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Norfolk Hilton Project

rusthebuss

By rusthebuss
in Norfolk

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okinawatyphoon Burg

okinawatyphoon

Posted
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I agree that the price tag on this project is excessive for the City... but I do take offense to the statement that: "this will discourage the city from doing business with minorities in the future" How about saying that this will discourage the city from doing business with Bob Johnson in the future. Bob Johnson is a Billionaire... he can afford to do this with out city funding... but chooses to be a cut throat businessman. If Trump was making this deal... would you say "this will discourage the city from doing business with White New Yorkers...of course not.. Remember there are 30 million+ African Africans. If one billionaires negotiating practices affects all others chances then that would speak very poorly for the city and America as a whole.
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vdogg Megalopolis

vdogg

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What Johnson is doing is tantamount to theft in my book but I agree with case. There are plenty of worthy minority businessmen who could make this project happen, Johnson just isn't one of them. If the city simply were to throw up their hands and say "well this is what we get for working with a minority businessman" then that would speak volumes of the character of this city, and would be a throw back to a time that I believe most of us wouldn't like to return to.

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NSUREDD Whistle-Stop

NSUREDD

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Mr. Johnson is not the only developer that has done this. How is he making working with minorities a bad thing? How is this one man a representation of all minority developers? Mr. Johnson is just doing what all developers do, it may not be a good thing but it is how business is done. The more money they make the more successful they are and Mr. Johnson is successful.

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Padman Hamlet

Padman

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The issue here isn't race. We shouldn't let it enter into our judgement about the merits of the development. Let's just say that It would set a good precedent if this were a good deal for everyone concerned, but it doesn't appear that way as things stand. Johnson and the City are at issue here.

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Sky06 Burg

Sky06

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Mr. Johnson is not the only developer that has done this. How is he making working with minorities a bad thing? How is this one man a representation of all minority developers? Mr. Johnson is just doing what all developers do, it may not be a good thing but it is how business is done. The more money they make the more successful they are and Mr. Johnson is successful.
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VAGATOR Whistle-Stop

VAGATOR

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The subsidy is pennies compared to the Convention Center and Parking garage. You heard the city cry poverty while the courthouses are literally falling apart, yet they have 70 million for a convention center and parking garage most people don't see a great need for.

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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The subsidy is pennies compared to the Convention Center and Parking garage. You heard the city cry poverty while the courthouses are literally falling apart, yet they have 70 million for a convention center and parking garage must people don't see a great need for.
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skylinefan Hamlet

skylinefan

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Funny, DC is courting RLJ Development to build a convention center hotel and is contemplating using very similar incentives to entice development. I think the time has come for Downtowns to stand on thier own. If Norfolk really has a booming Downtown then there is no longer a need for Performance incentives. If all of this buzz about Norfolk is nothing but smoke and mirrors it will become very apparent quckly that no developers are willing to invest their dollars in projects downtown. If this is the case maybe these incentives may be better spent in luring fortune 500 companies to establish headquarters or set up shop in Downtown Norfolk. If this is successful maybe then the developer will come a courtin.

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Sky06 Burg

Sky06

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Funny, DC is courting RLJ Development to build a convention center hotel and is contemplating using very similar incentives to entice development. I think the time has come for Downtowns to stand on thier own. If Norfolk really has a booming Downtown then there is no longer a need for Performance incentives. If all of this buzz about Norfolk is nothing but smoke and mirrors it will become very apparent quckly that no developers are willing to invest their dollars in projects downtown. If this is the case maybe these incentives may be better spent in luring fortune 500 companies to establish headquarters or set up shop in Downtown Norfolk. If this is successful maybe then the developer will come a courtin.
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VAGATOR Whistle-Stop

VAGATOR

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Randy Wright is a hypocrite. He doesn't mind using NRHA and tax money to push for his vision of Ocean View and make a nice little profit on the side selling real estate on the side, but he is outraged against this project. For me its two different issues. I don't mind the performance grant, but the money used on the convention center and parking garage could be used in a much wiser way i.e. a new courthouse, library or arena, all needed a lot more than a convention center.

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skylinefan Hamlet

skylinefan

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I agree with cities taking a stand, but your point about whether Norfolk is booming or not is completely irrelevant. Of course, Norfolk has been booming. There's no smoke and mirrors at all. You need only come here to see what's going on in DT, at Town Center, and all across the region. You make it sound as though we're begging developers to come here. Wrong. RLJ came to Norfolk, if I'm not mistaken. But you have to consider two other points: (1) Booming or not, things have slowed down here just as they have in DC and everywhere else. (2) Luxury hotels aren't built every day. Few cities are getting them, especially these days. Therefore, it's not about whether the claims of a booming market are true or not; that in itself won't get things done. It's more about the times and about the complexity or cost of the project itself.

Having said all that, I'm absolutely not in favor of giving away the farm. I think Norfolk needs to stand firm and set up a reasonable deal. After all, their risk could very well be more than the developer's.

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Sky06 Burg

Sky06

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I am going to use the words of Norfolk's leaders who stated not to long ago that the days of Norfolk lavishing incentives onto developers are coming to an end (Granby and HH were to be the last of them). Recent developments though seem to point to the idea that Norfolk is continuing business as usual. I was very much a supporter of other tax payer funded projects like Waterside, Nauticus, Marriott, McAurthur Center etc. when Downtown Norfolk was boarded up and moribund. According to the city the days of taxpayer funded projects are supposed to be a thing of the past, because of Norfolk's dramatic rebound. Now it seems that the city is willing to pay for more than half the cost of this project with no guarantee that it will ever be recouped in taxes. If the city goes along with this deal, they should be prepared to support this project for the forseable future.

I am a tax paying resident of Washington who has personally sent an e-mail to our Mayor telling him I am against incentives given to billionaire developers. I really don't think that it is required due to the prestige and interest in Downtown today. I doubt my opinion matters in light of the powerful forces me and other taxpayers are up against.

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gosscj Whistle-Stop

gosscj

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I agree with the general complaints about the funding for this project and about the developer himself, but I think when this project is complete we won't be complaining about it anymore. Looking at the sketch and thinking about the impact it will have on that corner of downtown, I can't help but think this will be a MAJOR improvement to an area that is generally prosperous but in need of something fresh. And having a (supposedly) four-star Hilton in downtown Norfolk... that will do a lot for the city. I can understand why the city officials are both extremely dedicated to this project and also apparently exasperated and trying to rush the process with incentives at this point. That's pretty much how I feel about it too.

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Sky06 Burg

Sky06

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I agree with the general complaints about the funding for this project and about the developer himself, but I think when this project is complete we won't be complaining about it anymore. Looking at the sketch and thinking about the impact it will have on that corner of downtown, I can't help but think this will be a MAJOR improvement to an area that is generally prosperous but in need of something fresh. And having a (supposedly) four-star Hilton in downtown Norfolk... that will do a lot for the city. I can understand why the city officials are both extremely dedicated to this project and also apparently exasperated and trying to rush the process with incentives at this point. That's pretty much how I feel about it too.
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