Ally Charlotte Center (f/k/a Tryon Place) - 26 floors - 427'

[CLT2014]

7 minutes ago, Piedmont767 said:

I get that, but this is what the planners supposedly wanted- new towers- and there are only 3 lined up or in construction, so there not that many. It just seems like that is what was written in the article new towers, we start new ones and then they are doomed to fail and never be built. 

Tryon Place isn't doomed to fail yet at all. It would just be a huge relieve if a building like 615 College announced a large tenant taking some space off the market. Or even better, Tryon Place could get somebody to sign on now. 

Edited February 25, 2016 by CLT2014

[KJHburg]

One possible tenant for Tryon Place maybe off the table that being BB&T. It looks like they are renewing in BB&T Bldg however I don't know for how long. Unless Crescent has a major financial backer investor I dont see this getting out of the ground anytime soon. Not trying to be negative but just realistic. I hope I am missing someone who can anchor or maybe several smaller tenants to sign on. US Bank is another possibility for a tenant as they lease 100,000 sq ft in Hearst Plaza and South Tryon Square now. However I would wonder how long their lease is there. Duke Energy is a possibility but they are starting work on their huge office complex in University Research Park so don't know how much new space they would need uptown. I do not believe an out of market tenant would swoop into town and take a huge chunk. It has just not happened in Charlotte.  So I guess my question is what anchor tenants could be out there? Regions Bank maybe? 715,000 sq ft is a lot of space at once when there is at least 600,000 sq ft of new space coming online not leased in Portman's 615 S College and 300 South Tryon.   (Bank of America and Wells Fargo don't seem to expanding much uptown)

[Niner National]

5 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

One possible tenant for Tryon Place maybe off the table that being BB&T. It looks like they are renewing in BB&T Bldg however I don't know for how long. Unless Crescent has a major financial backer investor I dont see this getting out of the ground anytime soon. Not trying to be negative but just realistic. I hope I am missing someone who can anchor or maybe several smaller tenants to sign on. US Bank is another possibility for a tenant as they lease 100,000 sq ft in Hearst Plaza and South Tryon Square now. However I would wonder how long their lease is there. Duke Energy is a possibility but they are starting work on their huge office complex in University Research Park so don't know how much new space they would need uptown. I do not believe an out of market tenant would swoop into town and take a huge chunk. It has just not happened in Charlotte.  So I guess my question is what anchor tenants could be out there? Regions Bank maybe? 715,000 sq ft is a lot of space at once when there is at least 600,000 sq ft of new space coming online not leased in Portman's 615 S College and 300 South Tryon.   (Bank of America and Wells Fargo don't seem to expanding much uptown)

Crescent sold a ton of properties last year and amassed something like a billion dollars from those sales. I don't know that they need an investor to finance the project.

[KJHburg]

Crescent does complete their apartment complexes, leases them up and sells them. That is a great strategy for them and very smart. What I trying to say is for Tryon Place to get off the ground it needs a HUGE financial commitment to go spec or they would need to have an anchor tenant.  Maybe they have a huge financial backer I don't know.  Portman got their tower started with the Chinese money and got started with no tenants  and 300 South Tryon had the anchor tenant Babson and built in financing with Babson and their investment partners. I think Tryon Place is a fantastic project and one that will be great addition to Charlotte but either a deep pocket investor or financial partner or an anchor tenant would be needed to get this tower started.  

Edited March 21, 2016 by KJHburg

[Dale]

Why do they need a HUGE financial backer if they already have a HUGE amount of money ?

[CLTProductions]

Because they already have close to 3/4 of a billion in development between stonewall station and noda along. Both of those projects have financial backers, this one will too. It's the most expensive of the 3

[Guest]

On February 24, 2016 at 4:51 PM, CLT2014 said:

That article was written before the towers took off. There was a big need for more office towers then. Fast forward to today and this project has a bit more risk. There are towers already under cosntruction such as Portman and 300 S Tryon and they are competing for tenants - none have announced a major tenant (other than 300 S Tryon that went up with Babson Capital lined up).

They are also bidding on Brooklyn Village with a 7-900M plan. 

[BullDurhamer]

so did the general assembly just kill any chance this thing ever had at getting off the ground?  

[Nick2]

Let's keep the discussion of HB2 in the coffee house please.

[dcharlotte]

On March 21, 2016 at 10:49 AM, Dale said:

Why do they need a HUGE financial backer if they already have a HUGE amount of money ?

Financial LEVERAGE. It is the reason you see people with 10 million dollars not buying a ten million dollar apartment complex - they buy the $90 million dollar complex and use debt to juice their returns.

[BullDurhamer]

On 4/5/2016 at 10:34 AM, Nick2 said:

Let's keep the discussion of HB2 in the coffee house please.

what?      

this isn't about whether you agree with hb2 or not.  this is a serious question.  does hb2 basically kill any of these projects relying on new tenants from getting built?  

if you want to bury the question, then this forum is absolutely worthless.   the actions of state government are absolutely relevant to all of these matters here and the impact of these decisions should be examined, not sent to some coffee house where we can have meaningless arguments about whether this is "good" or not.  f that.  stop being afraid and look at what's facing us.  where does hb2 take tryon place and other projects in limbo at this moment?    maybe we don't know, but let's not be part of the problem and sweep it aside you don't want to offend somebody.  again, if you think it's not pertinent to the discussion, then you're missing half of the entire story. 

[CLTProductions]

4 minutes ago, BullDurhamer said:

what?      

this isn't about whether you agree with hb2 or not.  this is a serious question.  does hb2 basically kill any of these projects relying on new tenants from getting built?  

if you want to bury the question, then this forum is absolutely worthless.   the actions of state government are absolutely relevant to all of these matters here and the impact of these decisions should be examined, not sent to some coffee house where we can have meaningless arguments about whether this is "good" or not.  f that.  stop being afraid and look at what's facing us.  where does hb2 take tryon place and other projects in limbo at this moment?    maybe we don't know, but let's not be part of the problem and sweep it aside you don't want to offend somebody.  again, if you think it's not pertinent to the discussion, then you're missing half of the entire story. 

The point is HB2 has been beaten to death in about 3 other topics on this forum. No need to beat the dead horse here. 

To answer your question if HB2 will affect Tryon Place in one word: No. 

Edited April 10, 2016 by Jayvee

[kermit]

On 4/5/2016 at 0:30 PM, BullDurhamer said:

so did the general assembly just kill any chance this thing ever had at getting off the ground?  

I posted about this in the Misc Uptown thread about a week ago (and was met with the same ostrich response). The rumor around town is that Tryon Place both has a tenant (I don't know who) and is too far along to cancel now. 

I do think its clear that any other office project not already underway is almost certainly dead. I think its very likely that HB2 ended our current office market cycle (no Grubb/Skyhouse tower, no Observer office space in this phase, and no new Southend office space other than DFA).

On the plus side, we all know that developers are among the most politically powerful players in our region. While they have been publicly quiet thus far, I have no doubt that they are making calls to Raleigh. While Class A Office developers are not the most progressive group, they are arguably going to take the biggest economic hit from HB2.

 

[Deleted.]

5 minutes ago, kermit said:

I posted about this in the Misc Uptown thread about a week ago (and was met with the same ostrich response). The rumor around town is that Tryon Place both has a tenant (I don't know who) and is too far along to cancel now. 

I do think its clear that any other office project not already underway is almost certainly dead. I think its very likely that HB2 ended our current office market cycle (no Grubb/Skyhouse tower, no Observer office space in this phase, and no new Southend office space other than DFA).

On the plus side, we all know that developers are among the most politically powerful players in our region. While they have been publicly quiet thus far, I have no doubt that they are making calls to Raleigh. While Class A Office developers are not the most progressive group, they are arguably going to take the biggest economic hit from HB2.

 

I would agree with you 100%. I've heard about the Tryon Place rumor as well. Whilst it is sad to see those developments paused, it certainly helps the developers of 300ST, TP, Westin Tower etc. The Observer site would going to be a master plan, no? So it was unlikely to really start going before this boom busts, which I expect to be within the next 12-18 months. 

The developers may follow the path of Red Ventures, switching to Roy Cooper for Governor, to try and less the impact of HB2. It was under Perdue that we economic incentives that got major companies to NC, with the exception of Sealed Air.

[KJHburg]

the economic expansion is getting long in the tooth anyway and many companies are reluctant to do big expansions in election years and this year is no exception. The office tower portion of the Charlotte Observer site will not be done in the next few years as we have to lease up the 1,000,000 sq ft coming along now that is under construction in 300 SouthTryon and 615 South College and that is before counting the 700K Tryon Place.  The anchor tenant for Tryon Place is probably already in this market. As stated before no big company has even flown into town and anchored an uptown office tower. Never happened in Charlotte history so far. Ally Bank was already in the market in Southpark and Ballantyne and NASCAR was already leasing space here. Someone leased a whole floor in the Hearst Tower this month and it could be (my speculation) US Bank. US Bank is the leading candidate if you ask me. If anyone has any other guesses I like to hear them. Now a few towers have been built on pure speculation like Charlotte Plaza and the Carillon buildings. 

Edited April 11, 2016 by KJHburg

[15895]

Well this is great news that Tryon Place supposedly has an anchor. So, is the time table still going vertical 4Q16 & utility work this summer?

[Prodev]

It's most likely Duke, and it should be announced soon. Total size may be larger than originally announced too. 

[cltbwimob]

^^^Duke??? Is this in addition to the DEC or are they moving?

[15895]

35 minutes ago, cltbwimob said:

^^^Duke??? Is this in addition to the DEC or are they moving?

It would obviously be in addition. I think they have big chunks of 400 South Tryon expiring in 2019. They have around 580,000 sq. feet of space total there. 

 

(It would be really cool if they made the light colors of Tryon Place and DEC [assuming Duke is the anchor] match)

Edited April 11, 2016 by AirNostrumMAD

[KJHburg]

Duke is also building a huge campus in the University Research Park and site work has already started. That may be some of the 400 South Tryon people moving there. I hope Tryon Place does get started soon and maybe Wells needs more space in their own building which is of course is Duke Energy Center (they own it)

[urbanlover568]

I have reservations If it's duke. They just had a major layoff due to the coal ash lawsuits.

[Niner National]

2 hours ago, mpretori said:

I have reservations If it's duke. They just had a major layoff due to the coal ash lawsuits.

900 out of 30,000 employees is hardly enough to think Duke is on shaky ground.

[Silicon Dogwoods]

30 minutes ago, Niner National said:

900 out of 30,000 employees is hardly enough to think Duke is on shaky ground.

Not to worry.

I keep thinking Duke, seeing the future, has one or more tricks up its sleeve.

[cltbwimob]

To be honest, I was hoping for something a little more flashy than Duke like a BMW NA HQ or Ally officially moving their HQ- something along those lines.  Nevertheless, I just am happy to hear that Tryon Place sounds as if it is moving forward even if it is just Duke trading spaces in Uptown.  For the past two months I have been pretty concerned that it just wasn't happening given that AT&T and Chiquita, through their departures, blessed us with 600K+ sq ft of prime office space in Uptown.

Will this be the first 600+ ft tower to rise post recession?

[Deleted.]

1 hour ago, cltbwimob said:

To be honest, I was hoping for something a little more flashy than Duke like a BMW NA HQ or Ally officially moving their HQ- something along those lines.  Nevertheless, I just am happy to hear that Tryon Place sounds as if it is moving forward even if it is just Duke trading spaces in Uptown.  For the past two months I have been pretty concerned that it just wasn't happening given that AT&T and Chiquita, through their departures, blessed us with 600K+ sq ft of prime office space in Uptown.

Will this be the first 600+ ft tower to rise post recession?

Well, the benefit of having an existing major company anchor a new tower is that they will definitely anchor a lot more space than a new company, IIRC Mercedes only created 800 jobs and uses something along the lines of 100,000 square feet in Atlanta, that would barely dent Tryon Place. 

 

So let me get this clear, the tenant is Duke Energy and it is going to be taller than 36 floors or 600ft?