Charlotte Center City Streetcar Network

[cltbwimob]

I completely agree with you about Eric's article being misleading.

As for Cut and cover, I'm not so sure about that... To really do what you suggested would require the purchase of about 100' of ROW, and putting a median down Monroe Rd (in order to reduce the possibilities of car and train collisions). That would require the purchase of not just land but also a lot of buildings. The street disruption with cut and cover would be similar as to a streetcar, since they would redo all the utilities putting in a streetcar. You could, arguably, have less traffic disruption compared to a streetcar, as you could temporarily bridge over the cut section as you work on it.

It wouldn't really need 100 ft of new ROW for a median and separation. The BLE only has a 31 ft wide median in North Tryon with only 4-5 feet of separation planned between the outer edge of rail cars and the inner edge of the road. Some light rail systems such as Norfolk, Houston, Salt Lake City and Portland have sections where they more or less did not really even bother with re-widening the streets, and just replaced automotive travel lanes with LRT. There is not a huge separation requirement between light rail and traffic, so there would be very little ROW purchase requirement beyond what is needed to add new lanes and a little extra for center platforms around station areas. For separation, concrete bollards and chains are often sufficient to keep autos off the tracks.

With regard to cut and cover, any time a large tunnel is incorporated into the design of a transit system, you can expect it to cost $200-300 million per mile compared to surface system costs of $60-110 million per mile. Standard 18-36 inch digs for utility work on a surface system aren't nearly as intrusive as 20-30 ft trenches, and the cost to engineer/build underground systems is much higher as a result. Case in point-the recently shelved Baltimore Red Line was to have a cost of almost $200 million per mile and only about a third of it was to travel underground. Tunnels will, without a doubt, be cost prohibitive.

Edited July 10, 2015 by cltbwimob

[Spartan]

There is not a huge separation requirement between light rail and traffic, so there would be very little ROW purchase requirement beyond what is needed to add new lanes and a little extra for center platforms around station areas. For separation, concrete bollards and chains are often sufficient to keep autos off the tracks.

 

Technically thats true, and it works quite well... but will NCDOT go for it since Monroe Rd is state-maintained?

[cltbwimob]

Technically thats true, and it works quite well... but will NCDOT go for it since Monroe Rd is state-maintained?

It is my understanding that all that would be required from the state's perspective is to maintain the same amount of travel lanes.  Of course that's just me extrapolating an opinion from a conversation that I had with one of the CATS engineers and not necessarily anything I can point to in a document so I could be wrong.  However, the Tryon St (also maintained by the state I believe) median is 31 feet wide, which is not much wider than 2 standard 12 foot lanes of asphalt.  That's why I say not much more ROW than what is required to widen the road by two new travel lanes would be required to implement LRT ROW.

Edited July 10, 2015 by cltbwimob

[ajfunder]

Anyone else feel like the streetcar is more than four days from opening. They are still working on the switch machines at Trade and Caldwell, half the stations lack benches, and 1/3 are missing some windscreen panels (Hawthorne/5th has none). I have this feeling that some of the windscreens were broken during transport/storage/installation.

[tozmervo]

Well, as of July 14 2015, Charlotte once again has streetcar service. The public may step on board starting at 1pm, the politicos are having their joyride now.

[RaleighHeelsfan]

Please someone! Take some live video of the ride and post it!!! I can't be there for another two weeks. Can't wait:)

[tozmervo]

Best option right now: https://twitter.com/ChrisMillerWBT/status/620973501047001088

From what I'm seeing reported on twitter, Anthony Foxx had some delightful things to say about the NC General Assembly, including this gold star comment: "You can't ignore Raleigh, but I can."

[kermit]

 

From what I'm seeing reported on twitter, Anthony Foxx had some delightful things to say about the NC General Assembly, including this gold star comment: "You can't ignore Raleigh, but I can."

Foxx is my new favorite pol!

[tozmervo]

Not video, but I did snap this when I ran out for lunch today. The other streetcar was in the process of getting to the street at the time, so I guess they'll run them both back and forth. 

[CLTProductions]

There's 2 trains running at all times. Just rode it down to Elizabeth to Earls from the arena stop. If you're in a super hurry it's not your best bet. It certainly is having some growing pains too (broke down on my way back, operator had to basically turn it off then back on). Once the kinks are ironed out and it gets a bit more regular it's awesome. 

 

But the trains are nice. Stations are shaded. And it beats the hell out of walking and driving. It's great for the future. 

Edited July 14, 2015 by Jayvee

[tozmervo]

Did you feel like the travel speed could have safely been faster?

[ajfunder]

Photos from today's opening. Thought it was funny when they got the confetti stuck on the catenary this morning, was interesting to see them remove it from the live wire.

[CLTProductions]

Did you feel like the travel speed could have safely been faster?

For now, no. Idiots are still running across the street, idiots still dont know how to dive. When people get used to it existing, yes it can run faster.

[ajfunder]

^My only observation is that the streetcar operators stop at green lights if they are about to turn yellow. There was eight seconds left on the crosswalk when we got to an intersection but we stopped instead of proceeding through (easily could have made it).  Happened a few other times as well. 

[CLTProductions]

^My only observation is that the streetcar operators stop at green lights if they are about to turn yellow. There was eight seconds left on the crosswalk when we got to an intersection but we stopped instead of proceeding through (easily could have made it).  Happened a few other times as well. 

Again, I think this goes with growing pains. As operates get better and more used to everything, this will change.

[jednc]

I took a video of the trolley approaching before it opened to the public at 1:00. I stuck around and rode the first trolley open to the public with several news crews.

VID_20150714_114843957.mp4

[Silicon Dogwoods]

Best option right now: https://twitter.com/ChrisMillerWBT/status/620973501047001088

From what I'm seeing reported on twitter, Anthony Foxx had some delightful things to say about the NC General Assembly, including this gold star comment: "You can't ignore Raleigh, but I can."

I share his disdain.

But I don't think sticking a finger in Raleigh's eye, no matter how well-deserved, is going to make them think fondly of Charlotte.

[Matthew.Brendan]

So my partner and I rode the trolley from CTC down to Carpe Diem for dinner. Afterwards walking we beat it back to CTC. So I guess that was my one token ride for now. 

[jtbell]

I went to the opening ceremony, which was moved from the plaza in front of the arena to inside the transit center (with buses roaring in and out during the speeches), then rode the first public trip in the afternoon. Here's the beginning of the ceremonial first trip, shortly after the ceremony:

Edited July 15, 2015 by jtbell

[tozmervo]

Took a lunchtime ride out to get food up on Elizabeth. On the whole, pretty much as-expected. I would guess it will garner as much ridership as the red line gold rush trolleys did after the curious-ridership dies down.

• Pull the cord to stop. Oops.
• We are going to have to keep saying it until we're blue in the face: RED LIGHT PRIORITY IS NEEDED AND NECESSARY.
• CTC Station should have never been an island-style. I'm looking at it with 20/20 hindsight, but as what should be the busiest platform it had no business being an island-style station. Further, they placed the station entrances at the far ends of where most people will be approaching (from the CTC direction). That just means most people are going around the barricades and crossing where they should have made the access in the first place

[Niner National]

Took a lunchtime ride out to get food up on Elizabeth. On the whole, pretty much as-expected. I would guess it will garner as much ridership as the red line gold rush trolleys did after the curious-ridership dies down.

• Pull the cord to stop. Oops.
• We are going to have to keep saying it until we're blue in the face: RED LIGHT PRIORITY IS NEEDED AND NECESSARY.
• CTC Station should have never been an island-style. I'm looking at it with 20/20 hindsight, but as what should be the busiest platform it had no business being an island-style station. Further, they placed the station entrances at the far ends of where most people will be approaching (from the CTC direction). That just means most people are going around the barricades and crossing where they should have made the access in the first place

I did the opposite for lunch--went from Elizabeth to Uptown. 

It was alright. Definitely agree with you on the CTC station.

 

What do you mean by red light priority?

[tozmervo]

Some control over red lights, so basically it gets a leg-up over regular traffic. Shorten red lights, extend green lights, that kind of thing. I'm being told that it DOES have some kind of ability, but that didn't appear to be in use.

[dubone]

All CATS vehicles may get this red light priority over time.   There are some line items in budgets for things like linking the CATS GPS locator system with the ITS (Intelligent Traffic System).   Don't forget, guys, this first line was a stimulus grant with a very low budget.  The did what they could within a $37m budget.  Even without the light control and some quirks for station designs, it is a long time coming, and hopefully the next section comes in no time. 

[kermit]

All CATS vehicles may get this red light priority over time

 

This plus a real time smartphone tracking ap plus an integrated fare card plus tighter parking uptown (already on the way) plus better bike access to transit will translate to the highest transit mode share in the South (by far)

 

[ajfunder]

Some control over red lights, so basically it gets a leg-up over regular traffic. Shorten red lights, extend green lights, that kind of thing. I'm being told that it DOES have some kind of ability, but that didn't appear to be in use.

The streetcar has signal priority at a few of the intersections. When it enters the left turn lane on Hawthorne to take a right on Elizabeth it automatically triggers the signal to change. It also has priority leaving the pocket track at CTC. Those are the only places in revenue service. It also has signal priority at all the intersections on the non revenue connector spur.

 

Signal priority at all the lights along the line would be very beneficial.