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Hampton Roads Military Developments

vdogg

By vdogg
in Hampton Roads

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hoobo Burg

hoobo

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Alright, let's try to make sense of this. The SEALs are based at Little Creek. However, more than likely they participate in operations staged from Oceana. It may be parachute drops, although I don't think the SEALs do that. Another possibility is they have urban training facilities at the base because other Navy bases don't have the space. If that's the case, a deal could be reached with Fort Story, Fort Eustis or even Fentress. If it is parachute drops, then flights could commence from Chambers Field or as Viper suggested, Langley. Anyway, Florida, Virginia, and BRAC may not be the only political players in this game. The Navy/Pentagon has its desires, and that's for Oceana to remain open as long as no more development occurs that they oppose.

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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Well, my point was if the SpecOps aren't a part of Oceana, then how are they staying at ...Oceana?

I come in here because I live here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The way you type you wouldn't have known that. I would have figured you live in Florida right now. I haven't heard anything positive on this matter besides opinions on florida. Just my thoughts though. It figures the one thing that we have become relying on for economy is leaving. I wonder if this area is actually going to step up or be left behind like it always does! :cry:

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Viper Burg

Viper

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A few positives have been brought up. Namely that HR has been trying to diversify its economic basis for a long time and with oceana probably closing, that grants VB a very large land parcel to do some something about that diversity.

To be honest, this area hurt itself by having 7 similarly sized cities clustered together. Most cities have enough issues trying to deal with one or two other big politcal entities (like the county or other nearby city) but to have 7 is detrimental.

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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A few positives have been brought up.  Namely that HR has been trying to diversify its economic basis for a long time and with oceana probably closing, that grants VB a very large land parcel to do some something about that diversity. 

To be honest, this area hurt itself by having 7 similarly sized cities clustered together.  Most cities have enough issues trying to deal with one or two other big politcal entities (like the county or other nearby city) but to have 7 is detrimental.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think that anyone will argue there about the 7 cities. I think that hurts the triangle too.

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hoobo Burg

hoobo

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To be honest, this area hurt itself by having 7 similarly sized cities clustered together.  Most cities have enough issues trying to deal with one or two other big politcal entities (like the county or other nearby city) but to have 7 is detrimental.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I always looked at it as a problem because there always appears to be infighting on regional projects. However, in reality, HR cooperates on regional projects such as transportation, economic growth, trash collection, recycling, wastewater treatment, and water needs. There are even purchasing agreements when it comes to buying school and office supplies to increase the economies of scale. Attracting a pro team, tourism (although partnerships between VB & Wburg and Norfolk & Portsmouth exist), homelessness, and LR are areas I can really think of where HR lacks in regional cooperation.

When a large company/office looking to move to the area, the state usually steps in to decide which city should take the lead on trying to land the company. In going after smaller companies, what is wrong with having 2 HR cities in the running? Wouldn't that attract a company more by showing that the area has several strong, legitimate contenders? Also, smaller cities can better serve their residents and businesses. NYC operates as five entities. Some part of LA (the Valley, Hollywood, or the Harbor district) is always trying to break away from the 3.5 million person city. Is big better? With no county, you don't have to worry about another layer of government. I think a lot of the problem has to do with the lack of attention from the state and weak representation in the legislature. Hopefully, the dilema with Oceana can remedy that.

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hoobo Burg

hoobo

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According to the BRAC report, VB had to buy the condo development because it is within the 70 dB zone. Although, VB and Chesapeake must condemn all property within APZ1, no new construction can take place within the 70 dB zone or along the flight path between Oceana and Fentress. The cities must by the development rights to those areas. Both cities must fully comply with the AICUZ guidelines or risk losing the jobs associated with NAS Oceana. The recommendations go far beyond the $15 mil/yr minimum for condemnation (upwards of $600+ million to condemn homes and businesses). The recommendations cripple future development in and the economies of VB and Chesapeake. If the legal battle is lost, it would be an insult to VB citizens if their city complies. However, if VB and Cpeake do comply, the housing boom will move in earnest to Suffolk and the commercial boom will concentrate in Pemrboke and DT Norfolk. Retaining Oceana will dramatically change the development and value of land in HR as much of VB and large swaths of Cpeake will be lost to AICUZ easements.

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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According to the BRAC report, VB had to buy the condo development because it is within the 70 dB zone.  Although, VB and Chesapeake must condemn all property within APZ1, no new construction can take place within the 70 dB zone or along the flight path between Oceana and Fentress.  The cities must by the development rights to those areas.  Both cities must fully comply with the AICUZ guidelines or risk losing the jobs associated with NAS Oceana.  The recommendations go far beyond the $15 mil/yr minimum for condemnation (upwards of $600+ million to condemn homes and businesses).  The recommendations cripple future development in and the economies of VB and Chesapeake.  If the legal battle is lost, it would be an insult to VB citizens if their city complies.  However, if VB and Cpeake do comply, the housing boom will move in earnest to Suffolk and the commercial boom will concentrate in Pemrboke and DT Norfolk.  Retaining Oceana will dramatically change the development and value of land in HR as much of VB and large swaths of Cpeake will be lost to AICUZ easements.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That is a good analysis. I think it will be realigned but if it doesn't it might help with the urban type developments everywhere else!

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reggie3 Crossroads

reggie3

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Isn't the JSF a VTOL....too many acronyms :D Then, I think there should be less of a crash zone because of that, huh?

Only the Marines will be using the VTOL version of the JSF. The Navy will be using a more conventional version.

The Tomcats are currently on their last cruise so you can expect the base to be all Hornets very soon.

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urbanvb City

urbanvb

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This issue is very far from being a dead one. Va Beach has hired a consultant .. and .. is also considering legal action against BRAC for such a harsh restrictive request. And now Cecil may have housing encroachment issues as well. Gee, this could drag out for quite awhile.

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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This issue is very far from being a dead one. Va Beach has hired a consultant .. and .. is also considering legal action against BRAC for such a harsh restrictive request. And now Cecil may have housing encroachment issues as well. Gee, this could drag out for quite awhile.

The politicians are on the other side. Jeb is pushing for this from his brother in the white house so you can kiss Oceana good bye and I would never spend any money in Vabeach if they take people's houses away from those people.

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hoobo Burg

hoobo

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I like Warner, actually both of them, but why does Gov. Warner keep saying that if Oceana goes, so does Norfolk Naval Base? Where will the aircraft carriers go? Mayport is only large enough to handle 2 aircraft carriers and associated battle groups. There is no room for expansion unless they dig up Jacksonville NAS, which won't happen due to cost and environmental litigation. Mayport also has major silting problems and is accessed through a jetty. The jetty is less than half a mile wide so a terrorist attack on it would cause more problems than one on HR's bridge-tunnel systems with mile wide channels. The Navy even says it wants 2 bases on each coast in case of such an attack.

There is no other naval facility on the Gulf or Atlantic coast that can handle nuclear aircraft carriers. In addition, naval facilities between Norfolk and Jax have been closing most notably, Charleston Naval Base. As for subs, the Navy recommended moving subs from Connecticut to Norfolk because operations are less expensive in Norfolk. King's Bay, GA poses its own problems as it is not a natural harbor. Subs have to enter a channel one mile off shore and once in it, cannot turn around until at the sub base. That was a nice little prize for Jimmy's home state.

When the planes left Miramar for central California, the ships didn't leave San Diego for Oakland. Why would it be any different in Norfolk?

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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Norfolk Naval Base isn't going anywhere. That's just simply rhetoric Warner is throwing out there to do whatever it is to keep the base. Heavy politics are being played on both sides.

by the way, residents on the Westside of Jax don't want the base and are fighting the city.

www.betterwestside.com

www.saynotocecil.com

I don't think the state cares what those people think. They never do.

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