River House Condominiums

[GRDadof3]

Now, you know why I say "hidden". Negotiated? Each unit all ready comes with 2 LEASED spots. Same thing almost happened to me, they were real anxious about getting my 3% down, after lengthly meeting they seemed frustered I wouldn't give it to them. They failed to metion, the two spots that they heavily promote, are in fact only leased, and not owned. The lease payment for 2 spots after 5 years will be at least another $200 per/mo. on top of mortgage payment, and maintenance fees. If your lucky enough to own at least one spot, which the majority of people don't beacuse they were selling around 27k, there's still is a monthly parking maintenance fee you'll have to pay along with your condo maintenance fees.

No way around making 3 total monthly payments.

It makes you wonder, why don't they make any mention of parking fees on there website, when they show you chart on how much money you can save living there?

They disclosed to us that the two spots were leased, and not indefinitely (5 years sounds about right). Did you read your contract?

[KzooKing]

They disclosed to us that the two spots were leased, and not indefinitely (5 years sounds about right). Did you read your contract?

Never got that far Dad. I ran when I figured out the "parking money maker". My point is, why are parking maintenance fees and parking lease payments not on their so called "savings" chart? Why do numerous people with money down just like the poster aboves relatives, not fully understand this, and why wasn't this explained before they asked for my down payment? It makes you wonder.... how many depositors aren't fully aware of parking situation?

[GRDadof3]

Never got that far Dad. I ran when I figured out the "parking money maker". My point is, why are parking maintenance fees and parking lease payments not on their so called "savings" chart? Why do numerous people with money down just like the poster aboves relatives, not fully understand this, and why wasn't this explained before they asked for my down payment? It makes you wonder.... how many depositors aren't fully aware of parking situation?

Don't really care. If I were a realtor or was going to buy there, I'd want to know what was on the contract. Marketing sheets aren't all that reliable.

[KzooKing]

http://www.dean-team.com/blogs/deans_team/...r-new-home.aspx

[fotoman311]

http://www.dean-team.com/blogs/deans_team/...r-new-home.aspx

I'm not sure that the condo market in Chicago is a very good comparison to the condo market here. Of course, I don't know if that's the point you are trying to make, because you just posted a link and nothing explaining your link. Yes, it certainly is a tough market for condos (or any real estate, really). But, you seem to have some sort of grudge against River House which you have not fully explained. Is it just the parking thing?

[GRDadof3]

http://www.dean-team.com/blogs/deans_team/...r-new-home.aspx

As fotoman mentioned, posting of just a link to another site with no discussion goes against our TOS here. Consider this your first warning. If you want to have a general discussion about the state of the financial and mortgage markets, take it to the main Coffee House

[smilesgr]

I am a little surprised by how upset 'kzoo' is about this whole project. Must have had a real bad time there. In my experiences with Riverhouse, I have had very few problems. They were very up front with the contracts, and nothing was hidden, including parking. Only complaint: people just wish the whole project would have gotten off the ground a little earlier.

As far parking "maintenance fees" go, that is only applicable to certain people with certain spots, and that was a part of their contract. I'm am pretty sure any new buyers at this point would not be a part of that. The rest of the people will have to begin leasing after 5 years, but that was also clear. Ask people in Chicago how many of them got free parking at condos for five years. I think you will find just about zero.

There was also a comment about high association dues, but I know that if you compare to association dues elsewhere (even within GR), you will find them similar or lower. We all know that buying a house doesn't require dues, and that is appealing to everyone. But hey, some of us don't like painting, mowing, cleaning, shoveling, etc. with our time off, wherever we may be in our lives. Or separately paying for those things, along with water and trash.

Not trying to sound irritated, but this person's fury needed to be responded to.

For those interested, move ins start the week of November 3.

[DwntwnGeo]

I agree smilesgr, everything was explained up front to me during my process with River House. I have been very happy with them and the result. I am looking forward to moving in a few weeks

[KzooKing]

I am a little surprised by how upset 'kzoo' is about this whole project. Must have had a real bad time there. In my experiences with Riverhouse, I have had very few problems. They were very up front with the contracts, and nothing was hidden, including parking. Only complaint: people just wish the whole project would have gotten off the ground a little earlier.

As far parking "maintenance fees" go, that is only applicable to certain people with certain spots, and that was a part of their contract. I'm am pretty sure any new buyers at this point would not be a part of that. The rest of the people will have to begin leasing after 5 years, but that was also clear. Ask people in Chicago how many of them got free parking at condos for five years. I think you will find just about zero.

There was also a comment about high association dues, but I know that if you compare to association dues elsewhere (even within GR), you will find them similar or lower. We all know that buying a house doesn't require dues, and that is appealing to everyone. But hey, some of us don't like painting, mowing, cleaning, shoveling, etc. with our time off, wherever we may be in our lives. Or separately paying for those things, along with water and trash.

Not trying to sound irritated, but this person's fury needed to be responded to.

For those interested, move ins start the week of November 3.

I appreciate your input, but the facts still remain the same. For those with mortgages, 3 monthly payments will be required:

1. parking lease payments, or parking maintenance payment

2. mortgage payment

3. condo maintenance fee

Again, why isn't parking payments stated on RH website savings chart? Hmmmm......

As far a Chicago condos, please check your facts, most of them come with owned spots, such as; new Trump, and the Ralpheal hotel condo conversion. Didn't Icon come with spot?

When you add parking payments, and condo maintenance dues, are RH maintenance dues really that low in comparison?

[GRDadof3]

I appreciate your input, but the facts still remain the same. For those with mortgages, 3 monthly payments will be required:

1. parking lease payments, or parking maintenance payment

2. mortgage payment

3. condo maintenance fee

Again, why isn't parking payments stated on RH website savings chart? Hmmmm......

As far a Chicago condos, please check your facts, most of them come with owned spots, such as; new Trump, and the Ralpheal hotel condo conversion. Didn't Icon come with spot?

When you add parking payments, and condo maintenance dues, are RH maintenance dues really that low in comparison?

No, most Chicago condos do not come with parking. $20,000+ per space. Icon came with one spot, period. No opportunity to get a second. Personally I'd rather pay for an extra spot in a parking ramp than have to pay to park outside in the elements.

[KzooKing]

No, most Chicago condos do not come with parking. $20,000+ per space. Icon came with one spot, period. No opportunity to get a second. Personally I'd rather pay for an extra spot in a parking ramp than have to pay to park outside in the elements.

Either Parking is built into condo price, or you pay extra for it, what's the difference? Personally, I'd still rather have 1 owned spot, than 2 leased spots, STARTING at $200 per/mo. I must say, I'm enjoying this lil debate.

[GRDadof3]

Either Parking is built into condo price, or you pay extra for it, what's the difference? Personally, I'd still rather have 1 owned spot, than 2 leased spots, STARTING at $200 per/mo. I must say, I'm enjoying this lil debate.

Was that per space, or for two? Either way, $200/month x 12 months = $2400/year. You'd have to live there ten years before you'd come close to paying what you'd pay to own that parking space. The cost to build one parking ramp space is minimum $20,000, and usually a lot more.

You might not mind the idea of having one indoor space and one outdoor, but a lot of people didn't like that feature at Icon (apparently). Do couples flip a coin to see who gets to go out and scrape their car in the winter every morning?

[smilesgr]

Was that per space, or for two? Either way, $200/month x 12 months = $2400/year. You'd have to live there ten years before you'd come close to paying what you'd pay to own that parking space. The cost to build one parking ramp space is minimum $20,000, and usually a lot more.

You might not mind the idea of having one indoor space and one outdoor, but a lot of people didn't like that feature at Icon (apparently). Do couples flip a coin to see who gets to go out and scrape their car in the winter every morning?

It is less than $100 per space, and that doesn't start until after year five.

[KzooKing]

It is less than $100 per space, and that doesn't start until after year five.

Less than $100 per space, might be STARTING price, but as you may know, overtime, lease payments rise like maintenance fees. What happens when your paying $150, or $200 per spot? In response to Dad's comment about weathering the conditions, I must say Dad, you make it sound as if were in North Pole. I live downtown, park outside, and it's not that bad. I thought the whole pitch to living downtown, was everythings within walking distance. Seems like 2 cars isn't needed. I'd rather own at least one space, saving over $2400 a year, in time. $20,000 is not a bad price, when considering, resale benefit, and comfort of knowing lease won't rise. Parking lease payments are no tax right off like owning a space, including it in your mortgage, and deducting interest. smilegr, your tone is all to familiar, you remind me of my neighbor -C

Good luck on your closing, if you can't sell before.

[GRDadof3]

Less than $100 per space, might be STARTING price, but as you may know, overtime, lease payments rise like maintenance fees. What happens when your paying $150, or $200 per spot? In response to Dad's comment about weathering the conditions, I must say Dad, you make it sound as if were in North Pole. I live downtown, park outside, and it's not that bad. I thought the whole pitch to living downtown, was everythings within walking distance. Seems like 2 cars isn't needed. I'd rather own at least one space, saving over $2400 a year, in time. $20,000 is not a bad price, when considering, resale benefit, and comfort of knowing lease won't rise. Parking lease payments are no tax right off like owning a space, including it in your mortgage, and deducting interest. smilegr, your tone is all to familiar, you remind me of my neighbor -C

Good luck on your closing, if you can't sell before.

The problem with the theory of "living downtown and being close enough to walk to everything" doesn't line up with reality, unfortunately. Grocery shopping? Have to leave downtown. Movies? Same. Clothes shopping? You get the picture. And not everyone works downtown, so they need to drive for work. Grand Rapids is not to the point for most people where they feel they can live without a car.

This is from direct feedback I have gotten from people who have looked at living downtown.

[KzooKing]

The problem with the theory of "living downtown and being close enough to walk to everything" doesn't line up with reality, unfortunately. Grocery shopping? Have to leave downtown. Movies? Same. Clothes shopping? You get the picture. And not everyone works downtown, so they need to drive for work. Grand Rapids is not to the point for most people where they feel they can live without a car.

This is from direct feedback I have gotten from people who have looked at living downtown.

I couldn't agree more.

[jas49503]

Less than $100 per space, might be STARTING price, but as you may know, overtime, lease payments rise like maintenance fees. What happens when your paying $150, or $200 per spot? In response to Dad's comment about weathering the conditions, I must say Dad, you make it sound as if were in North Pole. I live downtown, park outside, and it's not that bad. I thought the whole pitch to living downtown, was everythings within walking distance. Seems like 2 cars isn't needed. I'd rather own at least one space, saving over $2400 a year, in time. $20,000 is not a bad price, when considering, resale benefit, and comfort of knowing lease won't rise. Parking lease payments are no tax right off like owning a space, including it in your mortgage, and deducting interest. smilegr, your tone is all to familiar, you remind me of my neighbor -C

Good luck on your closing, if you can't sell before.

my dad used to have a condo in downtown chicago where he had to buy a parking spot for 25k. he still had to pay a monthly fee, something like a condo association fee. I think it was only like 30 dollars per month but over time that could rise also, the main difference is that you are stuck with it and you hope that you will be able to find someone who wants to buy it.

[KzooKing]

my dad used to have a condo in downtown chicago where he had to buy a parking spot for 25k. he still had to pay a monthly fee, something like a condo association fee. I think it was only like 30 dollars per month but over time that could rise also, the main difference is that you are stuck with it and you hope that you will be able to find someone who wants to buy it.

That's why, when you sell condo, you include spot. In most cases, places with owned spot, sell first, and sell for more. Example: Monroe Terrace. Big resale positives to owned spot. Agree, parking maintenance fees will rise overtime, but in no way, is comparable to lease increase. If owned parking is less sought after, like all of you portray in your replies, then why are all RH spots sold?

[jas49503]

. Big resale positives to owned spot.

unless you are the guy at the fitzgerald who bought 6 spots. there aren't many people who are going to need that many especially at 25k per spot (I'm guessing on the price) I would agree with you though that nobody spending several hundred thousand dollars is going to want to worry about where they are going to park thier car and would like to have at least a couple of spots included with the condo.

[GRDadof3]

That's why, when you sell condo, you include spot. In most cases, places with owned spot, sell first, and sell for more. Example: Monroe Terrace. Big resale positives to owned spot. Agree, parking maintenance fees will rise overtime, but in no way, is comparable to lease increase. If owned parking is less sought after, like all of you portray in your replies, then why are all RH spots sold?

I don't think anyone is saying an owned spot is less desirable than a leased spot. I don't even think that was an option at River House, because they had to work out a deal with the current Bridgewater owners. I remember hearing that River House was very close to not being built because of the parking situation. The new tower includes some parking spaces in the back of the lower floors, but many of the spots are coming from the current Bridgewater parking ramp. My guess is Bridgewater did not want to sell the parking spots, and instead agreed to a lease program.

My contention is that 2 leased covered parking spaces is more desirable than 1 owned parking space at other competing developments. If you know of a downtown condo project that comes with two (at least covered) parking spaces included or available to purchase, please post what project that is. Maybe Union Square of Boardwalk?

[Gorath]

Each condo at the Fitzgerald comes with one assigned covered parking space. Extra spaces are available for purchase. (The extra spaces could be all sold out now, I don't know). In addition some spaces can have a stacker added to them at extra cost if there is enough overhead room to turn one space into two.

An auto stacker would be something like this; http://www.asedeals.com/free_standing_storage_lifts.html

[InSecurity]

Less than $100 per space, might be STARTING price, but as you may know, overtime, lease payments rise like maintenance fees. What happens when your paying $150, or $200 per spot? In response to Dad's comment about weathering the conditions, I must say Dad, you make it sound as if were in North Pole. I live downtown, park outside, and it's not that bad. I thought the whole pitch to living downtown, was everythings within walking distance. Seems like 2 cars isn't needed. I'd rather own at least one space, saving over $2400 a year, in time. $20,000 is not a bad price, when considering, resale benefit, and comfort of knowing lease won't rise. Parking lease payments are no tax right off like owning a space, including it in your mortgage, and deducting interest. smilegr, your tone is all to familiar, you remind me of my neighbor -C

Good luck on your closing, if you can't sell before.

The condo docs that everyone received when they did their purchase agreement spells out how the parking costs per spot will be decided for the next 100 years. The exact amount per spot in the Bridgewater ramp is $112.61 in year 15. After that it is based on a formula using the CPI, 3% increase, and the average monthly cost of a parking spot in GR, per year.

And again the first 5 yrs (begining when the first unit is closed on) there is no cost to the unit owners for parking.

[KzooKing]

The condo docs that everyone received when they did their purchase agreement spells out how the parking costs per spot will be decided for the next 100 years. The exact amount per spot in the Bridgewater ramp is $112.61 in year 15. After that it is based on a formula using the CPI, 3% increase, and the average monthly cost of a parking spot in GR, per year.

And again the first 5 yrs (begining when the first unit is closed on) there is no cost to the unit owners for parking.

edited

[GRDadof3]

edited

KzooKing, this forum is not your own personal "better business bureau."

[KzooKing]

KzooKing, this forum is not your own personal "better business bureau."

Sorry Dad, I thought, asking why monthly parking costs are not shown on RH "savings" website chart, was an appropriate question.