New Titans Stadium (60,000 capacity dome, ground level retail, directly east of Nissan Stadium)

[nashvylle]

Looks like both the State of Tennessee and Metro Nashville debt have officially been issued for the new Titans Stadium:

https://www.nashvillescene.com/news/pithinthewind/titans-financing-clears-bond-market/article_a3d9f892-4774-11ee-a536-5bc463b0e99d.html

 

Edited August 30, 2023 by nashvylle

[Sean blackdog]

Today this evening from Tennessean. 
 

Tennessee Titans' value just went up. How Nashville stadium deal plays into $4.4 billion valuation 

https://www.tennessean.com/story/money/2023/09/05/forbes-tennessee-titans-value-surges-among-nfl-teams-nissan-stadium/70768351007/

 

[Nathan_in_DC]

How will construction impact the ability to use the existing stadium? Will they be able to completely work around it, finish the new stadium, then move on to demolishing the old one? 

[PaulChinetti]

They've said they will use the existing stadium the entire time. 

The East parking lot will obviously be no longer in use. It'll be interesting to see what other parking lots roads get closed. 

[japan]

On 8/25/2023 at 9:19 AM, glamdring269 said:

I’d like to put a deposit down but can’t find any estimated pricing to know if it’s something I’d even be interested in. Has that been shared and I’m just overlooking it?

Don't believe it's been shared yet.  Just rumors.

Edited September 6, 2023 by japan

[samsonh]

Lol at giving this product 2 billion

[PaulChinetti]

Lol at making a call on the season after one game. 

[Rick Dalton]

You dont make stadium decisions for the next 40+ years based on the quality of the 2023 team lol. Also, the offense looked awful but they covered the spread.

[samsonh]

12 hours ago, PaulChinetti said:

Lol at making a call on the season after one game. 

8 losses in a row. I’m a big fan, but man this team is underwhelming.

[nashvillain_too]

11 hours ago, Rick Dalton said:

You dont make stadium decisions for the next 40+ years based on the quality of the 2023 team lol. Also, the offense looked awful but they covered the spread.

Can we make it on 25 years of mediocrity? Also, can we admit that Metro was completely hoodwinked now that we know that the Titan's valuation increased to $4.4 billion after the stadium deal. An increase that was entirely predicted by anyone with a pulse who pays attention. What a racket

[Luvemtall]

How many times does it take to convince you all, that this new stadium isn’t the result of anything to do with the Titans. Yes they use it , but this whole thing is happening so Nashville gets a new large indoor event space. The State ponied up the cash in hopes of a future RNC convention plain and simple, and Metro needs it in hopes of winning the bids on major events. You want to talk about being hoodwinked, looks like they totally got you all.

[nashvylle]

1 hour ago, nashvillain_too said:

Can we make it on 25 years of mediocrity? Also, can we admit that Metro was completely hoodwinked now that we know that the Titan's valuation increased to $4.4 billion after the stadium deal. An increase that was entirely predicted by anyone with a pulse who pays attention. What a racket

Until they sell the team, it's all on paper. I do wish Metro had negotiated some sort of clawback if the Adams family does sell, because the valuation increase is in large part to the state and metro. 

However, again, looking at the $1BN+ renovation plans for cleveland, cincy, jacksonville, carolina... I am very grateful our property taxes are not going to a stadium. 

[Sean blackdog]

Today this morning from Tennessee Lookout. 

https://tennesseelookout.com/2023/09/11/taxpayers-to-pay-1b-in-interest-on-new-titans-stadium-as-team-value-spikes-from-project/

 

[Melrose]

1 hour ago, nashvylle said:

Until they sell the team, it's all on paper. I do wish Metro had negotiated some sort of clawback if the Adams family does sell, because the valuation increase is in large part to the state and metro. 

However, again, looking at the $1BN+ renovation plans for cleveland, cincy, jacksonville, carolina... I am very grateful our property taxes are not going to a stadium. 

...Until they sell of minority share(s) (perhaps even to someone who will eventually buy out the majority  stake) in the team at this inflated valuation.  This is the shorter term way the Adamses can and will cash in from this boondoggle. 

[nashvylle]

The Tennessee Lookout says "taxpayer" on purpose, because they know readers immediately think resident property taxes. The type of debt matters- a Nashville resident never going to the new stadium nor staying in a Davidson County hotel will not have $1 of property or sales tax going to the new stadium. That's pretty amazing. 

I do not like any debt going to billionaires either, but this was not a deal to bring a pro sports team to the city and hope for economic results (see Las Vegas with the Raiders, Golden Knights, and Oakland Athletics). We had a terrible lease, voted on by public referendum, which could have led to general obligation bonds (IE property tax revenue) in the amount of ~$1BN+ to renovate a bad stadium. We are now going to finally get sales and property tax revenue generated on the east bank go into metro's general fund, instead of 100% of sales tax going to the Music City Center. Plus, an estimated $130MM from non-NFL events going to the general fund over 30 years. 

There are boondoggles, and then there are turning a terrible deal into a reasonable one. 

Edited September 11, 2023 by nashvylle

[smeagolsfree]

The Fallon Company out of Boston will be the master developer for the Titans Stadium.

The Fallon Company | Commercial Real Estate Developers

[Rick Dalton]

Nice. I love the seaport 

[shanky]

On 9/11/2023 at 3:28 PM, nashvylle said:

The Tennessee Lookout says "taxpayer" on purpose, because they know readers immediately think resident property taxes. The type of debt matters- a Nashville resident never going to the new stadium nor staying in a Davidson County hotel will not have $1 of property or sales tax going to the new stadium. That's pretty amazing. 

I do not like any debt going to billionaires either, but this was not a deal to bring a pro sports team to the city and hope for economic results (see Las Vegas with the Raiders, Golden Knights, and Oakland Athletics). We had a terrible lease, voted on by public referendum, which could have led to general obligation bonds (IE property tax revenue) in the amount of ~$1BN+ to renovate a bad stadium. We are now going to finally get sales and property tax revenue generated on the east bank go into metro's general fund, instead of 100% of sales tax going to the Music City Center. Plus, an estimated $130MM from non-NFL events going to the general fund over 30 years. 

There are boondoggles, and then there are turning a terrible deal into a reasonable one. 

I do like the idea of sticking it to the tourists to pay for this big ole event space

[satalac]

Does anyone know if the new stadium will have a spotlight to highlight our wide receivers and tight ends so we'll know who to throw it to? 

[Argo]

On 9/11/2023 at 8:58 AM, Luvemtall said:

How many times does it take to convince you all, that this new stadium isn’t the result of anything to do with the Titans. Yes they use it , but this whole thing is happening so Nashville gets a new large indoor event space. The State ponied up the cash in hopes of a future RNC convention plain and simple, and Metro needs it in hopes of winning the bids on major events. You want to talk about being hoodwinked, looks like they totally got you all.

It wasn't publicized much, but they said they were going to use it for conventions and tradeshows that were too big for the Music City Center. It was a way to backdoor construction of a second larger convention center. They wanted to build a Music City Center II but they knew the taxpayers would have none of it. There was even an image of it.

Edited September 13, 2023 by Argo

[samsonh]

On 9/11/2023 at 3:28 PM, nashvylle said:

The Tennessee Lookout says "taxpayer" on purpose, because they know readers immediately think resident property taxes. The type of debt matters- a Nashville resident never going to the new stadium nor staying in a Davidson County hotel will not have $1 of property or sales tax going to the new stadium. That's pretty amazing. 

I do not like any debt going to billionaires either, but this was not a deal to bring a pro sports team to the city and hope for economic results (see Las Vegas with the Raiders, Golden Knights, and Oakland Athletics). We had a terrible lease, voted on by public referendum, which could have led to general obligation bonds (IE property tax revenue) in the amount of ~$1BN+ to renovate a bad stadium. We are now going to finally get sales and property tax revenue generated on the east bank go into metro's general fund, instead of 100% of sales tax going to the Music City Center. Plus, an estimated $130MM from non-NFL events going to the general fund over 30 years. 

There are boondoggles, and then there are turning a terrible deal into a reasonable one. 

Yet again, this is only the case if you think the new development area will not require city services. But they will, and that cost will necessarily be passed onto everyone else. 

[Luvemtall]

Yes , but this area is ALREADY part of the city services sector. It’s not adding to the service area like land that is being annexed into the city. So the taxpayers are already paying for it, not added to it.

[samsonh]

42 minutes ago, Luvemtall said:

Yes , but this area is ALREADY part of the city services sector. It’s not adding to the service area like land that is being annexed into the city. So the taxpayers are already paying for it, not added to it.

Will this land require increased police and fire presence from current levels? Yes, that is the entire idea of developing the land.  Will it require increased infrastructure spend? Yes.  Will adequate tax dollars be paid into city coffers from this development to cover those costs? No, because they will be going to debt service. 

 

This deal is similar to TIF deals. It is fine to make the tradeoff, but to say it doesn't cost existing taxpayers is factually incorrect. It absolutely does, since they are subsidizing city services that will be required and are not being paid for by the new development. 

 

 

[Luvemtall]

1 hour ago, samsonh said:

Will this land require increased police and fire presence from current levels? Yes, that is the entire idea of developing the land.  Will it require increased infrastructure spend? Yes.  Will adequate tax dollars be paid into city coffers from this development to cover those costs? No, because they will be going to debt service. 

Same can be said about the Nashville Yards development and the upcoming Beaman & Reed developments , Rutledge Hill development etc. they are all adding square footage and more people, therefore will require more fire , police, sanitation services plus infrastructure. It’s all inclusive to a growing population, and its required needs. The only sore point here, is because the Titans are part of this deal and many are focused solely on that subject. Forgetting that all of the East Bank redevelopment projects are cohesive and beneficial to the greater good of the city, turning blighted industrial wastelands and asphalt jungles into functional urban neighborhoods with substantial economic growth and this Stadium as the centerpiece will benefit all,as did Music City Center for SoBro and Metro in general despite all the bellyaching from the neysayers. 

[samsonh]

58 minutes ago, Luvemtall said:

Same can be said about the Nashville Yards development and the upcoming Beaman & Reed developments , Rutledge Hill development etc. they are all adding square footage and more people, therefore will require more fire , police, sanitation services plus infrastructure. It’s all inclusive to a growing population, and its required needs. The only sore point here, is because the Titans are part of this deal and many are focused solely on that subject. Forgetting that all of the East Bank redevelopment projects are cohesive and beneficial to the greater good of the city, turning blighted industrial wastelands and asphalt jungles into functional urban neighborhoods with substantial economic growth and this Stadium as the centerpiece will benefit all,as did Music City Center for SoBro and Metro in general despite all the bellyaching from the neysayers. 

Yes, those projects will definitely require additional services. And 100% of sales tax and property tax will go towards the appropriate funds(which is the entire point). Also, this project will not be generating entirely new revenue. Some of these sales tax dollars will be coming at the expense of sales tax dollars being spent elsewhere in the county currently. 

 

I am super excited about the development, potential new housing near downtown, and potential for a new neighborhood over the next 20 years. But it costs money and being intellectually honest about where the money is coming from is good.