Fairgrounds Speedway Racetrack expansion to 30,000 seats

[Argo]

12 hours ago, samsonh said:

I assume you are discussing the MLB pipe dream. If so, take it to that thread.

I'm just noticing the difference in reactions between the baseball project and the fairgrounds project. No need to get defensive because you have less thought for the people of Bordeaux than the fairgrounds area. Whatever "reason" that would be.

Edited July 31, 2023 by Argo

[samsonh]

5 minutes ago, Argo said:

I'm just noticing the difference in reactions between the baseball project and the fairgrounds project. No need to get defensive because you have less thought for the people of Bordeaux than the fairgrounds area. Whatever "reason" that would be.

I live about a mile and a half from the proposed TSU location for MLB, and am very much against it. Now take it to the MLB thread. 

[henburg]

13 minutes ago, Argo said:

I'm just noticing the difference in reactions between the baseball project and the fairgrounds project. No need to get defensive because you have less thought for the people of Bordeaux than the fairgrounds area. Whatever "reason" that would be.

So I'll say a couple things here- baseball and racing are two very different sports. Baseball may be the quietest of all major sports due to how many breaks are built in to the game. There will still be a lot to discuss regarding  traffic and other logistics if that project ever happens, but NASCAR brings on additional concerns that baseball will not. Another difference would be that this project is up for debate right now and can become reality very soon, whereas the Nashville Stars proposal still lacks a lot of necessary funding and any sort of commitment from MLB. There are concrete details and renderings for this plan, while an MLB Stadium being built in North Nashville is merely a suggestion still. I understand what you're meaning to imply and I take things of that nature very seriously, but it's not an apt comparison and you're really reaching in trying to draw parallels between the two situations as they currently stand. 

[Argo]

25 minutes ago, samsonh said:

I live about a mile and a half from the proposed TSU location for MLB, and am very much against it. Now take it to the MLB thread. 

Take what exactly to the baseball thread?

I find the fairgrounds project very interesting. 

[Luvemtall]

13 hours ago, henburg said:

I certainly understand the headaches surrounding the potential logistics of attending such a race in Lebanon, but that is what NASCAR races have required since forever

Let’s focus on this for a moment. Potential Logistics to get to the track in Lebanon being a headache , would be no different than People in Lebanon ( or wherever) traveling in to Nashville for a Preds or Titans event or any event. Many thousands do that as a daily commute to go to work. We aren’t talking about a major trip, it’s 30-40 minutes away. Plus demographics will show , there’s more rural people attending NASCAR races than intercity people. Anyone trying to play this as being just a city venue, with just Nashvillain attendees, would be not justifiably correct. If the Preds or Titans decided to move to a new venue outside of Davidson , would that mean they would not still have the same attendance? Or how about the pilgrimage on Saturday’s in the football season to Knoxville from every corner of this State? Doesn’t Matter where the venue is, if your a fan and you’re wanting to go see it live, you will go.

[Bos2Nash]

Bristol Motor Speedway is requesting a deferral on the lease agreement until the next legislative session. They prolly didn't have the support for a special session, but smart to just get out ahead of things and request the deferral.

Bristol Motor Speedway President Jerry Caldwell, “Rather than push for an additional special-called meeting during an election season, we are asking bill sponsors to defer this proposal until a new mayor and council are in place. We look forward to engaging the new council and continuing our dialogue with Fairgrounds neighbors. This agreement would provide the city with an economically viable solution to fulfill its own Metro Charter obligation to maintain the speedway, shift the substantial financial burden currently on taxpayers onto our back, and deliver significant benefit to Fairgrounds neighbors through sound reduction, increased campus parking and new community spaces.”

https://www.jayski.com/2023/08/01/bristol-motor-speedway-carries-community-support-to-next-legislative-session/

[Melrose]

53 minutes ago, Bos2Nash said:

Bristol Motor Speedway is requesting a deferral on the lease agreement until the next legislative session. They prolly didn't have the support for a special session, but smart to just get out ahead of things and request the deferral.

Bristol Motor Speedway President Jerry Caldwell, “Rather than push for an additional special-called meeting during an election season, we are asking bill sponsors to defer this proposal until a new mayor and council are in place. We look forward to engaging the new council and continuing our dialogue with Fairgrounds neighbors. This agreement would provide the city with an economically viable solution to fulfill its own Metro Charter obligation to maintain the speedway, shift the substantial financial burden currently on taxpayers onto our back, and deliver significant benefit to Fairgrounds neighbors through sound reduction, increased campus parking and new community spaces.”

https://www.jayski.com/2023/08/01/bristol-motor-speedway-carries-community-support-to-next-legislative-session/

Just to be clear,  there is not such thing as a "deferral" to next session.   All legislation that is pending but not approved at the end of the term is effectively withdrawn.   Time to start over with the next Mayor. 

[nashvylle]

15 minutes ago, Melrose said:

Just to be clear,  there is not such thing as a "deferral" to next session.   All legislation that is pending but not approved at the end of the term is effectively withdrawn.   Time to start over with the next Mayor. 

I think I read that the Fair Board approval is still valid (the 3-2 vote), which is needed prior to any council vote. Someone can correct me, however. 

[markhollin]

One of Mayor John Cooper’s top priorities for the end of his term will be inherited instead by his successor.

The Metro Council will not consider a $160 million plan to renovate the Fairgrounds Speedway before the end of this term later this year. A final vote was already seen as unlikely, as it would have required special-called meetings due to time constraints.

"We've got great community support and support in the council. There just simply aren't enough meetings left in the current term for the council to fully consider this, when you factor in the election and all of the other things going on," Bristol Motor Speedway President Jerry Caldwell said Tuesday via The Tennessean.

Election Day on Thursday, followed by runoffs next month, will determine the new mayor and council. Few candidates have expressed outright enthusiasm for making Cooper’s plan a priority in the new term.

More behind the Nashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/politics/metro/racetrack-proposal-on-hold-until-next-term/article_6a0840f4-312d-11ee-8b84-27e1a1838c75.html


And at The Tennessean here:

https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/local/davidson/2023/08/01/nashville-fairgrounds-speedway-deal-wont-move-forward-this-term/70504398007/

[markhollin]

A three-judge panel sided with Nashville on Thursday, agreeing with the city’s argument against a new state law that sought to pave the way for upgrades at The Fairgrounds Nashville aimed at bringing NASCAR back to the track. The law, a push by lobbyists to secure a city contract for regional racetrack operator Bristol Motor Speedway, would have lowered the threshold for approving major improvements to the fairgrounds to 21 Metro Council votes, down from 27. 

The city’s response — led by Metro legal director Wally Dietz and city attorney Allison Bussell — argued successfully that the law violates the Tennessee Constitution’s Home Rule Amendment, which protects jurisdictions from being specific targets of the Tennessee General Assembly. In other words, it is too preemptive in that the law is sufficiently narrow to target a single jurisdiction without allowing the city final say. Nashville sued in May, two weeks after Gov. Bill Lee signed the legislation into law, telling the court that the specific voting threshold tweak “applies and will only ever apply” to Nashville. The NASCAR push has since stalled, but proponents indicate they will revive efforts sometime during the upcoming council term.

More behind the NashvillePost paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/politics/metro/nashville-wins-lawsuit-over-racetrack-preemption/article_9679043a-90c5-5263-b310-93bc166a2b9f.html

[markhollin]

The state of Tennessee apparently does not plan to challenge the ruling of a three-judge panel striking down a new state law aimed at the Fairgrounds Nashville.

According to The Tennessean, the 30-day deadline for the state to appeal the ruling passed earlier this week with no action.

The law, one of several aimed at Metro Nashville this year, sought to lower the Metro Council vote threshold necessary to allow for major renovations to be conducted at the Fairgrounds. The legislation was designed to smooth the path for a plan to renovate the Fairgrounds Speedway and bring a top NASCAR race back to the track.

The three-judge panel ruled in September that the law violated the Tennessee Constitution's Home Rule Amendment, which protects local governments from targeted legislation.

"The opinion of the three-judge panel forcefully rejected the state's arguments," Metro Legal Director Wally Dietz said, according to The Tennessean. "We are grateful the state's attempt to rewrite the Metro Charter failed."

More behind the Nashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/politics/courts/state-wont-challenge-fairgrounds-lawsuit-ruling/article_4b426e36-7365-11ee-83a5-23f2d1c485a4.html

[Bos2Nash]

While I want the racetrack here. This is a huge win for the city and is the correct one in my opinion. The State has no business doing what it tried to do.

[nashvylle]

I want a new, updated track as well, but I also did not like the deal Cooper's team put together. I do pray something great happens here where racing history is preserved and a future is invested in, as well as the neighborhood gets the sound and traffic calming it wants. 

[Melrose]

1 hour ago, Bos2Nash said:

While I want the racetrack here. This is a huge win for the city and is the correct one in my opinion. The State has no business doing what it tried to do.

The State and Bristol  doing what they tried to do.....  

[Luvemtall]

If only we can get the State out of the Airport and Sports Authorities business, then it would be a trifecta win for Metro! 

[markhollin]

A new local group called Fairgrounds Preservation Partners is proposing a redevelopment plan for the Fairgrounds Speedway.

The group is pitching Cumberland Yards, which would replace the century-old Nashville racetrack with a campus including a park, live-work space for artists and musicians, and a new straight-line track for electric vehicle racing.

Supporters of the proposal include musician Ruby Amanfu and Shay Sapp, president of neighborhood group South Nashville Action Partners.

Cumberland Yards would be an alternative to an earlier proposal by track operator Speedway Motorsports, which called for more than $100 million in upgrades to the track to allow for the return of top-level NASCAR races to the city circuit. That plan has stalled with the departure of former Mayor John Cooper.

“The Nashville Fairgrounds belongs to all Nashvillians,” Mike Kopp, FPP chair, said in a release. “The future of this public property should be determined by the local community in partnership with the Fair Board and surrounding neighborhoods — and in a way that acknowledges the Fairgrounds’ complete history while addressing the city’s current needs.”

The group has met with new Mayor Freddie O'Connell's chief development officer Bob Mendes, Axios reported. O'Connell has been noncommittal about plans for the racetrack since taking office in September.

More behind the Nashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/politics/metro/local-group-pitches-new-plan-for-fairgrounds-speedway/article_90216f6e-8870-11ee-8582-276a2e2d0fc5.html
 

The Paddock

Referred to as the heart of the plan, The Paddock converts much of the 23-acre property into public parks and walking trails — with an overlook to Brown’s Creek — to be used for leisurely outdoor time, festivals, events and a midway for the fair.

The Grandstands

The Grandstands is the part of the project that aims to keep Nashville’s creative community in Music City, by providing places to live and work.

The mixed-use development would have 600 residential units, with hopefully half of them being affordable housing, and 75,000 square feet of commercial space — rehearsal spaces, recording studios, a small music venue, etc.

The Fast Track

Rather than NASCAR, the Cumberland Yard plan proposes EV drag racing, still keeping in line with Metro Charter’s requirement for auto racing at the site.

Cumberland Yard is still in the conceptual phase. Initial numbers have been run to ensure that the project is feasible, but no price tag has been set.

Over the next several months, the Fairgrounds Preservation Partners plan to set up key meetings with community stakeholders, including Nashville Mayor Freddie O’Connell, Metro Fair Board and Metro Sports Authority, while continuing to educate the public on the potential project.

And at NBJ here:

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2023/11/21/alternative-nashville-fairgrounds-speedway-plan.html

[satalac]

On 11/21/2023 at 8:07 AM, markhollin said:

A new local group called Fairgrounds Preservation Partners is proposing a redevelopment plan for the Fairgrounds Speedway.

The group is pitching Cumberland Yards, which would replace the century-old Nashville racetrack with a campus including a park, live-work space for artists and musicians, and a new straight-line track for electric vehicle racing.

Supporters of the proposal include musician Ruby Amanfu and Shay Sapp, president of neighborhood group South Nashville Action Partners.

Cumberland Yards would be an alternative to an earlier proposal by track operator Speedway Motorsports, which called for more than $100 million in upgrades to the track to allow for the return of top-level NASCAR races to the city circuit. That plan has stalled with the departure of former Mayor John Cooper.

“The Nashville Fairgrounds belongs to all Nashvillians,” Mike Kopp, FPP chair, said in a release. “The future of this public property should be determined by the local community in partnership with the Fair Board and surrounding neighborhoods — and in a way that acknowledges the Fairgrounds’ complete history while addressing the city’s current needs.”

The group has met with new Mayor Freddie O'Connell's chief development officer Bob Mendes, Axios reported. O'Connell has been noncommittal about plans for the racetrack since taking office in September.

More behind the Nashville Post paywall here:

https://www.nashvillepost.com/politics/metro/local-group-pitches-new-plan-for-fairgrounds-speedway/article_90216f6e-8870-11ee-8582-276a2e2d0fc5.html
 

The Paddock

Referred to as the heart of the plan, The Paddock converts much of the 23-acre property into public parks and walking trails — with an overlook to Brown’s Creek — to be used for leisurely outdoor time, festivals, events and a midway for the fair.

The Grandstands

The Grandstands is the part of the project that aims to keep Nashville’s creative community in Music City, by providing places to live and work.

The mixed-use development would have 600 residential units, with hopefully half of them being affordable housing, and 75,000 square feet of commercial space — rehearsal spaces, recording studios, a small music venue, etc.

The Fast Track

Rather than NASCAR, the Cumberland Yard plan proposes EV drag racing, still keeping in line with Metro Charter’s requirement for auto racing at the site.

Cumberland Yard is still in the conceptual phase. Initial numbers have been run to ensure that the project is feasible, but no price tag has been set.

Over the next several months, the Fairgrounds Preservation Partners plan to set up key meetings with community stakeholders, including Nashville Mayor Freddie O’Connell, Metro Fair Board and Metro Sports Authority, while continuing to educate the public on the potential project.

And at NBJ here:

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2023/11/21/alternative-nashville-fairgrounds-speedway-plan.html

Nope, don't like this. One, they're talking about how nobody wants the racetrack, then proceeds to name everything after a racetrack. Not everything in Nashville has to be bulldozed and made into something else. Can we not keep some history and make improvements? Isn't that what something called the Fairgrounds Preservation be doing? 

[markhollin]

In response to the Cumberland Yard plan, Bristol Motor Speedway issued the following statement to the Business Journal:

“Bristol Motor Speedway’s plan to preserve the historic Fairgrounds Speedway protects important elements of Nashville’s history, enhances the quality of life for the surrounding neighborhood, and will generate billions of dollars of revenue for local businesses and Nashville,” said Jerry Caldwell, president and general manager of Bristol Motor Speedway. “The new counter proposal calls for tearing down the speedway and destroying an iconic venue, which is in direct conflict with its intended public uses and a Metro Charter Amendment which passed by 71 percent in a countywide referendum.”

The referendum Caldwell is referring to took place in 2011, when the Fairgrounds was being eyed for redevelopment. The voter-approved charter change doesn’t mean that demolition or change of use is impossible, it would just need 27 out of 40 votes from Metro Council.

More at NBJ here:

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2023/11/22/debate-over-fairgrounds-speedway-bristol-motor-spe.html

[Luvemtall]

Although the Cumberland Yard plan might need a little tweaking, IMO it’s on the pathway to a better overall plan for both the Fairgrounds and surrounding neighborhood. I’m sorry to offend anyone, but there’s nothing of historical value left to preserve of the old racetrack. BMS would need to essentially tear down the track itself and replace it with basically a whole new venue, so that propaganda of them preserving the legacy is not flying. It’s all about them making money off the taxpayers in whatever forms of incentives and kickbacks that come their way, while they play the head games of the select few that want to hang on to times past. Time to move on Nashville!

[satalac]

On 11/24/2023 at 8:53 AM, Luvemtall said:

Although the Cumberland Yard plan might need a little tweaking, IMO it’s on the pathway to a better overall plan for both the Fairgrounds and surrounding neighborhood. I’m sorry to offend anyone, but there’s nothing of historical value left to preserve of the old racetrack. BMS would need to essentially tear down the track itself and replace it with basically a whole new venue, so that propaganda of them preserving the legacy is not flying. It’s all about them making money off the taxpayers in whatever forms of incentives and kickbacks that come their way, while they play the head games of the select few that want to hang on to times past. Time to move on Nashville!

I'd argue the historical aspect of it. It's been a racetrack since 1904 and has had tons of big name drivers race there. Making improvements shoudn't be seen as "not preserving the legacy". The legacy is the history of it being a racing venue. The speedway is something that brings some unique-ness to Nashville. More apartments isn't. 

[Luvemtall]

If we’re talking about the history and legacy, I believe back in the days of the original fair it was horses that made the spectators come. Racing comes in many forms, including the new and upcoming EV’S which NASCAR itself will convert to within the next decade. It might just have to come to another vote by all the citizens as to the fate of a city owned property, why just assume that because auto racing was the last use it has to remain as such. People might just prefer horses to cars, and that would fall into the charter requirements.

[Bos2Nash]

Couple questions/comments:

1. This group is proposing building three new residential buildings with a very large amount of parking. Must be parking for all those very expensive EVs that every resident will buy and "race" on the "dragstrip". Hope the garages are designed to carry the load (Are Electric Vehicles Increasing the Risk of Structural Failure in Parking Garages?). 
2. Who is going to own the buildings? Who is gonna pay for the very expensive ground lease? Who is going to operate these buildings? Who is going to maintain the dragstrip when they put very heavy EVs on the surface and they rip it up every other year because of their weight and torque? Who is going to pay for the constant setup and teardown of the concrete barriers/safety measures that will need to be in place when racing occurs?
3. The concept of an EV dragstrip is completely laughable and will never work because having cars at speed this close to residential buildings is entirely unsafe. They would need large concrete barriers on either side of a drag strip to make it safe enough to race on. Having a "drag strip" would be a very large switch-a-roo in that they would propose this and then most likely never use it as a dragstrip (maybe illegally), because what this group probably isn't saying is the residents of said buildings would have a say on when and how the racing occurs and I can almost guarantee that residents will never want it to happen. The operation team should need to schedule 10 to 15 scheduled events a year at the racetrack to maintain the charter requirement. That is alot of safety setup and teardown?
4. Income gentrification/displacement. This plan is pushing EVs, which are becoming increasingly expensive and very much outside the realm of possibility for the folks that actually keep the track operating. EVs (while I like the intent, but hate the implementation) are very white collar and this is essentially pushing out the blue collar (lower income) folks who have operated at the racetrack for a very long time. I understand there is a connotation with gentrification/displacement, but this is truly that.

The city should build upon the initial good parts of the BMS framework and work to get Metro removed from the back end of the deal. Once removed, this deal would sale through (because why else wouldn't it?) and we can have another great entertainment node for our city.

[Luvemtall]

The EV drag strip is definitely not a good concept, I’ll agree with that. Just think that was thrown out there to satisfy the Charter requirements, but to that extent ICE powered vehicles are on their way out. If they are to cause any gentrification or disruption of the blue collar folks ,is yet to be determined. As manufacturers dial in on the technology and innovation progresses, cost and efficiency will stabilize. Just imagine what the world thought of when ICE started making horse draw carriages a thing of the past, and now we love them so much we don’t want to see them go and new technology replace them. As far as the future of this particular property, it’s definitely time to move on and rebuild with an eye towards the future. Yeah the love of auto racing and the fun times had here for many over the years was a good gig , but Nashville as a whole is evolving into something else , something different. It’s time for this area to be something different also, just as SoBo, The Gulch, 12south, The Nations , East Bank etc are examples of evolution and are transforming right before our eyes. The folks at Bristol Motor Speedway have a very good track with  potential for the future, right in Nashville’s back yard in Lebanon, it’s even called Nashville Superspeedway (not Lebanon speedway) and putting that 100 million dollars they talk about into that track and improving upon the racing experience, would be a much better idea than trying to cram whatever they could into a ever increasing dense intercity neighborhood. Yes, I get a lot of your points and understand it’s sometimes hard to let go of fond memories, but sometimes it’s for the best. The Fairgrounds aren’t really The fairgrounds anymore, the transformation has started the Fair has moved on ( yes to Lebanon) and a new stadium and housing are making their mark. It’s time for the race track to evolve and become a better use for the surrounding neighborhood and it’s residents.

 

[Melrose]

On 11/24/2023 at 7:26 AM, markhollin said:

In response to the Cumberland Yard plan, Bristol Motor Speedway issued the following statement to the Business Journal:

“Bristol Motor Speedway’s plan to preserve the historic Fairgrounds Speedway protects important elements of Nashville’s history..."

LOLOL.  Bristol's proposal is to literally tear down the entire existing  "historic" speedway and build a new one that is twice as large, and of course, not at all historic.  

[Baronakim]

As far as I think, rebuilding THIS would be the only 'historic' project acceptable on this site.