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Brightline Trains

FLheat

By FLheat
in Orlando

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aent Burg

aent

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, codypet said:

Orlando to Miami was supposed to start running in 2014, then 2016, then 2020 just for perspective.

Yes, but those delays were a result of legal challenges from governmental entities along the coast. Since they started construction they seem to be moving fairly fast and keeping on schedule. There is little reason to believe there will be any legal challenges on an MCO-Disney expansion.

1 hour ago, spenser1058 said:

Brightline is another issue entirely. It’s worth noting when your priorities have little to do with providing the actual service how it muddies the results. Which, of course, is why Amtrak has been operating for decades (including currently). It’s also worth noting this organization has had problems before with its operations (in Canada) and its onetime partner Virgin was so bad they were removed from rail routes in the UK. Of course, Medicare Fraud Rick Scott has never been bothered with schemes to feather one’s nest.

Bottom line: if your priorities are diluted, the service you provide suffers accordingly.

I've asked numerous times without a response from you, can you please either provide some sort of example of other priorities for expanding to Orlando (or Disney). Since you've ignored me every single time, the only possible conclusion is entirely false. Time to put up or shut up.

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jgardnerucf
jgardnerucf

Thar she blows! Taken now, 11am, 6/20 heading East from MCO.

stevenycer1
stevenycer1

Christmas Eve 2019 / MCO Intermodal Construction:   Facing South Facing east  

dcluley98
dcluley98

Tracks are complete and the first BrightLine test train has made the full trip to the OIA Intermodal Station:   

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codypet City

codypet

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, aent said:

Yes, but those delays were a result of legal challenges from governmental entities along the coast. Since they started construction they seem to be moving fairly fast and keeping on schedule. There is little reason to believe there will be any legal challenges on an MCO-Disney expansion.

That's what got the blame, but that was not the real cause of the delays.

It's a serious ambitious effort that is akin to moving a mountain.  Projects like this don't go from planning to operation in 2 years, or 4 years.  (FL HSR died in 2010, BL seemed to show up around 2012.)  Sunrail and I-4 Ultimate both took decades of planning.  Kudos to BL for getting it mostly done within a decade. 

I suspect getting to Disney Springs/Tampa is going to be a similar timeline.  We heard rumblings when for Disney?  2018/19?  Push that out 8 years and I would estimate late 2026/2027 at the earliest.   And everyone......2027 is around the corner in construction speak.

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WAJAS Hamlet

WAJAS

Posted
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13 minutes ago, aent said:

Yes, but those delays were a result of legal challenges from governmental entities along the coast. Since they started construction they seem to be moving fairly fast and keeping on schedule. There is little reason to believe there will be any legal challenges on an MCO-Disney expansion.

I've asked numerous times without a response from you, can you please either provide some sort of example of other priorities for expanding to Orlando (or Disney). Since you've ignored me every single time, the only possible conclusion is entirely false. Time to put up or shut up.

If you're referring to other priorities for Brightline, then they have been public about at least one of them. The original purpose, and arguably still the main purpose, of Brightline was to increase the value of the FEC properties along the mainline. The Miami Station largely capitalized on this.

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aent Burg

aent

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9 hours ago, WAJAS said:

If you're referring to other priorities for Brightline, then they have been public about at least one of them. The original purpose, and arguably still the main purpose, of Brightline was to increase the value of the FEC properties along the mainline. The Miami Station largely capitalized on this.

Yes but why expand to Orlando? They have no properties near stations in the under construction Orlando route or even the proposed Tampa route. Why keep spending on these stations if they've already built the ones where they want to increase property value? Especially if service is not a priority?

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WAJAS Hamlet

WAJAS

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5 hours ago, aent said:

Yes but why expand to Orlando? They have no properties near stations in the under construction Orlando route or even the proposed Tampa route. Why keep spending on these stations if they've already built the ones where they want to increase property value? Especially if service is not a priority?

I'm not arguing that service isn't a priority, but its subordinate to increasing the property value. The expansion to Orlando will bring passenger traffic and attention that will increase the current property values in South Florida even more.

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aent Burg

aent

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And considering its costing $2.7 billion for the MCO expansion and we don't have a pricetag on the Disney one yet, does anyone think their properties are going to go up in value by more then $2.7 billion by having the train be extended to Orlando? Also, if Brightline doesn't provide some sort of reasonable service, will they still get a huge increase in property value on the South Florida properties?

Keep in mind the comment I'm replying to with my comment: "It’s worth noting when your priorities have little to do with providing the actual service how it muddies the results"

My point is its super clear at this point: Brightline's top priority is getting ridership up. I don't disagree Brightline wants to make money off of real estate as well, but they've already spent FAR too much money to make it worth it to do this venture without the passenger service, or even without it being literally the top priority.

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dcluley98 Town

dcluley98

Posted
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Brightline is not funding the MCO terminal.  Private investors are funding the rail expansion. It is yet to be seen who will fund the station at Disney.  

The real estate is controlled under separate entities from the rail line and service itself. They did this on purpose to limit risk of the rail line portion to a separate company and be able to retain the real estate portion in the event of failure of the rail line. I believe that Brightline does wish for the rail line/service to be successful, but they are hedging their bets in case it is not. Basically, they just want to get it built first, and drive traffic to their surrounding property ventures. However, if it does fail, they created it under a separate entity with separate private funding so that they wouldn't put their real estate ventures at risk. 

I honestly hope that Brightline is wildly successful and benefits all parties including FEC and the surrounding development ventures. But let's not sit here and pretend that they don't have other interests that are prominent in their plan and decision making. 

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spenser1058 Gigalopolis

spenser1058

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, aent said:

From what I've seen and heard, I'm guessing Mears will go under at some point. They're losing business everywhere with no recovery in sight.

One of their major competitors, Transtar, is already closed, whether permanently or not I don’t know. Mears of course is only owned 10% by the family these days. They sold the rest of the firm to a WPB investment company several years back.

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AmIReal Burg

AmIReal

Posted
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Brightline is 49% complete for the WPB/ MCO segment. They expect to finish Q4 '22 and begin service early '23.

Maybe I missed it previously, but this is the first time I've heard, "the company also spoke with Elon Musk's The Boring Co. on the potential feasibility to have a link between the Orlando airport and convention center." per OBJ.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/02/23/brightline-orlando-expansion-construction.html?cx_testId=40&cx_testVariant=cx_11&cx_artPos=1#cxrecs_s

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shardoon Hamlet

shardoon

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2 hours ago, AmIReal said:

Brightline is 49% complete for the WPB/ MCO segment. They expect to finish Q4 '22 and begin service early '23.

Maybe I missed it previously, but this is the first time I've heard, "the company also spoke with Elon Musk's The Boring Co. on the potential feasibility to have a link between the Orlando airport and convention center." per OBJ.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2021/02/23/brightline-orlando-expansion-construction.html?cx_testId=40&cx_testVariant=cx_11&cx_artPos=1#cxrecs_s

A tunnel from the airport to I drive in Orlando?? I do not think this is possible in Orlando......

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shardoon Hamlet

shardoon

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, codypet said:

Definitely not a cut/cover tunnel.  A boring tunnel.  Geez I just feel like its not gonna be worth the expense with all the ingress/egress requirements.

Is the limestone here with sinkhole happy soil capable of having a boring project? I feel like this would be trying to drill through a wet sponge. 

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codypet City

codypet

Posted
Posted
15 hours ago, shardoon said:

Is the limestone here with sinkhole happy soil capable of having a boring project? I feel like this would be trying to drill through a wet sponge. 

I don't know where to where they're trying to bore, but the soils are so different as you cross the state.  None of them really conducive to boring in the traditional sense.  I just don't see how it would make an cost sense to do it if they could.

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