White Point / Greystar / Barings / MRP - East x South

[Madison Parkitect]

52 minutes ago, jjwilli said:

They are?? I doubt NCDOT could ever find the funding to actually do this in my lifetime and I hope the city would push back. We do not need a 6 lane South Blvd through South End.

They absolutely are planning to, that's why the developer of the Tyber Creek site isn't able to save the historic Leeper building where it's currently standing.

Edited February 4, 2022 by Madison Parkitect

[Nathan2]

1 hour ago, Madison Parkitect said:

They absolutely are planning to, that's why the developer of the Tyber Creek site isn't able to save the historic Leeper building where it's currently standing.

What are you talking about, NCDOT has no plans or funding on any long range plan for South Boulevard. South Boulevard will never be widened, its not even physically possible anymore. 

[stw52]

1 hour ago, Nathan2 said:

What are you talking about, NCDOT has no plans or funding on any long range plan for South Boulevard. South Boulevard will never be widened, its not even physically possible anymore. 

I'm curious too. Has the new Strawn development allowed for widening?

[Madison Parkitect]

1 hour ago, Nathan2 said:

What are you talking about, NCDOT has no plans or funding on any long range plan for South Boulevard. South Boulevard will never be widened, its not even physically possible anymore. 

I don't know the details of the plan but those of us on the Historical Commission were specifically told by the developer that South Blvd is due to be widened in the 2045 plan so the current setback of the Leeper building isn't valid anymore. It's possible they meant the Charlotte comprehensive plan or another org's plan, but they told us it was the NCDOT 2045 plan. 

 

Edit: I found what they were talking about, it's the city's corridor report found here, starting on page 16. https://charlottenc.gov/Projects/Documents/FinalReportandRecommendations.pdf  They'd be widening South Blvd. both in car travel width and pedestrian width.

Edited February 4, 2022 by Madison Parkitect

[Nathan2]

1 hour ago, Madison Parkitect said:

I don't know the details of the plan but those of us on the Historical Commission were specifically told by the developer that South Blvd is due to be widened in the 2045 plan so the current setback of the Leeper building isn't valid anymore. It's possible they meant the Charlotte comprehensive plan or another org's plan, but they told us it was the NCDOT 2045 plan. 

 

Edit: I found what they were talking about, it's the city's corridor report found here, starting on page 16. https://charlottenc.gov/Projects/Documents/FinalReportandRecommendations.pdf  They'd be widening South Blvd. both in car travel width and pedestrian width.

I think that plan is more of wishful thinking by the city. Even in newer developments future ROW hasn't been dedicated for that wide of a road. As of now south boulevard hasn't even been added to or discussed for improvements to the MTP or CTP plans, which looks out to 2045. 

[tozmervo]

1 hour ago, Madison Parkitect said:

I don't know the details of the plan but those of us on the Historical Commission were specifically told by the developer that South Blvd is due to be widened in the 2045 plan so the current setback of the Leeper building isn't valid anymore. It's possible they meant the Charlotte comprehensive plan or another org's plan, but they told us it was the NCDOT 2045 plan. 

 

Edit: I found what they were talking about, it's the city's corridor report found here, starting on page 16. https://charlottenc.gov/Projects/Documents/FinalReportandRecommendations.pdf  They'd be widening South Blvd. both in car travel width and pedestrian width.

If I can nitpik a little, the new cross section doesn't expand the car travel lanes. It shrinks them from 11' to 10' and allows for 10' strip of on-street parking. 

[Miesian Corners]

6 hours ago, Madison Parkitect said:

They absolutely are planning to, that's why the developer of the Tyber Creek site isn't able to save the historic Leeper building where it's currently standing.

I thought CDOT had control of South from 277 to Scaleybark? They acquired it from NCDOT during Blue Line construction. 

[JRCLT]

Ah yes, the add more lanes to fix the problem…only to end up making it worst. Beautiful road engineering at its finest.

[Madison Parkitect]

On 2/4/2022 at 5:04 PM, tozmervo said:

If I can nitpik a little, the new cross section doesn't expand the car travel lanes. It shrinks them from 11' to 10' and allows for 10' strip of on-street parking. 

Yes, that's technically correct (the best kind of correct!). The travel lanes would be narrowed to 10' but when the add in the new parking lanes the overall street width would be widened.

 

On 2/4/2022 at 4:53 PM, Nathan2 said:

I think that plan is more of wishful thinking by the city. Even in newer developments future ROW hasn't been dedicated for that wide of a road. As of now south boulevard hasn't even been added to or discussed for improvements to the MTP or CTP plans, which looks out to 2045. 

It may be wishful thinking, but they're apparently telling developers to allow for it in their building setbacks. The developers of the Tyber Creek property were told their new building could not match the existing Leeper building's setback because the street is due to be widened. This, coupled with the sight triangle requirements and rules about how far the parking deck entrance has to be from the corner means that keeping the Leeper building where it is doesn't really work (or at least doesn't work in "semi-creative but we don't want to try too hard" developer land).

[jjwilli]

Could they not eliminate the 10’ parking lane requirement just in front the Leeper building?  Seems like there are other issues so it might be a mute point. However, it would be great if CDOT / NCDOT could be flexible to assist in saving older buildings located closer to the road.

[Madison Parkitect]

1 hour ago, jjwilli said:

Could they not eliminate the 10’ parking lane requirement just in front the Leeper building?  Seems like there are other issues so it might be a mute point. However, it would be great if CDOT / NCDOT could be flexible to assist in saving older buildings located closer to the road.

CDOT wouldn't tear the Leeper building down to widen the roadway, but the problem is that it would be in the sight triangle for anyone entering/exiting the development's parking along South Blvd, which means they couldn't put an entrance on South Blvd, which means the project isn't feasible, development-wise.

[kayman]

On 2/4/2022 at 4:53 PM, Nathan2 said:

I think that plan is more of wishful thinking by the city. Even in newer developments future ROW hasn't been dedicated for that wide of a road. As of now south boulevard hasn't even been added to or discussed for improvements to the MTP or CTP plans, which looks out to 2045. 

It's not even being discussed in the 2050 MTP or the CTP by CRTPO (Charlotte's mainMPO) either. 

Edited February 10, 2022 by kayman

[KJHburg]

Drove by the Greystar apartment site today first time in a month.   #SouthendRising a subset of #CharlotteRising 

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by KJHburg

[RANYC]

29 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

Drove by the Greystar apartment site today first time in a month.   #SouthendRising a subset of #CharlotteRising 

 

Are the street trees along South Blvd getting chopped down?

[KJHburg]

1 minute ago, RANYC said:

Are the street trees along South Blvd getting chopped down?

I hope not they are close to the sidewalk and South Blvd. 

[Matthew.Brendan]

What’s that brick building in the background?

[atlrvr]

http://dilworthartisan.com/

 

It's remaining.

[KJHburg]

No crane spotted yet on this site but this will rise soon.    Photo from Greystar and Charlotte Ledger article and text from @TheRealClayton

""Developer: Greystar 

Location: Corner of East Boulevard and East Kingston Avenue

Height: 24 floors of residential 

What’s Planned: Much of the theme of South End’s growth has been towers replacing buildings that weren’t the “highest and best use” for the site. This 324-unit multifamily project is no exception, replacing the former Rosemont Bar and a couple smaller buildings. When completed in early 2024, Ascent South End will include a new location for the neighboring Walgreens pharmacy, within the brick and steel high-rise building. ""

This tower will have great views up South Blvd and at an angle over Dimensional Funds.  

[Urban Cowboy]

Street trees are coming down now. Just drove past and the chainsaws and bucket trucks are out. Progress.

[Reverie39]

I hope we try our best to keep or replant urban trees in the future. Something that has always made southern cities like Atlanta and Charlotte beautiful is the amount of trees and greenery even near their urban cores. 

[RANYC]

2 hours ago, Reverie39 said:

I hope we try our best to keep or replant urban trees in the future. Something that has always made southern cities like Atlanta and Charlotte beautiful is the amount of trees and greenery even near their urban cores. 

Yes, we'll replant.  Just wait around for 25-30 years and we'll get right back to where we were.  All we've got is time, right?  And of course these mature, resilient, air cleaning, carbon-ingesting monuments of nature can't be allowed to linger on the periphery of these projects and blight these new big-box edifices.  Surely there's no possible option to design around these monuments.

Edited February 19, 2022 by RANYC

[Windsurfer]

3 hours ago, RANYC said:

Yes, we'll replant.  Just wait around for 25-30 years and we'll get right back to where we were.  All we've got is time, right?  And of course these mature, resilient, air cleaning, carbon-ingesting monuments of nature can't be allowed to linger on the periphery of these projects and blight these new big-box edifices.  Surely there's no possible option to design around these monuments.

The ones getting annihialated in the suburbs bother me even more. For every one or dozen in a city block multiply by a 20 in a country lot. Just take a look at what will be happening at the grand new development on Lake Wylie. 

[RANYC]

22 minutes ago, Windsurfer said:

The ones getting annihialated in the suburbs bother me even more. For every one or dozen in a city block multiply by a 20 in a country lot. Just take a look at what will be happening at the grand new development on Lake Wylie. 

Is clear-cutting woodlands or a thicket an activity defined in the zoning code?  It’s tragic because I wish I new the incremental cost to developers being more surgical about creating space for neighborhood roads and homes, versus the clear-cutting massacre of some forested ecosystem.

When Charlotte wakes up and finds it has banished/crowded out/priced out much of what it was, I hope it can still be enchanted and beguiled by what it has become.

Edited February 19, 2022 by RANYC

[RANYC]

23 minutes ago, Windsurfer said:

The ones getting annihialated in the suburbs bother me even more. For every one or dozen in a city block multiply by a 20 in a country lot. Just take a look at what will be happening at the grand new development on Lake Wylie. 

Not just a tree annihilated in the suburbs.  A forest, wildlife ecosystem.

[j-man]

4 hours ago, RANYC said:

Yes, we'll replant.  Just wait around for 25-30 years and we'll get right back to where we were.  All we've got is time, right?  And of course these mature, resilient, air cleaning, carbon-ingesting monuments of nature can't be allowed to linger on the periphery of these projects and blight these new big-box edifices.  Surely there's no possible option to design around these monuments.

I feel like some people just don't value trees enough to care about them in this way and its quite sad. If this was New Orlean, Charleston, or Savannah, those cities will do everything to protect trees while building new developments, so it for sure can be done. granted most developments in those cities aren't quite as large or tall, but its doable wither way in my opinion.