B Tower (5th Street Retail Infill Building)

[j-man]

3 hours ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Its much much much larger than that. I'm not sure the exact size, but for reference the H&M below Macys is 21,000 sq feet.

This was the worst way to make your point. Macy’s is an anchor store and H&M’s are extremely large clothing retail stores. Bad comparison to a store that sells electronics. I just looked up some and they said around 5,000 so I wasn’t off by much. 

13 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Fun fact, the Apple Store on 5th Avenue, gets twice as many visitors per year (57M), as Charlotte as a whole (27M)

No I’ve been saying for the longest that the Epicenter would be the best place for the Apple store “if” they do take out all the bars and clubs like there were walks of doing. But I think someplace off Tryon would be best. Maybe ground floor of Duke Energy 2 or another vacant space on that street.

[Madison Parkitect]

Charlotte absolutely does not have the population to support an Apple store outside of a mall.

[TheOneRJ]

8 hours ago, Madison Parkitect said:

Charlotte absolutely does not have the population to support an Apple store outside of a mall.

Yes it does? There are countless Apple stores in markets much smaller than Charlotte that are not located in a mall. 

I’d be more concerned with whether Charlotte can support three Apple stores. 

[j-man]

8 hours ago, Madison Parkitect said:

Charlotte absolutely does not have the population to support an Apple store outside of a mall.

??? Huh..Charlotte is literally one of the largest cities in the US so how is that so. Many smaller cities have Apple Stores outside of malls like Charleston which has a metro area population that isn’t even Charlottes city population alone and that Apple store is always crazy busy and if the city had a second one I’m sure it would be just as busy. Idk why you think that. It’s an Apple store, not a professional sports teams. 

[Cadi40]

1 hour ago, TheOneRJ said:

Yes it does? There are countless Apple stores in markets much smaller than Charlotte that are not located in a mall. 

I’d be more concerned with whether Charlotte can support three Apple stores. 

Charlotte can undoubtedly support three Apple stores. Think about the amount of people who live within a 10 minute drive of Uptown. The South Park location serves South Charlotte, Uptown serves Mid-Charlotte, and the Northlake location serves North Charlotte!

[CLT2014]

13 minutes ago, Larry Singer said:

Is there an Apple store in Pittsburgh, Portland, or New Orleans? If so, these cities are smaller than Charlotte in both city and metro. 

The Apple store in downtown Portland is part of the Pioneer Place urban mall, co-located with a ton of other retail stores that generate foot traffic. The Apple store is directly across the street from the part of the mall with Louis Vuitton and Coach.

In Pittsburgh, there is no Apple store downtown, but they do have one location outside the mall located in Shadyside. Shadyside is a very popular area with young people in Pittsburgh and is more like Dilworth than Uptown, with eclectic shopping on a main street (again generating lots of foot traffic). 

In New Orleans, the Apple store is in a mall like Charlotte.

If we built an urban mall in Uptown that Apple could co-locate with other retailers, I could see them selecting an Uptown location. Going on a street full of bank lobbies and fast casual workers.... less so. Take a stroll through Uptown at 10AM on a Tuesday when people aren't getting lunch or on a Sunday at 1PM when the Panthers aren't playing. It is pretty dead still and the critical mass to bring people Uptown outside of special events is still fairly low. It is more of an opportunity cost scenario.... why should Apple pick Uptown over say South End or Plaza Midwood for example? 

Edited January 23, 2020 by CLT2014

[TheOneRJ]

49 minutes ago, Cadi40 said:

Charlotte can undoubtedly support three Apple stores. Think about the amount of people who live within a 10 minute drive of Uptown. The South Park location serves South Charlotte, Uptown serves Mid-Charlotte, and the Northlake location serves North Charlotte!

The only cities with 3+ Apple Stores are twice the size of Charlotte. The only exception I see is Portland and Pittsburgh. 

[Guest]

12 hours ago, j-man said:

This was the worst way to make your point. Macy’s is an anchor store and H&M’s are extremely large clothing retail stores. Bad comparison to a store that sells electronics. I just looked up some and they said around 5,000 so I wasn’t off by much. 

No I’ve been saying for the longest that the Epicenter would be the best place for the Apple store “if” they do take out all the bars and clubs like there were walks of doing. But I think someplace off Tryon would be best. Maybe ground floor of Duke Energy 2 or another vacant space on that street.

Apple wouldn't touch a single one of the spaces at Epicenter with a 50 foot pole.  They have architectural and space requirements that cannot be met. 

12 hours ago, j-man said:

This was the worst way to make your point. Macy’s is an anchor store and H&M’s are extremely large clothing retail stores. Bad comparison to a store that sells electronics. I just looked up some and they said around 5,000 so I wasn’t off by much. 

No I’ve been saying for the longest that the Epicenter would be the best place for the Apple store “if” they do take out all the bars and clubs like there were walks of doing. But I think someplace off Tryon would be best. Maybe ground floor of Duke Energy 2 or another vacant space on that street.

I said the H&M below the Macys is 21,000 sq feet. I was just giving you a size comparison to show that Apple Store Southpark was not the size you were suggesting (4,000 Sq feet). 

I'm giving you an honest analytical reason as to why Apple would never ever ever ever ever ever sign in any of the places you are suggesting. 

3 hours ago, j-man said:

??? Huh..Charlotte is literally one of the largest cities in the US so how is that so. Many smaller cities have Apple Stores outside of malls like Charleston which has a metro area population that isn’t even Charlottes city population alone and that Apple store is always crazy busy and if the city had a second one I’m sure it would be just as busy. Idk why you think that. It’s an Apple store, not a professional sports teams. 

Charleston, SC has a booming tourist population that comes to the city strictly to entertain themselves during daylight hours (and at dinner). And is Littered with urban retail that works together cohesively. 

The bulk of Charlotte's visitors come to Charlotte to spend 9-5 inside a convention center, in an office, or visiting family in the suburbs.

Edited January 23, 2020 by Guest

[Guest]

1 hour ago, CLT2014 said:

If we built an urban mall in Uptown that Apple could co-locate with other retailers, I could see them selecting an Uptown location. Going on a street full of bank lobbies and fast casual workers.... less so. Take a stroll through Uptown at 10AM on a Tuesday when people aren't getting lunch or on a Sunday at 1PM when the Panthers aren't playing. It is pretty dead still and the critical mass to bring people Uptown outside of special events is still fairly low. It is more of an opportunity cost scenario.... why should Apple pick Uptown over say South End or Plaza Midwood for example? 

Exactly. 

Only way Uptown gets Class AA retail is if someone like Westfield comes in an spends a half a billion dollars on an urban destination, close to transit and even closer to a highway. That option fades away more and more as Legacy Union plows ahead with office towers instead of a retail destination and residential towers.

Meanwhile people were trying to move Discovery Place out of the core of uptown. Thats the kind of attraction that will bring folks uptown that maybe might shop.

Retail isn't going to survive on Johnny Robinson needing to get a new blue oxford for his interview at Merrill Lynch, its going to survive in places where a good portion of the daily population 1. Doesn't go to work 2. Doesn't have anything to do while the kids are in school. 3. Has a very high income 4. Has a LOT of parking 5) is made of a good portion of people that are primarily visitors with nothing to do but spend money.

Edited January 23, 2020 by Guest

[CharlotteWkndBuzz]

I'm sorry thread police.  But would like it here still as many have mentioned before a long time ago.  LU doesnt seem to be the retail i was hoping for either (yet), so Ally/JW  has a ton of potentiall.  I can't find the layout for the ground floor retail for either spot, but this could be a fantastic little shopping plaza.  Ally if i recall, has many retail spots at the bottom. 5 star JW will provide year-round money spenders too.

Edited January 23, 2020 by CharlotteWkndBuzz

[j-man]

32 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Apple wouldn't touch a single one of the spaces at Epicenter with a 50 foot pole.  They have architectural and space requirements that cannot be met. 

I said the H&M below the Macys is 21,000 sq feet. I was just giving you a size comparison to show that Apple Store Southpark was not the size you were suggesting (4,000 Sq feet). 

I'm giving you an honest analytical reason as to why Apple would never ever ever ever ever ever sign in any of the places you are suggesting. 

Charleston, SC has a booming tourist population that comes to the city strictly to entertain themselves during daylight hours (and at dinner). And is Littered with urban retail that works together cohesively. 

The bulk of Charlotte's visitors come to Charlotte to spend 9-5 inside a convention center, in an office, or visiting family in the suburbs.

Charlottes metro area has 2.5 million people and y’all dont think the urban core of this city can support 1 Apple store is beyond me. The amount of apartments, offices and retail that is flying up in Charlotte is record breaking so I’m not sure  why in 2020 when Indoor malls nationwide are closing because people prefer downtown and outlet shopping. Look at SouthEnd and all the retailers that people didn’t think would do good there like Sephora and see just how busy they are. 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, CharlotteWkndBuzz said:

I'm sorry thread police.  But would like it here still as many have mentioned before a long time ago.  LU doesnt seem to be the retail i was hoping for either (yet), so Ally/JW  has a ton of potentiall.  I can't find the layout for the ground floor retail for either spot, but this could be a fantastic little shopping plaza.  Ally if i recall, has many retail spots at the bottom. 5 star JW will provide year-round money spenders too.

2 minutes ago, j-man said:

Charlottes metro area has 2.5 million people and y’all dont think the urban core of this city can support 1 Apple store is beyond me. The amount of apartments, offices and retail that is flying up in Charlotte is record breaking so I’m not sure  why in 2020 when Indoor malls nationwide are closing because people prefer downtown and outlet shopping. Look at SouthEnd and all the retailers that people didn’t think would do good there like Sephora and see just how busy they are. 

Its a metro that takes up 8000 sq miles. 

Because Sephora is in a large concentration of retail (110,000 sq feet contiguous), and adjacent to a population that meets almost all of the criteria I listed above.

Edited January 23, 2020 by Guest

[j-man]

3 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

 

Its a metro that takes up 8000 sq miles. 

Because Sephora is in a large concentration of retail (110,000 sq feet contiguous), and adjacent to a population that meets almost all of the criteria I listed above.

So all the bankers, and other middle and upper class people in Uptown don’t all have and use Apple products.....

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, j-man said:

So all the bankers, and other middle and upper class people in Uptown don’t all have and use Apple products.....

I never said it wouldn't work downtown. You aren't listening to me. I'm saying there isn't a single place uptown currently that Apple would occupy. 

Edited January 23, 2020 by Guest

[j-man]

Just now, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

I never said it wouldn't work downtown. You aren't listening to me.

So what are you saying 

[tozmervo]

3 minutes ago, j-man said:

So what are you saying 

I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I believe he's saying  "I'm saying there isn't a single place uptown currently that Apple would occupy. "

[Synopsis101]

Not too long ago people said South End couldn’t support retail. Now it’s a local retail destination. Why can’t Uptown become something close to it? Uptown deserves more than a Jos. A. Bank.

[j-man]

9 minutes ago, tozmervo said:

I don't want to put words in his mouth, but I believe he's saying  "I'm saying there isn't a single place uptown currently that Apple would occupy. "

Well that’s different than writing these paragraphs going in circles. My point is that in a new retail space of a new building Charlotte could easily support an Uptown Apple store. It’s a no brainer. If this city can build this many grocery stores in and around its urban core, I’m sure ONE Apple store would do beyond well. 

Edited January 23, 2020 by j-man

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Synopsis101 said:

Not too long ago people said South End couldn’t support retail. Now it’s a local retail destination. Why can’t Uptown become something close to it? Uptown deserves more than a Jos. A. Bank.

Because its beside Dilworth, Atherton always had a good chance 

[CarolinaDaydreamin]

1 minute ago, j-man said:

Well that’s different that writing these paragraphs going in circles. My point it that in a new retail space of a new building Charlotte could easily support an Uptown Apple store. It’s a no brained. If this city can Build this many grocery stores in and around its urban core, I’m sure ONE Apple store would do beyond well. 

I think the best answer is that there needs to be even more intermediate retail options before Apple.  Apple stores are the pinnacle of non extreme luxury stores. Downtown Charlotte could use even more soft retailers before going for the retail flagship.

[j-man]

1 minute ago, Synopsis101 said:

Not too long ago people said South End couldn’t support retail. Now it’s a local retail destination. Why can’t Uptown become something close to it? Uptown deserves more than a Jos. A. Bank.

EXACTLY MY POINT! Lol I literally make sense when people try and shut me up. Charlotte metro grows about an entire small city in population a year and bringing new developments and stores is attracting people so why not. People also said grocery stores wouldn’t do well uptown and look at how great WholeFoods is doing and how much people want the planned Publix to come to the north side. Apple would do so well in an Urban Tech hub like Charlotte filled with millennials. 

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, j-man said:

EXACTLY MY POINT! Lol I literally make sense when people try and shut me up. Charlotte metro grows about an entire small city in population a year and bringing new developments and stores is attracting people so why not. People also said grocery stores wouldn’t do well uptown and look at how great WholeFoods is doing and how much people want the planned Publix to come to the north side. Apple would do so well in an Urban Tech hub like Charlotte filled with millennials. 

Do well isn't their business model though, doing PHENOMENALLY is. Apple Store will open in Center City in the next few years, but its not going to be uptown, it'll be in Southend.

Edited January 23, 2020 by Guest

[CarolinaDaydreamin]

2 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

 in Center City in the next few years, but its not going to be uptown, it'll be in Southend.

And thats the important thing we aren't considering in this argument. Even in San Francisco itself, there aren't apple stores in the Financial district, but in the adjacent Union Square. South End is our center city's Union Square. 

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, CarolinaDaydreamin said:

I think the best answer is that there needs to be even more intermediate retail options before Apple.  Apple stores are the pinnacle of non extreme luxury stores. Downtown Charlotte could use even more soft retailers before going for the retail flagship.

The real probably is there is no easy way to create the kind of critical mass of retailers that would be needed to make any retail spot successful uptown. You aren't going to survive on 9-5 workers, and uptown is still only like 7-8000 people per sq mile. You have to make a destination where everyone within a 50 mile radius will want to go there. Once you establish that,  you have to renegotiate all the leases at Southpark that have proximity based lease agreements with Simon that don't allow you to open a store within a 10 mile radius.

[j-man]

4 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

Do well isn't their business model though, doing PHENOMENALLY is. Apple Store will open in Center City in the next few years, but its not going to be uptown, it'll be in Southend.

You’re reaching at this point. When I say do well I do mean that in a PHENOMENAL way. The Apple store in Northlake is subpar and isn’t that visited. That one should just move to uptown where people can literally catch the light rail to get to it, they, can drive, or they can walk to it. It’s the most walkable part of Charlotte so why wouldn’t it make sense.