Charlotte Greenways and Trails

[Guest]

Just now, WEM said:

The other shopping center on park rd.  Near Selwyn and park.  Although I'm pretty sure I did read that they nixed that bridge shown on the map, but you can still cross the road bridge on the foot wide sidewalk.  

The map seems to show an implied crosswalk where the greenway crosses Park next to that shopping center, otherwise the greenway will be disconnected

 

[dubone]

 

In the video, the greenway will go under Park.  there is no way they would do otherwise. 

As for the bridge paralleling Brandywine behind Michaels, if there is concern that has been dropped, reach out to the project contact to find out.  the sidewalk on Brandywine is very tight, so hopefully they kept that bridge in the plan.

Joe Frey, PE
Senior Engineering Project Manager
jfrey  at   charlottenc.gov

[InSouthPark]

58 minutes ago, WEM said:

See, I would agree 100%, but from what I can tell they are not connecting the greenway to the shopping center.  I could be wrong, but the map on the XCLT website doesn't show a connection.  Maybe the shopping center would fund a connection, but someone would have to make a business case for it.

Reference map:

https://charlottenc.gov/Projects/Documents/BrandywineTyvolaMap.pdf

Not a direct connection but it will be a 2min walk from the Selywn access point.   

And the shopping center owns the land right where the bridge crosses back over so they could easily put in some stairs if they wanted to.   If i was the land owner, that would an easy decision (but as we know, Piper Glen parking gets hammered).  Still...more feet in the shopping center is a good thing for rent.

Edited July 27, 2020 by InSouthPark

[pgsinger]

Does anyone know what they have been doing on the Little Sugar Greenway just south of Morehead?  See picture below.  It looks like some form of infrastructure work.  I walk by it everyday, so I am curious about it.

Also, now that Atrium's expansion is approved, do we have any final details on the renovations to the greenway between East and Morehead?

[InSouthPark]

29 minutes ago, pgsinger said:

Does anyone know what they have been doing on the Little Sugar Greenway just south of Morehead?  See picture below.  It looks like some form of infrastructure work.  I walk by it everyday, so I am curious about it.

Also, now that Atrium's expansion is approved, do we have any final details on the renovations to the greenway between East and Morehead?

Isn't that is the section that had railroad ties holding up the dirt and looked like it would break away at any moment?

[dubone]

https://charlottenc.gov/StormWater/Projects/Pages/KenilworthRomany.aspx

 

That is the outflow of this stormwater project, mainly at the hospital.     I wish they had planned an accommodation for greenway on both sides in this section, but i suppose that isn't a project anywhere on the books, just a  hope. 

[videtur quam contuor]

I had a doctor who used to be in the three story building just above this worksite. It sits between the Latta creek that parallels Romany and enters into Little Sugar at that point. Every so often in a big rain the building would flood on the first floor. Once I was there and there were large fans at every door evacuating moist air and sandbags at all the doors but the main patient entry door. It had flooded a few days earlier. That building has since had a new exterior skin and (likely) interior). His practice moved to a newer and far nicer building some years ago. 

[DCtransplant]

Stewart Creek Greenway reopened this week after all the construction.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

[DH17]

On 8/8/2020 at 11:00 AM, DCtransplant said:

Stewart Creek Greenway reopened this week after all the construction.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 

Now if they can just re-open the underpass under I-77 and I can get back to my old route!

[NYtoCLT]

Does anyone know if there are plans to connect the Briar Creek Greenway in Plaza to the nature preserve/greenway in Chantilly Park?  Is it possible to connect under Independence?

[CLTdev18]

^ Yes, they are planning on connecting those areas. The greenway  will pass under Independence through one of the culverts. The greenway itself will be on the Chantilly side once it passes under Independence. I think they should be starting construction on it relatively soon (in the next year or so).

[KJHburg]

photos from last week Sugar Creek greenway.  We need more greenway trails and according to a quick search Charlotte has 52 miles versus the town of Cary (Wake County) with 80 miles!  and Raleigh with over 100 miles.  And I do remember the Charlottetown Mall/Midtown Square.  

But Charlotte wins the award for the Basketball Bush

[t_money]

In todays Ledger:

Quote

 

South Charlotte neighborhood opposes greenway connection
‘No greenway on Green Rea!’ residents say; In rare opposition, neighborhood near Carmel Country Club worries about traffic, parking

Charlotte residents are constantly clamoring for more greenways, and Mecklenburg County is moving quickly to build them to give people better nearby options for walking the dog or going for a run.

But residents in one south Charlotte neighborhood are taking the rare step of opposing a proposed greenway entrance. They say linking their neighborhood to the county’s greenway network will boost car traffic, create an unmanageable parking problem and put pedestrians at risk.

The owners of nearly every occupied house in the neighborhood along Green Rea Road, off Carmel Road near Pineville-Matthews Road, signed a petition last month opposing a pedestrian greenway access point. The petition lists the nearby Charlotte Country Day School middle school campus and Carmel Country Club as opponents, too.

 

Do greenway entrances cause that much parking and congestion?

[sclark]

55 minutes ago, t_money said:

In todays Ledger:

Do greenway entrances cause that much parking and congestion?

Also... what are the odds that this opposition will succeed in stopping this Greenway/entrance?

[kermit]

1 hour ago, t_money said:

In todays Ledger:

Do greenway entrances cause that much parking and congestion?

They do not. It has also been shown that proximity to a greenway has a positive impact on property value (one of these studies used data from Charlotte).

There should be a NIMBY surcharge on property tax bills for neighborhoods which push back and prevent new infrastructure that would add to the tax rolls. 

[SgtCampsalot]

Oh my goddddddd... there are probably dozens of kids and teens in that dead-end, lifeless street whose lives would be vastly improved by being able to get out of their trash neighborhood without weaving up to dangerous Carmel Rd to arrive to *nothing*.

This is the kind of thing growing up as a kid in suburban Charlotte that radicalized me (editor's note: among many other, more consequential things... but lord this kills me)

Edited October 19, 2020 by SgtCampsalot

[Bikeguy]

^ Neighboring Oberbeck Farms has two ped/bike access points to the LSC  Greenway and I have never seen the vehicle traffic/crowding as these folks fear.  

 

[CLT2014]

I've walked on Green Rea before. I think resident frustration is that there is no sidewalk along Green Rea, so residents are forced to do their walks in the street, et. Cars fly pretty quickly down the street and there is a school at the end which causes long back ups and traps residents. I think if the city was combining this with infrastructure improvements to add sidewalks in the neighborhood and make it more walkable that maybe be helpful. Without sidewalks, all of the various streets off Green Rea are kind of trapped and isn't really a safe walk to the greenway access point to serve their neighborhood anyhow. You'd really need to drive to safely access the greenway or risk walking right in the road.

With regards to Oberbeck Farms, they have a parking lot access point right next to their neighborhood on Sharon Road so cars park there instead. Cars definitely park on Burnt Mills Road though in front of houses where they are working on building a parking lot. Usually about 10 - 15 cars parked on both sides of the street along the last couple houses on the block on a weekend day. 

Edited October 19, 2020 by CLT2014

[kermit]

On 10/19/2020 at 11:09 AM, CLT2014 said:

With regards to Oberbeck Farms, they have a parking lot access point right next to their neighborhood so cars park there instead. Cars definitely park on Burnt Mills Road though in front of houses where they are working on building a parking lot. Usually about 10 - 15 cars parked on both sides of the street along the last couple houses on the block on a weekend day. 

As someone who is impacted by Greek Festival (nearly) every year I agree that it can be annoying when a bunch of extra people park on your street. However, as all of us here know, street parking is public space, it does not belong to residents. So when residents push back against people (greenway users) using their city-maintained streets for parking they are attempting to seize public space for their personal use. I don't think that is kosher, and they should be required to pay for this privilege. Hand every NIMBY a bill for the amount of property tax their preferences cost other taxpayers in the city.

Edited October 23, 2020 by kermit

[CLT2014]

24 minutes ago, kermit said:

As someone who is impacted by Greek Festival (nearly) every year I can say that its annoying when there are a bunch of extra people parking on your street. However, as all of us here know, street parking is public space, it does not belong to residents. So when residents push back against people using their city-maintained streets for parking they are attempting to seize public space for their personal use. I don't think that is kosher.

I concur. Dilworth does have a good sidewalk system though for residents to get around and connect on foot, despite crowded parking. This neighborhood has 0 sidewalks. Every car parked on the side of the street pushes residents further into the middle of the relatively busy and narrow road for walking. I guess the question is the greenway access point intended to improve mobility in this neighborhood (in that case maybe do sidewalks first) or is it intended to be a regional access point (and if so, why not add parking so people don't park all along the streets preventing residents from walking to the access point safely on foot)?

Edited October 19, 2020 by CLT2014

[t_money]

I'm a bit torn because this seems rather selfish of the neighborhood to stop people accessing a trail that is for the city. Also, the school was there when you bought your house and the traffic at that private school shouldn't necessarily stop the city from trying to make progress on a city wide project. My cynical side can't help but think "these rich people don't want 'others' in their neighborhood".

I can also see how it would be a pain if people came and parked there (especially without sidewalks) so I can kind of see their side.  I'm also impressed with the very very high percentage of signatures they have. 122 of 125 seems almost made up.

I also would think those that are coming to the greenway and parking are not doing it during school in/out times. Maybe on the weekends would be peak right?

[InSouthPark]

My house, as the crow flies, is 1/4m from the middle school ball fields but I don't live off of Green Rea.  I run on Green Rea regularly however.  I also live where they are building another access point to the same greenway.   I can tell you with 100% certainty, this is NIMBY and not wanting "undesirables" coming down their road.   

They are ok with the line of Range Rovers clogging the road twice a day but not a place to  access a greenway?   When I run on that road, most of these "concerned citizens" don't even move over when I am running.  They hate that anyone would come down "their" road.  Most of the houses there are in the million dollar + range.   While I do agree they should have sidewalks, I can guarantee they would throw up an even bigger hissy fit if that ever came about.  

They are also adding an entrance at Ryder Dr (with no parking ) and everyone in Shadowlake and Carmel Station are ecstatic about getting access., probably none more than me.

If I were city, I would say, "Well bless your heart....we are going to give you greenway access AND we are going to build a sidewalk all the way down Greenrea because if betters the neighborhood for ALL who live around there. "  They would lose their mind.  They want an exclusive neighborhood and not have any of those pesky poor people walking by their homes. 

Rant over.

[t_money]

^

this was on my heart but didn't know the area well enough to say it

[InSouthPark]

For those that don't know what the Green Rrea greenway plan that has the NIMBY all in arms: https://www.mecknc.gov/ParkandRec/CapitalProjects/Documents/McAlpine Creek Greenway Alignment - 2020.pdf

This isn't intended for as a place where thousands drive to.  It's meant for neighborhood access.   I can say I have probably done more greenway time on both on Sugar Creek and McMullen than the vast majority of folks in this city, and have used every single access point on McMullen and the south section of Little Sugar Creek, and I can count the number of cars parked at those access points without parking...on ONE hand.  If there is no parking, no one drives there and parks on peoples lawns.  Just doesn't happen. 

Edited October 20, 2020 by InSouthPark

[InTheYear2000]

3 hours ago, InSouthPark said:

My house, as the crow flies, is 1/4m from the middle school ball fields but I don't live off of Green Rea.  I run on Green Rea regularly however.  I also live where they are building another access point to the same greenway.   I can tell you with 100% certainty, this is NIMBY and not wanting "undesirables" coming down their road.   

They are ok with the line of Range Rovers clogging the road twice a day but not a place to  access a greenway?   When I run on that road, most of these "concerned citizens" don't even move over when I am running.  They hate that anyone would come down "their" road.  Most of the houses there are in the million dollar + range.   While I do agree they should have sidewalks, I can guarantee they would throw up an even bigger hissy fit if that ever came about.  

They are also adding an entrance at Ryder Dr (with no parking ) and everyone in Shadowlake and Carmel Station are ecstatic about getting access., probably none more than me.

If I were city, I would say, "Well bless your heart....we are going to give you greenway access AND we are going to build a sidewalk all the way down Greenrea because if betters the neighborhood for ALL who live around there. "  They would lose their mind.  They want an exclusive neighborhood and not have any of those pesky poor people walking by their homes. 

Rant over.

The article made my blood boil(another well written piece by the ledger). They live on city streets and you have as much right to that access point as they have to oppose it. If they don't like it, buy the streets at market price from the city and take the maintenance off our books.  I like the idea the city had of building the access point and placing no-parking signs all over the damn place.