Misc. Uptown Projects/News

[15895]

I would also rather build over a parking lot... But I have heard of no pre-submittals for those.

We might hav several parking lots get consumed before this one.

I'd like to see the block behind Trademark between Mint, 3rd & 4th get a 30 story residential. That'd be sweet with the new hotel behind Trademark, and the new smaller projects around the stadium

[MilZ]

We might hav several parking lots get consumed before this one.

I'd like to see the block behind Trademark between Mint, 3rd & 4th get a 30 story residential. That'd be sweet with the new hotel behind Trademark, and the new smaller projects around the stadium

Sorry I meant for a tower along the north end of uptown (other than sky house).

[Matthew.Brendan]

Wasn't sure where to post this but I suppose Uptown is at the center of it all.

http://www.newgeography.com/content/004130-the-evolving-urban-form-charlotte

There may be no better example of the post World War II urban form than Charlotte, North Carolina (a metropolitan area and urban area that stretches into South Carolina). Indeed, among the approximately 470 urban areas with more than 1 million population, Charlotte ranks last in urban population density in the United States (Figure 1) and last in the world.

According to the United States Census Bureau, Charlotte's built-up urban area population density was 1685 per square mile (650 per square kilometer) in 2010. Charlotte is not only less dense than Atlanta, the world's least dense urban area with more than 4,000,000 residents, but it is only one-quarter the density of the supposed “sprawl capital” of Los Angeles (Figure 2).

[15895]

Wasn't sure where to post this but I suppose Uptown is at the center of it all.

http://www.newgeography.com/content/004130-the-evolving-urban-form-charlotte

There may be no better example of the post World War II urban form than Charlotte, North Carolina (a metropolitan area and urban area that stretches into South Carolina). Indeed, among the approximately 470 urban areas with more than 1 million population, Charlotte ranks last in urban population density in the United States (Figure 1) and last in the world.

According to the United States Census Bureau, Charlotte's built-up urban area population density was 1685 per square mile (650 per square kilometer) in 2010. Charlotte is not only less dense than Atlanta, the world's least dense urban area with more than 4,000,000 residents, but it is only one-quarter the density of the supposed “sprawl capital” of Los Angeles (Figure 2).

We're also a bigger city than ATL....

Our Urban area isn't the best to go by.... Charlotte's metro area isn't anywhere close to 4 million people. It's around 2.5 million....

[ah59396]

Wasn't sure where to post this but I suppose Uptown is at the center of it all.

http://www.newgeography.com/content/004130-the-evolving-urban-form-charlotte

There may be no better example of the post World War II urban form than Charlotte, North Carolina (a metropolitan area and urban area that stretches into South Carolina). Indeed, among the approximately 470 urban areas with more than 1 million population, Charlotte ranks last in urban population density in the United States (Figure 1) and last in the world.

According to the United States Census Bureau, Charlotte's built-up urban area population density was 1685 per square mile (650 per square kilometer) in 2010. Charlotte is not only less dense than Atlanta, the world's least dense urban area with more than 4,000,000 residents, but it is only one-quarter the density of the supposed “sprawl capital” of Los Angeles (Figure 2).

 

 

Yeesh, that's a brutal write-up.  I guess the positive here is we have a lot of opportunity to grow (and room!)

[tozmervo]

Mary Newsome picked this up a couple days ago, some interesting points by her and others:

http://nakedcityblog.blogspot.com/2014/01/not-just-unwalkable-charlotte-is-least.html#comment-form

 

Takeaway: The numbers are a bit misleading with the boundary games

[kermit]

In addition to Cox leaping from one type of urban boundary to the next in order to suit his purpose he is also dishonest in his selection of the temporal boundaries of his data. His choice to end his analysis with the 2010 data is interesting since signs of the 'urban renaissance' he dismisses did not start to appear in census data until 2010 (the year that Mecklenburg started to grow at a faster rate than any of its surrounding counties).

In short, Cox is just another shill for the subdivision developers and oil interests which fund foundations like cato and reason. His, well documented, biases mean that he provides the same quality of information on cities as Randall OTool, Justin Bieber or anyone from the john lock foundation.

Edited January 15, 2014 by kermit

[nonillogical]

In addition to Cox leaping from one type of urban boundary to the next in order to suit his purpose he is also misleading with the temporal boundaries of his data. His choice to end his analysis with the 2010 data is interesting since signs of the 'urban renaissance' did not start to appear in census data until 2010 (the year that Mecklenburg started to grow at a faster rate than any of its surrounding counties).

In short, Cox is just another shill for the subdivision developers and oil interests which fund foundations like cato and reason. His, well documented, biases mean that he provides the same quality of information on cities as Randall OTool, Justin Bieber or anyone from the john lock foundation.

I wasn't sure if he had any specific agenda, but I took his boundary cherry-picking to indicate that he's more interested in generating trivia than presenting useful information. "Gee did you know that technically, by one metric, LA is more dense than NYC? Neat!"

[Urbanity]

Obviously any list that places L.A. having more Density than NY, SF, Portland or Chicago is a bit of a laugh to begin with.  That it lists L.A. as the most dense city in the nation is , well, it's 

 

That said I have no problems with saying Charlotte lacks real density outside of the CBD and small pockets.   Hell - it was this board that argued you need a car to live in South End...

[kermit]

Hell - it was this board that argued you need a car to live in South End...

Not exactly. The point I struggled (and failed) to make was that Southend retailers were going to need parking if they wanted to capture anything other than neighborhood customers. Outside of a few pockets, I just don't think Charlotteans are willing to do anything more than recreational walking.

[Urbanity]

^Sorry - To clarify that wasn't a dig about South End so much that South End isn't an island unto itself and even in one of the most "dense" areas of the city one needs a car.

[kermit]

NM, its in the Second Ward thread...

Edited January 16, 2014 by kermit

[caterpillar2]

Lots of people like to live in an area with a large yard for children to play and lots of space. This was the American dream after WWII. I believe  that many people from all over the world move here because of this. I personally believe that the area is laid out pretty wisely compared to most cities. The sparsely populated areas are filling in. No complaints here. I would just like to have more rail service to all areas. I don't see any disadvantages in not being a really high density populated city. I sort of like the way the young live in the villages and in town and family people have many, many options outside of the center of town.

Edited January 16, 2014 by caterpillar2

[southslider]

Except that a disadvantage to lower density is less rail transit.

[15895]

Money, money, money...

If only people would stop acting like the 20XX transit plan was set in stone and stop holding transportation plans hostage to politics. I'm not sure why we'll spend millions on Panthers, Bo. colesium and Studio Charlotte .... But transit can't get anymore funding.... Because It goes over the 1/2 tax....

I'm not sure why some council members will give the green light to colesiums & especially Studio Charlotte, but streetcar is supposedly the biggest waiste of money ever

[Guest]

Money, money, money...

If only people would stop acting like the 20XX transit plan was set in stone and stop holding transportation plans hostage to politics. I'm not sure why we'll spend millions on Panthers, Bo. colesium and Studio Charlotte .... But transit can't get anymore funding.... Because It goes over the 1/2 tax....

I'm not sure why some council members will give the green light to colesiums & especially Studio Charlotte, but streetcar is supposedly the biggest waiste of money ever

Agreed 100%

[CLTProductions]

So after talking with my buddy that lives in Austin, just got me thinking. It is astronomical how many more bars (and a variety of them) that city has compared to Charlotte. Honestly most cities (comparable in size) have a better selection than uptown. 

 

I think it would be really cool to see a development on the plot of land bordered by 3rd, 4th, Mint and Poplar and have it developed into a collection of bars (not corporate like Epi, more along the lines of the French Quarter/Lotta Arcade).

 

Am I alone in thinking this would be cool? I know a lot of you have said before that uptown doesn't need more bars/drinking establishments, but in comparison to the downtowns in cities like Austin, Columbus, Indy, Seattle....it WITHOUT a doubt needs more.

 

Using the Rich & Bennets list for the St. Patty's Day bar crawl, theres 30 "drinking establishments" on that list. I'd say add 5 more that aren't participating. That gives about 35 bars in downtown (for sake of argument). After doing some google maps searching that number isn't even CLOSE to the amount Seattle or Austin has (in the same amount of space).

 

That's not to say Charlotte doesn't need other things first (other cities do too), but this seems like it could be quickly remedied. I know an issue is there really isn't many open spaces uptown (next to Ri-Ra's is one of the only ones I can think of in a good location), but c'mon.

Edited January 17, 2014 by Jayvee

[nonillogical]

So after talking with my buddy that lives in Austin, just got me thinking. It is astronomical how many more bars (and a variety of them) that city has compared to Charlotte. Honestly most cities (comparable in size) have a better selection than uptown. 

 

I think it would be really cool to see a development on the plot of land bordered by 3rd, 4th, Mint and Poplar and have it developed into a collection of bars (not corporate like Epi, more along the lines of the French Quarter/Lotta Arcade).

 

Am I alone in thinking this would be cool? I know a lot of you have said before that uptown doesn't need more bars/drinking establishments, but in comparison to the downtowns in cities like Austin, Columbus, Indy, Seattle....it WITHOUT a doubt needs more.

 

Using the Rich & Bennets list for the St. Patty's Day bar crawl, theres 30 "drinking establishments" on that list. I'd say add 5 more that aren't participating. That gives about 35 bars in downtown (for sake of argument). After doing some google maps searching that number isn't even CLOSE to the amount Seattle or Austin has (in the same amount of space).

 

That's not to say Charlotte doesn't need other things first (other cities do too), but this seems like it could be quickly remedied. I know an issue is there really isn't many open spaces uptown (next to Ri-Ra's is one of the only ones I can think of in a good location), but c'mon.

I think uptown needs more specialized bars, both new and to replace some of the existing ones (our inner neighborhoods fare better but have a lot of room for improvement still). A high-end mixology bar. A speakeasy-style whiskey bar. A nerd bar. A gay bar. A serious craft beer bar. A real dive bar. A European beer hall. Even Raleigh has us beat by a longshot in the specialization department. Duckworths replacing Fox & Hound is a fantastic step in the right direction for at least the craft beer niche. Most uptown bars can currently fit into a few categories: sports bar, upscale lounge, irish pub. I agree that I'd like to see a new strip of bars in 3rd ward, but its going to be difficult to get most of the types I mentioned if its primarily new construction. 

Edited January 17, 2014 by nonillogical

[ah59396]

So after talking with my buddy that lives in Austin, just got me thinking. It is astronomical how many more bars (and a variety of them) that city has compared to Charlotte. Honestly most cities (comparable in size) have a better selection than uptown.

I think it would be really cool to see a development on the plot of land bordered by 3rd, 4th, Mint and Poplar and have it developed into a collection of bars (not corporate like Epi, more along the lines of the French Quarter/Lotta Arcade).

Am I alone in thinking this would be cool? I know a lot of you have said before that uptown doesn't need more bars/drinking establishments, but in comparison to the downtowns in cities like Austin, Columbus, Indy, Seattle....it WITHOUT a doubt needs more.

Using the Rich & Bennets list for the St. Patty's Day bar crawl, theres 30 "drinking establishments" on that list. I'd say add 5 more that aren't participating. That gives about 35 bars in downtown (for sake of argument). After doing some google maps searching that number isn't even CLOSE to the amount Seattle or Austin has (in the same amount of space).

That's not to say Charlotte doesn't need other things first (other cities do too), but this seems like it could be quickly remedied. I know an issue is there really isn't many open spaces uptown (next to Ri-Ra's is one of the only ones I can think of in a good location), but c'mon.

I like your idea and agree that uptown could use more bars of the "organic" nature. That said, keep in mind both Austin and Columbus benefit GREATLY from the two largest universities in the United States (Texas and Ohio State) being located virtually downtown.

It really hurts Charlotte's downtown (or at least inner core) dynamic by not having UNCC within a mile or two of Trade and Tryon. As a result, we lack significant additional pedestrian traffic, and an increased demand in things college students like (coffeehouses, interesting bars, second hand shops).

Plus, college students graduate. Kids at Ohio state and Texas live and reside in downtown Columbus and Austin. After they graduate, many stay and open small, creative businesses that they recognized had an under-served demand in downtown while they studied there. I'm sure there are some UNCC students that do the same, but I'd wager it's not even close to as many, as they live in suburban oriented apartment complexes and drive to Target.

[CLTProductions]

Very true and very good point about UT and OSU. And I also agree that we need a more VARIETY rather than just more. That's more or less what I was going for. As stated we have a very small variety, they're basically all the same. Out of the 30 I mentioned, my group of friends and I probably go to about 10 of them for a variety of reasons: the others aren't fun, crowd sucks, bad atmosphere, etc. 

 

The biggest thing we lack is a variety and that is what I would like to see more of.

 

On the topic of Duckworth's @ the old Fox & Hound spot, are we sure this is happening? I walked by it today and there was still an "Available" sign in the window.

 

Also, to ah59396's point, Raleigh benefits from all the colleges in the area as well. But on my checklist I would love to see:
 

A specialty cocktail bar (Bubble doesn't count)

A speakeasy/prohibition bar (Prohibition doesn't count. Quite possibly the worst use of that name and space. Place is just terrible)

A European bar

A real dive bar

Edited January 17, 2014 by Jayvee

[ah59396]

Very true and very good point about UT and OSU. And I also agree that we need a more VARIETY rather than just more. That's more or less what I was going for. As stated we have a very small variety, they're basically all the same. Out of the 30 I mentioned, my group of friends and I probably go to about 10 of them for a variety of reasons: the others aren't fun, crowd sucks, bad atmosphere, etc.

The biggest thing we lack is a variety and that is what I would like to see more of.

On the topic of Duckworth's @ the old Fox & Hound spot, are we sure this is happening? I walked by it today and there was still an "Available" sign in the window.

For what it's worth, whenever friends come to visit me, I take them to brevard court. I'd kill for more variety like that in uptown. We've got enough blackfinns and whiskey rivers.

[CLTProductions]

For what it's worth, whenever friends come to visit me, I take them to brevard court. I'd kill for more variety like that in uptown. We've got enough blackfinns and whiskey rivers.

But is Brevard Court really variety??? All those places are exactly the same, granted it's different than everything uptown, but Valhalla, Hooligans, Belfast and French Quarter are all the same style. Or did u mean variety in the sense that those exist, and because of that it adds variety?

 

And I do agree we definitely have enough Whiskey Rivers, Blackfinns etc.

Edited January 17, 2014 by Jayvee

[ah59396]

But is Brevard Court really variety??? All those places are exactly the same, granted it's different than everything uptown, but Valhalla, Hooligans, Belfast and French Quarter are all the same style. Or did u mean variety in the sense that those exist, and because of that it adds variety?

 

And I do agree we definitely have enough Whiskey Rivers, Blackfinns etc.

 

Yes I should clarify, variety in that that area is different (and rare) from the rest of Charlotte.

[ScottCLT]

 A speakeasy-style whiskey bar. A serious craft beer bar. A real dive bar. 

 

Just speaking for the type of establishments that I would frequent - yes, yes, and yes!!!

[birky]

I visited a buddy in Boston/Cambridge last March.  It was a different world in terms of bars. I know it's a much bigger city, but I think there is a lot of merit to the idea that the Uptown bar population suffers from not having a major campus in close proximity.

 

That said, I would love to see some different kind of bars pop up in Uptown.  Here's some shots of a cool place I visited in Cambridge called the Mead Hall.