I miss RVA Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 @RVABizSenseMikehas reporting in today's RBS that - sadly - the Hatch Local Food Hall, located in the Current, will be closing this spring. Mike makes an interesting observation to kick off the article: food halls are proving to be quite popular in OTHER cities - yet apparently are a failing proposition in Richmond. Friends, where have we seen this movie before? I can't help but wonder if -- yet again -- RVA's relatively small(er) market size is the big stumbling block? While other cities aren't specifically mentioned, I'd hazard to guess that food halls that are succeeding are in cities/markets that are significantly larger than Richmond. I honestly can't think of any other reason for why this kind of thing keeps happening - meaning - why time and again some initiative that works GREAT in other (admittedly larger) cities flops spectacularly in Richmond. I get kinda tired of this sequel playing out over and over and over. From today's Richmond BizSense: https://richmondbizsense.com/2024/01/19/manchesters-hatch-local-food-hall-calling-it-quits-after-two-years/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eandslee Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 Could be a population density issue too. Not enough folks living and working around to keep the place in business. Bigger cities are denser, but you don’t have to be a huge city to be densely populated. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 (edited) 24 minutes ago, eandslee said: Could be a population density issue too. Not enough folks living and working around to keep the place in business. Bigger cities are denser, but you don’t have to be a huge city to be densely populated. True - though I'd suspect it's a combination of both - plus - income density. Bigger cities (particularly where food halls tend to be located) have a greater density of people with sufficient disposable income to support something like that. No matter how you slice it, I do believe these kinds of failed attempts happen in Richmond more readily than in other - larger - cities because we're still just too small. I keep banging this drum - and I feel like a lone wolf howling into the wind sometimes - but unless and until we get a LOT bigger and do it quickly, things like this -- things that other cities enjoy -- are going to continue being unsuccessfully attempted in Richmond. It's the nature of the beast. And tbh, we don't need to have 650,000 people living in the city. If we could just get to that magical 340,000 by the tri-centennial (what the planners were talking about a couple of years ago during development of the Richmond 300 plan), stuff like this would probably succeed here with no problem at all. That level of growth would drive up not just the raw population total, but in all likelihood, population density of certain parts of town as well as income density. Edited January 19 by I miss RVA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Brent114 Posted January 19 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 19 That food hall was always bonkers. It was meant as an incubator for chefs and not a place for the locals to eat. A gyro costs $17.00. The way it was divided up ensured that no synergy was ever going to happen. The art direction was trash too. Minimalist with natural plywood stalls with minimal and hand painted signage. It was very washed out and uninviting. The flaw that can be blamed on Richmond is that it tried too hard too precious and local and didn’t try to actually feed the neighborhood. I'm sorry it’s going but I won’t miss a single thing about it. 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Virginian11 Posted January 20 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 20 (edited) 4 hours ago, Brent114 said: That food hall was always bonkers. It was meant as an incubator for chefs and not a place for the locals to eat. A gyro costs $17.00. The way it was divided up ensured that no synergy was ever going to happen. The art direction was trash too. Minimalist with natural plywood stalls with minimal and hand painted signage. It was very washed out and uninviting. The flaw that can be blamed on Richmond is that it tried too hard too precious and local and didn’t try to actually feed the neighborhood. I'm sorry it’s going but I won’t miss a single thing about it. this. The other food hall that didn’t work out seems to be more of a result of an odd legal spat between investor and contractor(s). Neither of these food hall issues have anything to do with the size of the metro. If anything, RVA well out punches its weight class in the food space. Id argue that our food scene is so competitive that you better bring a good product to the table or you ain’t gonna last. Too many other good options. As Brent said, if Hatch had a fun, festive vibe with more sensible options it would be incredibly popular. No one has opened a GOOD food hall here yet. Not Richmond’s fault! Edited January 20 by Virginian11 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Posted January 20 Report Share Posted January 20 sorry to see them go, but honestly as a guy that lives just a few miles west of there and eats out a lot I thought about checking it out but never did. I cant stand the QR code ordering and why would you go to a food court and pay restaurant prices instead of going to an actual restaurant? If you lived in one of those apartments (which a growing number of people do) and it was cheaper than going to a real restaurant (which evidently it wasnt) I could see it working - but why would you drive down there for that? Im glad to see people trying different things and seeing what works but I wouldnt read much into this not working out... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post RiverYuppy Posted January 20 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 20 I love the idea of food halls, but in practice I haven't really been the largest fan of the food of ones I've been to. Some of the restaurants I wonder if they make it not because of their food, but just because they secured a spot in the food hall. I would much rather see something like an Arts District lined with restaurants on Broad as the food destination. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icetera Posted January 20 Report Share Posted January 20 It was nice being able to sit at the bar and the bartender could order food from the various vendors and bring it out to you. Made for some nice variety with ala carte food options. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 21 Report Share Posted January 21 On 1/19/2024 at 5:22 PM, Brent114 said: A gyro costs $17.00. OUCH!!! Mind you, I have no idea if Mr Submarine is still in business or -- if it is -- if it's still at that location down on the Pike closer to Philip Morris - but if memory serves, you could get an awesome, delicious, authentic gyro there for something like $7 -- and they didn't cheat you on the portion size AT ALL. I used to go there for lunch when I worked at PM (since it wasn't far from the office) and grab a gyro, fries and a beverage - and I got the whole thing for far less than what you'd pay for just the gyro at the food hall. And yes - that was close to 25 years ago - but even still - it was a pretty good deal even for back then. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123fakestreet Posted January 21 Report Share Posted January 21 On 1/20/2024 at 12:59 AM, Rooster said: why would you drive down there for that? This is a problem for Manchester in general. A lot of apartments and people living there now, but if you're not one of them why would you ever go there? There's no draw. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Zone Posted January 22 Report Share Posted January 22 (edited) On 1/21/2024 at 12:58 AM, I miss RVA said: Mind you, I have no idea if Mr Submarine is still in business or -- if it is -- if it's still at that location down on the Pike closer to Philip Morris - but if memory serves, you could get an awesome, delicious, authentic gyro there for something like $7 -- and they didn't cheat you on the portion size AT ALL. Can't speak to that location, but the one at Broad and Malvern is still open (drive-thru only) and the line often stretches onto Broad at lunch-time. ETA: And, no, they won't charge you $17 for a gyro. Edited January 22 by Flood Zone 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icetera Posted January 22 Report Share Posted January 22 On 1/19/2024 at 6:22 PM, Brent114 said: A gyro costs $17.00. Is that including tax and tip? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brent114 Posted January 24 Report Share Posted January 24 Yeah. That is with tip (slow to respond because you made me question my entire existence lol, decided to order again in person before responding). I just ordered what is probably my last one (they are quite good). The base is $12. I added feta for $1. With tax and 18% tip it was $17.74. Funny stuff, I looked up their Carytown menu and the gyro here at Hatch is $1 more than at their sit down place on Cary. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 24 Report Share Posted January 24 (edited) 16 hours ago, Brent114 said: Yeah. That is with tip (slow to respond because you made me question my entire existence lol, decided to order again in person before responding). I just ordered what is probably my last one (they are quite good). The base is $12. I added feta for $1. With tax and 18% tip it was $17.74. Funny stuff, I looked up their Carytown menu and the gyro here at Hatch is $1 more than at their sit down place on Cary. Wow... and as I recall, the gyro at Mr. Submarine came WITH feta, no extra charge. And I never had to pay a tip. It didn't hurt that the owner (franchisee) of the establishment was also usually the guy slicing the meat. He also happened to be Greek and he owned a couple of other eating establishments around town. He was a really cool guy and while now - some 25-plus years later, I can't recall his name, we were on a first-name basis and he always shook my hand when I came in to get lunch. Oh - and if I ate in the restaurant instead of schlepping my lunch back to the office, he gave me free refills on Diet Coke and extra ice if I wanted it (to take back to the office if it was during the summer). Edited January 25 by I miss RVA 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brent114 Posted January 25 Report Share Posted January 25 I don’t mind tipping. It has been a part of the American experience for my whole life (dating back to tip jars on counters that I largely ignored). The service (what little there was) was good. I had become friendly with the guy that made my food and I could look around and see that he probably wasn’t going to make much in tips with such low traffic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitiWalker Posted January 25 Report Share Posted January 25 I don't mind tipping either.....if.... the service is good service. In fact, I would usually tip quite handsomely. The issue I have is when automatic gratuities are placed on my bill. I just feel like it is another way that employers use to cut how much they have to pay out to employees by passing the buck to the consumer. Also, I am a person that will not pay my hard-earned money for bad service, and I will not be shamed into paying just to pay. As I said I believe in tipping. It used to be that the people who were good at providing great service could expect good tips. Now not so much. Seems like everyone is going to be rewarded either way. I know people count on tips for a living and that is why I do tip big time when the service is GOOD. By the way....I hate self-checkout. I refuse to use them. That is a whole other topic. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 25 Report Share Posted January 25 1 hour ago, CitiWalker said: I don't mind tipping either.....if.... the service is good service. In fact, I would usually tip quite handsomely. The issue I have is when automatic gratuities are placed on my bill. I just feel like it is another way that employers use to cut how much they have to pay out to employees by passing the buck to the consumer. % -- THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icetera Posted January 25 Report Share Posted January 25 21 hours ago, Brent114 said: Yeah. That is with tip (slow to respond because you made me question my entire existence lol, decided to order again in person before responding). I just ordered what is probably my last one (they are quite good). The base is $12. I added feta for $1. With tax and 18% tip it was $17.74. Funny stuff, I looked up their Carytown menu and the gyro here at Hatch is $1 more than at their sit down place on Cary. You gave me the same effect, hence having to look up my receipts. I think they own their spot in Carytown now, so probably have to charge more for rent and whatever operating fees Hatch adds. I miss when the Carytown location was more of a counter service joint with cheaper prices. The meals tax adds up fast, which has significantly cut down on my eating out in the City over the past few years. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post whw53 Posted January 30 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 30 (edited) Another 127 units inthe pipeline for 4th street. https://energov.richmondgov.com/EnerGov_Prod/SelfService/richmondvaprod#/plan/69d89f33-63b6-4e78-9287-e4fb54b5f563 Edited January 30 by whw53 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eandslee Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 1 hour ago, whw53 said: Another 127 units inthe pipeline for 4th street. https://energov.richmondgov.com/EnerGov_Prod/SelfService/richmondvaprod#/plan/69d89f33-63b6-4e78-9287-e4fb54b5f563 Thanks for the heads up on this, but dang...only 127 on that big plot of land almost seems to be a waste. It doesn't appear that there will be much density here. 127 units will be what...like 3 stories? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 25 minutes ago, eandslee said: Thanks for the heads up on this, but dang...only 127 on that big plot of land almost seems to be a waste. It doesn't appear that there will be much density here. 127 units will be what...like 3 stories? I'll try to dig up the rendering later on today - I think it MIGHT be four stories. The building footprint is smaller because of surface parking included with the development. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whw53 Posted January 31 Report Share Posted January 31 5 hours ago, I miss RVA said: I'll try to dig up the rendering later on today - I think it MIGHT be four stories. The building footprint is smaller because of surface parking included with the development. This is CZC so super preliminary. You may be thinking of an approved project around the corner from this one at 915 E 4th. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 31 Report Share Posted January 31 (edited) 1 hour ago, whw53 said: This is CZC so super preliminary. You may be thinking of an approved project around the corner from this one at 915 E 4th. Yep -- I think that's correct. The development that's been approved is at 925 E. 4th. The RBS tracker doesn't show any development proposed at 1021 E. 4th, which is what the new CZC is for. Here's the rendering of the approved project - and it's five stories. Edited January 31 by I miss RVA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post rjp212 Posted January 31 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 31 Looks like Bruster's Ice Cream is coming to the ground level of The Cove. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I miss RVA Posted January 31 Report Share Posted January 31 Excellent!! Glad to see these kinds of businesses coming in. Hopefully just the first of many more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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