LOCAL and Florida Politics

[orange87]

5 hours ago, jrs2 said:

you're so full of it.  You are the one bereft of any point.  My message was loud and clear.

they chant "we're coming for your children" in gay parades not necessarily in Florida as well.  Do you need a video clip of that so that you can reply "that wasn't necessary!" again?  Actually, it was necessary.  Them making choir videos and chanting in parades- just that alone- you try to say is the equivalent of receiving this type of text:  "I'm gonna ______ you next time I see you.  LOL."  It's like The White House making excuses for the $25M Biden Family received especially recently after Jean-Pierre is hammered by not only conservative reporters but liberal ones as well.  You are making excuses for the obvious as well.

The Left here at home uses leftist gays as one of it's "victim classes," not gays in general  See what they do to conservative gays and how conservative gays are treated.  I know four in particular (sales, realtor, and two admin assistants) that are conservatives and/or voted for Trump and when the social media scorpions learned of it they were extoled from that community.  They do the same thing to women, blacks, Muslims, and Jews.  It's all about The Left and Marxism and if you ain't on board, you're the enemy.  Leftist hypocrites.

The bottom line about Israel is that it's a free country, and it is the main western ally, and it is politically conservative.  When you have Antifa and BLM supporting Hamas and people like Taleeb etc (many Democrats) attacking Israel for trying to eradicate Hamas, anything you say on this subject falls on deaf ears because you are a political puppet.  When Pro-Palestinian supporters equate Hamas to the IDF and discredit what Israel has to say as being "conservative propaganda," it exposes what this is all about:  the "victims" (a new set this time) against the perceived "colonizers", which is what this whole Leftist movement has been about this whole time.  Don't even try and throw religion into it.

Obama was an anti-Colonialist (Marxist) too.  Same with the Pro-Palestinian activists.  Its just that this time, the "whitey" or whatever happens to be Jewish.

I have to admit, you are correct here. I was in Manhattan last summer during gay pride month. It wasn't intentional and boy do I wish we went a different time of the year. Me my wife and our seven year old son saw degeneracy that is beyond words. Men and women wearing virtually no clothes in public and slobbering all over each other. They were high and drunk and very rowdy. It was so crowded that the sidewalks were packed tight like sardines. And yes, when I was there, we heard a chant of "we're coming for your children." Totally inappropriate for children and decent people in general. I've supported gay marriage for a long time, but the LGBT community is taking things way too far now. It was gross.

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, jrs2 said:

Oh, and one more thing...

HAPPY THANKSGIVING!!!

 

Right back atcha, my man!!!!  

 

 

[JFW657]

On 11/22/2023 at 6:03 PM, orange87 said:

I have to admit, you are correct here. I was in Manhattan last summer during gay pride month. It wasn't intentional and boy do I wish we went a different time of the year. Me my wife and our seven year old son saw degeneracy that is beyond words. Men and women wearing virtually no clothes in public and slobbering all over each other. They were high and drunk and very rowdy. It was so crowded that the sidewalks were packed tight like sardines. And yes, when I was there, we heard a chant of "we're coming for your children." Totally inappropriate for children and decent people in general. I've supported gay marriage for a long time, but the LGBT community is taking things way too far now. It was gross.

FWIU it's as bad or worse in SF during these pride events.

Men running around totally butt nekkid in broad daylight, some of them engaging in sex acts out in the open in plain view of everyone.

OTOH, I don't think that the basic desire to engage in public nudity and sex is as much a gay thing as it is a male thing.

Men generally, are horny dawgs no matter what their sexual/gender preference is. I think the reasons you don't see heterosexual couples engaging in this kind of activity in public, is for various reasons, none of which have to do with gender preference.

A couple of those reasons being....

1) There are no special "Straight Pride" events, which would provide the kind of convenient excuse to engage in such public displays of debauchery that Gay Pride events do.

2) Most women would never go for it.  You'd risk getting slapped across the face and not being spoken to for a week just for suggesting it.  

But if there were such events and women would allow it, straight men would be every bit as happy and willing to engage in any kind of public debauchery as gay men.

Because let's face it... men just want sex. Anywhere, anytime, any occasion. Gay, straight or other. Doesn't matter.   

.

Edited November 24, 2023 by JFW657

[nite owℓ]

So I guess debauchery within the straight community is no longer a thing? Ever hear of Spring Break, Miami Beach or Ibiza?? Scantily clad women with their T&A hanging out, fully naked women, intoxicated people making out with each other, drunken fights, dancing/grinding provocatively and of course the classy couple getting it on behind the dumpster. Enough with the double standard. On any given day you can find some woman wearing skin tight tops and leggings showing off every nook and cranny, but I guess that's ok right. So what's good for the goose is totally out of bounds for the gander?

Yes gay pride parades do have an overtly sexual undertone, but let's not pretend like all straight events or clubs don't get sleezy either. Living next to Lake Eola, I've seen lots of straight people that were not on their best behavior... including a girl who pleasured her male friend on the sidewalk (and no, they were not homeless).

Look, in no way do I want to see either community doing any of that stuff in public, but the clutching of pearls and hypocrisy is a bit over the top. Keep that in mind the next time you guys pat yourselves on the back as a half naked woman with all of her bits on display walks by in public in front of kids and everyone else to see.

[JFW657]

5 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

So I guess debauchery within the straight community is no longer a thing? Ever hear of Spring Break, Miami Beach or Ibiza?? Scantily clad women with their T&A hanging out, fully naked women, intoxicated people making out with each other, drunken fights, dancing/grinding provocatively and of course the classy couple getting it on behind the dumpster. Enough with the double standard. On any given day you can find some woman wearing skin tight tops and leggings showing off every nook and cranny, but I guess that's ok right. So what's good for the goose is totally out of bounds for the gander?

Yes gay pride parades do have an overtly sexual undertone, but let's not pretend like all straight events or clubs don't get sleezy either. Living next to Lake Eola, I've seen lots of straight people that were not on their best behavior... including a girl who pleasured her male friend on the sidewalk (and no, they were not homeless).

Look, in no way do I want to see either community doing any of that stuff in public, but the clutching of pearls and hypocrisy is a bit over the top. Keep that in mind the next time you guys pat yourselves on the back as a half naked woman with all of her bits on display walks by in public in front of kids and everyone else to see.

No offense intended, but I think you're 1) exaggerating, 2) missing the point and 3) drawing a false parallel.

Sure young girls/women (both lesbian and straight BTW) wear "itsy-bitsy-teeny-weenie yellow polka dot bikinis" at the beach.

And yes they jiggle and gyrate while dancing. Big deal. They've been doing that since Annette Funicello in Beach Blanket Bingo. 

There was a song about it way back in the early 60's. 

But nobody is knocking alphabets for dressing in skimpy bathing suits and gyrating anyway.

That's not the point at all. 

And TBH, I don't believe there are many (if any) known instances of young straight girls running around the middle of cities like SF, butt-nekkid, having sex in broad daylight. Also, I doubt any possible instances of straight couples having sex in public in broad daylight are anywhere near as prevalent as they are during gay pride in SF. 

OK, maybe in Ibiza. Wherever that is. But then, who cares? We're talking about 'Murica here. 

And BTW, where did you observe any "pearl clutching" going on in this thread? 

In my post, I was mainly attributing it to typical MALE BEHAVIOR.

Both gay and straight. 

Maybe you're looking for something to be offended about? 

At any rate, straight people are not the ones complaining about not being accepted by mainstream society. We ARE mainstream society. It seems to me that if being accepted by the majority is really the goal, "the community" would frown upon, denounce and discourage all that.  

But I don't hear anything like that. 

[Ivanhoe]

You seem to misunderstand something. The gay community is not and has not looked for acceptance by the straight majority, rather fought for equality.  To that measure, the movement has been largely successful. It is the straight majority who are fixated on their “acceptance rate” of gay marriage and other things that gay people do with their lives.

Just pointing that out, not as a matter of confrontation.

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, Ivanhoe said:

You seem to misunderstand something. The gay community is not and has not looked for acceptance by the straight majority, rather fought for equality.  To that measure, the movement has been largely successful. It is the straight majority who are fixated on their “acceptance rate” of gay marriage and other things that gay people do with their lives.

Just pointing that out, not as a matter of confrontation.

Acceptance = equality.  

Equality = acceptance.  

[Ivanhoe]

22 hours ago, JFW657 said:

Acceptance = equality.  

Equality = acceptance.  

Not only are they different definitions, they are different concepts.

Being equal under the law does not require anyone to have acceptance of another person’s lifestyle nor does it require said person to conform to a majority stance (whatever that actually means because I sure don’t put all straights comfortably into a box).

Edited November 26, 2023 by Ivanhoe

[JFW657]

3 hours ago, Ivanhoe said:

Not only are they different definitions, they are different concepts.

Being equal under the law does not require anyone to have acceptance of another person’s lifestyle nor does it require said person to conform to a majority stance (whatever that actually means because I sure don’t put all straights comfortably into a box).

Basic equality under the law is not true social equality, which exists in the hearts and minds of the majority of a population.

Certainly any group can turn to the law to force the acceptance of certain things (lifestyles etc) on a mostly skeptical public. But no law can force the majority to embrace them and see them as truly equal. That requires conformity to certain generally accepted standards and that is why certain public behaviors can harm or set back their efforts. 

In all honesty, I would go as far as to say that the very existence of drag shows and the idea of hairy dudes in makeup and women's lingerie clomping around in high heels still makes most average straight people a bit squeamish. I mean, I try to be open minded and relaxed about most things, but if I see a picture of it, there's still that little voice inside that goes... "Ewwwwwwwww......"  

It was suggested in a previous post by @nite owℓthat debaucherous behavior in public by heterosexuals is seen by other heterosexuals as being perfectly ok, when in fact that is no true. The City of Daytona Beach kicked spring break out of town for that very reason. I've never condoned it either.  

Social equality and acceptance go hand in hand. You might get basic equality in a technical and legal sense, but the more outlandish and outrageous behavior a group is seen engaging in, the more difficult true social acceptance will be to achieve. 

I'm not saying it destroys all chances, but it causes the reach to be a little further.  

[jrs2]

On 11/22/2023 at 7:55 PM, JFW657 said:

 

Right back atcha, my man!!!!  

 

Yeah, ya know... Isaac...probably the coolest character ever.  I think I'm gonna watch an episode on Pluto TV (they have a channel for The Love Boat).  You can stream it...

[jrs2]

9 hours ago, JFW657 said:

Basic equality under the law is not true social equality, which exists in the hearts and minds of the majority of a population.

Certainly any group can turn to the law to force the acceptance of certain things (lifestyles etc) on a mostly skeptical public. But no law can force the majority to embrace them and see them as truly equal. That requires conformity to certain generally accepted standards and that is why certain public behaviors can harm or set back their efforts. 

In all honesty, I would go as far as to say that the very existence of drag shows and the idea of hairy dudes in makeup and women's lingerie clomping around in high heels still makes most average straight people a bit squeamish. I mean, I try to be open minded and relaxed about most things, but if I see a picture of it, there's still that little voice inside that goes... "Ewwwwwwwww......"  

It was suggested in a previous post by @nite owℓthat debaucherous behavior in public by heterosexuals is seen by other heterosexuals as being perfectly ok, when in fact that is no true. The City of Daytona Beach kicked spring break out of town for that very reason. I've never condoned it either.  

Social equality and acceptance go hand in hand. You might get basic equality in a technical and legal sense, but the more outlandish and outrageous behavior a group is seen engaging in, the more difficult true social acceptance will be to achieve. 

I'm not saying it destroys all chances, but it causes the reach to be a little further.  

yeah, sometimes I'm like...get a room already...  I'm not a fan of PDA.  To me, I view it as the result of a manipulation by one of the 'insecure' partners towards the other.  You're almost stuck between a rock and a hard place (reciprocate or there is gonna be a fight later (or at that time)).  "I wanna tell the world!"  However, if you are on a cruise (The Love Boat, LOL) or like somewhere where it is geared for that sort of thing, then, sure, it's cool.  But those PDA'fers better not shame the public at large for looking and not averting their eyes...

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, jrs2 said:

yeah, sometimes I'm like...get a room already...  I'm not a fan of PDA.  To me, I view it as the result of a manipulation by one of the 'insecure' partners towards the other.  You're almost stuck between a rock and a hard place (reciprocate or there is gonna be a fight later (or at that time)).  "I wanna tell the world!"  However, if you are on a cruise (The Love Boat, LOL) or like somewhere where it is geared for that sort of thing, then, sure, it's cool.  But those PDA'fers better not shame the public at large for looking and not averting their eyes...

I'm just as uncomfortable watching straight couples engaging in that. 

I was always uncomfortable engaging in public smooching myself, with the girls I've dated.    

[Ivanhoe]

On 11/26/2023 at 10:39 AM, JFW657 said:

Basic equality under the law is not true social equality, which exists in the hearts and minds of the majority of a population.

Certainly any group can turn to the law to force the acceptance of certain things (lifestyles etc) on a mostly skeptical public. But no law can force the majority to embrace them and see them as truly equal. That requires conformity to certain generally accepted standards and that is why certain public behaviors can harm or set back their efforts. 

In all honesty, I would go as far as to say that the very existence of drag shows and the idea of hairy dudes in makeup and women's lingerie clomping around in high heels still makes most average straight people a bit squeamish. I mean, I try to be open minded and relaxed about most things, but if I see a picture of it, there's still that little voice inside that goes... "Ewwwwwwwww......"  

It was suggested in a previous post by @nite owℓthat debaucherous behavior in public by heterosexuals is seen by other heterosexuals as being perfectly ok, when in fact that is no true. The City of Daytona Beach kicked spring break out of town for that very reason. I've never condoned it either.  

Social equality and acceptance go hand in hand. You might get basic equality in a technical and legal sense, but the more outlandish and outrageous behavior a group is seen engaging in, the more difficult true social acceptance will be to achieve. 

I'm not saying it destroys all chances, but it causes the reach to be a little further.  

I would discourage you for speaking on behalf of most straight people. I do not see the average straight person at all squeamish about drag. Also, you can just simply avoid it if your feelings are so arcane towards the subject.

What you can’t do, however, is try to stop it like DeShameless because as a matter of fact those people have a right so do whatever they want if it’s within their rights, to which it is.

Also, I would discourage you from bucketing drag in with acts of indecent behavior whatever it be gay or straight.  It is completely legal whereas some of the things mentioned here such as indecent exposure, public nudity or sex, are not in most places not SF or Key West (and since you know those things are legal there, just don’t go if you don’t like it — it’s simple really).

Case in point: I do not want to get an STD from a MAGA republican, so I do avoid the Villages.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Ivanhoe

[jrs2]

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

I would discourage you for speaking on behalf of most straight people. I do not see the average straight person at all squeamish about drag. Also, you can just simply avoid it if your feelings are so arcane towards the subject.

What you can’t do, however, is try to stop it like DeShameless because as a matter of fact those people have a right so do whatever they want if it’s within their rights, to which it is.

Also, I would discourage you from bucketing drag in with acts of indecent behavior whatever it be gay or straight.  It is completely legal whereas some of the things mentioned here such as indecent exposure, public nudity or sex, are not in most places not SF or Key West (and since you know those things are legal there, just don’t go if you don’t like it — it’s simple really).

Case in point: I do not want to get an STD from a MAGA republican, so I do avoid the Villages.

did you get from your "pamphlet"?  I disagree with the proposed law (for different reasons), but its geared to disallowing minors to attend drag shows where Kibbles & Bits might be shown (unless I misunderstood).

[JFW657]

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

I would discourage you for speaking on behalf of most straight people. I do not see the average straight person at all squeamish about drag.

Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there. Despite any facade of acceptance people may portray on the surface, there's still an underlying perception amongst many straight (and non-straight) people, that men going around in public wearing neon wigs, campy makeup, high heels, fishnet stockings, skimpy lingerie and feather boas, is embarrassing behavior and something they would never do themselves. 

And if someone would not do something themselves, that indicates a level of squeamishness about it. 

Probably why you don't see more men doing it. 

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

Also, you can just simply avoid it if your feelings are so arcane towards the subject.

Personally, I do avoid drag shows. And so do most straight people. That said, simply avoiding things one sees as potentially problematic (in certain contexts) is no way of dealing with them. If drag shows are allowed in public places where kids and people who are squeamish about it might find themselves involuntarily exposed to it, there will always be people who will and should speak out against it. That's just the way it is. 

And there's nothing arcane about traditional standards.

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

What you can’t do, however, is try to stop it like DeShameless because as a matter of fact those people have a right so do whatever they want if it’s within their rights, to which it is.

Where did I ever say anything about trying to stop it? If some people feel the need to run around like that, that's their business. As long as it's confined to appropriate venues, have at it. Enjoy. 

But kids don't need to be exposed to that kind of thing. 

There are so many other ways available to adults to confuse and warp their minds and so many years in which to accomplish it. 

If your generation wants to normalize it so that it's everywhere all the time, just remember that it's your future, your society and your world that you'll be turning into a rudderless, amoral freak show. 

If I had my druthers, those involved would elect to voluntarily confine it to appropriate venues out of consideration for others. But in today's world, consideration for others is no longer a thing. Everyone has an agenda and the agenda trumps everything else.

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

Also, I would discourage you from bucketing drag in with acts of indecent behavior whatever it be gay or straight.

I didn't bucket drag in with anything. I mentioned the acts of public nudity and sexual activity in response to it being mentioned in another post. 

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

It is completely legal whereas some of the things mentioned here such as indecent exposure, public nudity or sex, are not in most places not SF or Key West (and since you know those things are legal there, just don’t go if you don’t like it — it’s simple really).

Illegal though it may be, some members of the "alphabet community" engage in it. Worse, the rest of the "community" either ignores or condones it. Nobody criticizes or speaks out against it, and in SF, the cops turn their heads. 

As far as public nudity in San Francisco and Key West are concerned, it is legal in SF and all of California, but only during a permitted parade. Public sexual activity in California is legal under a set of conditions. 

But what does that say about California? That it's a bastion of open mindedness? Or that it's a fetid swamp of decaying social mores?  

Neither is legal in Key West, BTW.

But just not going to those places is no solution, as it's only a matter of time before their moral slide into the sewer starts to spread and affect the rest of society. 

On 11/28/2023 at 6:50 AM, Ivanhoe said:

Case in point: I do not want to get an STD from a MAGA republican, so I do avoid the Villages.

Oh, I can't blame anyone for staying away from there.

But I doubt you'd have to worry about STDs from that bunch.

Most of them probably haven't had sex in decades. 

[jrs2]

12 hours ago, JFW657 said:

Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there. Despite any facade of acceptance people may portray on the surface, there's still an underlying perception amongst many straight (and non-straight) people, that men going around in public wearing neon wigs, campy makeup, high heels, fishnet stockings, skimpy lingerie and feather boas, is embarrassing behavior and something they would never do themselves. 

And if someone would not do something themselves, that indicates a level of squeamishness about it. 

Probably why you don't see more men doing it. 

Personally, I do avoid drag shows. And so do most straight people. That said, simply avoiding things one sees as potentially problematic (in certain contexts) is no way of dealing with them. If drag shows are allowed in public places where kids and people who are squeamish about it might find themselves involuntarily exposed to it, there will always be people who will and should speak out against it. That's just the way it is. 

And there's nothing arcane about traditional standards.

Where did I ever say anything about trying to stop it? If some people feel the need to run around like that, that's their business. As long as it's confined to appropriate venues, have at it. Enjoy. 

But kids don't need to be exposed to that kind of thing. 

There are so many other ways available to adults to confuse and warp their minds and so many years in which to accomplish it. 

If your generation wants to normalize it so that it's everywhere all the time, just remember that it's your future, your society and your world that you'll be turning into a rudderless, amoral freak show. 

If I had my druthers, those involved would elect to voluntarily confine it to appropriate venues out of consideration for others. But in today's world, consideration for others is no longer a thing. Everyone has an agenda and the agenda trumps everything else.

I didn't bucket drag in with anything. I mentioned the acts of public nudity and sexual activity in response to it being mentioned in another post. 

Illegal though it may be, some members of the "alphabet community" engage in it. Worse, the rest of the "community" either ignores or condones it. Nobody criticizes or speaks out against it, and in SF, the cops turn their heads. 

As far as public nudity in San Francisco and Key West are concerned, it is legal in SF and all of California, but only during a permitted parade. Public sexual activity in California is legal under a set of conditions. 

But what does that say about California? That it's a bastion of open mindedness? Or that it's a fetid swamp of decaying social mores?  

Neither is legal in Key West, BTW.

But just not going to those places is no solution, as it's only a matter of time before their moral slide into the sewer starts to spread and affect the rest of society. 

Oh, I can't blame anyone for staying away from there.

But I doubt you'd have to worry about STDs from that bunch.

Most of them probably haven't had sex in decades. 

Ask yourself this:  Are prisoners EVER against burning the prison down? 

[FLheat]

13 hours ago, JFW657 said:

 

Most of them probably haven't had sex in decades. 

I had a friend that was a drug rep for Eli Lilly and more than double the Cialis prescriptions were written in her district than anywhere else.

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, FLheat said:

I had a friend that was a drug rep for Eli Lilly and more than double the Cialis prescriptions were written in her district than anywhere else.

I wonder what percentage of those prescriptions are written for old codgers who use it to engage in self gratification....   

[orange87]

DeSantis seeks energy-saving rebates in apparent change of heart

Article: https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2023/12/18/desantis-seeks-energy-saving-rebates-in-apparent-change-of-heart/?utm_source=listrak&utm_medium=email&utm_term=https%3a%2f%2fwww.orlandosentinel.com%2f2023%2f12%2f18%2fdesantis-seeks-energy-saving-rebates-in-apparent-change-of-heart%2f&utm_campaign=Breaking%3a+DeSantis+seeks+energy-saving+rebates+in+apparent+change+of+heart

[orange87]

DeSantis-led Florida has rejected $11 billion in federal funding in recent years

Article: https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2024/01/05/desantis-led-florida-has-rejected-11-billion-in-federal-funding-in-recent-years/?utm_source=listrak&utm_medium=email&utm_term=https%3a%2f%2fwww.orlandosentinel.com%2f2024%2f01%2f05%2fdesantis-led-florida-has-rejected-11-billion-in-federal-funding-in-recent-years%2f&utm_campaign=Don't+Miss%3a+DeSantis-led+Florida+has+rejected+%2411+billion+in+federal+funding+in+recent+years

[orange87]

Democrats flip Florida state House seat in special election

Article: https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2024/01/17/democrats-win-florida-tom-keen-maxwell/

[orange87]

DeSantis Says Marijuana Legalization Will Be On Florida Ballot Following Court Review

Article: https://www.marijuanamoment.net/desantis-says-marijuana-legalization-will-be-on-florida-ballot-following-court-review/

[JFW657]

Sucks that they still won't let you grow it.

Pretty sure it's because they're afraid of losing the tax revenue generated from sales. 

[orange87]

23 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

Sucks that they still won't let you grow it.

Pretty sure it's because they're afraid of losing the tax revenue generated from sales. 

Tax revenue is obviously the reason. It sucks that ballot initiatives need 60% to pass in Florida or else I'd say this is basically guaranteed to pass. In 2020 a $15/hr minimum wage was still considered pretty radical yet it still got at least 60% support in Florida so maybe there is some hope for marijuana legalization in Florida.

Edited January 23 by orange87

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, orange87 said:

Tax revenue is obviously the reason. It sucks that ballot initiatives need 60% to pass in Florida or else I'd say this is basically guaranteed to pass. In 2020 a $15/hr minimum wage was still considered pretty radical yet it still got at least 60% support in Florida so maybe there is some hope for marijuana legalization in Florida.

Florida has become such a fascist state under DeSatan. 

Every trick in the book in order to make it more difficult for the people they serve to get the things done they want done. 

Oh, and I had originally written "Obviously..." before changing it to "Pretty sure..."