Norfolk Development

[vdogg]

Excerpt from norfolk website giving an overview of willoughby projects

A community that once was known for its rickety roller coaster and wooden fishing pier has been transformed into the

[Seven Cities]

Good idea willy. I think that oduguy on SSC did that at one point with the first or second picture.

I like the vantage point of those pictures. There is no trouble seeing where Granby Tower, Harbor Heights, Trader, and Hilton will be. On a side note, I've have always wanted to live in Harbor Tower in Portsmouth just for the view of DT Norfolk.

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Here are a few of mine to add to the fray if anyone wants to give it a go.

At least Trader (and Hilton) will somewhat fill in the gap between 150 W. Main and the Marriott. I wonder how much (if any) of Trader will be visible from here once the Hilton goes up. 35-40 story tower behind RBC Centura

Possible courts complex and DT Plaza buildings on the far right side of the picture (even thought the cranes somewhat obstruct the view). 35-40 story tower between City Hall and RBC Centura. And its possible Trader MAY be visible behind Main Street Tower. Its kind of hard to determine from this angle.

[rusthebuss]

I hope we get more business here. I want so much for this area to become a major urban name in the nation. I don't know if it will happen though

[urbanfan]

That picture of the silhoutte of buildings against the sun is awesome. Really shows the density of the main street area well. From that angle I believe that the Hilton and Trader building will fill the gap between the dense main street area and 150 w. main.

[willy]

Here's a few more that could be used.

[rusthebuss]

our downtown looks so small compared to cities that are so much smaller than us. I hope all of this development increases our skyline.

[urbanfan]

our downtown looks so small compared to cities that are so much smaller than us. I hope all of this development increases our skyline.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes it does. Remember though that almost all of the towers that you see right now are a product of norfolk tearing down old delapidated buildings and working on putting new towers in place. The majority of this work has happened in the last twenty years before the building boom hit downtown. (Not to mention at times where building loan interest rates were at all time highs.) Imagine in another twenty years what downtown will look like. Norfolk is starting to experience a snowball effect for their redevelopment efforts. I would venture to say that in another twenty years based on the past twenty years and the building boom that has hit, norfolks skyline will be three times the size that it is now. (thats probably conservative.) B)

[rusthebuss]

I hope you are right. Lets see what big business comes here. That is the key to our skyline.

[Seven Cities]

I would venture to say that in another twenty years based on the past twenty years and the building boom that has hit, norfolks skyline will be three times the size that it is now. (thats probably conservative.) B)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

With all of the development taking place, there is no doubt Norfolk will have a pretty good mid-major skyline in the years to come. DT Norfolk has the density, it just lacks height. That will soon be taken care of. Look at the the projects, proposals and rumors of significant height:

Trader

Harbor Heights

Hilton

Granby Tower

City Hall/St. Pauls lot

Courts Complex

DT Plaza redevelopment

And there will probably be more proposals on the table down the road once developers realize DT Norfolk's great potential.

Just think: a growing main CBD skyline, a new midtown skyline, and a possible small (uptown?) skyline in Atlantic City.

[rusthebuss]

Still i want to here a company moving its hq here and i won't be so skeptical, most of this is residential and hotels. Hotels you need businesses coming here to really make it work. Trader is great but its not that big of a company

[vdogg]

Still i want to here a company moving its hq here and i won't be so skeptical, most of this is residential and hotels. Hotels you need businesses coming here to really make it work. Trader is great but its not that big of a company

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The new cruise terminal will take care of the hotel business quite nicely , may even cause a few new ones to come to the table. B)

[rusthebuss]

I know but don't you agree about this area trying to become more marketable for these companies. I don't think the cities around here are pursuing any companies hard enough

[wrldcoupe4]

I know but don't you agree about this area trying to become more marketable for these companies. I don't think the cities around here are pursuing any companies hard enough

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just to let you know, just because a headquarters is in a city does not always equal substantial job growth or mighty towers. Some headquarters are very small...when CSX was based in richmond, its headquarters had maybe 100 people at the absolute maximum. On the other side, capital one is not based in richmond, but it is the base of much of its employment...almost 10,000 employees. It would almost be better to snatch the bulk of a companies operations than it would be to have a headquarters.

[rusthebuss]

Hq means that the money is hear, which means the higher paying jobs are here. It gives the area more of a national recognition. It brings higher end things to the area. We are a big area without few big boys in the seat of area. We have plenty of jobs, alot of companies out of Richmond come down here to work because of the abundant amount.

[urbanfan]

Hq means that the money is hear, which means the higher paying jobs are here. It gives the area more of a national recognition. It brings higher end things to the area. We are a big area without few big boys in the seat of area. We have plenty of jobs, alot of companies out of Richmond come down here to work because of the abundant amount.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

HQ are nice and they would bring more towers and buildings to Norfolk's Skyline. They however would never change the fact that we are an industrial City. If the Newport News Shipyard went away. This area will fall flat on its face. If the Ports in norfolk and portsmouth went away this area would be devestated. No amount of Headquarters can change that statistic. However, yes new headquarters here would be an added boost to the economy and the skyline.

[vdogg]

HQ are nice and they would bring more towers and buildings to Norfolk's Skyline.  They however would never change the fact that we are an industrial City.  If the Newport News Shipyard went away.  This area will fall flat on its face.  If the Ports in norfolk and portsmouth went away this area would be devestated.  No amount of Headquarters can change that statistic.  However, yes new headquarters here would be an added boost to the economy and the skyline.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We can change that however by making a concious effort to shift our work force from industrial to commercial based. Education is a big key in that as well as providing economic incentives to companies and to students who choose a curriculum that is more likely to benefit said companies and make this area more attractive to them. Business and technology related professional degrees is a must. We have a very heavy reliance on trade schools in this area, which benefits this area in their own right, but its not gonna attract the big dogs as far as the commercial area is concerned.

[rusthebuss]

i agree, i think we need a comlete balance of industrial and commercial business in the area and education and becoming marketable is the major key.

[krdarden]

i agree, i think we need a comlete balance of industrial and commercial business in the area and education and becoming marketable is the major key.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would target as many transportation and automotive companies to relocate here!

I would love to see us steal some of the business from Detriot, namely Ford and others like them! I think that governor Warner is the best hope we have in Richmond in quite some time and is pro active unlike the previous two Republican govenors!

[lammius]

I think that governor Warner is the best hope we have in Richmond in quite some time and is pro active unlike the previous two Republican govenors!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree. It's probably too early yet but what does the race between Kilgore and Kaine look like?

[rusthebuss]

I don't think Warner is any good

[vdogg]

I don't think Warner is any good

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll only make one comment because i really don't want the development thread to turn into a political one, however i think Warner made some really tough choices about the budget and did so knowing full well the politcal heat he was going to take from the electorate. Things got really bad for a while (remember all the DMV's closing), but he has managed to turn our defecit into a surplus and i have to admire that. I like my politicians to be good businessmen because, in the end, running a state is running a business.

[krdarden]

I'll only make one comment because i really don't want the development thread to turn into a political one, however i think Warner made some really tough choices about the budget and did so knowing full well the politcal heat he was going to take from the electorate. Things got really bad for a while (remember all the DMV's closing), but he has managed to turn our defecit into a surplus and i have to admire that. I like my politicians to be good businessmen because, in the end, running a state is running a business.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with Vdogg on the political comment; however, the govenor did announce more money toward the research similation facility in Suffolk and this does have an impact on our region, especially with the number of high paying jobs that has resulted from having them in the region!

[Glassoul]

Hi guys and gals,

This is my first post here (and it

[ace707]

[ace707]

Very good first post! You know basically everything you have said on all three topics is basically either my position too or knowledge that I am also aware of. In many of my posts where I talk about issues, I like to talk on a more realistic level rather than on either forceful type of rant that is based more on wishful thinking and I also avoid putting false info that reverts to forceful information that is more based on wishful thinking or desire.

On the topic of the airport, that plan has obviously been around for awhile and unfortunately more people would like to claim otherwise. But just like I posted before on the airport, the airport has more capacity still available before the addition of concourse C is ever seriously considered to be built and the third runway to be built parallel to the current large one will also not be rushed and not even considered to be constructed unless it's entirely necessary. I'm glad to see someone also have that knowledge. While I never took the point too seriously until now, I'm glad you pointed out the not-so-true reason that the airport will move because of crashes in the city. There is a reason why the airport is located near the bay and that the main runway makes flights decend (sp?) and accend over the bay or mostly over the river when landing or taking off from the southwestern end. I also totally agree with you on how it doesn't seem a very good idea to move the airport west. I basically said the same reasons when I became vocal on the issue on my last post about the airport.

On high-paying jobs and Fortune 500 company's to that end I practically ditto with you too. I like how you go into depth about how difficult and even unlikely it is to make high-paying businesses much less trying to make Fortune 500 company's base headquarters in our downtown. It's a great idea but the idea is such a long-shot to even take the topic of making more Fortune 500 company's move HQ's here as a serious and considerable conversation topic. Even though they aren't a Fortune 500 company, Trader's new tower was still a big enough business move to be a story in USA Today. It's because Trader's payroll of an average $45,000, expected emplyoee spending of $7 million a year in downtown, and the expected tax revenue of tens of millions of dollars that makes Trader just as big of an economic annoucement as any Fortune 500 company would. What a city's economy gets in return is more important that "name-brand" that a Fortune 500 has. Sure they could get a lot of money into the economy, but you may have to lose a lot first for a few decades before you see any real good returns. I was the one you were referring to in concern about biotech. I know EVMS has a lot of problems but my main reason for suggesting it was just to be an example of really what is hot in terms of growing industries. It's obviously not the only hot industry right now, but if things were more productive and efficient and properly executed, it would be one of the industries we could capitalize on.

I see what you are saying about overall downsides about pro teams but my position for sports teams are different. While most may want it because of economic spinoffs, I want it for quality of life reasons. I know pro sports in general are not doing so hot, all with declining attendances, declining ratings, dwindling support and increasingly bad images/reputations, but I'm for it for better quality of life, to have that entertainment option.

WHOO that was a lot!

I wanna add that I did see talk about the Hilton and it sure looks like we'll be getting some form of an announcement this month with hopefully more than just a few details. I like how I posted a month ago saying that expect Hilton info in April and here we are on the first day of the month and we are already starting to get bits and pieces on it! I'm happy that I made an educated guess/prediction that might turn out to be correct lol Also the courts complex... I spoke on the cost of nearly $85 million when I mentioned it before. I believe I was the one to first post the cost but I think it's ridiculously expensive! The city must have one hell of a Courts Tower coming up to be that much. At this rate, it looks like it may be more expensive than the Federal Court expansion but then again maybe not,... time will soon tell...