Greenville Journal contents

[krazeeboi]

More than likely after I finish this leg of grad school, I will wind up out of state (for more school). For how long, who knows--but I shall return sooner or later.

[Greenville]

More than likely after I finish this leg of grad school, I will wind up out of state (for more school). For how long, who knows--but I shall return sooner or later.

That sounds cool, krazee. Please keep us posted on where you move for the next portion of your education. And when you are ready to move back to SC, I know a wonderful, vibrant, growing city in the northwest corner of the state that would be perfect for you.

[krazeeboi]

Trust me, you guys will know.

I'm about overdue another trip to Greenville as well. I have family I need to visit other there. I'll make sure I get lots of pictures!

[RestedTraveler]

Friday, May 5, 2006:

TBA:

• We haven't heard the last of Piggly Wiggly. Rumors abound that their upscale offering, called "Newton's," may be in the works for the Greenville Market. Please direct any commentary on this subject to THIS THREAD.
  
• Piazza Bergamo renovation plans should go before Greenville City Council within the next few weeks; however, these will be staff recommendations only and Council Members can ask for modifications. The Peace Center may offer a better venue if the turnout is as great as expected.
  
• Hampton Inn and Suites RiverPlace is on schedule to open in June, as planned.
  
• Landscape and Streetscape work should begin around Heritage Green soon, making it easier for pedestrians to get to and from the museums, library, theatre, etc. as well as to dress up the intersection a bit.
  
• Landscape and Streetscape work on South Main Street between West End Field and Pendleton Street should be wrapping up soon; however, don't expect the improvements to continue on down Pendleton Street.
  
• People's Bank will be locating a branch on Pleasantburg where Perone's Restaurant once stood. This has city officials happy.
  
• The City of Greenville is in negotiations to sell naming rights for the Palmetto Expo Center.
  
• Greenville City Officials are hopeful that major contenders for the City Hall Plaza site can be convinced to build their plans elsewhere if they are not chosen for their preferred site.
  

PAGE ONE:

• Article on the 22 bells from the van Bergen Company that will become the centerpiece sculpture at RiverPlace, once a carillon worthy of them can be designed and chosen. These are the last bells cast at van Bergen's foundry, in 1938, prior to the company relocating to South Carolina ahead of the Nazi Occupation of Holland
  
• Article on Kickbacks received by South Carolina State Lawmakers
  

INSIDE:

• Article on the Proposed $391M Greenville County School Budget
  
• Article on Shoeless Joe memorabilia donated to the Shoeless Joe Jackson Museum
  
• Article on the City of Greenville Budget
  
• Article on the Results of Artisphere
  
• Article on City Hall Plaza Redevelopment
  

[GSP Tiger]

[*]Landscape and Streetscape work should begin around Heritage Green soon, making it easier for pedestrians to get to and from the museums, library, theatre, etc. as well as to dress up the intersection a bit.

Left turn signals would be useful here. Traffic engineers forgot to install them on the first try.

[*]Landscape and Streetscape work on South Main Street between West End Field and Pendleton Street should be wrapping up soon; however, don't expect the improvements to continue on down Pendleton Street.

Pendleton Street will eventually be improved. The first step is to finish eliminating the undesirable parts out from Vardry Street to South Academy Street /Easley Bridge Road, a stretch that has seen much suspicious activity over a couple years. If a few light retail, offices and townhomes go in, the area could improve a bit.

[krazeeboi]

Naming rights to the Palmetto Expo Center? Isn't that like Greenville's convention center? I don't think I've ever seen a corporate sponsor for a convention center in terms of having naming rights.

Edit: Interestingly enough, I just found out that Milwaukee's convention center is named Midwest Airlines Convention Center. Man, I'm wondering if ANY public venue will ever reflect something local (like, say, the city's name)?

[GvilleSC]

Naming rights to the Palmetto Expo Center? Isn't that like Greenville's convention center? I don't think I've ever seen a corporate sponsor for a convention center in terms of having naming rights.

Edit: Interestingly enough, I just found out that Milwaukee's convention center is named Midwest Airlines Convention Center. Man, I'm wondering if ANY public venue will ever reflect something local (like, say, the city's name)?

Hmmm, I'm not too sure about this either... I don't like "Midwest Airlines Convention Center" at all. Palmetto Expo is fine by me...

[breed]

Naming rights to the Palmetto Expo Center? Isn't that like Greenville's convention center? I don't think I've ever seen a corporate sponsor for a convention center in terms of having naming rights.

Edit: Interestingly enough, I just found out that Milwaukee's convention center is named Midwest Airlines Convention Center. Man, I'm wondering if ANY public venue will ever reflect something local (like, say, the city's name)?

It's only a matter of time until we have the "Piggly Wiggly County Square"

[RestedTraveler]

Hey, Hey, Hey! Wrong thread, buster!

[btoy]

Considering that Tax Payer money is being used on the Expo Center, I think any money that can be generated by selling naming rights its a great idea. I think passing up the oppurtunity would be a crime.

[vicupstate]

I consider it craze commercialism to sell naming rights to public facilities. The taxpayers pay a helluva lot more money than the "Sponsor". But it's all about the almighty dollar. I respect the integrity of cities and counties that name their facilities after distinguished city father's, or "Veterans" or some other worthy moniker.

I wish Kotex or Preparation H would buying the naming rights to something, so more people would see how stupid and craze the whole thing is.

[Greenville]

If naming rights mean that the final product is better, and taxpayers benefit more (by paying lower taxes, seeing an increase in quality of life, or both) then corporate sponsorship makes total sense. If the only barrier to corporate sponsorship is an aversion to the name attached to it, then I don't think that is a good reason. After all, this isn't Piggly Wiggly folks. <-- would have used the "hypocrite" face if there were one, after being one of the outspoken ones with regard to not wanting Piggly Wiggly

[gs3]

Naming rights can get out control. Anybody remember the Independence Bowl the year it became the "Poulan / Weed Eater Independence Bowl"?

[whitehourseview]

Never understood why Poulan being a sponsor was a bad thing. Seems like a good thing to me. Lots of Americans are employed by the Poulan Corporation. They have made products for decades that have been in high demand.

It saved the taxpayers of Shreveport millions. It funded a city-wide festival that brought yearly attention to an area that normally doesn't get a lot of attention in northern Louisana. The sponsorship helped to fund athletic and academic scholarships at participating institutions.

Funding convention centers, sports arenas and entertainment centers are not core government & taxpayer functions.

It always seemed to me to be a bit of snobbery to be against commercial sponsorship. We really like it when BMW sponsors golf tournaments. Everyone likes events like Artisphere sponsored by the Greenville News/ Gannett. Seems commercialism becomes a problem when we don't like the corporations offering the money.

Sure beats taxpayers being forced to fork over the funds on penalty of imprisonment.

[gs3]

Never had a problem with Poulan......great company, great products. Just always thought the fact that "Weed Eater" was in the name of the bowl sounded really funny. If it had just been the Poulan Independence Bowl instead of the Poulan WEED EATER Independence Bowl. Always struck me as very funny.

[vicupstate]

Never understood why Poulan being a sponsor was a bad thing. Seems like a good thing to me. Lots of Americans are employed by the Poulan Corporation. They have made products for decades that have been in high demand.

It saved the taxpayers of Shreveport millions. It funded a city-wide festival that brought yearly attention to an area that normally doesn't get a lot of attention in northern Louisana. The sponsorship helped to fund athletic and academic scholarships at participating institutions.

Funding convention centers, sports arenas and entertainment centers are not core government & taxpayer functions.

It always seemed to me to be a bit of snobbery to be against commercial sponsorship. We really like it when BMW sponsors golf tournaments. Everyone likes events like Artisphere sponsored by the Greenville News/ Gannett. Seems commercialism becomes a problem when we don't like the corporations offering the money.

Sure beats taxpayers being forced to fork over the funds on penalty of imprisonment.

A private event like a golf tournament is not the same thing as a taxpayer-funded building. Tax money is not supporting the tournament. Arenas and Convention Centers do NOT make money, therefore, private businsess is not going to build one. If the government didn't build them,there wouldn't be any.

If the taxpayer's paid for the building, it should have there name on it. There is enough damn advertising and commercialism in our society. Is nothing exempt from it, or is everything a sell-out? Will churches and synagouges be named after businesses next? Maybe instead of the Pete Hollis Highway, it should be called the Budweiser Highway. Let's sell the naming rights to the new Wade Hampton High School, while we are at it. HHHMMM, Clearasil High School, maybe?

Corporate sponsorship is fine to a degree, but there should be limits, and good taste should prevail over the almight buck.

[krazeeboi]

I wish Kotex or Preparation H would buying the naming rights to something, so more people would see how stupid and craze the whole thing is.

Add Trojan and Lifestyles to the list as well! LOL!

[btoy]

If naming rights mean that the final product is better, and taxpayers benefit more (by paying lower taxes, seeing an increase in quality of life, or both) then corporate sponsorship makes total sense. If the only barrier to corporate sponsorship is an aversion to the name attached to it, then I don't think that is a good reason. After all, this isn't Piggly Wiggly folks. <-- would have used the "hypocrite" face if there were one, after being one of the outspoken ones with regard to not wanting Piggly Wiggly

AMEN

A private event like a golf tournament is not the same thing as a taxpayer-funded building. Tax money is not supporting the tournament. Arenas and Convention Centers do NOT make money, therefore, private businsess is not going to build one. If the government didn't build them,there wouldn't be any.

If the taxpayer's paid for the building, it should have there name on it. There is enough damn advertising and commercialism in our society. Is nothing exempt from it, or is everything a sell-out? Will churches and synagouges be named after businesses next? Maybe instead of the Pete Hollis Highway, it should be called the Budweiser Highway. Let's sell the naming rights to the new Wade Hampton High School, while we are at it. HHHMMM, Clearasil High School, maybe?

Corporate sponsorship is fine to a degree, but there should be limits, and good taste should prevail over the almight buck.

Its just a name who care if it sponsered or not, if letting some company put its name on public buildings means less tax dollars are needed then it is the right things to do.

And that is a great idea, they should sell the naming rights to schools as well, and why not libraries and courthouses while we are at it. Actually we do that already, we name buildings all the time after donors who give money to make something happen, corporate sponsorship is no different.

[vicupstate]

Two bits, four bits, six bits , a dollar!

All for Clearasil stand up and hollar!

Will the school cheerleaders be choosen by how many zits they have? I guess that would give a new set of girls an opportunity at it.

Enron Federal Courthouse

Chico's Bail Bonds Law Enforcement Center

Some things should not be for sale. For the same reason I am not willing to let our attractive landscape be inundated with billboards, I am not willing to sell the names of community icons that should be named after the men and women who made this city what it is. I'm sure there would be money to be made in selling the naming rights to Townes Square, but I prefer to honor a great man, that will inspire our younger generation, rather teach them money can buy anything.

A line has to be drawn somewhere. Maybe a monument should be put in Piazza Bergamo (naming rights available) with a giant $.

[krazeeboi]

Important buildings in a city should reflect local history and identity, particularly civic buildings. So if a few more tax dollars have to be shelled out to preserve a city's legacy and not make it look like "Anyplace USA," so be it. I'm not against naming rights per se, but there needs to be boundaries. And a person donating money to a worthy cause and subsequently having his/her name recognized on a building is not that person PAYING to have his/her name out there, but is rather something that is done to honor that person's contribution--a person that more than likely has local ties to the area. Otherwise, the average Joe Blow should be able to buy naming rights to anything. How does "Krazeeboi's Peace Center for the Performing Arts" sound?

[Greenville]

I consider it craze commercialism to sell naming rights to public facilities. The taxpayers pay a helluva lot more money than the "Sponsor". But it's all about the almighty dollar. I respect the integrity of cities and counties that name their facilities after distinguished city father's, or "Veterans" or some other worthy moniker.

Naming a facility "Veterans" probably just means they couldn't find a corporate sponsor.

[whitehourseview]

How does "Krazeeboi's Peace Center for the Performing Arts" sound?

Well that would sound kinda silly since the Peace Family bought the naming rights with the seed money for the privately financed Peace Center. Charlotte has a Duke Power theatre and a Belk theatre in their Blumenthal performing arts center, named for the Blumenthal family. Sounds like a wonderful idea to me for those corporations and private individuals to contribute to the community above and beyond what they provide with services and jobs.

Look, I don't want to dig in with a disagreement here, so I'll just say my peace and move on. There are lots of different opinions on this subject, mine are probably out in left field, I'm not any sort of expert, just a observor. But this isn't the sort of issue that can just be skipped over and folks should ask themselves all sorts questions when these private vs. public debates come up.

But there are lots of privately run arenas and convention halls that are profitable. Such stadiums as Fenway, Yankee, Tiger, old Comisky, etc. were all privately financed, and all have made lots of profits for their owners over the decades.

It's a breath of fresh air that the Greenville community has a privately run and financed minor league baseball park. Yes, the city provided infrastructure set ups for the area, but that at least has shifted the burden to the private developer to make his arena profitable. Goes the same for Bank of America stadium in Charlotte, public infrastructure, privately owned and managed and a model for how a private organization can turn an arena into a profitable enterprise.

There are other examples of non-profit and for profit groups running convention centers, like was the case with Palmetto Expo Center until the late 90's/early aught's economic downturn forced a sell off to the city.

Lots of golf tournaments receive subsidies from governments for some of their operations. I like that the BMW tournament does not, instead it relieves the pressure on local governments by supporting charities that can better support lots of people better than the local government can.

Sponsorship for Townes Square? Wonder if Bell Labs would pony up for that since Dr. Townes did some of his greatest work as an employee of Bell Labs? Suits me, sounds like a great way to honor a former employee of theirs.

There are lots of degrees to how far we want to go with corporate sponsorship. For me it has to start with defining what the minimum of the sphere of government's influence is. Providing the "bread and circuses" for the local populace shouldn't be first on the list, or anywhere near the top.

This is a huge debate that can get very emotional, again, I'm not an expert, but the debate is not going away anywhere in modern American life. Local governments seem to be very good at setting leadership goals and getting things started. Managing operations and maintenance seems to not work out so well for local government.

[vicupstate]

Those stadiums you listed are in places like NYC and Chicago and the owning establishments have been around for decades, before pro sports starting sending the bills for there stadiums to the taxpayers.

The Palmetto Expo being privately owned was a most unusual situation, and I doubt it turned a profit for it's owner.

I see a big difference between naming something for an individual as opposed to a company, which turns it into an advertisement. In the case of Belk, the family name and the company are the same. But if Bill Gates gives Furman $100mm for a new building, and they name it for him, I don't have a problem with that. If he gives them $100mm and they name it the Microsoft Building, that crosses a line with me.

[krazeeboi]

Naming a facility "Veterans" probably just means they couldn't find a corporate sponsor.

LOL.

Or perhaps they didn't want one or actually wished to honor veterans. One arena that looks really good and I'm sure has no problem attracting corporate sponsors is the Jacksonville Veterans Memorial Arena. I applaud them for retaining a local name instead of renaming it "Winn Dixie Arena."

[gs3]

Corporate sponsorship is already WELL engrained in our schools, so naming rights can't be far behind. I remember a couple of year ago, I was at my sisters house on the first day of school for her children. They came home with a package of pencils, book covers, magnets, etc, etc and all were plastered with corporate names from Pepsi to Apple to Barnes & Noble. Capitalism is alive and well and will continue to find ways to creep into every aspect of our lives. Not saying I agree with it, just stating fact.