NoDa (N Davidson St Arts District) Projects

[Desert Power]

3 hours ago, CLT Development said:

We, the neighborhood business association are currently creating a calendar for a new revamped website and a portal for people to submit their events in a free and easy manner. 

This sounds cool. Always find it cumbersome to look up local events.

[a2theb]

14 hours ago, CLT Development said:

Their financial scenario says that there is a 954-seat music venue with a true sloped floor transition that offers great line of sight, that could use a ton of TLC. I don’t know if you have been there with the house lights on, its gross. Fix it up, put some money into marketing, get a independent operator and you have an amazing space for local, regional and even national acts.\

Today they put out in a statement that they “,will maintain the authentic use of Neighborhood Theatre as a storied piece of our city’s history.”

Such great bones as a venue but it needs to be cleaned up and for the love of god have the sound fixed. 

[3397char]

On 2/20/2023 at 2:05 PM, ATxIn said:

It wasn't this trashy when I moved here. It's gone downhill in the past two years. Really, it tracks right along with the addition of Crowntown Cannibas and the street vendors. 

 

 

Where is the culture and diversity you speak of? All my neighbors are white and can afford million dollar homes; there's no diversity in terms of race or other demographics.  The only POC I see are working here in some capacity. There are two music venues, but no local music scene that I can see. No art galleries, no working artist studios, no dance studios or performances, no theatres, stand-up, spoken word, no festivals or farmer's markets.

The culture is at Camp North End, where there are actually artist-owned and artist-run spaces. Goodyear Arts, etc.  And in the new "Trailhead District"...The Independent Picture House is wonderful, but it's not in "NoDa." SouthEnd has C3 lab, and downtown has the Vapa Center and Brooklyn Arts.  Theatre in Charlotte is essentially dead, unfortunately. 

I'm lamenting the fact that there is no art or culture in the "Arts District".  I don't know how NoDa lost it or how we can get it back.  I think if something isn't done soon, NoDa will lose its personality altogether.  It's a shame there's no real art being created here. 

Lots of opinion here but little in the way of facts.  A lot of hyperbole  that is well into the realm of falsehoods.  

You are simultaneously complaining about "Trashy" and lamenting the lost of artistry.  Much of what is on the avant garde of art through history has been often labelled as "trashy" contemporaneously.   I would argue that it would be impossible to "clean up" NoDa (I guess to your standards) and fight for the preservation of artistic counter-culture at the same time.  Fat City was trashy.  Neighborhood Theater was gritty.  Pat's Time for One More was a dive bar. Kelly's was Podunk. Most of the galleries outside of Blue Pony and Center of the Earth were not what most would call well curated.  All were gloriously trashy in  different ways.   

The vendors have been on N Davidson St in some capacity for well over a decade; not the last 2 years.  I would agree that the quality of the vendors has gone downhill, though.

While you may not see color in NoDa, it exists. From the 2020 census for Charlotte census tract #14 (The closest approximation to NoDa boundaries)

• 16% African-American or Black
• 5.1% Asian
• 9.1% Hispanic or Latino Origin
• 1.9% Native American
• 8.7% Other
• 76% White

(you will note that this adds up to well over 100%, the census now allows you to self-report in multiple categories, so many of those self-labelled as "white" are also latinx or something else) 

So while it is undeniable that NoDa has gentrified both economically and racially over the last 2 decades, it still remains perhaps the most diversified neighborhood at this price point in Charlotte. Added to that, it borders other neighborhoods of significant diversity that feed into the culture and business clientele  of NoDa. 

Most of the Trailhead District you reference is in NoDa.  For a while, many have called it "NoDa North"

I have been reading about the demise of NoDa since I moved to Charlotte and in to NoDa in 1999. They say "It ain't what it used to be." Yet here we are: NoDa still stands. It has not died yet, I I don't think your prognostications are based on any new data. 

The gallery crawls twice a month were great back circa 2002.  Nothing like it and I do indeed miss them.  But I bet that the vast majority of those wistful sepia-toned lamentations are by people who did not visit NoDa the other 28 days of the month.  It was dead almost all those nights (unless there was a big NT show).  Nobody on the streets.  A ghost town by 9 PM. And  MANY good small businesses failed due to no foot traffic.

I challenge you to name 5 large chain/corporate businesses with storefront in NoDa. Food Lion?  BofA branch? Sherwin Williams? Who else?  NoDa remains a vibrant and unique incubator for Charlotte small businesses. 

Change is not all bad. 

[MrBluePrint]

On 2/20/2023 at 4:15 PM, jf430 said:

Regarding the 'Arts District' moniker.  A good neighborhood friend who worked at every mill in North Charlotte at one time or another always had the best stories about old the neighborhood.  He would talk about how he (in a very kind and good natured way) would kid the gallery owners about how 'you know we'd been here about a 100 years before you guys ever showed up and started calling this place NoDa'.  The point I'm trying to make is that the 'Arts District' was one fantastic chapter in the very long book that is North Charlotte.

Fair point! A very valid perspective. You could say the same of SoHo or any number of neighborhoods in NYC or London.

I guess change is inevitable. We will hold on to this property regardless of all the posters here who said to move. Not sure if we will rent it or pass it on to the next generation, but it's a long-term hold. Really not looking forward to the monolith that's coming next door.

Neighbor met with the YMCA director and they are not showing any cards.

[JRCLT]

Fair point! A very valid perspective. You could say the same of SoHo or any number of neighborhoods in NYC or London.
I guess change is inevitable. We will hold on to this property regardless of all the posters here who said to move. Not sure if we will rent it or pass it on to the next generation, but it's a long-term hold. Really not looking forward to the monolith that's coming next door.
Neighbor met with the YMCA director and they are not showing any cards.

Yes change is inevitable, sorry that is the case in life. Evolving is the only way to survive. Not saying NoDa is moving in the right direction in every aspect but it must move in one or another or risk it’s eventual downfall. The cause of which I wouldn’t be even capable of thinking of off the top of my head. I’m glad you want to stay and think for yourself. As for YMCA, the only thing we can do is wait and see. Don’t worry about what you don’t know because as people have tried, no one has gotten any information to share. No news is technically good news for you in a way. It means they aren’t building that monolith tomorrow, or anytime soon.

[jf430]

12 hours ago, ATxIn said:

Fair point! A very valid perspective. You could say the same of SoHo or any number of neighborhoods in NYC or London.

I guess change is inevitable. We will hold on to this property regardless of all the posters here who said to move. Not sure if we will rent it or pass it on to the next generation, but it's a long-term hold. Really not looking forward to the monolith that's coming next door.

Neighbor met with the YMCA director and they are not showing any cards.

I am generally comfortable with the NoDa NBA representing my interests & preferences on the future of that property but just out of curiosity what would you (or any others on here) like to see happen with it?  It's going to transform the neighborhood one way or the other when something happens there.

[CLT Development]

 

1 hour ago, JeanClt said:

Yes change is inevitable, sorry that is the case in life. Evolving is the only way to survive. Not saying NoDa is moving in the right direction in every aspect but it must move in one or another or risk it’s eventual downfall. The cause of which I wouldn’t be even capable of thinking of off the top of my head. I’m glad you want to stay and think for yourself. As for YMCA, the only thing we can do is wait and see. Don’t worry about what you don’t know because as people have tried, no one has gotten any information to share. No news is technically good news for you in a way. It means they aren’t building that monolith tomorrow, or anytime soon.

Not sure why anyone is sitting and waiting, I shared exactly whats happening there in this thread. I've seen the RFQ that people bid on. 300-400 unit residential, grocery, new YMCA and micro retail. Some open space facing North Davidson, massing that gets taller toward the train tracks. Simple as that. Thats what residential partners bid on. Seems like a lot for one parcel, but this parcel is an acre larger than the footprint of The Francis, Whole Foods, Even Hotel and Home 2Suites combined.

The winning developer has done a couple of these YMCA value ads, for reference linked. 

https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/ymca-arlington

https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/y-magnolia-village

Edited February 23, 2023 by CLT Development

[JRCLT]

 
Not sure why anyone is sitting and waiting, I shared exactly whats happening there in this thread. I've seen the RFQ that people bid on. 300-400 unit residential, grocery, new YMCA and micro retail. Some open space facing North Davidson, massing that gets taller toward the train tracks. Simple as that. Thats what residential partners bid on. Seems like a lot for one parcel, but this parcel is an acre larger than the footprint of The Francis, Whole Foods, Even Hotel and Home 2Suites combined.
The winning developer has done a couple of these YMCA value ads, for reference linked. 
https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/ymca-arlington
https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/y-magnolia-village

Do you have access to site plans? I mean Im not in the loop I was more meaning movement at the site. Unless I have been under a rock I haven’t heard or seen any movement or coverage of construction or site prep happening. I personally don’t have any qualms with these plans, so please refrain telling anything that does not pertain to me or my opinions. I was offering consolation not an opinion on this site. Whether it was well received by the person in question I am not sure, but had nothing to do with an opinion on the site.

[MrBluePrint]

On 2/23/2023 at 12:49 PM, JeanClt said:

Not sure why anyone is sitting and waiting, I shared exactly whats happening there in this thread. I've seen the RFQ that people bid on. 300-400 unit residential, grocery, new YMCA and micro retail. Some open space facing North Davidson, massing that gets taller toward the train tracks. Simple as that. Thats what residential partners bid on. Seems like a lot for one parcel, but this parcel is an acre larger than the footprint of The Francis, Whole Foods, Even Hotel and Home 2Suites combined.
The winning developer has done a couple of these YMCA value ads, for reference linked. 
https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/ymca-arlington
https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/y-magnolia-village

 

Do you know the timeline, or any idea of where the parking and entrance/exits will be? I believe they have to preserve green space facing N Davidson as there are heritage trees.  I understand at the tallest, the building could be 100 feet? I also wonder how long it would take to build something like this. For example, they've been working on the Commonwealth for almost two years now, and it seems like they are not very far alone.

To address the other previous poster, the YMCA did some community input sessions, coming up on four years ago. They did not, as far as I know, address any possibility of a grocery or apartments on the site. Nor do they care that their casual research was done in 2019, when the neighborhood was quite different than it is now.

Also, I understand the area around the Indie is not considered NoDa.  They are trying to market it as the "Trailhead" district. 

 

 

[KJHburg]

These are Mill District area photos or south NoDa, west Villa Heights, north Optimist Park area photos   From Parkwood to Matheson between N Davidson and N Brevard.  No matter what you call this area it is BOOMING.   From my walkabout this morning starting around 25th St.   (and yes Camden NoDa my favorite under construction apartment complex in the midrise category in Charlotte right now)    Lintmens is looking good.  New townhomes going up behind Chadborn Mill.  and a few hold out SF houses and I hope they continue to hold out!  This area needs more grocery stores or at least A full sized grocery store!   I called it several years ago when I said N Brevard would be the most changed street in the city in the next few years. 

[MrBluePrint]

On 2/23/2023 at 9:43 AM, CLT Development said:

 

Not sure why anyone is sitting and waiting, I shared exactly whats happening there in this thread. I've seen the RFQ that people bid on. 300-400 unit residential, grocery, new YMCA and micro retail. Some open space facing North Davidson, massing that gets taller toward the train tracks. Simple as that. Thats what residential partners bid on. Seems like a lot for one parcel, but this parcel is an acre larger than the footprint of The Francis, Whole Foods, Even Hotel and Home 2Suites combined.

The winning developer has done a couple of these YMCA value ads, for reference linked. 

https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/ymca-arlington

https://www.republicfamilyofcompanies.com/developments/y-magnolia-village

Can you compare the size of this development to anything existing or under construction in the area? You mentioned it's an acre larger than .... but what is closer in size and scope? Camden? Commonwealth? Just trying to get an idea. A neighbor has met with the YMCA and the Y wanted to hear what we would "like to see" in the design and promised it won't be a "big blocky box." 

[CLT Development]

On 2/27/2023 at 5:03 PM, ATxIn said:

Can you compare the size of this development to anything existing or under construction in the area? You mentioned it's an acre larger than .... but what is closer in size and scope? Camden? Commonwealth? Just trying to get an idea. A neighbor has met with the YMCA and the Y wanted to hear what we would "like to see" in the design and promised it won't be a "big blocky box." 

I don't think it'll be a big blocky box, NoDa has actually done pretty well for getting unique looking buildings because we generally demand it. I would think its 2-3 floors facing North Davidson and then tapers up to 7 floors facing the train. Its about the size of Camden NoDa plus the hosiery mill in scale. A lot can fit there. 

[turbocraig]

I LOVE this Camden Cowork building!  I’ve never seen it before. 
 

[videtur quam contuor]

That project as a whole is far better than average. (Average is drek)

[buildleft]

I'm not sure if this was already known info on this site, but this is for the parcel next to UDM and across from Rhino. Looks like nearly 400 apartments and 8500 sf of retail.

It's satisfying to witness the development in this area gradually become taller

https://aca-prod.accela.com/CHARLOTTE/Cap/CapDetail.aspx?Module=LandDevelopment&TabName=LandDevelopment&capID1=23LDR&capID2=00000&capID3=00071&agencyCode=CHARLOTTE&IsToShowInspection=

[KJHburg]

All these apartment buildings are being built along 36th Street I walked basically from N Tryon to Charles Ave.   Avery Hall has 2 apartment complexes underway,  Grubb has one,  the Wandry by FCP and Centro is started and a boutique 720 building.   I only took photos along 36th Street so this shows you how much construction there is on this street. 

3100 North Tryon Street – Avery Hall (averyhallinvestments.com)

300 East 36th Street – Avery Hall (averyhallinvestments.com)

NoDa Wandry is a pet-friendly apartment community in Charlotte, NC

[Take2]

On 2/28/2023 at 8:30 PM, turbocraig said:

I LOVE this Camden Cowork building!  I’ve never seen it before. 
 

I agree 100% Never seen it but it is a tough looking complex... well done

[jf430]

New sign just went up on the old Poe NoDa site on the other side of the bridge from the Camden development.

[3397char]

On 3/7/2023 at 12:20 PM, jf430 said:

New sign just went up on the old Poe NoDa site on the other side of the bridge from the Camden development.

I talked to the new owner a couple of weeks ago.  Still planning to do 29 townhomes (as the sign implies).  Same owner that is scraping the land at 2604 N Brevard behind the Chadbourn Mill smokestack to build 38 townhomes:

 

[MrBluePrint]

On 2/21/2023 at 10:03 AM, CLT Development said:

Do yourself and all of us a favor then, MOVE. This reeks of racism and exclusion. You clearly have no actual love of this neighborhood. As far as the neighborhood theatre goes, everyone on the block has a long term lease and the new buyer intends to honor that. I've talked to every single party involved  and a few of the tenants. So hurry up and move to the arboretum or wherever would be quiet and white enough for you.

BTW as a Black person, I love being called racist. Just shows how little the word means today.

Also, the Protagonist is moving...because of the street vendors disrupting its business. 

There was an altercation between Cabo and the street vendors that almost came to blows, I understand. 

The vendors are an issue nobody wants to address. 

[SouthEndCLT811]

I was/still kind of am a fan of the vendors but when I was on the patio at Cabo in late June and my wife and I had to hit the ground and duck in to the restaurant because shots were fired right out front of the restaurant.  In the moment you don't know where it's coming from and that's jarring and a kind of experience that sticks even a little.  In that case it turns out someone tried to rob the CBD table and then let off his gun when the vendors associates were administering a beat down to the robber.  I know that guy was a bad actor and can't fault the vendors for reacting to someone robbing them.  But either way that experience has stuck, fortunately for me I had been to NoDa hundreds of times before so I know that's not the norm, but it wouldn't be good for the neighborhood or it's businesses if that type of experience or the one referred to above about the altercation was someone's introduction to the neighborhood.

Edited March 17, 2023 by SouthEndCLT811

[kermit]

^ its stories like this that remind me of how little enforcement I see from CMPD. I would bet that robbery would have been less likely to happen if CMPD had a policy of a regular, semi-permanent, walking or biking beat cops in central NoDa (and everywhere else in Charlotte where enforcement activities from a car (with the windows rolled up and AC on) is ineffective). 

I see bike cops semi-regularly in Southend, but never once have I seen them engage with anyone for any reason [<— anecdote disguised as data]. I do see them regularly riding on the sidewalk, so I guess biking on the road is too dangerous for CMPD.

Edited March 17, 2023 by kermit

[Desert Power]

Have never been a fan of the street vendors personally. It makes an already small sidewalk more cramped. In some spots it feels like you have to step into the road, which is the opposite of a positive pedestrian experience. 

Would be nice to further limit or outright remove on-street parking on North Davidson for a lot of this area, but this would require enforcement from CMPD they are not interested in.

[15895]

I love street vendors - particularly as many as NoDa has - just wish there were also some soft good ones and some food ones too. Sorta wish Camden St. In SouthEnd would become a 1 way, Widen the sidewalks and have lots of vendors there too. 

It sucks anytime there is crime. It can really affect peoples habits after 1 incident as noted above, so. Not to be dismissive of those experiences but i overall view the vendors as a good thing. 
 

 

 

[JRCLT]

I think people sometimes forget we don’t live in bubbles…someone being nearby will affect everyone nearby. Venders being in one place will affect the entire area around them just as the area affects them. I don’t see how referring to venders as a problem makes any sense. All I hear is they’re a problem because they exist there in that moment trying to make a living? (Bet someone will think they should go somewhere else. So they can be somebody else’s “problem” huh?). Just as all other businesses are doing the same? I find it interesting how easily we dismiss people for just being in a particular place. The world is just as much theirs as it is anyone else’s. There’s always going to be disadvantages and advantages to having anything. If you think of anything as being strictly one or the other than you have no idea what reality really is and when it comes to development specifically, it’s important to understand that. Also understand that everyone in a neighborhood is part of it, they are all just people living their lives. Venders specifically should not be seen as “a problem” to the neighborhood because that’s not all they are. Clearly it shows some people on here enjoy or appreciate their presence. They just have disadvantages like anything else. The question really is, do these outweigh one another good or bad and what are you considering in the first place. What one prioritizes over other effects. I suggest people think really carefully and thoroughly when they are about to say anything about any group or individual because it isn’t as simple as (for example): “they’re disruptive.”

I really didn’t like the wording “[They’re] an issue no one wants to address.” It’s dehumanizing when referring to people as the problem instead of focusing on the problem they may be responsible for which is two different concepts btw. Otherwise, using that former point of view, from where I’m standing we’re all problems and what gives anyone else a rise above any other to fix all else except ones self. Seriously. Not to call any one specific person out but really I’m saying this in reference to several comments on here from multiple people. This particular phrase just struck me the most.