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GRDadof3

By GRDadof3
in Grand Rapids

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Rizzo City

Rizzo

Posted
Posted

I'm interested in what Ms. Gill is referring to, "chronic problems with parking"?

Never mind, the article goes on to say, "But the biggest complaint has been about the parking and it’s just hard to get people downtown.”

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Rizzo City

Rizzo

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I'm disregarding that notion that it is solely, because of free parking.

Its not the length of walk or price so much as it is whether parking is in sight of the front door to the establishment. It's about line of sight. If it's not in sight, it's much easier to complain about length of walk and price.

It's pretty evident parking is a problem. Especially, if these establishments aspire to attract a new client/customer base not accustomed to the downtown parking realities. Its more evident that there's a problem when you have the folks in the trenches talking about it.

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AlexPKeaton Burg

AlexPKeaton

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No kidding. The Sierra room is pretty much right next to one of the largest concentrations of surface parking downtown. There aren't any confusing ramps to navigate through, though those are nearby as well.

I think people say parking is the problem when they really mean convenience. It's not obvious where to park because there isn't a parking lot associated with every building, unlike the suburbs. And, although parking is plentiful, it's not free and the cheaper ones among us refuse to pay for parking. You don't have to pay for parking in the suburbs, not directly anyway.

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gvsusean Burg

gvsusean

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No kidding. The Sierra room is pretty much right next to one of the largest concentrations of surface parking downtown. There aren't any confusing ramps to navigate through, though those are nearby as well.

I think people say parking is the problem when they really mean convenience. It's not obvious where to park because there isn't a parking lot associated with every building, unlike the suburbs. And, although parking is plentiful, it's not free and the cheaper ones among us refuse to pay for parking. You don't have to pay for parking in the suburbs, not directly anyway.

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GRDadof3 Ecumenopolis

GRDadof3

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1) These restaurants, especially higher-end ones like Sierra Room, cannot be sustained on downtown residents alone.

2) There are more and more restaurants opening up on 28th, Rivertown, Alpine, East Beltline, you name it that are much more convenient and less expensive for diners. I'm guessing most people do a little shopping at Target or wherever, and then hit the restaurants afterward. That's why the restaurants congregate around shopping areas.

3) There is no concentrated cluster of retail downtown to create this same sort of effect.

4) So essentially, as Gill said, it's very difficult for people to make a special trip downtown to go out in a nice restaurant. It's for anniversaries or special occasions.

5) Sierra Room is probably now competing with McFaddens for parking spots (not that it's bad).

I was at Louis Benton's on a Saturday evening with friends about a month ago and the place was dead.

NO ONE is giving anyone in the suburbs a reason to go downtown, period. It's all relative. If downtown were THE place to go for pretty much anything, people would put up with horrendous parking situations. When you put up with inconvenience, and then the end reward is mediocre, you're not in a hurry to do it again.

You think it's bad now, just wait until the two lifestyle villages open with restaurants like PF Chang's, or Red Star Tavern, or the Cheesecake Factory, or even more we don't have in this area.

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gvsusean Burg

gvsusean

Posted
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1) These restaurants, especially higher-end ones like Sierra Room, cannot be sustained on downtown residents alone.

2) There are more and more restaurants opening up on 28th, Rivertown, Alpine, East Beltline, you name it that are much more convenient and less expensive for diners. I'm guessing most people do a little shopping at Target or wherever, and then hit the restaurants afterward. That's why the restaurants congregate around shopping areas.

3) There is no concentrated cluster of retail downtown to create this same sort of effect.

4) So essentially, as Gill said, it's very difficult for people to make a special trip downtown to go out in a nice restaurant. It's for anniversaries or special occasions.

5) Sierra Room is probably now competing with McFaddens for parking spots (not that it's bad).

I was at Louis Benton's on a Saturday evening with friends about a month ago and the place was dead.

NO ONE is giving anyone in the suburbs a reason to go downtown, period.

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Raildudes dad Hamlet

Raildudes dad

Posted
Posted
1) These restaurants, especially higher-end ones like Sierra Room, cannot be sustained on downtown residents alone.

2) There are more and more restaurants opening up on 28th, Rivertown, Alpine, East Beltline, you name it that are much more convenient and less expensive for diners. I'm guessing most people do a little shopping at Target or wherever, and then hit the restaurants afterward. That's why the restaurants congregate around shopping areas.

3) There is no concentrated cluster of retail downtown to create this same sort of effect.

4) So essentially, as Gill said, it's very difficult for people to make a special trip downtown to go out in a nice restaurant. It's for anniversaries or special occasions.

5) Sierra Room is probably now competing with McFaddens for parking spots (not that it's bad).

I was at Louis Benton's on a Saturday evening with friends about a month ago and the place was dead.

NO ONE is giving anyone in the suburbs a reason to go downtown, period. It's all relative. If downtown were THE place to go for pretty much anything, people would put up with horrendous parking situations. When you put up with inconvenience, and then the end reward is mediocre, you're not in a hurry to do it again.

You think it's bad now, just wait until the two lifestyle villages open with restaurants like PF Chang's, or Red Star Tavern, or the Cheesecake Factory, or even more we don't have in this area.

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torgo Town

torgo

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It's rarely (if ever) free at a restaurant that charges $20+ per entree.

My theory is parking isn't the issue....it's the perception that parking is the issue, held by suburbanites who make the up the target audience for ritzy downtown restaurants.

I have to say Sierra Room was a pretty cool looking spot. I'm sad to see them leave....but just around the corner you have Bar Divani which is so freakin' busy every time I go in there I cannot get a table. Parking isn't causing them any problems.

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mgreven Hamlet

mgreven

Posted
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Reading the article in the press today, I think their comments are interesting. Parking seems to be a scapegoat. I went there once and although it was cool, I didn't care for the food for the price. They may have been busier when it opened and it was the hip, new place but since then there have been many hip, newer places. They say that they were a casual dining restaurant, but their marketing (or lack thereof) never seemed to promote that.

Don't you feel like places like this need to keep reinventing themselves and heavily marketing that to survive? How often does the successful B.O.B. (with further away parking) try new concepts to keep it fresh?

Finally, the article today said they were going to try something else, but not downtown. Could you imagine something like the Sierra Room working by the Grandville mall or something? I don't.

I hate to see something like this go, but I feel it's just a "changing of the guard" so to speak.

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eagle Whistle-Stop

eagle

Posted
Posted
Tuscan works wonderfully on 28th Street in Cascade.

It's the kind of restaurant I'd eat at far more often if it was downtown...but I'm in the minority. Most people I talk to are positively ecstatic to have such a great restaurant near their homes in Cascade.

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joeDowntown Metropolis

joeDowntown

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This is a real bummer, however I personally don't think it is a reflection on dining downtown (or parking for that matter) ;). Look at places like Bistro Bella Vita, San Chez, One Trick Pony, etc.

I tried really hard to like the Sierra Room but never dug the menu. I was always unhappy with the food. I will miss the deserts though, and we always liked to stop by there for an after dinner drink (ironically, after visiting one of the places above).

Looks like Ionia has a few vacancies to overcome. It's a great building. I hope something replaces it quickly.

Joe

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CK1 Whistle-Stop

CK1

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From the sounds of the article in the Press, the owners blamed parking first and foremost, but they also mentioned that the place was perceived as a "high-end, special occassion" place. I don't think parking did them in (look at McFaddens, Taps, Girdellas on any given night - people gladly park 4 blocks away and huff it in even on the snowiest / rainiest nights, and Sierra Room even had valet parking right outside its door!) as much as it was the (lack of?) marketing.

Never nice to see a fairly well-established name go, but I'm sure someone will come in and fill the spot before long, especially with it being in the shadow of the arena.

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CK1 Whistle-Stop

CK1

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Posted

Tre Cuigini also had a twofer in the current Grand Rapids Magazine...a great way to get some foot traffic.

My guess is that restaurants like Louis Benton's, Cuigini, Leo's, etc. etc. etc. make 10 times more off of the drinks that come with the dinner than they do on the meals themselves...deals like this only help them (a great marketing strategy) - they just have to be sure they don't fall into the trap that a lot of mass-market retailers have, where customers will wait to go to them until that coupon / deal shows up in the mail or paper.

A nice article in the GR Press today on the restaurant / night club coming to Ionia Ave. I hope they can distinguish themselves from the other places along that strip and around town...

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