Metro Orlando Airport News

[aent]

On 1/17/2024 at 9:40 AM, shardoon said:

Will also be interesting to see if Frontier makes a renewed bud and if the federal govt allows that to go through since every one of the arguments cited by the judge would once again apply.

I thought a big reason Frontier's original bid failed was because of this very concern, and the JetBlue deal was thought to be able to get through this process without issue. Little did I know, you're right, reeks of government corruption. I was looking forward to Spirit flights getting a little nicer, Frontier has gotten way worse since their failed merger attempt.

[shardoon]

5 hours ago, aent said:

I thought a big reason Frontier's original bid failed was because of this very concern, and the JetBlue deal was thought to be able to get through this process without issue. Little did I know, you're right, reeks of government corruption. I was looking forward to Spirit flights getting a little nicer, Frontier has gotten way worse since their failed merger attempt.

Exactly, so the larger airlines get a pass and can merge away on a much larger scale because they already charge high prices?

[shardoon]

Gotta call out OIA here again.  So their solution to packed parking is offering a program to reserve a spot in advance at a price gauging rate of $32 a day. Are they insane? They already just raised parking rates across the board. They opened surface lots, which were a drop in the bucket and still a walk away. 

Why is it so hard for them to pull the trigger and build out parking garage C? It will pay for itself immedietely. I remember back in the day it Detroit, before the north terminal was rebuilt, they built out the humongous parking garage that was grossly oversized for the gates and traffic at the north terminal. They did this cause they needed parking for the huge McNamara terminal on the southern end that was just built. The garage next to the McNamara terminal just couldn't handle the traffic. They did it right. 

All this is gonna do is take away more parking spaces for people that were already getting price gauged. Now there will be even less spaces available when they close off level 4 of garage C for this BS venture. If successful, they are gonna do it at parking garage A and B. That's NUTS. It so hard to find a spot as it is. 

I get it, capitalism means trying to make as much profit as possible. This is a way for them to raise prices to $32 a day without admitting that they did. Problem is, publicly funded, owned, and subsidized entities should not be allowed to act like fully independent private companies. 

https://www.orlandoairports.net/press/2024/01/22/orlando-international-offers-reserved-parking-to-passengers/

Edited January 23 by shardoon

[FLClarkKent]

25 minutes ago, shardoon said:

Gotta call out OIA here again.  So their solution to packed parking is offering a program to reserve a spot in advance at a proce gauging rate of $32 a day. Are they insane? They already just raised parking rates across the board. They opened surface lots, which were a drop in the bucket and still a walk away. 

$32 is surprisingly steep. Was at Logan in Boston recently. Their garage rate was crazy high ($60 or so for first day, steps down a bit for each subsequent day).  But you can reserve in advance for only $25 per day.

(They also have this weird thing called “mass transit” where you can get to the airport by subway, bus, and ferry. No parking required. What’ll they think of next!)

[shardoon]

3 hours ago, FLClarkKent said:

$32 is surprisingly steep. Was at Logan in Boston recently. Their garage rate was crazy high ($60 or so for first day, steps down a bit for each subsequent day).  But you can reserve in advance for only $25 per day.

(They also have this weird thing called “mass transit” where you can get to the airport by subway, bus, and ferry. No parking required. What’ll they think of next!)

When Brightline or Sunrail has a stop close to my house, I will be more than happy to take the train to the airport. As of now, an uber or taxi is $75 each way, which may be good for a long trip, but not for a short trip. I do like using Fast Park and relax for long trips, they are great along with the AAA discount. However, I occasionally do have to take short 2-3 day trips where I arrive home late at night and would rather just walk to my car. 

[jrs2]

4 hours ago, FLClarkKent said:

$32 is surprisingly steep. Was at Logan in Boston recently. Their garage rate was crazy high ($60 or so for first day, steps down a bit for each subsequent day).  But you can reserve in advance for only $25 per day.

(They also have this weird thing called “mass transit” where you can get to the airport by subway, bus, and ferry. No parking required. What’ll they think of next!)

I wonder if Mears has had any pull in, or, put in effort in, delaying that Sunrail connection to MCO...

[codypet]

21 hours ago, jrs2 said:

I wonder if Mears has had any pull in, or, put in effort in, delaying that Sunrail connection to MCO...

They did about 10 years back.  As did Rosen. I don't know if they do anymore.

Edited January 24 by codypet

[jrs2]

3 hours ago, codypet said:

They did about 10 years back.  As did Rosen. I don't know if they do anymore.

Mears is like Baltar in the ear of the President of the Colonies in  discouraging him from authorizing Adama to launch Vipers; Mears is also like Senator Palpatine in the ear of Queen Amidala of Naboo in influencing her to call for a vote of no confidence in Chancellor Valorum.

Mears is like...'hey FDOT...you'll have better luck getting the funding if the airport link is part of Sunshine Corridor than if it is its own project.  I wouldn't be surprised if they also influenced that committee from missing that deadline in 2023 that we posted about...  And I wouldn't be surprise if they had the ear of OUC in the $$$ that they demanded for use of that easement...

[codypet]

That's disheartening to hear.  I was hoping their grip loosened as they started to suffer the impacts of Uber/Lime.

[shardoon]

Final 2023 stats are in. Unfortunately, fell short of 58 million.  However, did add 7.5 million more passengers over the record breaking 2022 year, which is quite impressive. Should break 60 million this year, which was unfathomable even pre covid, and certainly during any near term recovery projections during the covid shutdowns.  

Final 2023 total: 57,735,726 passengers. 

Officially 15.1% increase over the prior year.

December 2023 performance 12.85% increase over December 2022. 

 

Comparisons for airports that were ahead of Orlando in 2022.

Las Vegas, not released yet. 

Miami, not released yet, but should be comfortably ahead of them. 

JFK not released.

Madrid 60.220.984

Ne Delhi, seeing prelim numbers at 65 million

Amsterdam 61,889,586

 

Based off of all of this, even though Orlando had a record breaking year........so did everyone else. I think when all is said and done, we remain top 20, but stay between 15-20, mainly because of everyone else getting busier, and China coming back online. 

 

 

 

 

[dcluley98]

They are building an entirely new garage/CONRAC for Terminal C/Intermodal. 

[CFL Rez]

GOAA is studying several things. Decisions should be made on what to tackle, in what order later this year.

1) a parking survey to deduce need and amount of need (how many more spaces and what kind of spaces - short term vs long term, premium vs economy) and a price comparison to comparable airports.

2) A CONRAC (combined remote rental car facility).  The CONRAC will free up public parking  space in all garages. The study will analyze size and location of future CONRAC. Several location are being studied.

3) traffic management and roadway  congestion study. To address roadway backups at the approach to arrival and departure curbs.

4) North Terminal modernization, including redevelopment of TSA Checkpoints and Concession master planning (think what DEN just did). Possibly relocate Checkpoints to alleviate backups and put more Concessions post security.

5) modernization/expansion of Airsides 1, 2, 3 and 4. (Primarily 1 & 3 first).

6) expansion of Terminal C (Phase 2). Studying includes timing and size (only 12 or full 22 gates).

7) airline reshuffle to better utilize facilities. Part of this was on hold pending the jetBlue/Spirit merger, but I think now will move ahead. Several International airlines should relocate to Terminal C this Spring with others "reshuffling" some time after.

 

There is a lot in the study phase. GOAA should have started some of this 5 or 6 years ago. I think the push back they got when they initially attempted to start Terminal  C back in 2015,(they've since changed their operating practice to avoid this) and then the pandemic made them gun shy. Now they have to play catch up with a regional economy that is out pacing them. They won't be able to tackle everything all at once, hence the studies to aide in prioritization. They'll move forward with some of these soon, nut of course it will be several years before any of these projects are complete and in operation. 

Orlando International Airport is owned and operated by GOAA through Florida State statute. It is quasi government. (Neither fully publicly owned, nor fully privately owned) GOAA is an independent Authority self governed by a Board. GOAA is self funded and takes no public funding outside of government grants for construction (federal and state) funded by user fees.

 

[dcluley98]

I also heard a Lynx/Bus main station to connect with Intermodal/APM for the whole facility. 

Any smoke on that @CFL Rez?

[jrs2]

14 hours ago, CFL Rez said:

GOAA is studying several things. Decisions should be made on what to tackle, in what order later this year.

1) a parking survey to deduce need and amount of need (how many more spaces and what kind of spaces - short term vs long term, premium vs economy) and a price comparison to comparable airports.

2) A CONRAC (combined remote rental car facility).  The CONRAC will free up public parking  space in all garages. The study will analyze size and location of future CONRAC. Several location are being studied.

3) traffic management and roadway  congestion study. To address roadway backups at the approach to arrival and departure curbs.

4) North Terminal modernization, including redevelopment of TSA Checkpoints and Concession master planning (think what DEN just did). Possibly relocate Checkpoints to alleviate backups and put more Concessions post security.

5) modernization/expansion of Airsides 1, 2, 3 and 4. (Primarily 1 & 3 first).

6) expansion of Terminal C (Phase 2). Studying includes timing and size (only 12 or full 22 gates).

7) airline reshuffle to better utilize facilities. Part of this was on hold pending the jetBlue/Spirit merger, but I think now will move ahead. Several International airlines should relocate to Terminal C this Spring with others "reshuffling" some time after.

 

There is a lot in the study phase. GOAA should have started some of this 5 or 6 years ago. I think the push back they got when they initially attempted to start Terminal  C back in 2015,(they've since changed their operating practice to avoid this) and then the pandemic made them gun shy. Now they have to play catch up with a regional economy that is out pacing them. They won't be able to tackle everything all at once, hence the studies to aide in prioritization. They'll move forward with some of these soon, nut of course it will be several years before any of these projects are complete and in operation. 

Orlando International Airport is owned and operated by GOAA through Florida State statute. It is quasi government. (Neither fully publicly owned, nor fully privately owned) GOAA is an independent Authority self governed by a Board. GOAA is self funded and takes no public funding outside of government grants for construction (federal and state) funded by user fees.

 

the car rental facility as a stand alone structure seems to be a consensus design among a lot of airports; O'Hare, MIA, TPA, and SFO, to name a few.  I always thought MCO had a superior design with the car rental desks on Level 1, both A & B sides.  But it seems like GOAA is trying to decentralize MCO with landsides/airsides and now the car rental facility.

As for parking costs (in garages), I am less interested in the daily cost as I am with the notion of parking availability.  It is a real pain to have to hire a car to drive you to MCO because there is no parking, versus just parking in TTP and going down the elevator to Level 3.  I feel like those days are over.

 

[codypet]

14 hours ago, CFL Rez said:

GOAA is studying several things. Decisions should be made on what to tackle, in what order later this year.

1) a parking survey to deduce need and amount of need (how many more spaces and what kind of spaces - short term vs long term, premium vs economy) and a price comparison to comparable airports.

2) A CONRAC (combined remote rental car facility).  The CONRAC will free up public parking  space in all garages. The study will analyze size and location of future CONRAC. Several location are being studied.

3) traffic management and roadway  congestion study. To address roadway backups at the approach to arrival and departure curbs.

4) North Terminal modernization, including redevelopment of TSA Checkpoints and Concession master planning (think what DEN just did). Possibly relocate Checkpoints to alleviate backups and put more Concessions post security.

5) modernization/expansion of Airsides 1, 2, 3 and 4. (Primarily 1 & 3 first).

6) expansion of Terminal C (Phase 2). Studying includes timing and size (only 12 or full 22 gates).

7) airline reshuffle to better utilize facilities. Part of this was on hold pending the jetBlue/Spirit merger, but I think now will move ahead. Several International airlines should relocate to Terminal C this Spring with others "reshuffling" some time after.

 

There is a lot in the study phase. GOAA should have started some of this 5 or 6 years ago. I think the push back they got when they initially attempted to start Terminal  C back in 2015,(they've since changed their operating practice to avoid this) and then the pandemic made them gun shy. Now they have to play catch up with a regional economy that is out pacing them. They won't be able to tackle everything all at once, hence the studies to aide in prioritization. They'll move forward with some of these soon, nut of course it will be several years before any of these projects are complete and in operation. 

Orlando International Airport is owned and operated by GOAA through Florida State statute. It is quasi government. (Neither fully publicly owned, nor fully privately owned) GOAA is an independent Authority self governed by a Board. GOAA is self funded and takes no public funding outside of government grants for construction (federal and state) funded by user fees.

 

1 & 3 First?  Didn't they get updated the most recently too?  I know 2 really hasn't seen anything past updates to the food court in since it opened.  That said, it's still the nicest looking of the North Terminal Airsides.

3 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

I also heard a Lynx/Bus main station to connect with Intermodal/APM for the whole facility. 

Any smoke on that @CFL Rez?

I heard that's on the table.

14 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

the car rental facility as a stand alone structure seems to be a consensus design among a lot of airports; O'Hare, MIA, TPA, and SFO, to name a few.  I always thought MCO had a superior design with the car rental desks on Level 1, both A & B sides.  But it seems like GOAA is trying to decentralize MCO with landsides/airsides and now the car rental facility.

As for parking costs (in garages), I am less interested in the daily cost as I am with the notion of parking availability.  It is a real pain to have to hire a car to drive you to MCO because there is no parking, versus just parking in TTP and going down the elevator to Level 3.  I feel like those days are over.

 

This was the first trip I've had where FastPark and Relax just said to me, there's not hope in getting to Terminal A and we're gonna drop you off in Terminal B and you'll have to walk across because backups were so bad.

Remember when all the rental car companies were just on 436?  Surprised if we don't end up with an on property version of that.

[jrs2]

12 minutes ago, codypet said:

1 & 3 First?  Didn't they get updated the most recently too?  I know 2 really hasn't seen anything past updates to the food court in since it opened.  That said, it's still the nicest looking of the North Terminal Airsides.

I heard that's on the table.

This was the first trip I've had where FastPark and Relax just said to me, there's not hope in getting to Terminal A and we're gonna drop you off in Terminal B and you'll have to walk across because backups were so bad.

Remember when all the rental car companies were just on 436?  Surprised if we don't end up with an on property version of that.

I swear it was like a switch was flicked... one minute, you could park in TTP on a Saturday, the next minute, you have a greater probability of double zero at the roulette wheel.

I don't think a Sunrail connection is gonna make a dent into the parking situation at the rate its going.  We're at 57.7M with a 15% growth rate which means we'll be well over 61M next year...  it's just amazing.  

They really need to get done with this current Terminal C phase and get more flights routed over to there.  It won't matter, though, because there isn't enough parking at C by a longshot...

...and BL is still making money, which is also amazing...

[jrs2]

https://news.yahoo.com/breeze-airways-now-flying-destination-165158420.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFUS13ICupY1AKr5HZK0I_-pq_9fpKQeDnX2AKnoZwLODiG45Q21kQ-fNvja8uXIXHbd2XQmwZ39CYDinl7cxgTcpPufaZ5Dg2e_3n6ya4onJ_Gonv34iaHHSjNqTQmGxeb9i1vmtyLArEt9AyR2n0ZrjpG5A2OxoXPNkwlqhpdV

new Breeze Airways route

[jrs2]

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2024/02/13/orlando-airport-loses-longtime-parking-place-over-3500-spots/

3,500 less spaces near MCO for parking...

[codypet]

13 hours ago, jrs2 said:

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2024/02/13/orlando-airport-loses-longtime-parking-place-over-3500-spots/

3,500 less spaces near MCO for parking...

Wow that headline is misleading.  I read the Sentinel article for this place.  I don't have a lot of sympathy for that particular spot because he plowed over wetlands to expand his parking a few years ago.  He complained this time around that he couldn't keep buying busses to get to Terminal C.   So the business model is unsustainable for him.  Its not the airports fault.   Meanwhile FastPark and Relax quietly annexed Payless Rent a car next door and expanded to the west.   They used to also us the current Sixt rent a car as overflow parking.

[jrs2]

2 hours ago, codypet said:

Wow that headline is misleading.  I read the Sentinel article for this place.  I don't have a lot of sympathy for that particular spot because he plowed over wetlands to expand his parking a few years ago.  He complained this time around that he couldn't keep buying busses to get to Terminal C.   So the business model is unsustainable for him.  Its not the airports fault.   Meanwhile FastPark and Relax quietly annexed Payless Rent a car next door and expanded to the west.   They used to also us the current Sixt rent a car as overflow parking.

I cannot find a construction photo of Terminal C.  I will literally have to drive there myself and risk life and limb to do a one handed snapshot of the new wing like I did last time...

[shardoon]

OIA cracked 58 million. 12 months rolling through January is 58,034,076. We should easily top 60 million this year. 

[shardoon]

So  Jetblue and Spirit formally ended heir merger.  Essentially the government said Spirit cannot merge with anyone in order to preserve their low fares. So the other option is bankruptcy, which kind of defeats the purpose.  Another option is if a legacy carrier decides to buy them, suddenly the Fed will be ok with this.  The legacy carriers have better lobbies. 

[codypet]

17 hours ago, shardoon said:

So  Jetblue and Spirit formally ended heir merger.  Essentially the government said Spirit cannot merge with anyone in order to preserve their low fares. So the other option is bankruptcy, which kind of defeats the purpose.  Another option is if a legacy carrier decides to buy them, suddenly the Fed will be ok with this.  The legacy carriers have better lobbies. 

Doesn't Jetblue owe Spirit a huge cash payout if the merger isn't approved?........Oh yea, $69 million.....nice

The government is really shooting everyone down aren't they?  I just saw them giving the Albertson's/Kroger merger a hard time.  Wonder if Winn Dixie/Aldi will have similar problems?

[shardoon]

10 minutes ago, codypet said:

Doesn't Jetblue owe Spirit a huge cash payout if the merger isn't approved?........Oh yea, $69 million.....nice

The government is really shooting everyone down aren't they?  I just saw them giving the Albertson's/Kroger merger a hard time.  Wonder if Winn Dixie/Aldi will have similar problems?

Sure, but this merger was small potatoes compared to the legacy mergers, but yet they were allowed through. Their reasoning was also sketchy..... specifically calling out that they like Spirit's low fares and do not want to see them go away...... like hello..... there is a reason they are teetering on bankruptcy. 

[codypet]

29 minutes ago, shardoon said:

Sure, but this merger was small potatoes compared to the legacy mergers, but yet they were allowed through. Their reasoning was also sketchy..... specifically calling out that they like Spirit's low fares and do not want to see them go away...... like hello..... there is a reason they are teetering on bankruptcy. 

True.  But when it comes to low fare airlines you still have Alaska, Allegiant, Frontier and Southwest.