Massive Riverfront Project

[allbusiness]

<snip> If it is just an entertainment venue, it may mean a few jobs, but nothing long-term or sustainable.

I agree. Didn't the whole idea of "entertainment" come up because a tv talking head asked if this project "might" involve entertainment, and the respondent said, "Yes, it might". When did that idea first hit the forum? Typical case of a reporter "steering" the questioning. I think it's a red herring. They would have received the same answer if they'd asked about energy or retail or...anything.

I think I'll just stick with my original theory: "I think what we have here is a world headquarters for an entirely new energy source which will radically change the way we all live."

Frankly, after all this hype, I'd be disappointed in anything less spectacular.

[torgo]

but it sounded more geared towards business development than entertainment.

I am also beginning to think this is the case, not an entertainment center. It makes more sense to me, and, while not as flashy or fun, it would certainly have a much greater long-term impact potential than a big mall that provides $8 a hour jobs. Maybe it could also even act as a boon for more development downtown: housing, hotels, retail.

[Sunlover38]

Why would it be Google...

Furthermore - whoever keeps mentioning this dark fibre thing has no clue.

. . . . . .no one has a clue right now . . just best guesses and wishful thinking . . . . no need to be insulting . . .

[grandmabetty78]

Just a little fun fact; The inventors / creators of Google were from East Lansing.....GO MSU....that could make a headquarters type project in GR...'appealing.' Hmmmmmm........

Such a little mystery we have on our hands, don't we:)

[Phizzy]

I find the "no students they want" a bit odd, considering 2 of the founders along with other high ups are UofM alums...

Yes, it is a strange comment, unless you have a belief that a company like Google only draws people from a 50 mile radius.

Distance from Grand Rapids to Big Ten universities:

• Michigan State - 61 miles

• Michigan - 109 miles

• Northwestern - 122 miles

• Purdue - 185 miles

• Wisconsin - 189 miles

• Illinois - 237 miles

• Ohio State - 247 miles

• Indiana - 266 miles

• Iowa - 314 miles

• Minnesota - 404 miles

• Penn State - 429 miles

And that is just Big Ten universities...

[jrwquattro]

Fresh off WOODTV.comis the following statement:

In a statement Tuesday, the firm Grubb & Ellis-Paramount said, "The aim and objective of the Grand Rapids development corporation is to provide citizens of Grand Rapids and its surrounding populations with the infrastructure that will create economic growth in the form of jobs, commerce and industry."

The statement goes on to say that "... this development will establish an increased tax base which will advance the social and economic well being of the city and State of Michigan."

As others have speculated, this development will probably fall into the realm of research and development or a new business venture on the front edge of technology.

Additionally if you look at the actions and words of people in the know you see trends and business decisions that indicate a few things:

- The development will be a sustainable business, incorperating "green" practices and more than likely be a LEED certified project.

- While housing may fall into part of the development, the main focus will be to bring good jobs to the area. Too many people in the know are overextending the downtown housing market way past capacity for the current needs of the region. These developers are operating on "hunches" .

- The housing being developed by developers under confidentiality agreements is not being built to target employees that will be filling $8/hr jobs at retail or entertainment.

This is BIG whatever the developer is proposing and by all indications will be great for everyone in the Grand Rapids area. By the indications given and the leaks of information by Grubb and Ellis timed out over the past week, my guess is that by this time next week we will need to start a new thread with the project name.

[localtalent]

Yes, it is a strange comment, unless you have a belief that a company like Google only draws people from a 50 mile radius.

Distance from Grand Rapids to Big Ten universities:

• Michigan State - 61 miles

• Michigan - 109 miles

• Northwestern - 122 miles

• Purdue - 185 miles

• Wisconsin - 189 miles

• Illinois - 237 miles

• Ohio State - 247 miles

• Indiana - 266 miles

• Iowa - 314 miles

• Minnesota - 404 miles

• Penn State - 429 miles

And that is just Big Ten universities...

Rerun the same line of thinking with Chicago as your target market.

Then run the decision process (urban revitalization opportunities, culture, entertainment, access issues, etc) comparing GR to Chicago.

Then try to tell me GR comes out on top for a West Coast high tech uber-hip company.

[PBJ]

Rerun the same line of thinking with Chicago as your target market.

Then run the decision process (urban revitalization opportunities, culture, entertainment, access issues, etc) comparing GR to Chicago.

Then try to tell me GR comes out on top for a West Coast high tech uber-hip company.

Then take your almighty knowledge and look at property and development costs in the urban core of chicago...

Then try and tell me why chicago would come out on top for anything that doesn't rely directly on the area it's located for its market and business.

From all your "insights" you've made GR sound like the worst place to start anything other than a trash dump. I would challenge you to come forth with something YOU see as a viable thing in this city. Otherwise you're just trolling...

[terra firma]

Its too bad Eric has to take the vacation, I always look forward to the insightful conversations.

Sorry Rizzo, but I cannot offer much insight this time !

I will only say that this is a very large and believable project with all the right ingredients.

Resultantly, we're putting our 202-216 Grandville project "on hold." No more construction... until this thing sorts itself out which I obviously believe is likely as evidenced by our 'sit and wait' mode.

When you see Deb on the street, thank her for her tireless efforts. It would not be happening without her.

Fingers crossed as the clock ticks.....

[twoshort]

thanks for the insight jrwquattro.

And eric, we knew you couldn't say anything, but hey, we can wish!

[localtalent]

From all your "insights" you've made GR sound like the worst place to start anything other than a trash dump. I would challenge you to come forth with something YOU see as a viable thing in this city. Otherwise you're just trolling...

No no no.

I just think it's something of a disservice to what WILL be happening with this project for everyone to get hung up on Google.

I wouldn't be here if GR wasn't about to attract a very significant regional development.

I'll drop my Google rantings (I promise this time!) after one more comment...

One of the reasons the fixation on Google upsets me is that this project will have a much larger and more sustainable impact on the area than anything Google could possibly bring.

OK, there....I'm done discussing Google. Sorry to have sounded so negative.

[Veloise]

... it would certainly have a much greater long-term impact potential than a big mall that provides $8 a hour jobs. ...

Was in the vicinity of the Grandville mall last night. What a mess.

Perhaps the mystery project will include a movie theatre.

[p.s. need the FAQ on the crossroads-whistle stop-hamlet-metropolis legend]

[designcritic]

Already did. He e-mailed his buddy who mentioned working on something here a while back, and got no response. He says that might mean it's confidential. Firm is Solomon Cordwell Beunz if that helps.

SCB came up with the original design for Icon. Maybe those two towers where what they were working on a while back.

[HolidayInnExpress]

Mind you, I am just a speculator, but here are a few things that I am pretty confident of, assuming a rational motivation of the developer/investors.

It is something that will be dependent upon bringing people from outside the immediate area. The reason that I say that is because there is no pent up demand that is simply waiting for a billion dollar investment to create the supply, except maybe in regards to labor. Thus, I would assume that the project would have to either be a major regional or national tourist attraction and or a major relocation or startup company and concept that will bring in people from outside the area.

The demographic that Grand Rapids has, which makes it standout, is that the area has the largest percemtage of workers employed in the manufacturing sector. Other than that, there is nothing remarkable about the demographics of the area. If the project is related to the demographics of the area, one must assume that it includes manufacturing of a good, assuming that it is not a tourist attraction type project.

I think that the most important thing of this project is jobs, as opposed to what form the project will take. Michigan

[jrwquattro]

...Thus, I would assume that the project would have to either be a major regional or national tourist attraction and or a major relocation or startup company and concept that will bring in people from outside the area. ...

I think you are right on the manufacturing side of this. While the initial project may not include manufacturing, it would spurn manufacturing jobs within the region (making a R&D venture more and more rational). Think back to Heartwell's State of the City speech, the vision was set to reuse the Steelcase properties on the south end of GR (right off US-131??) and the Walker areas. The vision was not for downtown for large scale introduction of sustainable manufacturers.

Additionally, a regional or national tourist attraction would require a ton of parking. Typically these types of developments do not locate in an area where they would need to build ramps to house thousands of cars on a regular basis. They instead rely on large tracts of land and cover them with asphalt for as far as you can see.

Plus, when is the last time you went to Cedar Point and looked into the Stay and Play package at the JW Marriott

[HolidayInnExpress]

I think you are right on the manufacturing side of this. While the initial project may not include manufacturing, it would spurn manufacturing jobs within the region (making a R&D venture more and more rational). Think back to Heartwell's State of the City speech, the vision was set to reuse the Steelcase properties on the south end of GR (right off US-131??) and the Walker areas. The vision was not for downtown for large scale introduction of sustainable manufacturers.

Additionally, a regional or national tourist attraction would require a ton of parking. Typically these types of developments do not locate in an area where they would need to build ramps to house thousands of cars on a regular basis. They instead rely on large tracts of land and cover them with asphalt for as far as you can see.

Plus, when is the last time you went to Cedar Point and looked into the Stay and Play package at the JW Marriott

Very valid points

[Phizzy]

clue

scope the inter-city for records

Interscope Records?

[Rizzo]

Sorry Rizzo, but I cannot offer much insight this time !

I will only say that this is a very large and believable project with all the right ingredients.

Resultantly, we're putting our 202-216 Grandville project "on hold." No more construction... until this thing sorts itself out which I obviously believe is likely as evidenced by our 'sit and wait' mode.

When you see Deb on the street, thank her for her tireless efforts. It would not be happening without her.

Fingers crossed as the clock ticks.....

Hey a guy can try... Oh and I plan on taking my hat off to Shurlow, quite the job for her.

Thanks Eric.

[Phizzy]

One of the reasons the fixation on Google upsets me is that this project will have a much larger and more sustainable impact on the area than anything Google could possibly bring.

Okay, but ealier you wrote...

...I do think you guys should take regular "reality check" breaks...this riverfront project isn't anything near what you all are making it out to be.

...the end result doesn't have the national splash some of you think. It's just another development deal. Cool, no doubt...but not billions of dollars and not thousands of jobs.

[torgo]

Plus, when is the last time you went to Cedar Point and looked into the Stay and Play package at the JW Marriott

Well, there is the family fun package with the Amway Grand and Craigs Cruisers...

[localtalent]

Okay, but ealier you wrote...

I once wrote a short story about an alien from mars. Doesn't mean you should read it. Or believe it.

I may have been a bit quick trying to downplay it....I should never have attacked the numbers. My point was to bring some of the really fanciful thinking back to earth.

I've since learned that much of the fanciful thinking is only intended to be for fun, not serious predictions of what's happening. So I'm trying to let it go.

[localtalent]

nice

Now we enter dangerous territory.

[snoogit]

Interscope Records?

Oh I hope there is no connection to the music industry I would fear this more then a connection to the automotive industry

[PBJ]

Now we enter dangerous territory.

Why would they want to come to GR..

[designcritic]

Now we enter dangerous territory.

Not Google but Yahoo!!!???