LOCAL and Florida Politics

[jack]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:05 PM, aent said:

We'll also have to see what the dems do to try to block it as well. Obama and Biden have famously been very anti-marijuana as well, and we had more action on the federal level towards legalizing it under Trump then either of those 2. This really isn't a partisan issue, and I'd be surprised if this doesn't pass.

Except the states that are GOP led are less likely to approved MJ through the legislature. The best avenue is ballot initiative. Biden is irrelevant  when it comes to MJ legalization. I doubt he will spend political capital to block it when DeSantis has already come out against it. 

It is not a partisan issue except older evangelicals are the most against it. And they still have power in Southern states. 

[jrs2]

On 5/14/2023 at 3:48 PM, JFW657 said:

Are you talking about medical mj?

This ballot initiative is about just making it legal in Florida to buy, sell, possess and use it in smaller quantities for whatever purpose one wants to. 

yes and no.  there's so many dynamics here.  if they open it up for rec use, that means that they will offer more licenses, right?  Maybe not.  Based on what I heard, those finite license holders would be against it b/c they'd lose money.  I am assuming because of competition from other sources for MJ- sources being more license holders? bringing it in from elsewhere? i.e., flooding the market...

Medicare...I totally forgot what my take on that was; I think I was at that brunch when I posted that (so exciting that I'm posting on UP...go figure)...

[JFW657]

2 hours ago, jrs2 said:

yes and no.  there's so many dynamics here.  if they open it up for rec use, that means that they will offer more licenses, right?  Maybe not.  Based on what I heard, those finite license holders would be against it b/c they'd lose money.  I am assuming because of competition from other sources for MJ- sources being more license holders? bringing it in from elsewhere? i.e., flooding the market...

Medicare...I totally forgot what my take on that was; I think I was at that brunch when I posted that (so exciting that I'm posting on UP...go figure)...

I think if they legalized it for recreational use, the same licensed dealers who are selling it for medical use, would be the ones licensed to sell it for recreational use.

Your traditional neighborhood dealer selling it out of their back bedroom would probably be the ones who'd "take a hit" (pun intended) because the local weed store could probably sell it cheaper and would have a much wider selection of different kinds of weed for different kinds of high. 

[jack]

15 hours ago, JFW657 said:

Your traditional neighborhood dealer selling it out of their back bedroom would probably be the ones who'd "take a hit" (pun intended) because the local weed store could probably sell it cheaper and would have a much wider selection of different kinds of weed for different kinds of high. 

Except we have been constantly shown that the government cannot help itself and either taxes it so high its better to buy from the back market. Or, put up so much red tape no one bothers opening (NYC). 

Regardless, the government will screw it up somehow. 

[prahaboheme]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:05 PM, aent said:

We'll also have to see what the dems do to try to block it as well. Obama and Biden have famously been very anti-marijuana as well, and we had more action on the federal level towards legalizing it under Trump then either of those 2. This really isn't a partisan issue, and I'd be surprised if this doesn't pass.

Are you high?

Look at the map my friend. 

Edited May 16, 2023 by prahaboheme

[JFW657]

31 minutes ago, jack said:

Except we have been constantly shown that the government cannot help itself and either taxes it so high its better to buy from the back market. Or, put up so much red tape no one bothers opening (NYC). 

Regardless, the government will screw it up somehow. 

Hard to say how many and what kind of roadblocks the govt might try to put up, but as for the back market or neighborhood dealers, I think that there would still be a couple of things working in favor of the store owners.

First, a lot if not most people don't know neighborhood weed dealers, aka "connections". That's traditionally been one of, if not THE biggest problem in scoring weed. And if penalties were put in place for selling it without a license, that might discourage the some neighborhood dealers.

Then there's the issue of selection. Nowadays there are so many different kinds and strains of cannabis that provide different effects, people would probably willing to pay a premium just for that, not to mention the other items probably available in stores. 

I'm reasonably confident that if it passes with the voters,

and the state leadership doesn't try to pull something cute,

and the courts uphold the people's decision,

and it gets to the point where weed is finally and officially declared legal in Florida for recreational use,

these stores will survive and thrive. 

[jrs2]

On 5/14/2023 at 3:48 PM, JFW657 said:

Are you talking about medical mj?

This ballot initiative is about just making it legal in Florida to buy, sell, possess and use it in smaller quantities for whatever purpose one wants to. 

I'm pulling a Scooby-Doo...

Trulieve- one of the largest dispensaries in the nation:

https://www.marketscreener.com/quote/stock/TRULIEVE-CANNABIS-CORP-46353318/company/

Their largest shareholder, Cowen

https://www.bloomberg.com/profile/company/328490Z:US#xj4y7vzkg

got purchased by TD Bank in March.  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TD_Cowen#:~:text=Cowen Inc.,-Type&text=New York City%2C U.S.&text=On August 2%2C 2022%2C Toronto,acquisition finalized in March 2023.

Not sure what it means at the moment...

[orange87]

The party of limited government is using the weight of big government to subvert the will of the voters (as usual).

Florida Attorney General Asks State Supreme Court To Block Marijuana Legalization Initiative From 2024 Ballot

Article: https://www.marijuanamoment.net/florida-attorney-general-asks-state-supreme-court-to-block-marijuana-legalization-initiative-from-2024-ballot/

[orange87]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:05 PM, aent said:

We'll also have to see what the dems do to try to block it as well. Obama and Biden have famously been very anti-marijuana as well, and we had more action on the federal level towards legalizing it under Trump then either of those 2. This really isn't a partisan issue, and I'd be surprised if this doesn't pass.

What a laughably incorrect take.

[jrs2]

39 minutes ago, orange87 said:

The party of limited government is using the weight of big government to subvert the will of the voters (as usual).

Florida Attorney General Asks State Supreme Court To Block Marijuana Legalization Initiative From 2024 Ballot

Article: https://www.marijuanamoment.net/florida-attorney-general-asks-state-supreme-court-to-block-marijuana-legalization-initiative-from-2024-ballot/

https://harrisbricken.com/cannalawblog/2024-adult-use-marijuana-in-florida/

well, the Single Subject Rule- from their 2022 effort

[jrs2]

58 minutes ago, orange87 said:

The party of limited government is using the weight of big government to subvert the will of the voters (as usual).

Florida Attorney General Asks State Supreme Court To Block Marijuana Legalization Initiative From 2024 Ballot

Article: https://www.marijuanamoment.net/florida-attorney-general-asks-state-supreme-court-to-block-marijuana-legalization-initiative-from-2024-ballot/

Florida isn't the only state with the Single Subject Rule...see below:

https://ballotpedia.org/Single-subject_rule

 

[JFW657]

3 hours ago, jrs2 said:

https://harrisbricken.com/cannalawblog/2024-adult-use-marijuana-in-florida/

well, the Single Subject Rule- from their 2022 effort

 

2 hours ago, jrs2 said:

Florida isn't the only state with the Single Subject Rule...see below:

https://ballotpedia.org/Single-subject_rule

Well, apparently Trulieve's team of very expensive and highly competent lawyers feel that the Smart & Safe Florida initiative meets all the necessary requirements in that regard.  

Of course, the Florida Supreme Court is packed with highly conservative appointees of the last two Republican Governors.

So there's that to worry about.  

[jrs2]

13 hours ago, JFW657 said:

 

Well, apparently Trulieve's team of very expensive and highly competent lawyers feel that the Smart & Safe Florida initiative meets all the necessary requirements in that regard.  

Of course, the Florida Supreme Court is packed with highly conservative appointees of the last two Republican Governors.

So there's that to worry about.  

I wouldn’t know about the competency of their lawyers, because you would think they would have corrected the mistakes from 2022 that violate this Rule; it’s not like the State didn’t give them a road map of how not to word it… and there’s no reason to give them a “pass” for being sloppy; they are no different than anyone else.  They should have used a consultant with experience at this sort of thing and see how they did this in other SSR states.  I’m sure folks in CA and CO would be more than willing to assist.

[JFW657]

1 minute ago, jrs2 said:

I wouldn’t know about the competency of their lawyers, because you would think they would have corrected the mistakes from 2022 that violate this Rule; it’s not like the State didn’t give them a road map of how not to word it… and there’s no reason to give them a “pass” for being sloppy; they are no different than anyone else.  They should have used a consultant with experience at this sort of thing and see how they did this in other SSR states.  I’m sure folks in CA and CO would be more than willing to assist.

Who says they didn't?

Ashley Moody?

I wouldn't take her word for it or the word of anyone else in the current administration. 

According to the linked article, Trulieve's lawyers are confident that they covered everything. 

Guess we'll see.  

[jrs2]

2 hours ago, JFW657 said:

Who says they didn't?

Ashley Moody?

I wouldn't take her word for it or the word of anyone else in the current administration. 

According to the linked article, Trulieve's lawyers are confident that they covered everything. 

Guess we'll see.  

But to be fair, who says they actually did, the actual person who doesn't want to get egg on his or her face?  I mean, if it was me, I would blame Moody 'till I was blue in the face, because, in the words of that guy on that talk radio audiobyte from the early 2000's "I gots tuh get payyyyyed!" 

That being said, I'm going to reach out to a couple people I know and see what their take is on that compared to how this was drafted.  

[jack]

On 5/16/2023 at 1:12 PM, JFW657 said:

Hard to say how many and what kind of roadblocks the govt might try to put up, but as for the back market or neighborhood dealers, I think that there would still be a couple of things working in favor of the store owners.

First, a lot if not most people don't know neighborhood weed dealers, aka "connections". That's traditionally been one of, if not THE biggest problem in scoring weed. And if penalties were put in place for selling it without a license, that might discourage the some neighborhood dealers.

Then there's the issue of selection. Nowadays there are so many different kinds and strains of cannabis that provide different effects, people would probably willing to pay a premium just for that, not to mention the other items probably available in stores. 

I'm reasonably confident that if it passes with the voters,

and the state leadership doesn't try to pull something cute,

and the courts uphold the people's decision,

and it gets to the point where weed is finally and officially declared legal in Florida for recreational use,

these stores will survive and thrive. 

There are penalties in states where it is legal. The black market still exists. 

The problem is fundamentally state legislatures see taxing it as a golden goose but end up driving people back to the black market. And they put up so many hurdles that it is hard to open and stay open if you want to start a dispensary. 

States need to stop the license BS which is just another benefit to well connected individuals and firms and treat it the same way we treat cigarettes. 

[JFW657]

2 hours ago, jack said:

There are penalties in states where it is legal. The black market still exists. 

The problem is fundamentally state legislatures see taxing it as a golden goose but end up driving people back to the black market. And they put up so many hurdles that it is hard to open and stay open if you want to start a dispensary. 

States need to stop the license BS which is just another benefit to well connected individuals and firms and treat it the same way we treat cigarettes. 

I wasn't suggesting the old neighborhood dealer system would go away completely. Just that fines and penalties would do a little bit to help keep down the competition for the licensed stores.

I still think most people would prefer the convenience of just popping in to the local Ye Olde Bud Shoppe and browsing through their vast selection of fine, selected buds, to chasing down some sketchy dealer who may not even be home.

Etc, etc.

But I agree about them making it overly difficult and expensive for the small stores.  

[jack]

14 hours ago, JFW657 said:

I wasn't suggesting the old neighborhood dealer system would go away completely. Just that fines and penalties would do a little bit to help keep down the competition for the licensed stores.

I still think most people would prefer the convenience of just popping in to the local Ye Olde Bud Shoppe and browsing through their vast selection of fine, selected buds, to chasing down some sketchy dealer who may not even be home.

Etc, etc.

But I agree about them making it overly difficult and expensive for the small stores.  

New York legalized it in 2021. Two yeas later, they have approved 5 shops. Thankfully, the bodegas are willing to break the law and sell it themselves. 

https://reason.com/2023/05/05/new-yorks-heavy-hand-keeps-illegal-marijuana-and-tobacco-dealers-in-business/

 

[orange87]

Thanks DeSantis!

The Walt Disney Co. Nixes $1 Billion Lake Nona Campus

Article: https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/18/media/disney-florida-desantis/index.html?fbclid=IwAR0ZcKbHHlOjNut724y8wMm3Ed38kFhnBXwP5eNCtwiZBwmMWyBSewxepDY

Edited May 18, 2023 by orange87

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, orange87 said:

Thanks DeSantis!

The Walt Disney Co. Nixes $1 Billion Lake Nona Campus

Article: https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/18/media/disney-florida-desantis/index.html?fbclid=IwAR0ZcKbHHlOjNut724y8wMm3Ed38kFhnBXwP5eNCtwiZBwmMWyBSewxepDY

Personally, I do not disagree in principal with everything DeShameless does.

Keeping certain subject matter away from young school children etc, is a legitimate position. 

But the guy just thinks he is some kind of demigod.

A mini-Mussolini. 

But Meatball Ron is really just pandering to Trumpers.  

[jrs2]

5 hours ago, jack said:

New York legalized it in 2021. Two yeas later, they have approved 5 shops. Thankfully, the bodegas are willing to break the law and sell it themselves. 

https://reason.com/2023/05/05/new-yorks-heavy-hand-keeps-illegal-marijuana-and-tobacco-dealers-in-business/

 

do you mean 5 licenses or 5 total shops?

[prahaboheme]

6 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

Personally, I do not disagree in principal with everything DeShameless does.

Keeping certain subject matter away from young school children etc, is a legitimate position. 

But the guy just thinks he is some kind of demigod.

A mini-Mussolini. 

But Meatball Ron is really just pandering to Trumpers.  

Keeping kids away from Charlottes Web and I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings is not a position. 

[jrs2]

2 hours ago, orange87 said:

Thanks DeSantis!

The Walt Disney Co. Nixes $1 Billion Lake Nona Campus

Article: https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/18/media/disney-florida-desantis/index.html?fbclid=IwAR0ZcKbHHlOjNut724y8wMm3Ed38kFhnBXwP5eNCtwiZBwmMWyBSewxepDY

from the article:

Disney, along with the broader media industry, is grappling with a difficult advertising environment and a massive writers strike. Earlier this year it announced it would be cutting 7,000 jobs as part of a cost-cutting effort.

Separately, the company confirmed Thursday that it would shut down its Star Wars: Galactic Starcruiser resort at Disney World just over a year after it opened.

The popular attraction “will take its final voyage” at the end of September, Disney said, adding that it is working with guests to rebook reservations for later in the year.

[orange87]

44 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

Personally, I do not disagree in principal with everything DeShameless does.

Keeping certain subject matter away from young school children etc, is a legitimate position. 

But the guy just thinks he is some kind of demigod.

A mini-Mussolini. 

But Meatball Ron is really just pandering to Trumpers.  

I agree with DeSantis on some things too. I too hate "woke culture."

[jrs2]

41 minutes ago, prahaboheme said:

Keeping kids away from Charlottes Web and I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings is not a position. 

Regarding the Angelou book:

The book is also a valuable resource for those studying psychology and human development. I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings covers tough issues such as the effects of rape and the trauma resulting from abuse; sexual development and gender issues; identity; and the impact of relationships between family members, friends, teachers, and students.

https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/3924/i-know-why-the-caged-bird-sings-by-maya-angelou/9780812980028/teachers-guide/#:~:text=I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings covers tough issues,friends%2C teachers%2C and students.

Last I checked, Psychology 101 and Human Development/Behavior or similar are part of a COLLEGE curriculum.