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Growth: Southwood

cityboy05

By cityboy05
in Tallahassee

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TD Burg

TD

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We just found out that Southwood is building a huge apartment complex near Town Center. The builder is the same one that built the apartments across from Publix on Captial Circle SW. The project will consist of 458 1-3 bedroom rental apartment units (that
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stjoe Hamlet

stjoe

Posted
Posted

Southwood residents look like they will fight this.

The issue, very little commercial space and increased density. Basically St Joe lied about what they were doing when selling homes (I know...I was one of those lied to).

"PUBLIC NOTICE:

A COMMUNITY MEETING HAS BEEN PLANNED FOR SOUTHWOOD RESIDENTS TO REVIEW THE SOUTHWOOD TOWN CENTER MASTER PLAN

This Meeting will be held at the Community Center located at the pool next THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 1, AT 7PM.

This is a resident initiated event. We will invite St. Joe representatives, as well as representatives from the development and design team to come and present this project. We have no confirmation of who will actually be there, but come with your questions and concerns and be prepared to meet a lot of neighbors you

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jpl02 Hamlet

jpl02

Posted
Posted

Mixed housing (single and multi-family) is an important part of any New Urbanism (read: Southwood) development. I know some apartments do exist.......it would be interesting to compare the value of houses adjacent to the existing apartments.

I understand the concerns regarding apartments, but at the rent these places are going for, it seems that a lot of the negatives that people associate with apartments (like poorer tenants, crime, etc) will be minimal. Nobody but upper crust people are going to be able to afford to rent these units, and that in itself should ease people's minds.

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stjoe Hamlet

stjoe

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I understood there would be density and apartments, it was the change and zoning and increase in density originally requested (and sold on).

Also, residents were told the area would be for commercial use.

Those that have hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in the area have every right to be concerned.

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Rachiroo Whistle-Stop

Rachiroo

Posted
Posted
I understand the concerns regarding apartments, but at the rent these places are going for, it seems that a lot of the negatives that people associate with apartments (like poorer tenants, crime, etc) will be minimal. Nobody but upper crust people are going to be able to afford to rent these units, and that in itself should ease people's minds.
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poonther Town

poonther

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For Southwood to increase the density first approved in their PUD (Planned Unit Development) for this area and for them to decrease the approved commercial space and increase the multi-unit residential space, they would first(to the best of my knowledge)have to applied for and receive approval from COT for these changes as a revision to their PUD approval (master plan.)

Does anyone know if they have applied to COT for these revisions and if they've already received approval?

If they have, they would have been required to notify via mail only the property owners w/in 500 ft. of the proposed revision. Due to the location of the Town Center area, I don't think that would notify very many property owners.

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thetoolman Whistle-Stop

thetoolman

Posted
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Florida - do you (or anyone else) have a copy of the original Southwood artist's rendering? The one I vaguely remember is an aerial rendering looking NW from above the area where JPII High School is now. It was very early (probably 2000) when it was done, but that rendering shows something in on this property next to the lake. I was wondering what was shown on there if anyone remembers or has a copy.

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stjoe Hamlet

stjoe

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This should shed some light on the issues. A letter from the main homeowner rep at Southwood:

"Hi this is Chris Kraft your newly elected board member of the SouthWood Residential Community Association (Homeowners Association). The association is governed by a three member board. Two of which are appointed by the developer that work for St. Joe, Project Manager Bill Wier and Operations Specialist John Nettles. The third, myself, elected by the 13 neighborhood reps, chaired by Carl Fuqua.

Here is the situation with the

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Florida Megalopolis

Florida

Posted
Posted

I still have the feeling that the company originally acted in "Good Faith" when you all purchased your homes. They've laid such a nice foundation out there for future growth. I'd love to see some mixed use development in the Southwood Town Center, similar to something that was mentioned before, that being Condos or Apartments above Commercial in the town center. I don't think rents at $1,250.00 will attract tenants who will bring disaster to that neighborhood.

Why can't we get these companies to build these apartments downtown where we really need the bodies!?!

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stjoe Hamlet

stjoe

Posted
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disaster....maybe not. Decrease in property values? Yes.

Why would folks that dont' own there care? Of course you guys don't....you don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars invested there.

I was lied to....so were many other Southwood owners.

Our homeowners dues pay for many holiday events.....when these apartment residents live there....they don't pay. So I pay for them. So do other homeowners. How is that fair?

It is so odd when folks are getting screwed and people with nothing vested say 'so what...I don't see anything wrong with it'.

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DaiDreamer5 Hamlet

DaiDreamer5

Posted
Posted

The rental tenants will pay those activity fees. It is included in thier rent. Just like property taxes and other stuff that homeowners take care of.

I don't think property prices will fall that much unless the complex has crappy management. Most apartment complexes require you to make three times the rent. So these people will be bringing home over 3000 in income. Not that high income means that you aren't a slob but it does mean that you are responsible enough to have a job that pays that much (my job doesn't pay that much). Also, this area is a bit aways from the college campuses, so you won't get too many students here.

Though, if there is a large number of current home owners that disagree with the rentals being built, then I think they should have a say. These apartments will be part of thier community. These tenants might have a voice in what happens in Southwood. You should petition your home owners association to speak with St. Joe Company. If enough voices are heard, perhaps it can change some things.

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Florida Megalopolis

Florida

Posted
Posted

stjoe, I feel vested in everything that goes on in Tallahassee and for that reason I'd like this to workout in the best interest of the community. I take it residents feel backed into a corner, left in the dark about the acquisition of this property, and now being told it will be used for a purpose not originally planned. I support coming together to support the vision as originally planned, not to oppose apartments. The sentiment is different.

When you say:

We need to fight for the Town Center we were promised complete with shops, restaurants, post office, bars, coffee shops, book stores and so forth.....

vs.

We need to keep them from building these nasty apartments in our town center because it's going to bring down our property values and make the neighborhood less desirable.

It just has a different ring to it, ya know.

Is there something you'd like us to do as an organization? Write letters, attend the meeting, fact find?

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Go Gators Burg

Go Gators

Posted
Posted
disaster....maybe not. Decrease in property values? Yes.

Why would folks that dont' own there care? Of course you guys don't....you don't have hundreds of thousands of dollars invested there.

I was lied to....so were many other Southwood owners.

Our homeowners dues pay for many holiday events.....when these apartment residents live there....they don't pay. So I pay for them. So do other homeowners. How is that fair?

It is so odd when folks are getting screwed and people with nothing vested say 'so what...I don't see anything wrong with it'.

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stjoe Hamlet

stjoe

Posted
Posted

"Is there something you'd like us to do as an organization? Write letters, attend the meeting, fact find?"

No, not really...just presenting a side of a story that is big in Southwood right now.

Truthfully, I only hope for some compromise. I want St Joe and the developer to respect the homeowners and maybe provide some compromise (there won't be much, but some)....and allow for folks to feel like a corporation can NOT be deceptive and just do whatever they want in your neighborhood. It is up to the homeowners to fight for that. maybe they will...maybe they won't.

But if the homeowners show they care about there community and St Joe and the developer show some level of humanity and compromise (even if it is just a little), then I am happy. Otherwise, I will feel this has been ugly and that is not fun because it taints a place I love to live in.

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thetoolman Whistle-Stop

thetoolman

Posted
Posted

I just posted this on towntalk (southwood's forum) after talking with someone who is both knowledgeable about the situation, and someone I trust regarding the character of Southwood:

I learned a bit more about this project today, and I think I have changed my mind about my previous concerns. If the following information is confirmed by St Joe representatives on Thursday, I think many people's fears will have been based on the poor communication from the developers regarding the project, rather than the actual plans.

As I understand it:

-Town Center phase 2 is still planned as it always was, using the previously seen live work arrangement for the 2nd block

-Epoch will build a nicely appointed and professionally maintained apartment complex with its own amenities (like Delaney Park - where some of the amenities are nicer than the regular SW stuff)

-They are building apartments to sell as condos when the market will support that (this seems to conflict with notes on the plans right now, hopefully this gets worked out)

-The apartments will rent for upper end-rates, which will hopefully promote care of the community

-The developer will presumably pay into the CDD on their property taxes until the units are sold as condos, at which time individual owners will pay their CDD

-There will be alley access to garages in the units, similar to SW townhomes, which will limit surface parking needs

-New Town Center retail should do much better with additional density nearby

Also, I am pretty sure that there has always been a plan for this sort of density in this area (thinking back to the original aerial renderings way back when we bought in 2002). If they can't sell condos in this market, selling apartments that are condo-like and potentially future condos is not so bad.

Hopefully the information presented this week will back up these assumptions and make sure this was just a case of St Joe sharing too little information with those of us who have our property values at stake.

One other note: there are additional community plans (restaurants, parks) between the apartments and the lake to make good use of that space, the views, and the area.

Also, if things get "loud" maybe St Joe will get the message that communicating with homeowners about their plans in advance can defuse situations like this. Of course, I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that they did not try to hide it because they thought we might revolt. Hopefully that is not the case.

Unfortunately, I can't make it to the meeting Thursday where they will be showing streetscapes, renderings, etc and answering questions.

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