Economic Development - Expansions and Relocations

[atlrvr]

14 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

While it would be nice if they anchored a new building , this is probably their ideal location.

I know this was a bit tounge-in-cheek, but I'll throw out a guess of the 2nd building in LoSo by Beacon (one of the two buildings nearly fully lease, the other doesn't have an office tenant yet, but basically ready for move-in)

[CLT Development]

My money is on The Line.

followed by Robinson Bradshaw's new building, and also Robinson Bradshaw's old space at 101 Independence Center.

Edited July 12, 2023 by CLT Development

[RANYC]

16 hours ago, CLT Development said:

My money is on The Line.

followed by Robinson Bradshaw's new building, and also Robinson Bradshaw's old space at 101 Independence Center.

I’m so rooting for 101 independence.  Owners came into the core of uptown to retrofit a building, opening it up to the streetscape.  I want them to have immense, precedent-setting success.  101 has bank of London, I believe.  This new HQ would be tremendous.

[rancenc]

Great news for downtown's office market with this expansion.

https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/indy-logistics-company-spot-expanding-in-charlotte

[CLT2014]

17 minutes ago, rancenc said:

Great news for downtown's office market with this expansion.

https://www.insideindianabusiness.com/articles/indy-logistics-company-spot-expanding-in-charlotte

Did they take some of the WeWork square footage?

[KJHburg]

1 hour ago, CLT2014 said:

Did they take some of the WeWork square footage?

Not sure but probably took some of their floors as they had like 7 or 8 in that building.  

this is a great win for Charlotte and uptown and our office market.  We need to diversify our uptown office market and a firm like this growing there is great.

""Indianapolis-based Spot has expanded its uptown Charlotte footprint with plans to more than double its employee base here.

The logistics company is leasing an additional floor spanning 22,000 square feet at First Citizens Bank Plaza, at 128 S. Tryon St. Spot has leased space on two floors there since September 2021. The company's total office footprint is now 48,000 square feet.

A Spot communications representative told Charlotte Business Journal that the additional floor has 144 workstations and a new state-of-the-art training center that allows for critical training and ongoing education for its employees. Spot's 108 local employees moved into the new space earlier this week.""

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2023/07/13/spot-logistics-expands-uptown-office-space-hiring.html

  Look at their Charlotte office and looks like they took some of Passport's space near the top

https://spotinc.com/locations/

[KJHburg]

new German manufacturer may open HQ and office in Concord. 

""Concord City Council is set to consider incentives tonight for an international company's investment there.

MS Assets LLC and MS XTEC LLC are proposing a project "to develop a new North American headquarters facility focusing on powertrain technology" at a site on Pitts School Road in Concord, city documents state.

The project calls for an investment of over $6.8 million and the creation of 39 jobs at an average wage of about $34 per hour. The facility would be 46,500 square feet at 570 Pitts School Road.

MS XTEC is a German company specializing in manufacturing concepts, including automation and digitalization. It made the following announcement on its website July 1: "We have also made the step across the pond! In the USA, we will soon be opening our new location in the Charlotte region of North Carolina."""

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2023/07/13/concord-city-council-german-ms-xtec-incentives-hq.html

foreign companies often start off small and grow and grow into larger operations.  There are many cases of this in the Charlotte region.  

[a2theb]

15 hours ago, KJHburg said:

Not sure but probably took some of their floors as they had like 7 or 8 in that building.  

this is a great win for Charlotte and uptown and our office market.  We need to diversify our uptown office market and a firm like this growing there is great.

""Indianapolis-based Spot has expanded its uptown Charlotte footprint with plans to more than double its employee base here.

The logistics company is leasing an additional floor spanning 22,000 square feet at First Citizens Bank Plaza, at 128 S. Tryon St. Spot has leased space on two floors there since September 2021. The company's total office footprint is now 48,000 square feet.

A Spot communications representative told Charlotte Business Journal that the additional floor has 144 workstations and a new state-of-the-art training center that allows for critical training and ongoing education for its employees. Spot's 108 local employees moved into the new space earlier this week.""

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2023/07/13/spot-logistics-expands-uptown-office-space-hiring.html

  Look at their Charlotte office and looks like they took some of Passport's space near the top

https://spotinc.com/locations/

With absolutely no evidence to make this assumption, I feel like WFH has opened the door for the more traditional "suburban" office users (i.e. logistics) to enter the uptown office market. 

 

Spot just seems like someone that would have ended up over in Coliseum 5 years ago, not uptown . I would assume nice leases are driving it or I could be completely wrong, who knows.

[atlrvr]

17 minutes ago, a2theb said:

With absolutely no evidence to make this assumption, I feel like WFH has opened the door for the more traditional "suburban" office users (i.e. logistics) to enter the uptown office market. 

 

Spot just seems like someone that would have ended up over in Coliseum 5 years ago, not uptown . I would assume nice leases are driving it or I could be completely wrong, who knows.

I agree with this somewhat, but I think the rationale is more than just more negotiable lease rates.  I think before employers assumed employees would show up wherever they were told, but now a company that wants an in-office culture either needs a building that gets people excited to show up, or a location that does.  I think the older buildings in Uptown meet that definition.  A boring building with no amenities in a suburban office park are at the biggest disadvantage.

[KJHburg]

Uptown is the best market even on par with Southend in terms of amenities.  You can live, work, eat, entertain uptown and this is part of a flight to quality.  Quality is making the location something they call commute worthy.  Uptown and Southend fit that bill.  Ballantyne is reimagined itself with more non office amenities and new areas like River District and Waverly have the mixed uses or will.   That all being said their always will be companies choosing suburbs for convenience factor to where many of their employees live or they want a big enough campus that has amenities within like Wells Fargo CIC or TIAA Cref or other larger campuses. 

Suburban pure office campuses just office buildings really have not been built in the last 5 years or so everything is mixed use and full of amenities now.  Standalone suburban office parks are probably dead going forward.  Everyone wants to be in some sort of mixed use environment like Uptown or even in a Ballantyne reimagined.  

[kermit]

^ The unavoidable problem with suburban districts like Btyne is that they are, by definition, peripheral to the urban core. While these offices are convenient to the employees who happen to live in Btyne, they are effectively off limits to any potential workers who live in N Meck due to distance and traffic — and this friction of distance increases as the metro grows (look at commuting patterns in Atlanta, nobody wants to drive from Marietta to Norcross to go to work each day). This is not a huge deal for low-skill jobs or times when unemployment is high, but I would think most hq type activities will have a much easier time hanging onto (and hiring) high-skill workers when they are in the physical center of the metro (“half-way to everywhere”). This becomes an even more significant factor if workers continue to move away from the city to get more space (to accommodate hybrid work for example)

Edited July 15, 2023 by kermit

[RANYC]

5 hours ago, kermit said:

^ The unavoidable problem with suburban districts like Btyne is that they are, by definition, peripheral to the urban core. While these offices are convenient to the employees who happen to live in Btyne, they are effectively off limits to any potential workers who live in N Meck due to distance and traffic — and this friction of distance increases as the metro grows (look at commuting patterns in Atlanta, nobody wants to drive from Marietta to Norcross to go to work each day). This is not a huge deal for low-skills jobs or times when unemployment is high, but I would think most hq type activities will have a much easier time hanging onto (and hiring) high-skill workers when they are in the physical center of the metro (“half-way to everywhere”). This becomes an even more significant factor if workers continue to move away from the city to get more space (to accommodate hybrid work for example)

This right here

while “perimeter” office parks will try to create an amenity-laden context  to compete, they don’t get local government as a partner in this in the same way.  Charlotte has created a critical mass of regional attractions targeting professionals in its city center: pro sports venues, arts & culture venues.  I’d add The Pearl to that too, a sort of intensive think tank bringing thousands of surgeons to get trained here annually.  TOD zoning is driving the extraordinary apartment boom which will create the energy of additional residential clustering, and given all this, B’tyne is a bit of a lonely island.  I think B’tyne is certain viable and has a niche to fill, but for a newcomer to town, center city wins.  

Edited July 14, 2023 by RANYC

[KJHburg]

New London based software firm opening US headquarters in Charlotte small to start out with but with lots of growth in mind.

""London-based management software firm Rocketseed has chosen Charlotte for its U.S. headquarters.

The company moved earlier this year into a small office at Venture X, which is located at Toringdon Office Park in south Charlotte. Rocketseed CEO Damian Hamp-Adams said the office currently has four local employees with plans to hire at least two more by the end of the year.   Rocketseed looked at office spaces in South End and SouthPark but ultimately decided that Toringdon met its needs for the time being, Hamp-Adams said. The company plans to stay put for at least the next 18 months before it begins to look at expansion to a more permanent office space.   The company also operates an office in California, but Hamp-Adams said the decision to make Charlotte its U.S. hub was an easy one. Factors like the city's rapid growth, access to the airport and talent pool all affected the decision-making process. He said Nashville, Tennessee, and Tampa, Florida, were also in the running.""

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2023/07/20/rocketseed-us-headquarters-toringdon-office-park.html

[CarolinaDaydreamin]

On 7/14/2023 at 2:30 PM, RANYC said:

This right here

while “perimeter” office parks will try to create an amenity-laden context  to compete, they don’t get local government as a partner in this in the same way.  Charlotte has created a critical mass of regional attractions targeting professionals in its city center: pro sports venues, arts & culture venues.  I’d add The Pearl to that too, a sort of intensive think tank bringing thousands of surgeons to get trained here annually.  TOD zoning is driving the extraordinary apartment boom which will create the energy of additional residential clustering, and given all this, B’tyne is a bit of a lonely island.  I think B’tyne is certain viable and has a niche to fill, but for a newcomer to town, center city wins.  

Ballentyne is essentially Atlanta's Perimeter- the center of the northern (in this case southern) suburbs. Charlotte has an attraction to the north for residential, which Atlanta doesn't have in Lake Norman, so it might actually have 2 "perimeter" business districts at some point, and the airport/river district to the West, but also is 40+ years behind Atlanta in terms of growth. 

[RANYC]

4 minutes ago, CarolinaDaydreamin said:

Ballentyne is essentially Atlanta's Perimeter- the center of the northern (in this case southern) suburbs. Charlotte has an attraction to the north for residential, which Atlanta doesn't have in Lake Norman, so it might actually have 2 "perimeter" business districts at some point, and the airport/river district to the West, but also is 40+ years behind Atlanta in terms of growth. 

Being behind Atlanta implies we're on the same track, and I hope we're not.  

[15895]

10 minutes ago, RANYC said:

Being behind Atlanta implies we're on the same track, and I hope we're not.  

This isn’t a loaded question or anything. Just curious, which metropolitan area / city do you think Charlotte is on a similar track to? Or is it just too unique of a track? 

[Hornets]

2 hours ago, AirNostrumMAD said:

This isn’t a loaded question or anything. Just curious, which metropolitan area / city do you think Charlotte is on a similar track to? Or is it just too unique of a track? 

I'll jump in and say Charlotte reminds me of a smaller version of Houston, TX.

[kermit]

On 7/20/2023 at 6:34 PM, AirNostrumMAD said:

This isn’t a loaded question or anything. Just curious, which metropolitan area / city do you think Charlotte is on a similar track to? Or is it just too unique of a track? 

IMO every growing Sunbelt metro is evolving in exactly the same, sprawling, way. They (Atlanta, Charlotte, Raleigh, Nashville, etc.) all have the same underlying NIMBY culture (made worse as transplants arrive who are only attached to the city by their home rather than a connection to the history and culture of the place), the same degree of auto dependence (even Charleston and Savannah) and (largely) the same economic base (outside of Florida). 

Some cities are doing things at the margins like zoning, under-built transit (a light rail line w 20 minute frequencies), or perhaps localized walkability (Greenville SC)  that allow them to superficially claim they are moving away from auto dependence. Charlotte might be at the top of this superficial list (thanks largely to our zoning along the Blue Line and the lucky accident of the rail trail), but these strategies come at a huge political cost so they quickly get marginalized (No transit expansion or competent operation, highway widening,  and starting to wiggle out of the more urban aspects of the UDO before it even begins). Nashville might be at the bottom of this list (in terms of planning for sustainability), but their growth really hasn’t been different in rate or character than our own.

Looking at post-pandemic patterns I am pessimistic. I just don’t see signs that Sunbelt city growth is going to be accommodated in any way other than  more sprawl -- particularly when most professionals feel like they now need a house with a home office. The only real difference between large Sunbelt cities is the number of token walkable districts that get built (Southend) or preserved (Dilworth) around the edges of their respective downtowns. Whats worse is there are so few of these districts relative to demand that they are priced such that they are reserved only for the wealthy and childless --  a situation that makes the remainder of the city resentful of urbanism and unwilling to fund more of it.

I think its time for my medication now.

Edited July 24, 2023 by kermit

[CLTranspo]

11 minutes ago, kermit said:

We spend lots of time on UP talking about differences between cities but the only real differemce between them  is the number of token walkable districts that get sprinkled around the edges of their respective downtowns. Whats worse is these districts are increasingly reserved for the wealthy and childless.

Totally agree, and as a young person this is why I'll probably be moving somewhere like Chicago where I can actually afford to own my own place in a neighborhood that doesn't require car travel to get by.

 

[videtur quam contuor]

13 hours ago, CLTranspo said:

Totally agree, and as a young person this is why I'll probably be moving somewhere like Chicago where I can actually afford to own my own place in a neighborhood that doesn't require car travel to get by.

 

 

Find a city/neighborhood where the mail is delivered on foot. Old style with a bag or that three wheeled cart. Sometimes due to narrow streets. Usually a dense enough area that driving and parking is inefficient. That style is normally called park and loop. Even in Dilworth there is park and loop. This walking delivery can be in a small dense town, not only large cities,

[Blue_Devil]

1 hour ago, videtur quam contuor said:

 

Find a city/neighborhood where the mail is delivered on foot. Old style with a bag or that three wheeled cart. Sometimes due to narrow streets. Usually a dense enough area that driving and parking is inefficient. That style is normally called park and loop. Even in Dilworth there is park and loop. This walking delivery can be in a small dense town, not only large cities,

I mean, between Dilworth, SouthEnd, LoSo, Uptown, and Wilmore… that is a huge walk able chunk of city. To me Nashville doesn’t have that, Austin doesn’t have it, Atlanta has golf carts, Tampa doesn’t have it, Orlando doesn’t have it, Jacksonville is a no, Fort Lauderdale is a no.

I suspect in 10 years between the gold district, pipe and foundry, west end, and the optimist area all growing rapidly, NODA and Plaza will be much better connected, and maybe with the growth on Morehead Mid town will be too.

Now public transit, specifically buses, will really need to improve, but you are fooling yourself if you don’t think 100,000 people living in a very walkable 2 mile radius of the city center isn’t impressive for one of these Growing southern cities.

yes there is a ton of sprawl in Charlotte, but there is also about to be a super dense core here, that is really only found in your bigger Northern and Midwest areas

[KJHburg]

There are neighborhoods where you can easily live without a car as others have said and more so here than in an Austin or Nashville.   Like NoDa, Villa Heights, right around University Place,  all along the South Blvd corridor from uptown to southend to Loso to down by arrowood.  We have a Whole Foods right on the LYNX plus other grocery stores in most of these other neighborhoods.    And Charlotte is a lot more affordable than these bigger cities mentioned.  If you want a moderate cost of living and extensive rail system look into Dallas.   But Charlotte is a good choice in this region other than maybe Atlanta. 

[RANYC]

3 hours ago, Blue_Devil said:

I mean, between Dilworth, SouthEnd, LoSo, Uptown, and Wilmore… that is a huge walk able chunk of city. To me Nashville doesn’t have that, Austin doesn’t have it, Atlanta has golf carts, Tampa doesn’t have it, Orlando doesn’t have it, Jacksonville is a no, Fort Lauderdale is a no.

I suspect in 10 years between the gold district, pipe and foundry, west end, and the optimist area all growing rapidly, NODA and Plaza will be much better connected, and maybe with the growth on Morehead Mid town will be too.

Now public transit, specifically buses, will really need to improve, but you are fooling yourself if you don’t think 100,000 people living in a very walkable 2 mile radius of the city center isn’t impressive for one of these Growing southern cities.

yes there is a ton of sprawl in Charlotte, but there is also about to be a super dense core here, that is really only found in your bigger Northern and Midwest areas

I agree.  I think our trajectory is promising.  I regularly host friends from other places and we get all around center city on foot, on bike, using transit lines into events/sports, and the occasional short ride using rideshare.  If weather is nice we are super active on the greenway going from uptown to freedom park and then walking east blvd back into south end.  Our city center is vastly more walkable than many of the southern belt growth cities I’ve visited, and I’m pretty bullish on where that’s headed.  

Over and over at and just after the CNU, attendees remarked on the “mind-boggling densification” happening in our city center.  No we can’t just reverse out past sprawl sins one finds in various parts within city limits, nor are we about to seize people’s property, but I’m very optimistic about our well-reasoned and methodical trajectory.  I’m going to celebrate our pivots and our strivings rather than make myself unhappy because we’re short of perfection.
 

 

Edited July 21, 2023 by RANYC

[CLTranspo]

I agree with what everyone is saying, and appreciate everyone’s comments. For me, there just aren’t any affordable condos/homes available to BUY in these areas. But agree, I like these areas and what Charlotte is growing towards, and have been pretty happy renting here. I just can’t justify the cost of purchasing housing in these areas vs the amount of walkability/urban amenities available NOW (not in 10 years)..

[15895]

6 hours ago, Blue_Devil said:

I mean, between Dilworth, SouthEnd, LoSo, Uptown, and Wilmore… that is a huge walk able chunk of city. To me Nashville doesn’t have that, Austin doesn’t have it, Atlanta has golf carts, Tampa doesn’t have it, Orlando doesn’t have it, Jacksonville is a no, Fort Lauderdale is a no.

I suspect in 10 years between the gold district, pipe and foundry, west end, and the optimist area all growing rapidly, NODA and Plaza will be much better connected, and maybe with the growth on Morehead Mid town will be too.

Now public transit, specifically buses, will really need to improve, but you are fooling yourself if you don’t think 100,000 people living in a very walkable 2 mile radius of the city center isn’t impressive for one of these Growing southern cities.

yes there is a ton of sprawl in Charlotte, but there is also about to be a super dense core here, that is really only found in your bigger Northern and Midwest areas

As of 2021, uptown has a population of 18,300 people. I’m pretty sure the 2-mile radius is closer to 36,000 in 2021. Not 100,000.

Center City Partners 2021 State of the Center City is the source. Or just add up the zip code populations. 
 

Edited July 21, 2023 by AirNostrumMAD