Scope Area Renovations and Redevelopment

[BFG]

This is the updated rendering. Looks like they added about five rows to the upper deck (under the window). I counted about 700 in that section alone, and with the lower level addition, that appears to be another 700. I think 13,000-14,000 minimum is doable. Wish they could add luxury boxes and some LED ribbon lights but I’m a little more optimistic here. 

[ONCE1stBlvd]

2 hours ago, BFG said:

This is the updated rendering. Looks like they added about five rows to the upper deck (under the window). I counted about 700 in that section alone, and with the lower level addition, that appears to be another 700. I think 13,000-14,000 minimum is doable. Wish they could add luxury boxes and some LED ribbon lights but I’m a little more optimistic here. 

sigh........just build a new arena and stop being cheap

[HRVT]

8 hours ago, ONCE1stBlvd said:

sigh........just build a new arena and stop being cheap

Kind of agree. I dont see how this renovation does much of anything to move the needle in any way. The current arena is good enough for things like the MEAC Tournament, an ECHL team, WWE events, a number of concerts, etc and would continue to be. This renovation doesnt look to be enough to upgrade any of that... maybe a few concerts? But is that really worth the price tag? This looks like an attempt to kick the can down the road 10-20 years by making an antiquated arena "look nice" and have a few more seats for sale (which maybe impacts an occasional Admirals game and some concerts).

This is lipstick on a pig.

[BFG]

I love March Madness and have been hoping for years to get a game in HR. Getting this to 12-13K could at least make that a reality. Deep down I’m still hoping we could get a pro team that maybe calls Scope its temporary home, but in the meantime developers believe this could get us major events, and I’m hoping March Madness is at least one of them. 

What really needs to happen is Norfolk, VB, and Chesapeake’s mayors need to come together and get serious about a regional arena that can be funded with a hotel tax. Location doesn’t matter, and I think some sort of revenue split could be agreed upon*.

*Fully aware two of those cities couldn’t even agree on where to place an outlet mall. 

[mintscraft56]

2 minutes ago, BFG said:

I love March Madness and have been hoping for years to get a game in HR. Getting this to 12-13K could at least make that a reality. Deep down I’m still hoping we could get a pro team that maybe calls Scope its temporary home, but in the meantime developers believe this could get us major events, and I’m hoping March Madness is at least one of them. 

What really needs to happen is Norfolk, VB, and Chesapeake’s mayors need to come together and get serious about a regional arena that can be funded with a hotel tax. Location doesn’t matter, and I think some sort of revenue split could be agreed upon*.

*Fully aware two of those cities couldn’t even agree on where to place an outlet mall. 

If your expecting VB and Norfolk to come together I'm pretty sure those are pretty high hopes. 

[BFG]

Hence the asterisk and footnote haha

[Si7i]

This is only word of mouth/ speculation but some on council are getting skittish of the scope revamp proposal because it potentially competes with McMalls redevelopment. Which I do not fully understand because the mall renderings did not look like an arena of any sorts but at most a conference or event hall type of venue. I see the scope revamp getting kicked down the road entirely. 

Edited April 25 by Si7i

[baobabs727]

2 hours ago, Si7i said:

This is only word of mouth/ speculation but some on council are getting skittish of the scope revamp proposal because it potentially competes with McMalls redevelopment. Which I do not fully understand because the mall renderings did not look like an arena of any sorts but at most a conference or event hall type of venue. I see the scope revamp getting kicked down the road entirely. 

They must be talking bout $$$$. Debt capacity. Bond rating, etc.

[ONCE1stBlvd]

I really can't wait to find out what the struggle REALLY is. This level of non cooperation is on a deliberate level. Orchestrated level. No where else do you see this level detriment enabled by a state or even a nation. I'm telling you guys, a lot of this should be illegal for it's effect on quality of life 

[mintscraft56]

2 hours ago, ONCE1stBlvd said:

I really can't wait to find out what the struggle REALLY is. This level of non cooperation is on a deliberate level. Orchestrated level. No where else do you see this level detriment enabled by a state or even a nation. I'm telling you guys, a lot of this should be illegal for it's effect on quality of life 

Yea. Norfolk and VB are not really enemies per say, but our cities definitely got beef. Not that we hate each other of course but its the fact we never get along. Which might be over racist mindsets or more fears of "Hoods" spreading to VB which was a source of fear someone I know personally had said to me once....which was either a insult to me or a generalization of our city through the eyes of the rich folk in Ocean Front. I dont know. Either way the fears and divides are real and its impossible to heal what damage has been done. 

Edited April 26 by mintscraft56

[zeppelin14]

I've been going to Scope for a long time.... to Admiral games since 1990 and whatever events since. I went to Journey & Toto on Friday night and another Admirals playoff game tonight. Scope is just long past its prime. The concourse is too narrow with not enough bathrooms and vendors. You can't walk around the vendors barely because the concourse is so narrow.

The seating is horrible. I'm 6'0 and 230 lbs. Not huge but I should feel fairly comfortable in an arena seat. It is not.... My knees are right against the seat in front of me. I have no room on either side of me. There's no way they can Expand the rows and make it more comfortable. The location is ideal so the consideration should be to demolish Scope and rebuild on the same lot.

Chrysler Hall is similarly built, but that can be renovated by removing some seating to make it more comfortable and building off to the sides of the building to increase bathrooms and concessions which it greatly needs. I saw John Mellencamp there last Sunday so I have very recent experience with both.

 

[ONCE1stBlvd]

On 4/25/2024 at 11:41 PM, mintscraft56 said:

Yea. Norfolk and VB are not really enemies per say, but our cities definitely got beef. Not that we hate each other of course but its the fact we never get along. Which might be over racist mindsets or more fears of "Hoods" spreading to VB which was a source of fear someone I know personally had said to me once....which was either a insult to me or a generalization of our city through the eyes of the rich folk in Ocean Front. I dont know. Either way the fears and divides are real and its impossible to heal what damage has been done. 

Sound like an enemies to me ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[HRVT]

On 4/28/2024 at 12:21 AM, zeppelin14 said:

I've been going to Scope for a long time.... to Admiral games since 1990 and whatever events since. I went to Journey & Toto on Friday night and another Admirals playoff game tonight. Scope is just long past its prime. The concourse is too narrow with not enough bathrooms and vendors. You can't walk around the vendors barely because the concourse is so narrow.

The seating is horrible. I'm 6'0 and 230 lbs. Not huge but I should feel fairly comfortable in an arena seat. It is not.... My knees are right against the seat in front of me. I have no room on either side of me. There's no way they can Expand the rows and make it more comfortable. The location is ideal so the consideration should be to demolish Scope and rebuild on the same lot.

Chrysler Hall is similarly built, but that can be renovated by removing some seating to make it more comfortable and building off to the sides of the building to increase bathrooms and concessions which it greatly needs. I saw John Mellencamp there last Sunday so I have very recent experience with both.

 

Agree on both counts. Chrysler is salvageable and a potentially nice facility again. Scope is outdated and small... and seating isn't the only problem. While a 12-13k seat arena is just large enough to host some NCAA Tournament games, it's barely large enough and as antiquated as the facility is, I doubt a refurbished Scope attracts it to a tertiary market like Norfolk. On top of that, conference realignment in college sports could have impacts on the NCAA Tournament. 

All of this to say, Scope needs to be replaced, not refurbished. Can Chartway and/or Hampton Coliseum serve the Admirals for a year or two while Scope is rebuilt?

[BFG]

Coliseum, yes. They hosted a hockey team back in the 70s. I think Chartway is basketball-only. 

I keep going back to the 2017 proposal but the city really needs to put that plan back on the table. Yes, digging into the ground is going to cost you (back then it was about 200M, so with inflation let’s say 250), but a new arena will be twice as expensive. Do what you have to do to get to 15K, and revisit this plan. I think naming rights, a hospitality tax, and now tax credits offsets the cost quite a bit. If you can figure out a revenue-sharing plan, get other cities to contribute to a regional hospitality tax and explain this new Scope benefits everyone. 

A 1% hospitality tax for five years, a 10-year deal with Dollar Tree, and tax credits should provide at least half of the cost.

 

Edited Wednesday at 09:21 PM by BFG
Better quality image