First Ward Urban Village / North Tryon Vision Plan

[dubone]

29 minutes ago, Jayvee said:

Q3 2016 is supposed ground breaking for the hotel with an 18 month construction schedule. I've heard Levine is under the gun by Hilton on that one, so it might actually happen. As for the rest, who knows....

Or he could breach his contract, and they could go to 3rd Ward like Novare did. :|

 

 

I ran through First Ward Park yesterday.  It has a much more open different feel than Bearden.  I liked the materials and how  they reduced impact of 8th Street but retained the street.

[cltbwimob]

43 minutes ago, Jayvee said:

Q3 2016 is supposed ground breaking for the hotel with an 18 month construction schedule. I've heard Levine is under the gun by Hilton on that one, so it might actually happen. As for the rest, who knows....

Good, at least someone will hold his feet to the fire on something. That's more than we can say for our city leadership.

35 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Honestly guys, I'm disappointed with his plan. $700 million is not the size project that should happen on 24 acres. Should be more like $2.5 billion, in my opinion. Pretty sure Crescent is spending more than $700million on just two plots of land on stonewall. This is 7.5 city blocks and I'm a little mad we are only getting 300 hotel rooms out of it. Not to mention... Here are the promised specs from 2008. How are we letting him get away with only 1/4 of this.

“Over a 10– to 15-year period, Levine plans to build 2 million square feet of office space, 2,150 apartments and condominiums and 282,000 square feet shops and restaurants.”

 In all honesty, my expectations of this guy are so low, that if we get the park, the 10th St. apartments, and the hotel, along with the renovated Dixie's Tavern building and Treloar house, then I will be thrilled.   I am just glad his land assemblage is predominantly east of the light rail line. I am thankful most of the properties along College and Tryon streets will be open to developers who know what they're doing, and that he will not be able to singlehandedly muck up the entire North Tryon vision.

[dubone]

Even the new vision plan has mostly mid-rise in this district.   Inner 3rd Ward is not almost all high rise and high intensity public space.   First Ward could have been exactly the same or better.  North Tryon and First and Fourth Wards were the main focus of activity 10-15 years ago.  It was the entire nightlife of the city, where most  office space was being added, blocks and blocks of public amenities, the location of major outdoor concerts.   The the area received the arena and Epicenter and light rail, Imaginon, and more recently a major influx of public investment in the new park and streets.    

If the parcels were not held by a single old miser, it would have been redeveloped as densely and quickly as 3rd Ward did.   

 

Levine DID hurt all the the previous North Tryon plans because his holdings took all the energy away from most of the area.  You don't want to build a major retail destination if it will be surrounded by dead space.  

 

Now needs to be the turning point while he has some pressure of contracts and public attention, as well as a good market.   But we must not forget the abject incompetence and backwards motivations of this strange human being.  It is completely plausible for him to stall until a recession and use that excuse for contract extensions.      

He is the exact reason we don't have monarchies.   You can take a name and inherited wealth and power and end up still being completely useless to society.  

[Deleted.]

1 hour ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Honestly guys, I'm disappointed with his plan. $700 million is not the size project that should happen on 24 acres. Should be more like $2.5 billion, in my opinion. Pretty sure Crescent is spending more than $700million on just two plots of land on stonewall. This is 7.5 city blocks and I'm a little mad we are only getting 300 hotel rooms out of it. Not to mention... Here are the promised specs from 2008. How are we letting him get away with only 1/4 of this.

“Over a 10– to 15-year period, Levine plans to build 2 million square feet of office space, 2,150 apartments and condominiums and 282,000 square feet shops and restaurants.”

Did we really expect Levine to a) do what he said he would and 2) do a good job of it? 

[tozmervo]

The worst-kept-secret is official, Google Fiber's Charlotte HQ will be in the old Dixie's Tavern. 

[SgtCampsalot]

6 minutes ago, tozmervo said:

The worst-kept-secret is official, Google Fiber's Charlotte HQ will be in the old Dixie's Tavern. 

On paper: that sounds cool and excellent. As a citizen of the city: I will now initiate the most epic of eye-rolls 

6 minutes ago, tozmervo said:

The worst-kept-secret is official, Google Fiber's Charlotte HQ will be in the old Dixie's Tavern. 

On paper: that sounds cool and excellent. As a citizen of the city: I will now initiate the most epic of eye-rolls 

6 minutes ago, tozmervo said:

The worst-kept-secret is official, Google Fiber's Charlotte HQ will be in the old Dixie's Tavern. 

On paper: that sounds cool and excellent. As a citizen of the city: I will now initiate the most epic of eye-rolls 

[go_vertical]

I'm with you there. While Google locating there isnt necessarily bad, that building, now with the park next door, was just begging for a more active use.

[SgtCampsalot]

[go_vertical]

That sounds pretty accurate

[kermit]

I don't know that Google Fiber will be an awful tenant for that building. They do sponsor community activities and training out of their space in Kansas City. While some of that stuff looks to be standard sales propaganda, some of it might actually have some useful community applications if they choose to frame it that way. I am certain that they will have stronger interactions with the public than Time Warner does. 

All that said, a local restaurant with a balcony on the park side would have been better.

[sclark]

Some of you guys would prefer Dixie's Tavern over Google Fiber's office in that building? I think it's a great use of the space.

[Spartan]

Restaurant and retail space will always be more active than an office use. My guess is that Google is going to have some sort of public display area to educate people about what 'Google Fiber' is... but most likely it will be closed during evenings and weekends. So while the use might 'technically' be active, a restaurant would be better there.

[SgtCampsalot]

Well I should amend my posting to say that Dixie's Tavern DID have a history of bigoted, horrible clientele causing ruckuses. So they, as a business, I'm okay seeing gone. 

Edited December 8, 2015 by SgtCampsalot

[dubone]

I agree about Dixies Tavern.  (I hated that place for personal reasons.)  I am glad the building was kept and restored on the outside in a good way.   

Google will be fine, but not exactly what any one envisioned when they imagined integrating a restaurant into the park.   But at least it will be something that people in the area might want to stop in for with the buzz around Google Fiber, and possibly anything else that Google may end up putting in there.    But for example, it's not like we would have been happy with AT&T or TWC offices going in the park, so same with Google Fiber.  

At least the building was kept, though.  This "Philip Carey" building is from ~1908. 

http://www.cmhpf.org/S&Rs%20Alphabetical%20Order/surveys&rcarey.htm 

Bearden Park designers didn't keep any of the 100y old storefront buildings on its fringes, not even to use for a bathroom building.  There were 2 plus the Virginia Paper building from the 1930s that was leveled for BB&T Park.  

 

[SgtCampsalot]

35 minutes ago, dubone said:

Bearden Park designers didn't keep any of the 100y old storefront buildings on its fringes, not even to use for a bathroom building.  There were 2 plus the Virginia Paper building from the 1930s that was leveled for BB&T Park.  

 

I hate that they didn't keep this building of storefronts.

There's such a lacking of anything small-scale like this, it could've been an asset. It's a little obscene that a developer reinvested in an old structure for a park, but the city didn't.

[Guest]

34 minutes ago, SgtCampsalot said:

I hate that they didn't keep this building of storefronts.

There's such a lacking of anything small-scale like this, it could've been an asset. It's a little obscene that a developer reinvested in an old structure for a park, but the city didn't.

Yea dude, RIP, I loved those cool old buildings.

[Niner National]

4 hours ago, Spartan said:

Restaurant and retail space will always be more active than an office use. My guess is that Google is going to have some sort of public display area to educate people about what 'Google Fiber' is... but most likely it will be closed during evenings and weekends. So while the use might 'technically' be active, a restaurant would be better there.

Maybe they'll have a retail component selling Android phones and tablets?

[Third Strike]

18 minutes ago, Niner National said:

Maybe they'll have a retail component selling Android phones and tablets?

Don't quote me on this, but I think I Google Fiber Spaces also act as a sales store for Google's other products. The Philip Carey building is certainly large enough to accommodate a retail component.

With that said, I hope Google considers opening a full fledged office in Charlotte someday. They have offices in Atlanta, Raleigh, and near Charleston, but not here. 

[Nick2]

While I acknowledge that Levine has been holding first ward hostage all these years and it is criminal he has done essentially nothing with it, the more renderings and more details about his "master plan" that I see, the more optimistic I become. With a developer having deep pockets and owning so much land in uptown, this has the potential to be the most transformative project to ever hit uptown if done right.

Maybe it'll be done in phases. I'm ok with that as long as it's done consistently and intelligently. I like the idea of having more comparatively affordable housing in uptown. The vision shown in this observer article would be amazing:

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/business/biz-columns-blogs/development/article45512388.html

A livable neighborhood built from scratch. If we're lucky, Levine will begin this process soon. I think once things get rolling, it will keep going.

The biggest complaint I have is like RDF said, these tracts of land deserve double or triple that 700 million in development they're talking about. 

I haven't been following his hostage situation with first ward all that long so I'm a bit more optimistic about this whole thing becoming reality sooner rather than later. I think what is outlined in that Charlotte Agenda article is very possible within this current cycle.

What are the chances that he'll bring in a third party to build some actual skyscrapers (or do it himself)?

[captainjack]

The Charlotte Observer posted a video of the park's opening from tonight. The interactive water features are a great addition.

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article48717455.html

Edited December 9, 2015 by cjolley92

[InSouthPark]

8 hours ago, cjolley92 said:

The Charlotte Observer posted a video of the park's opening from tonight. The interactive water features are a great addition.

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article48717455.html

My daughter's school (which is across 9th from the park) went to the opening yesterday and all she could talk about was the water features.  This will be a great addition once we get some more "things" around the park. I know our school plans to use the park daily for recess and other activities and I would imagine 4th Ward Elementary will as well. A bunch of elementary age kids having a good time will help breathe some life into the park during the day. 

On a related note, I was looking at Levine's master plan and includes demoing our newly renovated 1920 warehouse building apartments. WTF. Well I assume my kid will be in grad school by the time that happens.

[go_vertical]

14 hours ago, Nick2 said:

While I acknowledge that Levine has been holding first ward hostage all these years and it is criminal he has done essentially nothing with it, the more renderings and more details about his "master plan" that I see, the more optimistic I become. With a developer having deep pockets and owning so much land in uptown, this has the potential to be the most transformative project to ever hit uptown if done right.

Maybe it'll be done in phases. I'm ok with that as long as it's done consistently and intelligently. I like the idea of having more comparatively affordable housing in uptown. The vision shown in this observer article would be amazing:

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/business/biz-columns-blogs/development/article45512388.html

A livable neighborhood built from scratch. If we're lucky, Levine will begin this process soon. I think once things get rolling, it will keep going.

The biggest complaint I have is like RDF said, these tracts of land deserve double or triple that 700 million in development they're talking about. 

I haven't been following his hostage situation with first ward all that long so I'm a bit more optimistic about this whole thing becoming reality sooner rather than later. I think what is outlined in that Charlotte Agenda article is very possible within this current cycle.

What are the chances that he'll bring in a third party to build some actual skyscrapers (or do it himself)?

I used to be optimistic too until I learned who Daniel Levine is. The thing is that he isn't just holding the land hostage, he keeps promising thing and builds NOTHING. He is nothing but a scared, tightwad that I dont think even wants to build on his land. I'm sure he is more than happy just collecting revenue from his lots.

Now, if he wants to land bank and make his living off parking spots then fine. That would still suck but this is America. His property so naturally his prerogative. But don't continuously work out deals with the city and promise pie-in-the-sky plans that even he knows he doesn't have the ability to deliver. The people are tired of it. Mark my words, where a multi-billion dollar project with a number of towers was teased fifteen years ago will only end up becoming Southend part deux.....but only after another ten years. And he will figure out a way to screw that up.

[Niner National]

I went to the park last night. It was pretty nice, but clearly a big step down from Romare Bearden. Not much vegetation, so even after the tree mature, it'll still feel pretty barren.

I guess nobody told the homeless that the park had opened because they were nowhere to be seen. I imagine that won't be the case long.

[Deleted.]

1 hour ago, Niner National said:

I went to the park last night. It was pretty nice, but clearly a big step down from Romare Bearden. Not much vegetation, so even after the tree mature, it'll still feel pretty barren.

I guess nobody told the homeless that the park had opened because they were nowhere to be seen. I imagine that won't be the case long.

I don't find it very "party" not many trees and a lot of concrete. Like the general idea, not executed well. 

[nonillogical]

Personally I'm ok with the more open layout of this park, but IMO it won't feel "right" until its as boxed in by development as Romare Bearden is.