The Transportation and Mass Transit Megathread

[GregH]

Seems like BRT with actually-enforced/protected ROW would be 95% of the way to a "trackless tram" for much cheaper.

[henburg]

On 12/26/2023 at 6:28 PM, PillowTalk4 said:

Could this be an alternative for Nashville to consider?

How trackless trams could help revitalize city suburbs

I wouldn't even advocate for the driverless aspect of this, but I do think it's really important that the cars look and function like these do for any BRT type of plan that it seems our city is heavily leaning toward now. Not only is the design more efficient and easy to load on/off than the buses currently on our roads, but I think that we're going to need something drastically different from the traditional bus design to help get more non-transit users to buy in. These are eye-catching and as a result I think that they would be much more successful in winning over new riders than simply placing electric buses in a dedicated lane will. 

Edited December 28, 2023 by henburg

[BeaveStirs]

Here is a late Christmas present to the forum. Rumor has it TDOT is now required to spend half their budget on improving public transit in Nashville 

[Luvemtall]

Damn! I had to stop and stare at that picture for a while. Don’t know how you did that, but it sure looks amazing! We can only dream.

[markhollin]

TDOT plans to widen a 4.4 mile stretch of Nolensville Pike (State Route 11/U.S. 31) fro Old Hickory Blvd. south to Burkitt Rd.  The current two lanes will become 5 lanes  with sidewalks on each side.

https://www.tn.gov/tdot/projects/region-3/state-route-11--nolensville-road-.html?utm_term=nashtoday&utm_campaign=daily-newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_source=nashtoday&utm_content=nashtoday

[Digital Dust]

3 hours ago, markhollin said:

TDOT plans to widen a 4.4 mile stretch of Nolensville Pike (State Route 11/U.S. 31) fro Old Hickory Blvd. south to Burkitt Rd.  The current two lanes will become 5 lanes  with sidewalks on each side.

https://www.tn.gov/tdot/projects/region-3/state-route-11--nolensville-road-.html?utm_term=nashtoday&utm_campaign=daily-newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_source=nashtoday&utm_content=nashtoday

What's crazy to me is that the initial public meeting was back in January 2006... This plan can vote now

[Luvemtall]

1 hour ago, Digital Dust said:

What's crazy to me is that the initial public meeting was back in January 2006... This plan can vote now

So TDOT fast paced this one ! 

[go_outside]

7 hours ago, markhollin said:

TDOT plans to widen a 4.4 mile stretch of Nolensville Pike (State Route 11/U.S. 31) fro Old Hickory Blvd. south to Burkitt Rd.  The current two lanes will become 5 lanes  with sidewalks on each side.

I appreciate CM Sean Parker pushing for slightly narrower lanes (TDOT’s current plan is 12’ lanes). https://x.com/seanforfive/status/1744406502633246883?s=46&t=esxz5S9AONY_ADGiyzx4fw
 

Hopefully TDOT narrows the lanes somewhat and uses the extra space for wider sidewalks/street trees.

[Luvemtall]

Narrow lanes might sound good to a lot of folks, and I get the overall sentiment of them within the urban core. But I know that no one is thinking about or considering the effects that those lanes will have on the truckers bringing goods into town. Yes you all know them, those unforgettable good folks that bring you EVERYTHING that you touch, eat, purchase. Reducing lanes down to 10 foot from the current 12 equals 4 feet loss on a normal two lane road , might be good for a Kia or VW but it’s drastic for maneuvering a 80 foot long semi. And before the wise mouth remarks about how you don’t think semis belong downtown, remember not only does everything you consume get delivered by truck somewhere along the line, remember all those beautiful new buildings popping up all over town , need materials ( especially steel) to get built. Yes you might not like them or you probably never think of them other then their always in your way or they are this or that , whatever you want to think they are a necessity of life and we can’t survive without them. Stop trying to rid the world of things that don’t fit a dream utopian fantasy of the perfect urban environment and think of ways to blend what is here and now with the right amount of infrastructure for all modes of transportation. I fully understand and support advocating for proper bike lanes and better implementation of multi modal transport, but anyone who only thinks about their needs and perspectives without regard to others is blindly ignorant 

[PaulChinetti]

I think that might be the rub for me, all of those things happen but are such a small percentage of how roads are used. 

I'd rather design roads for people that live there, instead of things that happen say weekly for a delivery (hypothetical timeframe).


Is there a minimum lane width that is recommended?

[go_outside]

3 hours ago, Luvemtall said:

Narrow lanes might sound good to a lot of folks, and I get the overall sentiment of them within the urban core. But I know that no one is thinking about or considering the effects that those lanes will have on the truckers bringing goods into town. Yes you all know them, those unforgettable good folks that bring you EVERYTHING that you touch, eat, purchase. Reducing lanes down to 10 foot from the current 12 equals 4 feet loss on a normal two lane road , might be good for a Kia or VW but it’s drastic for maneuvering a 80 foot long semi. And before the wise mouth remarks about how you don’t think semis belong downtown, remember not only does everything you consume get delivered by truck somewhere along the line, remember all those beautiful new buildings popping up all over town , need materials ( especially steel) to get built. Yes you might not like them or you probably never think of them other then their always in your way or they are this or that , whatever you want to think they are a necessity of life and we can’t survive without them. Stop trying to rid the world of things that don’t fit a dream utopian fantasy of the perfect urban environment and think of ways to blend what is here and now with the right amount of infrastructure for all modes of transportation. I fully understand and support advocating for proper bike lanes and better implementation of multi modal transport, but anyone who only thinks about their needs and perspectives without regard to others is blindly ignorant 

If we design our streets for the comfort of semi trucks, the streets will be uncomfortable and unsafe for bicyclists and pedestrians.

Sure, 10’ lanes will require semi drivers to drive more slowly and cautiously. As long as they can get where they need to go, I don’t see why that is such a bad thing? We all need to share the road, which requires compromises from everyone.

[Luvemtall]

2 hours ago, go_outside said:

If we design our streets for the comfort of semi trucks, the streets will be uncomfortable and unsafe for bicyclists and pedestrians.

Sure, 10’ lanes will require semi drivers to drive more slowly and cautiously. As long as they can get where they need to go, I don’t see why that is such a bad thing? We all need to share the road, which requires compromises from everyone.

I’m not saying to design roads just for the benefit and comfort of semis, nor should you be requesting that we change them for the benefit and comfort of bicyclists or pedestrians. I’m just pointing out a talking point , from the perspective of a 42 year veteran of the commercial driving industry. I totally respect your opinion, and in no way am I trying to pick a fight. The network of roads and highways have been designed to accommodate to the needs of their intended users, which includes commercial vehicles. The standard width of which are between 96-102 inches, with lengths of non semis  up to 45 feet and semis up to 80 feet not including any oversized loads . These vehicles require a substantial amount of room to navigate and intercity routes add to the equation. It has nothing to do with speed or drivers being more cautious, they just require adequate space to move safely. If the lanes are reduced to 10 feet that leaves less then a foot clearance on each side of a 8 1/2 foot wide vehicle , yes it can be done but it just causes discomfort for both the driver and the vehicles around them . I’m just saying that we can’t take away from what’s already existing, to create something that caters to a select few without having a open mind to the needs of everyone else. Why is it that it’s ok to take away from others who rightfully have the choice to drive and make it uncomfortable for them. Everyone needs to work together to find a solution that’s fair across the board, we need safe reliable roads just as much as we need safe and accessible bike lanes and sidewalks.

[Bos2Nash]

Similar to the conversation on Gallatin Pike/Main Street, I think we should be looking at a 10' + 11' lane configuration. I would be inclined to say 11' at the curb and 10' more centered, but not sure what this road really looks like from a travel corridor. 12' wide is too wide for a surface road. 11' is wide enough to accommodate a slower moving large vehicle (think transit/semi width) and 10' is a width that would work for more "normal" sized vehicles. I am always a little worried about less than 10' because now we are approaching the width of parking stalls used at certain locations like grocery stores.

Not every road needs to be an urban street, but bringing the widths down even just 12" or 24" will do nothing but slow down the speeds. Slightly lower speeds = a tremendous improvement in safety for people not in vehicles. If TDOT is spending the money on sidewalks, it doesn't make sense to build a road not safe to walk along. 

[Luvemtall]

That’s a good sensible and fair solution. This is on par with what I have been referring too, thoughtful, well informed and meaningful conversation about All forms of infrastructure. Not a selfish centered individual need, don’t “punish “ the other side but rather work together for a better future for everyone. I’ve been listening and discussing this with you all, and frankly some replies are very disturbing. Like for instance making it harder for people driving to find parking or jacking up the rates to a point of painful economic hardship, eliminating new or improved roadways etc. and on the other side, not caring about the need for safe protected bike lanes and sidewalks or the need for a reliable transit network. It might be a bit harder or cost a bit more, but open minded shared infrastructure as Bos2Nash talks about is the right way to get to a better solution for all of us.

[PaulChinetti]

Planters are up on the Broadway bridge. Looks pretty good. 
 

I think they could have used the center lane as a lane switch to slow everyone down. 

[markhollin]

NDOT seeks to transform segments of Main Street and Gallatin Pike into roadways that accommodate all users, including those who drive, walk, bike, and take transit. This will include improved street lighting + more sidewalks and crosswalks.

According to the project timeline, the Main Street segment (South 5th Street to South 10th Street) will be prioritized due to paving needs. The Gallatin Pike segment (South 10th Street to Briley Parkway) will come later and complement the Main Street design.

https://www.nashville.gov/departments/transportation/projects/multimodal-street-projects/gallatin-pike-and-main-street

Here's an online survey:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/GallatinPike_MainStreetVision

[markhollin]

Mayor Freddie O'Connell said Friday that he expects to know more about whether a November transit referendum is feasible "by the end of the month."

He also announced the temporary hiring of Vanderbilt's Michael Briggs as director of transportation planning in the lead-up to a potential referendum. Briggs' appointment is in partnership with Vanderbilt, where Briggs is the director of mobility, and he is expected to return to the university in less than two years, O'Connell told reporters.

"He's coming on to help evaluate feasibility, work with [the Nashville Department of Transportation] and WeGo, work with [Metro's new transportation director Tanisha Hall] to do some of the technical advisory pieces that would potentially go into a referendum," the mayor said.

Prior to moving to Vanderbilt, Briggs spent a decade at the Metro Planning Department, eventually leading its multimodal transportation planning division.  

O'Connell's transit-focused transition committee recommended putting a transit referendum on the November ballot in order to take advantage of higher voter turnout during a presidential year. Metro's most recent transit referendum was handily defeated in 2018, and O'Connell has said a potential new vote would focus on smaller-scale improvements than those sought six years ago.

More behind theNashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/politics/metro/mayors-office-continues-moving-toward-transit-referendum/article_340e7e22-b171-11ee-97b7-d79ef1cec540.html

[markhollin]

Nashville’s WeGo Public Transit and the Regional Transit Authority of Middle Tennessee are set to receive $10.7 million in grant funding from the Tennessee Department of Transportation.

The department has awarded more than $46 million across the state for multimodal transportation investments from three grant programs: the Transportation Alternatives Program, the IMPROVE Transit Investment Grant and the Multimodal Access Grant. RTA and WeGo were awarded funding for four projects from the IMPROVE grant, which requires a commitment of local funds. Metro plans to contribute nearly $2.7 million in funding for the four projects.

RTA of Middle Tennessee will receive $800,000 for the purchase of equipment for WeGo Star rail vehicles.

“It's for real-time train arrival information,” Melcher said. “We'll be able to provide that in a number of different places including information displays at the stations, which we have really needed. It'll also automatically go to the transit app and some other sites.”

WeGo was awarded $2.4 million for pedestrian improvements and transit amenities at three sites along Trinity Lane and one on Murfreesboro Pike. The Trinity Lane sites will support the recently proposed crosstown bus route connecting East Nashville to the future North Nashville Transit Center. The route is a part of the Spring 2024 proposed service changes that the WeGo board will vote on at its Jan. 25 meeting.

“It provides for three fairly major construction projects along the route that would provide not only shelters but also crosswalks and other safety features, just to make it safer for folks to be able to use the transit shelters that we’ll build there,” Melcher said.

He said the improvements are planned for where Dickerson Pike, Gallatin Pike and Whites Creek Pike meet Trinity. The Murfreesboro Pike funding will be for a Route 55 bus stop and pedestrian improvements at Murfreesboro Pike and Thompson Lane.

Additionally, bus stops along the High Injury Network, part of Nashville’s Vision Zero plan, were awarded $5 million in funding. WeGo was awarded funding for similar improvements from the 2023 IMPROVE grant as well.

The third WeGo grant from the funding announcement is $2.5 million for the future Southeast Transit Center planned at the former Hickory Hollow Mall site. WeGo was awarded $5 million in IMPROVE grant funding for this project in 2023 as well. Melcher said this grant brings the total funds raised for the project to $20 million, adding that comes from multiple funding sources. The project's total cost has not been released.

More behind the Nashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/business/development/state-awards-10-7m-for-nashville-multimodal-improvements/article_a40016ee-b187-11ee-a168-7b300d491fc1.html

[markhollin]

The Crestmoor Rd. to Glen Echo Rd. Realignment at Hillsboro Pike update: more infrastructure work being done.

Looking NW from Hillsboro Pike at Glen Echo Rd:

Looking east from Crestmoor Rd., 1/8 block west of Hillsboro Pike:

[Nathan_in_DC]

17 hours ago, markhollin said:

Nashville’s WeGo Public Transit and the Regional Transit Authority of Middle Tennessee are set to receive $10.7 million in grant funding from the Tennessee Department of Transportation.

The department has awarded more than $46 million across the state for multimodal transportation investments from three grant programs: the Transportation Alternatives Program, the IMPROVE Transit Investment Grant and the Multimodal Access Grant. RTA and WeGo were awarded funding for four projects from the IMPROVE grant, which requires a commitment of local funds. Metro plans to contribute nearly $2.7 million in funding for the four projects.

RTA of Middle Tennessee will receive $800,000 for the purchase of equipment for WeGo Star rail vehicles.

“It's for real-time train arrival information,” Melcher said. “We'll be able to provide that in a number of different places including information displays at the stations, which we have really needed. It'll also automatically go to the transit app and some other sites.”

WeGo was awarded $2.4 million for pedestrian improvements and transit amenities at three sites along Trinity Lane and one on Murfreesboro Pike. The Trinity Lane sites will support the recently proposed crosstown bus route connecting East Nashville to the future North Nashville Transit Center. The route is a part of the Spring 2024 proposed service changes that the WeGo board will vote on at its Jan. 25 meeting.

“It provides for three fairly major construction projects along the route that would provide not only shelters but also crosswalks and other safety features, just to make it safer for folks to be able to use the transit shelters that we’ll build there,” Melcher said.

He said the improvements are planned for where Dickerson Pike, Gallatin Pike and Whites Creek Pike meet Trinity. The Murfreesboro Pike funding will be for a Route 55 bus stop and pedestrian improvements at Murfreesboro Pike and Thompson Lane.

Additionally, bus stops along the High Injury Network, part of Nashville’s Vision Zero plan, were awarded $5 million in funding. WeGo was awarded funding for similar improvements from the 2023 IMPROVE grant as well.

The third WeGo grant from the funding announcement is $2.5 million for the future Southeast Transit Center planned at the former Hickory Hollow Mall site. WeGo was awarded $5 million in IMPROVE grant funding for this project in 2023 as well. Melcher said this grant brings the total funds raised for the project to $20 million, adding that comes from multiple funding sources. The project's total cost has not been released.

More behind the Nashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/business/development/state-awards-10-7m-for-nashville-multimodal-improvements/article_a40016ee-b187-11ee-a168-7b300d491fc1.html

Why is it up to WeGo to fund streetscape pedestrian improvements like crosswalks instead of NDOT/TDOT?

[PaulChinetti]

City streets versus state roads?

[nashvillain_too]

1 hour ago, Nathan_in_DC said:

Why is it up to WeGo to fund streetscape pedestrian improvements like crosswalks instead of NDOT/TDOT?

Maybe there is some overlap between WeGo and NDOT as their institutional roles aren't super well defined and/or maybe tackling the crosswalks within the scope of a larger infrastructural WeGo project might represent a good opportunity to get it done within the scope of that project rather than it being part of a separate NDOT project with a different funding mechanism and different timeline. Who knows...? 

[donNdonelson2]

1 hour ago, Nathan_in_DC said:

Why is it up to WeGo to fund streetscape pedestrian improvements like crosswalks instead of NDOT/TDOT?

Because WeGo got grants from the state for use on these sorts of improvements.

Nashville’s WeGo Public Transit and the Regional Transit Authority of Middle Tennessee are set to receive $10.7 million in grant funding from the Tennessee Department of Transportation.

[markhollin]

Planters installed along both sides of the Broadway Viaduct.
 

[PruneTracy]

On 1/13/2024 at 8:32 AM, Nathan_in_DC said:

Why is it up to WeGo to fund streetscape pedestrian improvements like crosswalks instead of NDOT/TDOT?

On 1/13/2024 at 9:49 AM, donNdonelson2 said:

Because WeGo got grants from the state for use on these sorts of improvements.

Nashville’s WeGo Public Transit and the Regional Transit Authority of Middle Tennessee are set to receive $10.7 million in grant funding from the Tennessee Department of Transportation.

The grants (TAP and MMAG) are agnostic as to the agency proposing them. It can be DOTs, public works departments, planning departments, transit agencies, regional development agencies, etc. This is particularly true for municipalities, because as @nashvillain_too said the roles of city departments even of Nashville's size frequently overlap. You just have to show that you have the capacity to manage the administration of the grant (or can hire someone who can manage it).