3rd Ward Midrise Projects

[atlrvr]

THis makes me realize how dreadful the 330 S. Tryon adn 400 S. Tryon parking decks are, and how bad the will mess up that developing streetscape.

[PwC Keith]

First great renderings. They look awesome. Typically, I only the read the forum on here and ask questions, but this time it looks like I might be able to add some information. In Friday's CBJ about the condo market it looked like there were two big updates to this project.

1) It looks like the expected completion date moved from Winter 2009 to Spring 2009, so probably a push back of 3 months or so.

2) which I consider to be more interesting is that units won't be sold until the project is nearing completion. So in my eyes that probably means that units won't go on sale until at least Nov, when I previously was thinking possibly sometime in the March timeframe. That will definitely take a lot of speculators out of this project and also allow Novare to make sure their inventory of Avenue units is reduced to almost none.

Overall, I'm still very excited about this project and find myself looking at the webcam at least twice a day to see how much progress is being made.

[dubone]

While it is hopeless to expect that 400 S Tryon's deck will be replaced, I feel as though there is a strong possibility that after the market uncertainty straightens itself out, that the Chamber's building associated parking deck would be a strong candidate for redevelopment. The Chamber might benefit to take up office space in one of the new towers, and sell that extremely prime land. Not only does the land face the park, but it also faces Wachovia Plaza. With South Tryon and South Church gaining development momentum, they might benefit greatly from selling that land.

It is prime land with a terrible deck the really hurts the frontage of the park that they worked so hard to get there. Perhaps if they are unwilling to move, they could just sell the land under their parking deck. While it doesn't redeem it much at all, at least the 400 S Tryon deck has an attempt at art and retail on their street level, rather than just seeing the front of the cars in spaces. It is still bad, just better than most of the other S Church Street decks.

I toured the Avenue today and was wondering where the amenities will go for Catalyst. Will they be in the building or on the separate parking deck?

[atlrvr]

Except the Chamber doesn't own the space, First Colony does....that said, We may see them look to redevelop the entire parcel, but obviously they have the Renaissance Place project to tackle first....I suppose depending on how well that works out, they would reconsider the 330 S. Tryon building as a future project....it just makes so much money for them, that I don't expect much to happen until the area is a good bit more built out.....of course it's tough to say what kind of premium that location will become once all the surrounding projects are completed.....that's my long-winded way of saying I have no clue, but I expect at somepoint that it will be redeveloped.

The 400 S. Tryon deck while god awful ugly, does at least have two or three retail spaces along Church (oops, I just saw Dubone already mentioned this)....I would almost be ok with a recladding, but again, at somepoint, downtown prices will dictate that it makes more sense to redevelop....there's a lot easier decks/surface lots to tackle though in the interim.

Edit. About Catalyst, the amenities will go on a second floor "amenities deck" on the south side of the building between there and the alley separating it from the new Novare/Trinity office tower.

[SentioVenia]

I think we're finally going see the north-south spine of uptown and its energy spread out from Tryon. This has been predicted for years, but there was never enough development to serve as catalyst (Hey, I'm punny!).

Example: with EpiCentre/TTT and the Ritz-Carlton well under way, Founder's Hall is finally going to get a makeover that opens up its College St. face to the public. It's almost ridiculous to think that such a public building with that much retail/cultural facilities kept such a closed-off, blank face to the one street that it fronted! But in '92 when it was finished, everything was directed towards Tryon.

Once Romare Bearden Park opens - regardless of what happens with 330 S. Tryon - I think we'll see some focus on Church St., and hopefully those parking decks serving Tryon St. buildings.

[Mobuchu]

I toured the Avenue today and was wondering where the amenities will go for Catalyst. Will they be in the building or on the separate parking deck?

Here ya go.

1-27-08

This just shows the nice wide space they left for the sidewalks

[Skyybutter]

Landing in Charlotte today I had no problem spotting this tower taking shape. A bit harder to see Wachovia still.

[charlotte49ersuptown]

This just shows the nice wide space they left for the sidewalks

Some of this space is allowed for the conversion of MLK to a two way street. If you look up the street towards the Rennaisance Hotel that is probably about how wide the street will be here as well. Of course there will also be 16 foot sidewalks which adheres to the Center City Transportation Plan

[Guest]

Landing in Charlotte today I had no problem spotting this tower taking shape. A bit harder to see Wachovia still.

I'm not sure how thats possible, wachovia tower is taller than Catalyst at this point in construction, due to much smaller floor heights.

[28202]

Duke power & the stadium block some of the visibility of Wachovia at this point from the airport side of the skyline. Catalyst is on the outer edge of the core.

[dubone]

Given the new development in the area, it would be very wise to extend the eastbound lanes of MLK down to Church street, which would be a natural interim terminus to those, given that they can then turn right onto the one-way 'workhorse' street toward the freeway interchange. Does anyone know if this is included in part of the funds for nearby street improvements that are part of the park and ballpark deal?

Novare would certainly benefit from having the larger 2-way street be extended in front of their land, as it would greatly simplify access to the site for its new residents.

While ending the 2-way lanes for now at Church, it would be awesome if the city would call eminent domain and chop off the edge of the 400 S Tryon deck.

[grodney]

They added the cage-extender thingies to the tower cranes over the weekend, so we should be seeing these cranes get taller in the near future.

[Andyc545]

I don't remember this file ever being posted on here, but here's todays find...

http://www.trinity-partners.com/admin-syst...%2011.28.07.pdf

It's for the leasing of 440 S. Church Office tower. There's a few new views in there that I specifically enjoy, especially page 4 that has the three towers and Wachovia's new HQer's incorporated, sized, and located within the uptown isometric shot...

This file should answer a lot of the questions about where the buildings are located, their sq footage, office space floorplans, etc...

Edited February 6, 2008 by Andyc545

[Guest]

I don't remember this file ever being posted on here, but here's todays find...

http://www.trinity-partners.com/admin-syst...%2011.28.07.pdf

It's for the leasing of 440 S. Church Office tower. There's a few new views in there that I specifically enjoy, especially page 4 that has the three towers and Wachovia's new HQer's incorporated, sized, and located within the uptown isometric shot...

This file should answer a lot of the questions about where the buildings are located, their sq footage, office space floorplans, etc...

FANTASTIC find, adn no I don't think this has been posted before. I love the flow of each of the buildings lobbies, thank you very much for sharing Andy!

[PwC Keith]

I don't remember this file ever being posted on here, but here's todays find...

http://www.trinity-partners.com/admin-syst...%2011.28.07.pdf

It's for the leasing of 440 S. Church Office tower. There's a few new views in there that I specifically enjoy, especially page 4 that has the three towers and Wachovia's new HQer's incorporated, sized, and located within the uptown isometric shot...

This file should answer a lot of the questions about where the buildings are located, their sq footage, office space floorplans, etc...

I agree that is an amazing set of pictures. I'm also very impressed with the details for the park. Good work.

[dubone]

The siteplan was great to see, as it seems that while fitting in with the grid in a very solid way, they are also creating a very safe pedestrian environment to allow for the necessary mixing between the buildings (especially to the parking deck). I'm also glad that the pool and amenities are in the Catalyst building for those residents, although I think there will be some sun-shadow issues with the office tower, but I might be wrong.

I think it is great that they are able to put all of the parking into a single large deck shared for all the buildings on that large block. It is a bit of extra walking for the Catalyst residents, but it supports the reduced dependence on cars that uptown condo owners should theoretically experience.

I am so happy that Novare has come to this city and is making these types of project happen here.

[cha]

i am happy to see that at least they are putting some retail in the parking deck

[Mobuchu]

Yeah, looks like a decent amount of retail spread out through the entire block. Do any of those look big enough to support a grocery store?

[Andyc545]

Bravo on Novare. After I found that file and saw the site plan, I was more excited and more impressed then I was before. I think that small street that runs between Catalyst and the office tower works well. It gives access to both buildings from all sides, and then it also puts in a little drop off hotel entrance, without polluting cars on the main roads, and of course offers an alternative into the parking deck. The retail was better than expected, as it was distributed throughout the project. I see how they used that signature "S" thats incorporated into the architecture of the office tower and then brings that as part of the logo for "S" as in South Church. I hope they carry that distinct "s" curve more throughout making the building a more recognizable icon, since it will be fairly short. As far as its impact on the skyline, it makes a much stronger statement than I originally imagined. Since the buildings don't exceed 40 floors and would otherwise blend in, these 3 towers actually adds a tremendous amount of growth and density in 3rd Ward, and with the park and baseball stadium, it's amazing how transformed 3rd Ward is. It works beautifully with all projects around it, the stadium, and Wachovia's new campus. Novare is brilliant.

[atlrvr]

Yeah, looks like a decent amount of retail spread out through the entire block. Do any of those look big enough to support a grocery store?

I was wondering that myself......The largest space is the space in the parking deck, which would also be the most logical place to put a grocery store, as many customers would want to lode up their car a la HT at 5th and Pop. The space only appears to be 10k-12k sq. ft. That's really small for any major chain, except perhaps Trader Joes, though with them at Midtown, I don't see it happening.

My money is still on a smaller Bloom concept. Perhaps they could do a lofted version similar to HT, but being in a parking deck might make that hard, since they typically have low ceiling heights.

[grodney]

Taken Thu Feb 07.

[SentioVenia]

^^^^

It looks like those are footings where Twelve will be. Does that mean we should be expecting that to start soon?

[UrbanCharlotte]

No thats for the parking deck

[hotshoe]

Does Novare have any tenants for the office space yet ?

[Charlotte_native]

Does Novare have any tenants for the office space yet ?

None that i've seen or heard announced.