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Ally Charlotte Center (f/k/a Tryon Place) - 26 floors - 427'

Bled_man

By Bled_man
in Charlotte

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gman430
gman430

I'd be like Ant Man and pee my pants if I was these guys:   

CharlotteHokie
CharlotteHokie

Long-time lurker (as in probably a decade plus), first-time poster.  Two pics of Tryon Place - construction on the tower itself and the JW Marriott site.   

UPEnergy
UPEnergy

So here's a new view of Uptown  from Ally....  pretty cool!

Posted Images

CLTProductions City

CLTProductions

Posted
Posted

At least the sail didn't get value engineered off of 300 S Tryon. But again, everything is VEd across the country. And not every single building needs to be a signature building. We already have more signatures than a lot of older cities. Look at Miami. They're building almost as many buildings at NYC, not one of them (I don't think) is remotely unique or signature. Sure the architecture is cool but it's not a huge dif between them 

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atlrvr Metropolitan Area

atlrvr

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Tenants in Charlotte aren't interested in paying a premium for architecturally significant buildings (well, banks did for the HQ buildings before the financial crises).....you can get a lot more creative in NYC when tenants will pay $80/sf+ for new construction, vs $38 (maybe!!???) in Charlotte.  The cost of land and cost of labor does NOT make up the difference.

I think Crescent delivered what they thought was a significant building, and the market told them what they would be willing to pay in rent, so it was back to the drawing boards so to speak.  Add in the fact that 2 other buildings are in the market with 500k sq ft of space, and 2 other buildings (First Citizens and 300 S Bevard) both have blocks of 300k/sf space, and lenders are going to require a lot more equity, further hurting Crescent's return.

EDIT:  It should be pointed out the 1st picture is actually "Value Engineered" down from the original proposal, that had almost a scaley texture to the glass facade....think shingled green glass facade.

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HopHead City

HopHead

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Stepping back a bit from the ledge here... until we actually see a side by side rendering comparison of the before and after it's a little hard to get too upset right now. Ok, so the glass color changed. I liked the original green-ish color too. But it's not the end of the world. What else has changed? What did they really simplify? What elements did they keep? Seems like a lot of questions that should be answered first before rushing to judgement. 

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cjd5050 Hamlet

cjd5050

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3 minutes ago, RaleighHeelsfan said:

That's not the point though. They should not have ever released the renderings like that in the first place if they don't plan on sticking to it. They wanted a wow factor to attract tenants and get everyone excited. They knew they would value engineer from the start

Makes the "The Tryon Place Story" video on the website but funny, sad and cringe worthy at the same time.  3 minutes of hot air.  

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Guest

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28 minutes ago, cjd5050 said:

Makes the "The Tryon Place Story" video on the website but funny, sad and cringe worthy at the same time.  3 minutes of hot air.  

The rendering on the street right now doesn't do it justice. The changes aren't THATTTT drastic. 

Buildings change based on the kind of client let its targeting. Look at WTC 3, it went from being targeted to financial firms to being the new HQ for News Corp, and the design changed... Completely. It's just how it goes. Shouldn't the anchor tenant have say about what their building will look like?

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Dale City

Dale

Posted
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9 minutes ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

The rendering on the street right now doesn't do it justice. The changes aren't THATTTT drastic. 

Buildings change based on the kind of client let its targeting. Look at WTC 3, it went from being targeted to financial firms to being the new HQ for News Corp, and the design changed... Completely. It's just how it goes. Shouldn't the anchor tenant have say about what their building will look like?

No, they should cater to us highrise geeks, regardless the cost.

Seriously, if not green, I think I prefer greyscale, if only for the contrast.

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cjd5050 Hamlet

cjd5050

Posted
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1 hour ago, ricky_davis_fan_21 said:

The rendering on the street right now doesn't do it justice. The changes aren't THATTTT drastic. 

Buildings change based on the kind of client let its targeting. Look at WTC 3, it went from being targeted to financial firms to being the new HQ for News Corp, and the design changed... Completely. It's just how it goes. Shouldn't the anchor tenant have say about what their building will look like?

I understand that.  I think it was mostly a comment on those types of videos.  3 minutes of people talking about how different what they are doing is...only to have the result be based off a formula.  It's the creative fluff...coming from someone who works in the creative space (web) these videos are all over the place.  

1 hour ago, Dale said:

No, they should cater to us highrise geeks, regardless the cost.

I don't think they should cater to highrise geeks.  I do think that if they are going to create a video about how different they are and how unique the project it...they should follow through.  Or not make the videos at all...which would be my personal preference.

 

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mfowler12 Unincorporated Area

mfowler12

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3 hours ago, Jayvee said:

One buzzkill note on the parking thing. They're just switching parking operator to the one who will be handling their stuff for Tryon Place

can you share that operator? I'm selfishly interested because I currently have no parking as of Sept 1. :) 

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jednc Burg

jednc

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Posted (edited)

 Something just feels off here. I get that a development of this scope doesn't just materialize over night. But, the pace at which this project has moved up to this point just seems suspect. Now, out of nowhere, a big new office project is submitted on an adjacent block? That's a huge red flag to me. If there was a major tenant out there looking for space in this vicinity, why would they not sign with Crescent since their plans were so far along? Of course, there are plenty of reasons why this could have happened, but none of them are as likely as somehow Crescent has dropped the ball.

I don't write any of this because I'm hoping this project will fail to materialize. In fact, I really do hope it happens. But, for me, no more posts about meeting with the developer or seeing new renderings or having contacts telling someone that groundbreaking is set for this quarter or that quarter is going to move me. Bottom line: I'll believe it when I see dirt moving.

Edited by jednc
Apparently I do not know how to spell Crescent...
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KJHburg Ecumenopolis

KJHburg

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I think of all the major possible anchor tenants out there, Duke being one of them, this does have me question the timing of this project. PLEASE dont get me wrong I like the design and look of this tower (even if tweaked) however I operate in Real-ville too. One possibility I did think of, is if US Bank wants to consolidate their 100,000 sq ft space they occupy in 2 buildings uptown this building could be the one. If Regions does anchor 615 South Tryon in some form or fashion with naming rights US Bank a much bigger bank would not want to be a co-anchor I would think. So this leads me to believe unless Wells or US Bank steps up to sign a letter of intent this tower maybe delayed again. Doesn't mean cancelled but timing may not be right. Remember 300 South Tryon was a much taller mixed use building as first proposed in 2007/2008 I think before it was shelved for several years. I think Duke is your anchor for the Lincoln Harris tower.  This is all like a big chess game with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake. 

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jednc Burg

jednc

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Dale said:

Didn't Crescent say they were building spec ?

They did. And they were supposed to already by building by now. Now this news of possible value-engineering. That just doesn't follow logically. If they were willing to move forward building on spec with their earlier plans, the fact that no tenant has signed should not be causing any value-engineering. Either you're confident in your product and you're all in, or not. If not, it's silly to say you are going to build on spec. Sort of sounds to me like they were trying to generate interest by making announcements of imminently going vertical only to have the market call their bluff. Since tenants haven't materialized, now it's back to the value-engineering drawing board so to speak.

I come off as really down on this project. In fact, it's just a pet peeve of mine for announcements to be made by companies when they really aren't ready to do anything. I guess in my opinion, I shouldn't hear about your plans until they are 100%. If it's all just the "hope" that your company can do "x", that doesn't belong in an announcement of any kind.

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jednc Burg

jednc

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, mpretori said:

Look, it's NOT Crescent's fault. Obviously a tenant deal fell through due to reasons i shall not speak of here, now they have to cater the building towards another tenant.  

 

If that were true, then wouldn't that make them liars to say they would be spec regardless of a signed tenant or not?

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jednc Burg

jednc

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Posted
13 minutes ago, mpretori said:

Not really, they were probably in process and Crescent probably felt really confident. but like Pay Pal, said company probably backed out last minute. 

I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this point. If they say SPEC...that means no tenant but willing to roll the dice. It does not mean we have a tenant "all but signed" and can't release details yet but "trust us". If that IS what they meant, then they lied.

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