/rdPage.aspx

It seems to just be the state wish-list. Ahhh, these are "proposals" sent in by people online. Don't read too much into that, wait til the state releases its plan. Most projects will be maintenance anyways.

[mlsimons]

A new report is out on the Midtown tunnel....

It was suggested that adding a light rail line would cost the drivers an entire lane of traffic...essentially only providing 1 new lane.

My comment was this:

Skanska should be allowed to collect to portion of the ridership fare for those who choose to use light-rail through the tunnel, even if its only 25%. This would make the extra room needed in the tunnel to be cost-appropriated. Also, how about offer an unlimited monthly pass option for the drivers. Maybe 65 bucks per month. This would mean immediate profit for Skanska regardless of how many times they use the tunnel, which could also provide a savings to those who go through more than usual. I hope Skanska, Norfolk and Portsmouth keep throwing around ideas. A happy medium is right round the corner if they keep investigating!

Please guys, let me know what you think about this idea?

[cpeakesqr]

A new report is out on the Midtown tunnel....

It was suggested that adding a light rail line would cost the drivers an entire lane of traffic...essentially only providing 1 new lane.

My comment was this:

Skanska should be allowed to collect to portion of the ridership fare for those who choose to use light-rail through the tunnel, even if its only 25%. This would make the extra room needed in the tunnel to be cost-appropriated. Also, how about offer an unlimited monthly pass option for the drivers. Maybe 65 bucks per month. This would mean immediate profit for Skanska regardless of how many times they use the tunnel, which could also provide a savings to those who go through more than usual. I hope Skanska, Norfolk and Portsmouth keep throwing around ideas. A happy medium is right round the corner if they keep investigating!

Please guys, let me know what you think about this idea?

Is light rail going to be in a position to just throw money around like that? We don't even know what kind of budget it will have once things are running.

I still don't like this idea of a consortium beautifying one tunnel, building a useless highway extension, and creating either two vehicular lanes and no light rail, or one vehicular lane with light rail. Do they get to toll the DT tunnel for putting some lipstick on it?

[spiker3]

Is light rail going to be in a position to just throw money around like that? We don't even know what kind of budget it will have once things are running.

I still don't like this idea of a consortium beautifying one tunnel, building a useless highway extension, and creating either two vehicular lanes and no light rail, or one vehicular lane with light rail. Do they get to toll the DT tunnel for putting some lipstick on it?

I disagree completely. It needs done, desperately. The highway extension is not useless, it's one of the worst things in Portsmouth right now. Driving down London Blvd to Frederick or Effingham to get onto 264 is a pain, and clogs streets with traffic. Unifying the tunnels with a highway is sorely needed, especially with the volume of port traffic in the area. If the state can't do it, which looks more and more likely every day, why not let a private partnership do it?

The Midtown tunnel is the most pressing issue in the area, hands down. It has to be fixed as soon as possible. The downtown would be in the top 5. It makes sense to have all the projects completed as one, rather than splitting them up or hoping against hope that the state finds the money.

[Mobius57]

What??? The new Midtown tunnel section with light rail would not cost any lanes of traffic. The tunnel parts will have one tube of 2 lane traffic and a 2 lane multimodal tube next to it. So, paired with the existing midtown tunnel, there would be 2 lanes of traffic going west, 2 going east, and 2 rails for light rail.

Edited March 13, 2009 by Mobius57

[cpeakesqr]

I disagree completely. It needs done, desperately. The highway extension is not useless, it's one of the worst things in Portsmouth right now. Driving down London Blvd to Frederick or Effingham to get onto 264 is a pain, and clogs streets with traffic. Unifying the tunnels with a highway is sorely needed, especially with the volume of port traffic in the area. If the state can't do it, which looks more and more likely every day, why not let a private partnership do it?

The Midtown tunnel is the most pressing issue in the area, hands down. It has to be fixed as soon as possible. The downtown would be in the top 5. It makes sense to have all the projects completed as one, rather than splitting them up or hoping against hope that the state finds the money.

I concede the MLK extension isn't useless.

I don't agree that rolling these projects into one makes sense. Why not separate the projects and bid them out? No one in their right mind would disagree that there is a huge problem, but we shouldn't immediately jump on the first offer just because were "desperate."

You would put re-tiling the DT tunnel in the top 5 problems in the area?

What??? The new Midtown tunnel section with light rail would not cost any lanes of traffic. The tunnel parts will have one tube of 2 lane traffic and a 2 lane multimodal tube next to it. So, paired with the existing midtown tunnel, there would be 2 lanes of traffic going west, 2 going east, and 2 rails for light rail.

Is that from the proposal, or is that something envisioned from previous talks of the midtown expansion?

Edited March 13, 2009 by cpeakesqr

[Mobius57]

Its something i created. Parts of it are from www.roadstothefuture.com . Its what they would do though.

[spiker3]

I don't agree that rolling these projects into one makes sense. Why not separate the projects and bid them out? No one in their right mind would disagree that there is a huge problem, but we shouldn't immediately jump on the first offer just because were "desperate."

You would put re-tiling the DT tunnel in the top 5 problems in the area?

Concede the re-tiling point, but until we find out what their idea of improvement is, I'm still on board. In a perfect world the 264/464 intersection needs to be completely redone; 95% of cars coming from 464 are trying to get to downtown and 98% of cars on 264 are trying to head to Norfolk/Va Beach.

And the state currently has called for bids on the project, they're not just rubber-stamping Skanska. But if no other offers come in, at some point desperation becomes a factor. We've seen what a decade of procrastination can do, imagine another decade of it. We need something, anything at this point.

[varider]

Great video on light rail in the region. Reminds me of that video on Charlotte Light Rail

[varider]

As Hampton Roads continues to pursue an effective regional transit system, I was wondering what you guys think about the "Transit Vision Plan" and what changes you would make to it.. Do you really think they will be able to get funding and effectively build all of these different LRT lines and BRT in the time frames that they set forth?? I really am looking forward to one day hopping on the train near my house, get something to eat for breakfast, and make my way to work on the train like they do in DC, NYC, Ect.. Do you think that is a pie in the sky dream or will it soon become reality for Hampton Roads, Virginia.?

[spiker3]

There is a transportation thread...why start a new one?

Edited March 14, 2009 by spiker3

[Mobius57]

This is for the Transit Vision. I think it deserves its own thread.

[varider]

There is a transportation thread...why start a new one?

I think it deserves its own thread.. The transportation thread is about roads, tunnels, AND Mass Transit.. I just thought it'd be cool to discuss the transit vision plan on its own..

[vdogg]

I don't know guys. I'm really thinking about merging this back with the transportation thread. We already have 2 discussions on transit, one for Norfolk and one for Va. Beach. We have a transportation thread for Hampton Roads in general that reasonable people would assume includes all discussion on transit in the HR area as well. I think a 4th thread on the same topic is a bit much. How will this thread be substantially different from the rest?

[varider]

I don't know guys. I'm really thinking about merging this back with the transportation thread. We already have 2 discussions on transit, one for Norfolk and one for Va. Beach. We have a transportation thread for Hampton Roads in general that reasonable people would assume includes all discussion on transit in the HR area as well. I think a 4th thread on the same topic is a bit much. How will this thread be substantially different from the rest?

You have a point vdogg.. You can if you want too.. I am just really excited about the transit vision plan so i made a new thread lol.. You can merge them..

Edited March 15, 2009 by varider

[urbanfan]

Interesting that the next spur outside of Va. Beach is the spur to the naval base. Watch the video and at 7:40 roughly they talk about the spur running from the terminus at the medical center to the base. So, looks like its going up hampton or colley, one or the other.

[urbanvb]

Norfolk airport traffic is down 12% in February.

Seems likes its only bad news for the airport for a good while now. I wonder how other airports are fairing considering the economy?

Edited March 16, 2009 by urbanvb

[mlsimons]

Interesting that the next spur outside of Va. Beach is the spur to the naval base. Watch the video and at 7:40 roughly they talk about the spur running from the terminus at the medical center to the base. So, looks like its going up hampton or colley, one or the other.

Actually the spur is around W. Ghent. along the lamberts point coal terminus. They have already cleared some trees so they can survey a proposed route. There is redgate ave which parallels the proposed route between a paved bike/pedestrian trail and the route beside the terminus. Whether they put the line on top of the bike route (which has feasible space), or put it directly west along the fence line, I do not know. But this is the only route being investigated. It has been stated that both Hampton and Colley are too congested and do not have nearly enough space to safely route a light rail line.

Although Hampton or Colley would be the better choice, due to the surrounding density, it just is not feasible. One benefit to this alternative, is the train can go much faster than traffic on either Hampton or Colley. Possibly up to top speed. Which means taking the train from EVMS to ODU would take less than 5 minutes, even with 1 or 2 stops in between.

[urbanfan]

Actually the spur is around W. Ghent. along the lamberts point coal terminus. They have already cleared some trees so they can survey a proposed route. There is redgate ave which parallels the proposed route between a paved bike/pedestrian trail and the route beside the terminus. Whether they put the line on top of the bike route (which has feasible space), or put it directly west along the fence line, I do not know. But this is the only route being investigated. It has been stated that both Hampton and Colley are too congested and do not have nearly enough space to safely route a light rail line.

Although Hampton or Colley would be the better choice, due to the surrounding density, it just is not feasible. One benefit to this alternative, is the train can go much faster than traffic on either Hampton or Colley. Possibly up to top speed. Which means taking the train from EVMS to ODU would take less than 5 minutes, even with 1 or 2 stops in between.

That still doesn't explain how you get to ODU or the Naval base. That existing rail corridor is east and west not north and south. The proposed extension has to follow either Hampton or Colley at some point or some other less traveled road.

[spiker3]

That still doesn't explain how you get to ODU or the Naval base. That existing rail corridor is east and west not north and south. The proposed extension has to follow either Hampton or Colley at some point or some other less traveled road.

They said they would shoot around Lambert's Point, then come down 38th St and join up with Hampton Blvd to go to ODU and then the Naval Base...that's just on paper right now obviously

[Mobius57]

Hampton further up to road towards ODU has more of a median, so mabe they can restructure the road so the light rail can goo through the center up there. Hampton and Colley in ghent are too tight though. The tracks can join hampton at the railtracks by means of a flyover.

[spiker3]

Hampton further up to road towards ODU has more of a median, so mabe they can restructure the road so the light rail can goo through the center up there. Hampton and Colley in ghent are too tight though. The tracks can join hampton at the railtracks by means of a flyover.

That's exactly what i described above...there is no maybe, this is Fraim's plan to extend LR to ODU and Naval Base...and i'm not sure what you mean about a flyover, unless you're talking about the overpass at 21st St...regardless, they've already said that LR would come down 38th St then meet Hampton Blvd and up through ODU to the base

[Henry_Ryto]

Here's the lowdown: Norfolk wanted Virginia Beach in on light rail. Virginia Beach demanded the EVMS - Navy base via ODU spur as a precondition. Norfolk planned to eventually do it anyway, so Norfolk accepted. Virginia Beach:

1. Thought light rail made little sense without the Navy base.

2. the Newtown Road - Dome site DEIS numbers will be boosted by including the EVMS - Navy base spur in the Study.

The two extensions are one political package deal joined together. One doesn't happen without the other.

[Mobius57]

That's exactly what i described above

O

By flyover i mean a bridge to get the line into the median so it does not have to cross any lanes of traffic.\

Dont forget we need an airport line as well. Though quick shuttles between millitary station and the airport can do for now.

Edited March 18, 2009 by Mobius57