The Greensboro Triumph Center

[cityboi]

I have to admit...it is a guilty pleasure for me to read this thread. With almost no information whatsoever, you guys (and it's pretty much one of you) have turned this into Guilford Co's 8th Wonder of the World.

Talk about WILD speculation. Anyway, don't view what I'm saying here as an attempt to change things. Like I said, I enjoy the hyperbole.

(And to be honest, I hope something big does happen in GSO...I love that city. I just think some people are going to be almost suicidal when the details of this thing are finally known.)

LOL No one is saying this is going to be the wonder project of the country but I dont believe I will be dissapointed at all when plans are revealed we heard what Ray Gibbs was saying about this project. If you disagree with him, you either think he is lying or he is just overly exagerating this thing. I know Ray Gibbs, the man is a professional who has handles downtown projects for the past 8 years and I know he would never exagerate a project. but my speculations are based upon the information that Ray Gibbs and others in the know about this project have given...and they are realistic speculations based upon that info. Im not saying those specualtions will happen though.

[krazeeboi]

I think it could be said that perhaps too much stock is being put into this one project. Typically, the megaproject as a "magic bullet" concept has always failed. I just see this project as being a healthy edition to Greensboro's urban fabric, but I don't think it will catapult the city into the next tier of cities or anything like that.

[cityboi]

I think it could be said that perhaps too much stock is being put into this one project. Typically, the megaproject as a "magic bullet" concept has always failed. I just see this project as being a healthy edition to Greensboro's urban fabric, but I don't think it will catapult the city into the next tier of cities or anything like that.

at least not in the short term future......but I do think it could over time with the combination of everything else going on downtown. I also think this project will have the "spin off" effect attracting future unknown projects.

[jednc]

LOL No one is saying this is going to be the wonder project of the country but I dont believe I will be dissapointed at all when plans are revealed we heard what Ray Gibbs was saying about this project. If you disagree with him, you either think he is lying or he is just overly exagerating this thing. I know Ray Gibbs, the man is a professional who has handles downtown projects for the past 8 years and I know he would never exagerate a project. but my speculations are based upon the information that Ray Gibbs and others in the know about this project have given...and they are realistic speculations based upon that info. Im not saying those specualtions will happen though.

No, no...nothing like that. I'm def. not questioning anyone's integrity here. I honestly hope this project turns out to be something great. I've always been one of those people who wants NC to have more than just one nationally known metro (think Ga.). I'll be very pleased for this to put GSO "on the map" along with Charlotte and Raleigh.

If anyone is offended by what I just said...please know I don't mean for it to be taken that way...it's just a comment.

I love your quote jednc.

Thanks...it was inspired by another UP member.

[krazeeboi]

at least not in the short term future......but I do think it could over time with the combination of everything else going on downtown. I also think this project will have the "spin off" effect attracting future unknown projects.

See the emboldened part. That's what it will take to help move Greensboro to the next level--synergy between all of the good things going on downtown and throughout the city, not just the contribution of one project (no matter how big). Just look at this development as a piece of the puzzle, not the whole kit and kaboodle. Greensboro will still have its work cut out for it even after it lands this project.

[Route]

I think the true megaproject for G'boro was putting the baseball stadium downtown. Build it and they will come. Look at what all has happened since then.

[cityboi]

I think the true megaproject for G'boro was putting the baseball stadium downtown. Build it and they will come. Look at what all has happened since then.

I know. It was amazing how many people were downtown one night I passed through...a late baseball game was happening with fireworks. The stadium was filled almost to capacity (6,000 plus people). At the same time Elm Street was packed with people on the sidewalks, people lined up to get into nightclubs and eating at sidewalk cafes, Natty Greene's was packed as usual. The center-city park had at least 30 to 50 people and the traffic on Elm Street was at stand still. It also looked like alot of people were coming out of Triad Stage as well. There was also activity on other streets with nightclubs and restaurants (Greene Street and Davie Street) and this was like around 10 pm. Alot of events were going on. Just imagine how the number of people coming downtown will grow even more if this "mystery project" is built! and its suppose to have entertainment options bigger than whats downtown now. Greensboro could surely rival some major cities when it comes to downtown nightlife. Greensboro will have a more urban image and will be portrayed as a city thats a happening place.

[cityboi]

for those who are still skeptical of the magnitude of this secret project, we already know the project includes a luxury hotel, convention center, residential, office and entertainment venues. That being the case why is this project still SO secret? If its nothing more than that and a few nightclubs and restaurants, we already know and there would be no reason for keeping this secret anymore. and why is the mayor so excited over this saying comments like "breathtaking"? and why is Ray Gibbs saying peoples jaws will drop? A convention center and hotel are definately great for downtown but I wouldnt use the word breathtaking and they wouldnt make my jaws drop although it is a surprise downtown is being considered for those facilities. That hints to me the magnitude of the kind of attractions that would be in this project.

[JerseyBoy]

No offense pal but I think we get it.

[cityboi]

No offense pal but I think we get it.

LOL....just checking

[1968]

dejavu

[ChiefJoJo]

I do think its interesting that this convention center could be larger than the Koury Convention Center, maybe even as large as the Charlotte Convention Center. The developers seem to be counting on major entertainment and shopping venues to target major conventions. I do think this project could spur more hotel construction in Greensboro and in the surrounding area. More hotels in the area actually help other events such as High Point's World Home Furnishings Market. If Greensboro does indeed become "Convention City" expect more BIG hotels.

Is this secret project going to have the convention center you speak of? Even if it has a conv ctr, I very much doubt that it will be bigger than Koury and certainly not bigger than CLT. I believe the cost estimate for this project has been mentioned at $200M max, right? You couldn't build a conv ctr + hotel bigger than Koury (or Ral or CLT) for $200M, and that's including the entire amt--no office, retail, etc. I also would question where the market would be for even more conference space in town.

Is it possible that something large and totally unique will be built in Gso? Yes, but I think that folks need to bring the anticipation level down a bit until you find out more details. As these types of projects often go, another city could be chosen, it could be downsized or cancelled altogether if things don't fall right.

[blueJ]

Hey Chief,

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[unique1rdu]

Yeah, but that is the price for the convention center here

[JerseyBoy]

Like I've said, for that quoted amount you're going to get something good but not as big and full fledged as it's been hyped up to be. I think the people in the know are probably relying on the after affect of this rather than the project itself.

[jednc]

Like I've said, for that quoted amount you're going to get something good but not as big and full fledged as it's been hyped up to be. I think the people in the know are probably relying on the after affect of this rather than the project itself.

I think you are probably right about this. And, the people salivating over this project will slowly start to say that's what they meant all along or that this scenario is "just as good".

Now, I don't think this will be as big a deal as some want us to believe. If I'm wrong, I'll be happy to admit that and def. congratulate the ones who had faith. BUT, if what is being hyped on this board does not happen, then I won't hesitate to hold those "cheerleaders" to the fire.

We regularly read one person say, "oh, I know someone with inside info and they say this project will contain X". Then a few posts down we have other people quoting that first person and saying we now KNOW this project will have "X". Rumor and speculation are quickly turned to "fact".

I def. plan to through around a heavy dose of reality if and when this house of cards tumbles.

[cityboi]

ok here is the deal. If the largest plans happens the way its planned it WILL be a HUGE deal and all the skeptics here will be wrong. Obviously there are chances the project could be scaled back or maybe not happen at all. Things could be taken out of the project or added. NOTHING is set in stone, I'll admit. But as it stands, IF the largest plans happens and nothing is scaled back it will be a huge deal. I mean think about it for a second. What kind of attractions could be in this that the developers would have to look at a 2 hour drive radius around Greensboro? What kind of attractions would lure people by car from as far away as Rock Hill, SC or Lynchburg, VA to spend a day in Greensboro? Think about that for a minute. There is NOTHING downtown that could curently do that. I think people need to use a little common sense here and its so obvious what the POTENTIAL magnitude of this project COULD be considering what was said about this project by DGI president Ray Gibbs, the mayor and the developers. It was flat out said that the developers want this development to be a destination for the southeast. Thats no specualtion or overhype. That IS indeed the goal of the developers and thats a FACT. Now Whether developers reach that goal is another story. But you are right, this project could be scaled back which would alter the kind of impact it would have on the city....we will just have to wait and see I think people shouldn't underestimate what Greensboro can support because you know it would be a different tune among the skeptics here if this were being proposed in Charlotte or even Raleigh. The skeptics, especially from those cities, would be saying "maybe it could have a House of Blues".

But the developers are attracted in Greensboro's central location and its downtown revitalization scene.

I think what ever is built, im sure we'll see some great architecture in this project. unlike projects built by local developers. Im sure we would see something very inspiring here, especially if this project is being built by a major national developer with deep pockets which appears to be the case.

This massive mixed-use retail/residential/office complex below cost $140 million to build and is currently under construction. Its called Premier Trade Plaza located in Orlando, Florida and includes a 12 screen multiplex theater/entertainment, 300 residential units, over 400,000 sqaure feet of office space, and shops. So you see, alot can be built with $200 plus million dollars. BTW its been rumored that the company thats building Premier Trade Plaza is the company behind the Greensboro project. So you see the magnitude of the kind of projects this company builds.

Premier Trade Plaza - now this looks like something between $300 and $500 million, especially with all the amenties included, but its only $140 million. You cant judge a project by the cost of it. One residential tower can cost as much as this entire big mixed-use complex in Orlando.

[nowensone]

City, not sure that anyone is necessarily skeptical of this being a decent sized project, just that it is still too early, and more importantly, not enough known details, to be talking about the "project" to this degree.

I know you hang out in the Charlotte forum enough to have seen the sheer number of projects that do not get realized or that get scaled down significantly. I would think that there is at least an equal chance (if not greater) of that happening in GSO since this developer would have much more dominance (and no competition) in the design process, and therefore less to keep them from deviating from any prior promises made.

[cityboi]

City, not sure that anyone is necessarily skeptical of this being a decent sized project, just that it is still too early, and more importantly, not enough known details, to be talking about the "project" to this degree.

I know you hang out in the Charlotte forum enough to have seen the sheer number of projects that do not get realized or that get scaled down significantly. I would think that there is at least an equal chance (if not greater) of that happening in GSO since this developer would have much more dominance (and no competition) in the design process, and therefore less to keep them from deviating from any prior promises made.

you could be right. certainly not out of the question. That may very well happen and it could get scaled back, or one thing can screw this whole thing up and keep it from happening. We just dont know yet...But I was just explaining to those skeptics that were doubting the "potential" of this project and the goals of the developers. They think nothing that big could be built in Greensboro and particularly downtown.

[krazeeboi]

The thing is, we really don't know "how big" this thing is going to be because right now, it's nothing more than a proposal. All we have is a proposal and a dollar figure (which is actually an estimate). We don't have renderings or site plans or anything like that, so everything is just wide open. But even given the little that we do know, I think some reasonable assesments can be made, such as what ChiefJoJo mentioned.

We need to understand that the jobs of the mayor and the president of the downtown association include being boosters of the city, and that should be taken into consideration. We just need a dose of realism here. Personally, I don't think there will be anything so spectacular in this potential project that would warrant me bypassing Charlotte just 10 minutes up the road to spend a night on the town in Greensboro, but that's just me--even if it would include a House of Blues.

[cityboi]

The thing is, we really don't know "how big" this thing is going to be because right now, it's nothing more than a proposal. All we have is a proposal and a dollar figure (which is actually an estimate). We don't have renderings or site plans or anything like that, so everything is just wide open. But even given the little that we do know, I think some reasonable assesments can be made, such as what ChiefJoJo mentioned.

We need to understand that the jobs of the mayor and the president of the downtown association include being boosters of the city, and that should be taken into consideration. We just need a dose of realism here. Personally, I don't think there will be anything so spectacular in this potential project that would warrant me bypassing Charlotte just 10 minutes up the road to spend a night on the town in Greensboro, but that's just me--even if it would include a House of Blues.

like I mentioned before...not everyone is into the nightlife scene....alot of people are though. As for the Mayor being a booster for this project...remember, like you and others on this forum, he was skeptical too, as well as Ray Gibbs when the developers first approached the city, obviously they have some information that made them change thir tune. I will say this, it must be BIG, at least for Greensboro, if those two were skeptical about this project in the beginning. I think we can all agree at the very least that the concept is as big as its hyped up to be....whether it happens the way it is conceptualized is another story.

[krazeeboi]

I think we can all agree at the very least that the concept is as big as its hyped up to be.

I don't think we can, because we don't have anything solid. Don't get me wrong, it sounds substantial, but I'm very hesitant to start comparing this potential project to any others because we don't have any sure details about it--only what it could contain.

[JerseyBoy]

Krazeeboi is absolutely right, we all have to remember that we have NO solid facts about this project.

[cityboi]

Krazeeboi is absolutely right, we all have to remember that we have NO solid facts about this project.

We do have solid facts in what the developers said about the project and that is that their goal is for this to be a southeast destination with entertainment venues for all ages and some attracting national acts. Whether or not they meet their goals is another story. Thats what I meant when I said we can at least agree that the concept is what its hyped up to be.

[krazeeboi]

We do have solid facts in what the developers said about the project and that is that their goal is for this to be a southeast destination with entertainment venues for all ages and some attracting national acts. Whether or not they meet their goals is another story. Thats what I meant when I said we can at least agree that the concept is what its hyped up to be.

But those aren't details; all of that is quite vague and could mean any number of things. So no, I can't agree that the concept is what it has been hyped up to be. Convention centers larger than Raleigh's and Charlotte's? "LA of the East Coast"? Nah, I can't agree with all of that.