Hurricane Katrina - the aftermath

[ironchapman]

The looting is ridiculous but folks have been under such stress probably many are doing what they normally would not. You have huge amounts of people with no food, no water, no clothing, no house and probably some with killed or missing relatives. In addition they are cramped up, hot, etc. This is really the worst. I just hope the leeves hold up and they can some how get some control to this mind boggling situation. My heart and prayers are with them all.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't have much of a problem with people stealing food, water, and clothes (perhaps), but why would a person whose house has just been toppled need to steal a TV or appliance?

It seems to me that this is turning into a "Lord of the Flies" type situation. Certainly one of the most memorable events of our lifetimes.

[urbanvb]

I don't have much of a problem with people stealing food, water, and clothes (perhaps), but why would a person whose house has just been toppled need to steal a TV or appliance?

It seems to me that this is turning into a "Lord of the Flies" type situation. Certainly one of the most memorable events of our lifetimes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree wholeheartedly. Stealing something like a TV or such is just .. how can I even say it. I wanna say I can't believe people would do it but of course I can. What in the world are they gonna do with it with no power and probably no power for weeks on end.

[vdogg]

As if the loss of hundreds in the storm and its aftermath weren't enough, it is apperent that some people actually have no respect for human life at all.

How many more will fall in the coming days as the struggle to survive continues?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I may receive a lot of flak for this but it has crossed my mind that some of them (the ones looting food in particular) may be doing what they have to do to survive. By all means the looters who are breaking into stores stealing clothes and appliances should be dealt with summarily but when I hear of those who are looting food I am left to wonder why. Picture this, trapped in the middle of a vast city, rescue may be days away, you have no food and no water because the water is contaminated and your house destroyed. What would you do?

[goodbye]

I was on I-85 here in Upstate SC today and noticed caravans of power and other utility trucks from various states heading south. One group was from Massachusetts. This was a very encouraging sign!

[vdogg]

I agree wholeheartedly. Stealing something like a TV or such is just .. how can I even say it. I wanna say I can't believe people would do it but of course I can. What in the world are they gonna do with it with no power and probably no power for weeks on end.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We all posted this at the same time. I think a lot of people are finally starting to put themselves in these peoples shoes.

[urbanvb]

We all posted this at the same time. I think a lot of people are finally starting to put themselves in these peoples shoes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yup. I am not a person to steal but if I thought my kids or wife was getting sick and had to eat I would do what I must to provide. Desperate times call for desperate measures..but how desperate would I become..

[goodbye]

I agree wholeheartedly. Stealing something like a TV or such is just .. how can I even say it. I wanna say I can't believe people would do it but of course I can. What in the world are they gonna do with it with no power and probably no power for weeks on end.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Don't be surprised if much of the extra loot ends up on Ebay. There are several stores in Upstate SC set up to sell items for people (BidZirk is the largest).

[vdogg]

CBS news

"We are very, very worried that this is going to go a lot higher," said Joe Spraggins, civil defense director for Harrison County, home to Biloxi and Gulfport. "We're just estimating but the number could go double or triple from what we're talking now."

"What I'm authorized to say now is we expect the death toll to be higher than anything we've ever seen before," said Jim Pollard, a colleague of Spraggins.

[goodbye]

Yup. I am not a person to steal but if I thought my kids or wife was getting sick and had to eat I would do what I must to provide. Desperate times call for desperate measures..but how desperate would I become..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sounds like a good philosophical ethic to me. It would most likely depend on the serious nature of the situation. I have a feeling that much of the people looting are out for more than nurishment. Don't they care for their City more than that?

[goodbye]

No one ever expected this level of destruction, but come on - a Cat 5 hurricane! Anyone with common sense should have felt bad about this one and at least gotten to a shelter further inland. I understand some didn't have the means to completely leave the area, but that is the purpose of the storm shelters.

[urbanvb]

So without reading all through the postings what is the newest. I heard that the city of NO will evacuate. Has that been declared as of yet?

[vdogg]

So without reading all through the postings what is the newest. I heard that the city of NO will evacuate. Has that been declared as of yet?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes it has. They are currently working out the logistics of evacuating the now 30,000 people in the superdome. The governor has declared that the city will have to be abandoned til the flood is under control.

[urbanvb]

Well this says it all. I found it on CNN website.

"Deteriorating conditions in New Orleans will force authorities to evacuate the tens of thousands of people at city shelters, including the Superdome, where a policeman told CNN unrest was escalating. "

[goodbye]

Folks, this evening I was thinking about the longterm impact this storm will have on the U.S. Does everyone realize that well over a million people will be relocated for an indefinite period of time? This after effect will be felt for a long while, if nothing can be done to revive the drowning city of New Orleans. I thought War of the Worlds had some of the most creepy shots ever, but the images I've seen in the past few days could have come right from that movie.

[Spartan]

Yes it has. They are currently working out the logistics of evacuating the now 30,000 people in the superdome. The governor has declared that the city will have to be abandoned til the flood is under control.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is indeed bad. They probably should abandon it for now. They should declare martial law in Orleans and Jefferson Parishes for the time being.

I have heard a couple people say they should just go ahead and abandon the whole city. Just let the water in, and move inland.

I personally think this is stupid. What do you think?

[goodbye]

I don't think they have much choice right now. NO is not going to stop flooding until the water reaches sea-level, and then the task of trying to dam up the waters again and pump the water back out will take an enormous amout of money and time. Then the entire infrastructure will have to be cleaned up and rebuilt in some cases before it could be reinhabited. It is a serious mess!

Edit: You'll have to take into consideration the fact that disease will play a large role in the inhabitability of the area as well.

[vdogg]

This is indeed bad. They probably should abandon it for now. They should declare martial law in Orleans and Jefferson Parishes for the time being.

I have heard a couple people say they should just go ahead and abandon the whole city. Just let the water in, and move inland.

I personally think this is stupid. What do you think?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They have already declared martial law. As for rebuilding, I'm split on this. The fighter in me says build it stronger and better than before. The practical side of me says if it is rebuilt, it should be in a different location. This has been long predicted and with the increased incidences of Hurricanes it may happen again sooner than later. Part of me wonders about the wisdom of rebuilding a city below sea level that even in good weather has to be protected by levees.

[ironchapman]

They have already declared martial law. As for rebuilding, I'm split on this. The fighter in me says build it stronger and better than before. The practical side of me says if it is rebuilt, it should be in a different location. This has been long predicted and with the increased incidences of Hurricanes it may happen again sooner than later. Part of me wonders how wise it would be to rebuild a city below sea level that even in good weather has to be protected by levees.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, if they abandon it, it woul dset an interesting precedent in american history. I wonder what would happen to it theN? Surely something like the National Park Service would take over.

[Spartan]

They have already declared martial law. As for rebuilding, I'm split on this. The fighter in me says build it stronger and better than before. The practical side of me says if it is rebuilt, it should be in a different location. This has been long predicted and with the increased incidences of Hurricanes it may happen again sooner than later. Part of me wonders about the wisdom of rebuilding a city below sea level that even in good weather has to be protected by levees.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They aren't doign a very good job of enforcing it then. Lootting is getting worse. Maybe the National Guard hasn't been able to get in there yet. I don't see why they can't do boat patrols until they can patrol on foot.

As for the flooding, I found this invterview with the Army Corps of Engineers: http://www.wwltv.com/local/stories/083005c...g.45718845.html

Sorry if it has already been posted

[vdogg]

Well, if they abandon it, it woul dset an interesting precedent in american history. I wonder what would happen to it theN? Surely something like the National Park Service would take over.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It seems like a lot of precedents are being set already today. I get the sense that even the government is making decisions on the fly at this moment. There will be some very tough issues that have to be addressed in the coming days.

[vdogg]

I find this part interesting.

Q.3. Why only Category 3 protection?

A.3. That is what we were authorized to do.

It is a basic tenet of engineering to always plan for the worst case scenario. If they could've built it stronger than they should have. Makes me wonder who did the authorizing?

[ironchapman]

I find this part interesting.

Q.3. Why only Category 3 protection?

A.3. That is what we were authorized to do. 

It is a basic tenet of engineering to always plan for the worst case scenario. If they could've built it stronger than they should have. Makes me wonder who did the authorizing?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

While I agree with your post, one wonders how often a CAT 4 of this intensity will strike.

[goodbye]

But I would not live in a city below sea-level - directly next to the sea - if it wasn't able to withstand the worst. I guess that is the main reason I never planned to move there. I think this way.

[goodbye]

BTW, thanks for the link, Spartan. That backs up my assumptions.

[tombarnes]

I believe you can put thoughts of abandoning New Orleans to rest. I'm fairly certain it will be rebuilt. The cultural loss would be incalculable if it were to be abandoned. It's unthinkable, even though the "unthinkable" may have just occurred.