Virginia Beach Development

[rusthebuss]

Planning Commission to hold workshop on Resort area zoning.

Pay close attention to this one guys. This will pertain to the future of all the development at the oceanfront, including plans to urbanize the 19th street corridor. Bottom line, this will determine whether the oceanfront remains a collection of rather subpar hotels orwhether we can experience something truly great and extend the North end revitalization efforts (read OBC, Hilton) to include the entire area. The future of height limits in that region may also be determined (though not specifically mentioned, you can't discuss zoning without discussing that).

You are right about that! I think they now see that the MJB is a good source but it doesn't expand the economy of the city like the city would like to see. Its causing to much controversy on possible high tax revenue projects. Hope they make the right decision and let them leave!

Edited November 29, 2005 by rusthebuss

[vdogg]

It would seem to me that the city first would need to have decided their position of Oceana before they could go forward determining height, density, etc in the Oceanfront area.

Not necessarily if said zoning issues can be changed in a manner that doesn't go against navy recommendations. I don't think they can however which is why i am saying watch closely. What the planning commission determines is good for the city will more than likely clash with what the Navy determines is good for it, leaving city council with yet another choice to make.

[willy]

I know this off the subject that you all have going here but...

Site of the Dockside Inn & Lynnhaven Seafood Market & Marina was listed during the week of 11/07/05 for sale at $6.5 million. The site has already attracted 4 offers, some above asking price. Each prospective buyer plans high-rise condominium development. The buyer will have to buy out the restaurant & marina's lease. The site is across the street from the former Duck Inn, which is also going to be replaced with condominiums very soon.

Just thought I would pass this little bit of info. out if you didn't already know.

Edited November 30, 2005 by willy

[hoobo]

I wish these restaurants were preserved in the condo developments. I hope VB doesn't lose Chick's Oyster Bar anytime soon. (I don't think Bubba's/Inlet Catering or Lynnhaven Fish House are going anywhere in the foreseeable future.) The rate things are going, VB will be over-priced resort restaurants for tourists and copy-cat chains for the rest of the city.

[Padman]

Not necessarily if said zoning issues can be changed in a manner that doesn't go against navy recommendations. I don't think they can however which is why i am saying watch closely. What the planning commission determines is good for the city will more than likely clash with what the Navy determines is good for it, leaving city council with yet another choice to make.

Agreed, and I think that timing will be a real factor in what will probably be a series of decisions. Both sides can get what they need if they are tactful and patient. I don't think that the Navy can curtail reasonable development at the Oceanfront for very long, nor do they have a very strong reason to do so. Safety is far more of an issue than noise levels are. Let's see what the City agrees to do within the APZ1 areas.

[vdogg]

A bit dated but I haven't seen this posted yet, Planners view Oceana proposal as a damper to redevelopment.

Here's an excerpt. " Several commissioners expressed concern that the proposal would kill the potential for commercial redevelopment in the areas, including aging sections of Virginia Beach Boulevard."

[rusthebuss]

A bit dated but I haven't seen this posted yet, Planners view Oceana proposal as a damper to redevelopment.

Here's an excerpt. " Several commissioners expressed concern that the proposal would kill the potential for commercial redevelopment in the areas, including aging sections of Virginia Beach Boulevard."

I hope the city decides to let them go. Besides having threats thrown at you make you bitter.

[urbanvb]

I hope the city decides to let them go. Besides having threats thrown at you make you bitter.

The Blvd. down near Oceana really could be a jewel in the rough sorta like OV. I do hope something can be done.

Edited December 2, 2005 by guynvb

[odumonarch]

The Blvd. down near Oceana really could be a jewel in the rough sorta like OV. I do hope something can be done.

General Booth Blvd? I agree that the road needs some upgrade. So far, a lot of stores and restaurants are there from Virginia Aquarium all way down to Nimmo Pkwy. But it could use a bit more enlivening - some housing, some Class A office space, and etc. Now, before Corporate Landing takes shape, it is still a road bordered by fast-food restaurants and below-average stores.

[Former Resident of HR]

General Booth Blvd? I agree that the road needs some upgrade. So far, a lot of stores and restaurants are there from Virginia Aquarium all way down to Nimmo Pkwy. But it could use a bit more enlivening - some housing, some Class A office space, and etc. Now, before Corporate Landing takes shape, it is still a road bordered by fast-food restaurants and below-average stores.

LOL I think that most people think of "VA Beach Blvd." when they hear "THE Bloulevard" so I am assuming that is what was meant.

[hoobo]

The Blvd. down near Oceana really could be a jewel in the rough sorta like OV. I do hope something can be done.

I too hear VB Blvd not General Booth. The Redwing/Ocean Lakes area (i.e. General Booth) is just another Lynnhaven, Salem, and Kempsville. Back to the original comment. Doesn't Laskin/Hilltop with all the strip malls and apartment complexs pull focus away from the Blvd? The exit off 264 is focused onto Laskin. Even most lanes from the Blvd west of Laskin continue onto Laskin as opposed to their namesake road. The city does want to revitalize the Blvd because they consider it a gateway to the Strip. Still, it would probably make more sense to work west from the Strip (or even Birdneck) than working east from Oceana. Right now, Laskin and Oceana's flight paths are too much of a negative force.

[urbanvb]

Hopefully Pembroke mall will be next on the drawing board!

I would like to say yes buuuuut.. they have several new stores now in the mall and Target should be coming next year.

[rusthebuss]

I would like to say yes buuuuut.. they have several new stores now in the mall and Target should be coming next year.

I know but it was wishful thinking on my part.

[urbanlife]

I talked to the owners of Pembroke Mall years ago and they want to keep the mall as apart of the downtown. So all that can really be hoped for is renovations and that they try to work it in with the rest of the city.

Funny thing is you could call the Pembroke Mall Old Pembroke seeing it is the oldtown of that area.

[urbanvb]

Although the mall is old it does have an urban feeling to it and now it offers free wireless internet in the cafe area.

[rusthebuss]

Although the mall is old it does have an urban feeling to it and now it offers free wireless internet in the cafe area.

Sorry but Pembroke Mall doesn't have a urban feel to me at all. But that is just my opinion

[urbanvb]

I guess what I mean is that it has a good sense of place.. that of course is my opinion.

[urbanlife]

it was a rotting piece of crap when I was last there but that was 2001. Anyone want to take some pictures of that has changed with Pembroke Mall?

[rusthebuss]

I guess what I mean is that it has a good sense of place.. that of course is my opinion.

I just feel that it is prime property for something better and maybe a outdoor style retail instead of that mixed with office and living space!

[urbanvb]

I just feel that it is prime property for something better and maybe a outdoor style retail instead of that mixed with office and living space!

I agree. Pembroke is not competing with Lynnhaven or MacArthur but it is coming around although slowly. The stores near the front entrance look ok but the stores in the corridor leading to furniture liquidators are still sad looking but that will will probably quickly change once Target is built. Oh and if these comments are out of topic perhaps Vdogg can move them but not sure where except off topic.. here are a few pics although rather dated now.

food court

[mistermetaj]

Pembroke mall is unsalvagable. It cannot compete with lynnhaven so none of the big name stores will go there. No amount of renovations can change the appeal of it or the quality of stores it will retain, not to mention the gigantic parking lot which seems bigger than all of town center doesn't really add to an urban feel. Hopefully money talks and the city can buy the mall. A lot depends on the mall eventually being razed and developed on since it is such a large chunck of the downtown area.

[PeninsulaKiddo]

I love Pembroke Mall.. it has a very nice "feel" to it, however, it's somewhat useless to the shopper. Having a Target will help, along with the Sears, but other than that it functions as little more than a lunch destination for people who live and work nearby. Ideally... I'd like to see at least one floor added to the main corridor just because I think the increase in volume will add to the sense of urbanity more than just an increase in square footage.

My dream for Pembroke (if it has to remain intact as one building): Go Prudential Center-Style; expand the main corridor upwards (retaining decor) to a three-level section, or at least that tall in terms of interior height. Barrel-vault the ceiling with glass. At the north end of the Mall, add in a huge lobby area with granite or marble finishes (something classy) and add in 1 or 2 high-rise towers with parking garages. Just a thought...

[nrdzrool]

i'd like pembroke mall to stick around, and i don't really think it's necessarily unsalvageable. years down the line, i'd love to see the mall do what several other city-center malls become...in stages, i could see the mall converted into something much more urban, in that there would be actual streets in a typical grid pattern, with all the stores acting as individual or grouped buildings. i've seen it done before, and i don't see why we wouldn't do it eventually. it would also give the pretend streets in town center to stretch out a bit and become a little bit more important to the life of downtown. as for the parking lots, i could be mistaken, but wasn't it mentioned at some point that some sort of tower was going to be built on a portion of it?

[vdogg]

mentioned at some point that some sort of tower was going to be built on a portion of it?

Yes, where the suntrust building currently sits. Their lease is supposed to be up in 06'. The idea was the developer didn't want just some random pedestrian bridge connecting towncenter to the mall so they pushed the pedestrian bridge back. They hope to have an office tower of some sort sit on the suntrust lot and a skybridge connect between that and the AH parking garage. This was some time ago that these plans were mentioned and may have changed considerably by now.

[hoobo]

Pembroke mall is unsalvagable. It cannot compete with lynnhaven so none of the big name stores will go there. No amount of renovations can change the appeal of it or the quality of stores it will retain, not to mention the gigantic parking lot which seems bigger than all of town center doesn't really add to an urban feel. Hopefully money talks and the city can buy the mall. A lot depends on the mall eventually being razed and developed on since it is such a large chunck of the downtown area.

The City already got the ball rolling with TC. It doesn't need to spend more public money in helping a mall. The TIF created for Lynnhaven is enough. Market forces should drive the Pembroke Mall redevelopment as they are with Pembroke Office Park and the HQ Center (I can't keep track of all these developments with City in their name). Redeveloping Pembroke is complicated by Sears owning its lot. Which brings up another question, why is K-mart still open? Shouldn't it close with Sears across the street. Hopefully Target will force its closure. Then Michael's can move to the K-mart space leaving half of that shopping center open for redevelopment.