The State of Downtown Retail

[Cityplanner]

2 hours ago, gman said:

Target just announced one of its small format stores is coming to King St. in Charleston. This concept would do well in downtown Greenville too. https://www.postandcourier.com/business/target-to-open-small-format-store-on-king-street-in-downtown-charleston/article_2938b66e-8dae-11eb-ac42-afc8e1704344.html

I remember shopping in the Target space...back when it was a Saks Fifth Avenue.  Kind of a drop in prestige?

Central Greenville definitely could support a Target.  The County Square site had two large discount stores back in the '70s and at least one was around until the '80s.  There's definitely a market for a Target, and the downtown area could definitely support one.  It's such a pain to drive to Woodruff Road.

Hopefully a "real" Target will open in or near downtown.  A mini-Target is better than no Target, but I'd prefer a "real" one.

[vistatiger]

36 minutes ago, Cityplanner said:

I remember shopping in the Target space...back when it was a Saks Fifth Avenue.  Kind of a drop in prestige?

Central Greenville definitely could support a Target.  The County Square site had two large discount stores back in the '70s and at least one was around until the '80s.  There's definitely a market for a Target, and the downtown area could definitely support one.  It's such a pain to drive to Woodruff Road.

Hopefully a "real" Target will open in or near downtown.  A mini-Target is better than no Target, but I'd prefer a "real" one.

I would say the drop from Saks to Forever 21 on King St. was a bigger drop in prestige.  Target would be an upgrade from F21. 

[Cityplanner]

Good point.  If we get a dollar store in the Brooks Brothers space I'll be crushed.  Let other cities have their retail downgrades.

The former JCPenney building across from ONE would actually be a good site for a Target, and it's spacious.  It seems weird that it's still office--who needs ground-floor office space?

Edited April 1, 2021 by Cityplanner

[gman430]

2 hours ago, Cityplanner said:

Good point.  If we get a dollar store in the Brooks Brothers space I'll be crushed.  Let other cities have their retail downgrades.

The former JCPenney building across from ONE would actually be a good site for a Target, and it's spacious.  It seems weird that it's still office--who needs ground-floor office space?

That site is slated for ONE phase II by Hughes.

[gman430]

CORE is moving from ONE to Overbrook Village.

[goodbye]

10 hours ago, gman430 said:

That site is slated for ONE phase II by Hughes.

So would it be called TWO Greenville (2 North Main Street)?  I thought the ONE development already included multiple completed phases.

[GvilleSC]

36 minutes ago, Skyliner said:

So would it be called TWO Greenville (2 North Main Street)?  I thought the ONE development already included multiple completed phases.

Yea -- you're correct. I think the conjecture  by folks should be framed as the potential next phase. Or just acknowledgement of the ownership and the likelihood that one day they'll redevelop the site when the market deems it appropriate. 

[gman430]

2 hours ago, Skyliner said:

So would it be called TWO Greenville (2 North Main Street)?  I thought the ONE development already included multiple completed phases.

Yes: http://romeoffice.us/#/office-headquarters/

[gvegascple]

50 minutes ago, gman430 said:

Yes: http://romeoffice.us/#/office-headquarters/

I love this design for this corner location

[Cityplanner]

There are some news articles out about how an owner of a warehouse used by Brooks Brothers was left with a warehouse full of junk and invoices that Brooks Brothers didn't pay.  If that's how the ONE owners were treated, I can see why they wouldn't do whatever was necessary to keep that store.  BB is now on my "do not shop" list (which is easy to comply with since so many of its stores are closed). Hopefully loss of a higher-end store won't be damaging to downtown's prospects; losing Saks Fifth Avenue didn't seem to affect Charleston much at all, so hopefully it'll be the same for Greenville.

[motonenterprises]

1 hour ago, Cityplanner said:

There are some news articles out about how an owner of a warehouse used by Brooks Brothers was left with a warehouse full of junk and invoices that Brooks Brothers didn't pay.  If that's how the ONE owners were treated, I can see why they wouldn't do whatever was necessary to keep that store.  BB is now on my "do not shop" list (which is easy to comply with since so many of its stores are closed). Hopefully loss of a higher-end store won't be damaging to downtown's prospects; losing Saks Fifth Avenue didn't seem to affect Charleston much at all, so hopefully it'll be the same for Greenville.

This won't hurt Greenville. I've been in that store once just to look.

[vicupstate]

Table 301 closes Table 301 Kitchen (formerly Soby's on the Side)

[gvegascple]

On 5/2/2021 at 3:20 PM, vicupstate said:

Table 301 closes Table 301 Kitchen (formerly Soby's on the Side)

I was wondering  about hearing from potential employees about situations like this. I keep hearing restaurants say no one wants to work for them so they have to close.   I thought if you offered someone employment and they turned it down they don't get unemployment. I also read articles quoting owners  that no one wants to work for the pay the restaurants are offering.   Are there any restaurant employees that can shed light on this? I get that if you work for tips on top of pennies per hour and restaurants are not at capacity that your pay may not cover expenses to work and that you could end up losing money working (maybe this is the crux  of things).  I am also hoping to keep this to just first hand experience and knowledge and not a political debate.

[GvilleSC]

46 minutes ago, gvegascple said:

I was wondering  about hearing from potential employees about situations like this. I keep hearing restaurants say no one wants to work for them so they have to close.   I thought if you offered someone employment and they turned it down they don't get unemployment. I also read articles quoting owners  that no one wants to work for the pay the restaurants are offering.   Are there any restaurant employees that can shed light on this? I get that if you work for tips on top of pennies per hour and restaurants are not at capacity that your pay may not cover expenses to work and that you could end up losing money working (maybe this is the crux  of things).  I am also hoping to keep this to just first hand experience and knowledge and not a political debate.

Covid relief removed the work requirement from unemployment benefits and then that has been extended by subsequent bills until the fall I believe. 

[gvegascple]

33 minutes ago, GvilleSC said:

Covid relief removed the work requirement from unemployment benefits and then that has been extended by subsequent bills until the fall I believe. 

This makes sense for the aforementioned people who would be faced with returning to work at reduced capacity restaurants making $2/hr.  They would be screwed.  Seems like we have to wait until enough people are vaccinated to allow for enough consumer confidence before things return to normal.  When its safe and everyone is back dining,  there should be plenty of new workers ready to take anyone's (good) jobs if those on unemployment want to keep sitting this out too long.  I am more than ready (and vaccinated) for this to happen and my 5G reception has never been better

.

Edited May 5, 2021 by gvegascple

[Horatio Nelson]

My girlfriend is a chef, and the issue is a combination of things:

-Many people in the restaurant industry got a taste of life with a more normal schedule and they decided to leave the industry (restaurant schedules are not great)

-Because of the crunch in getting people back alot of restaurants or places that need cooks are offering more money. The places that aren't are finding it very difficult to retain anyone.

-And of course people who are sitting on the sidelines because they are waiting for Covid to be over because (They live with someone with a compromised immune system, etc) further constrains the supply of workers.

Edited May 5, 2021 by Horatio Nelson

[gman430]

2 hours ago, GvilleSC said:

Covid relief removed the work requirement from unemployment benefits and then that has been extended by subsequent bills until the fall I believe. 

The requirement was added back for the state of South Carolina a week or two ago. 

[NewlyUpstate]

6 hours ago, Horatio Nelson said:

My girlfriend is a chef, and the issue is a combination of things:

-Many people in the restaurant industry got a taste of life with a more normal schedule and they decided to leave the industry (restaurant schedules are not great)

-Because of the crunch in getting people back alot of restaurants or places that need cooks are offering more money. The places that aren't are finding it very difficult to retain anyone.

-And of course people who are sitting on the sidelines because they are waiting for Covid to be over because (They live with someone with a compromised immune system, etc) further constrains the supply of workers.

I think the first point is pretty important.  There are plenty of places online where you can get a fully remote customer service job for 15-20 dollars an hour as long as you are decent at talking to people (I think Apple pays $19 right now, there's many other options though too).   It doesn't surprise me at all that someone looking for a job would rather work at home in their PJs making a living wage of $15/hr instead of going into a place, subjecting themselves to the risk of getting covid, and making a poverty wage of $2 an hour plus tips.

Restaurants need to start paying competitively if they want to get labor back. People are learning there's other options out there.

Edited May 5, 2021 by NewlyUpstate

[apaladin]

10 hours ago, gvegascple said:

This makes sense for the aforementioned people who would be faced with returning to work at reduced capacity restaurants making $2/hr.  They would be screwed.  Seems like we have to wait until enough people are vaccinated to allow for enough consumer confidence before things return to normal.  When its safe and everyone is back dining,  there should be plenty of new workers ready to take anyone's (good) jobs if those on unemployment want to keep sitting this out too long.  I am more than ready (and vaccinated) for this to happen and my 5G reception has never been better

.

Have you been out to eat lately? Restaurants are crowded and back to full capacity in most cases. Little or no mask requirements. 

Edited May 5, 2021 by apaladin

[johnpro318]

It's simple, if you can't get workers, raise your benefits to encourage people to work for you. 

[gman430]

Hopefully this helps especially if all 30,000 of them have to go back to work: https://www.wspa.com/news/dew-needs-documentation-from-30000-south-carolinians/?fbclid=IwAR16n-QHnWVQar3GWNxpuB55lMSm3Ex09zGjD0HHpkueU5AXS9ZPZ7Tu9P0

[NewlyUpstate]

10 hours ago, gman430 said:

Hopefully this helps especially if all 30,000 of them have to go back to work: https://www.wspa.com/news/dew-needs-documentation-from-30000-south-carolinians/?fbclid=IwAR16n-QHnWVQar3GWNxpuB55lMSm3Ex09zGjD0HHpkueU5AXS9ZPZ7Tu9P0

This is just people who haven't submitted paperwork yet and not related in any way to people currently unemployed looking for jobs. Prior to the Pandemic, we were at an all-time low unemployment rate of 2.5%.   We peaked at about 11.5% in April, but are back to a fairly normal 5.2% unemployment rate.

If I was a business owner, I would be rethinking my labor and business strategy for competitiveness. If they think there will be a gush of cheap labor re-entering the market in the next couple months, I'm afraid they are going to be a little disappointed.  

[gman430]

2 hours ago, NewlyUpstate said:

This is just people who haven't submitted paperwork yet and not related in any way to people currently unemployed looking for jobs. Prior to the Pandemic, we were at an all-time low unemployment rate of 2.5%.   We peaked at about 11.5% in April, but are back to a fairly normal 5.2% unemployment rate.

If I was a business owner, I would be rethinking my labor and business strategy for competitiveness. If they think there will be a gush of cheap labor re-entering the market in the next couple months, I'm afraid they are going to be a little disappointed.  

That’s what I’m saying. Hopefully those 30,000 people now actually get a job and help these establishments having trouble finding workers instead of just sitting at home being lazy. The stricter guidelines being implemented seem to be working: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/06/weekly-jobless-claims.html

[NewlyUpstate]

edit

Edited May 6, 2021 by NewlyUpstate

[gman430]

https://governor.sc.gov/news/2021-05/south-carolina-return-pre-pandemic-unemployment-program-address-workforce-shortages?fbclid=IwAR2B6ju__iEwcJ-3FX3AFDS8sRIQlOGnM0M182RZ2HauxKQLLe_J1zSR2yI