major hotel in the works for downtown Greensboro

[cityboi]

here is the video link

http://www.myfox8.com/news/wghp-story-hotel-proposal-100707,0,2060423.story

also a pdf of the new proposal showing floor plans. Looks like they are showing the old rendering on the cover page because the new plan shows the hotel tower behind the Elm Street Center and not above it like on the rendering. There will also be an event lawn next to the tower behind the Elm Street Center.

Greensboro already has a Wyndham Garden Hotel near the airport but the garden hotel is a lot like Hyatt Place. It has the Wyndham name but its not really an upscale luxury hotel. The Wyndham Downtown will be a full service upscale luxury hotel which are typically located in major U.S. cities across the country.

http://mm.news-record.com/drupal/files/documents/ProposedHotelPlan072010.pdf

[crowe1856]

Disappointed to read the line in the proposal about "owned and leased surface parking adjacent to the hotel." Anyone know the details? N&R lot, perhaps? Just seems a shame to replace a deck (albeit a small outdated one) with something requiring additional parking, only to have said parking come in the form of a surface lot.

[twincity]

Is it a Wyndham or of the Wyndham brand?

[cityboi]

Is it a Wyndham or of the Wyndham brand?

The media is saying it will be a "Wyndham" In addition the proposal package Urban Hotel Group sent to the bond authority says it will be Wyndham. But once approved for the bonds, construction will start at the end of the year.

my guess is that Weaver and Dennis will try one last ditch effort to stop the hotel but with all the concerns being addressed including the feasibility of the new plan, they dont have a leg to stand on. HVS Consulting, the same company that did a study on the first plan and said that plan wasnt feasable now says the new plan is. Weaver and Dennis said they want a third party to come in and do a study but they forget they were the ones who recommended HVS Consulting to the city in the first place. They feel threatened by another luxury hotel opening and unlike their hotels, this one has a big luxury name attached to it.

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/07/08/article/editorial_a_new_improved_hotel

Here is the website to the Empire/Regency room. It will serve as conference space for the downtown Wyndham.

other Wyndham luxury hotels....because of the Wyndham brand and image, you can see why Dennis and Weaver are concerned. Currently Raleigh is the only city in North Carolina with a Wyndham hotel. However its located near the airport and the rates are less than what is being proposed here in Greensboro.

Wyndham Boston

Wyndham Chicago

Wyndham Greensboro

Wyndham New Orleans

Wyndham Houston

Wyndham Cleveland

Wyndham Pittsburgh

Wyndham San Francisco

Wyndham Phoenix

Wyndham Minneapolis

Wyndham Miami

[cityboi]

hotel project is ready for review and developers are confident the will get approval because all concerns have been addressed in the new plan. After Tuesday we will officially know if this project gets the green light. Once approved, the hotel group will get ready for demolition of the old parking deck behind the Elm Street Center and start construction on the 10-story hotel tower at the end of 2010. The opening date is expected to be spring or summer of 2012....read more

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/07/14/article/proposal_for_hotel_is_ready_to_review

[twincity]

My question is, if its a Wyndham, why dont the articles say its a downtown Wyndham? This is just a hunch but sounds like it will be "------------ by Wyndham." Kinda like the Sundance Plaza Hotel and Suites by Clarion here in Winston.

I think something more like this is whats planned for Elm Street.

I could be wrong...

[cityboi]

My question is, if its a Wyndham, why dont the articles say its a downtown Wyndham? This is just a hunch but sounds like it will be "------------ by Wyndham." Kinda like the Sundance Plaza Hotel and Suites by Clarion here in Winston.

I think something more like this is whats planned for Elm Street.

I could be wrong...

If you read the package that was sent to the board its says "Wyndham Luxury Hotel" not Wingate by Wyndham or Wyndham Garden Hotel.

In fact if you go to the Wyndham website, they have hotels classified in several categories. "Wyndham Luxury Hotel", Wyndham Historic Hotel, and "Wyndham Resort Hotel" All three categories carry the Wyndham name and are not associated chains like Wingate by Wyndam or Hawthorn Suites by Wyndham.

We know its not a garden hotel because Greensboro already has a Wyndham Garden Hotel near the airport. But even the garden hotels are pretty exclusive and are really on located in the nation's top 25 markets so I doubt Greensboro will have two Wyndham Garden Hotels. The "Garden Hotels" are also built near airport and suburban locations. Wingates are not luxury hotels and they would have mentioned that it would be a Wingate if it were. The kind of rates this downtown hotel will have, you wont find in Wingates or garden hotels.

BTW Fox 8 did a live report and called it "the downtown Wyndham"

Every now and then the big luxury chains do enter "smaller markets". Greenville, SC has a Hyatt Regency and a Westin.

[twincity]

If you click the link I provided, you see its a non-chain hotel in Galveston, TX. Its a unique hotel managed by Wyndham. Thats why I used the Sundance Plaza in W-S as an example. "Sundance Plaza" is one of a kind for Clarion.

All indications, to me, are that they dont have a name for the hotel yet, but it would be managed by Wyndham Resorts...clearly stated in recent articles.

"The development group also got a commitment from Wyndham Hotel Management to run the hotel under the Wyndham name."

The developers, Urban Hotel Group and Elm Street Center, LLC, say they have a signed letter of intent with Wyndham Hotel Management Inc. to become the flag designation and manager of the hotel.

"The hotel is tentatively called the “Downtown Greensboro Luxury Hotel” -from July 6 .pdf

[cityboi]

If you click the link I provided, you see its a non-chain hotel in Galveston, TX. Its a unique hotel managed by Wyndham. Thats why I used the Sundance Plaza in W-S as an example. "Sundance Plaza" is one of a kind for Clarion.

All indications, to me, are that they dont have a name for the hotel yet, but it would be managed by Wyndham Resorts...clearly stated in recent articles.

"The development group also got a commitment from Wyndham Hotel Management to run the hotel under the Wyndham name."

The developers, Urban Hotel Group and Elm Street Center, LLC, say they have a signed letter of intent with Wyndham Hotel Management Inc. to become the flag designation and manager of the hotel.

"The hotel is tentatively called the “Downtown Greensboro Luxury Hotel” -from July 6 .pdf

This pretty much says it will be a Wyndham

"The development group also got a commitment from Wyndham Hotel Management to run the hotel under the Wyndham name" (not a non chain hotel or chain associated with Wyndham...also the associated chains are not luxury hotels and you wont find a Wingate by Wyndham that has a hotel rate as high as $200 a night. From what im hearing the range will be between $160 and $200 a night depending on the room ect. But the $200 will not be the average rate. In the first plan it was the average rate, which is a reason why the study found the first plan not to be feasible. The average rate of this hotel will be similar to that of the Proximity and O'Henry hotels.)

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/07/14/article/proposal_for_hotel_is_ready_to_review

It wouldn't be odd for Wyndham to operate a Wyndham hotel in Greensboro when you consider they sponsor our PGA golf tournament. Greensboro already has a working realtionship with Wyndham and while Wyndham really only operartes "Wyndham" hotels in big city markets, that realtionship with Wyndham is a big reason Greensboro would get a Wyndham hotel. At one time Wyndham was considering buying out Grandover Resort and turning it into a "Wyndham Resort Hotel" (Joe Koury would roll over in his grave if that happened). Clearly Wyndham is interested in having its presence in Greensboro which is actually good for a long term commitment to our PGA Tournament. But It was a relationship connection that also led to Greenville, SC getting a Hyatt Regency. People who don't know the story behind that think its odd Greenville, a city smaller than Greensboro, has a Hyatt Regency.

.

[cityboi]

Guilford County Bond Authoriy unanimously approved issuing bonds for downtown Wyndham hotel. Even though there are a few more steps (which are formalities), It looks like this thing is getting built. Once all hurdles are clear, construction will begin at the end of the year. The hotel construction will take about a year to a year and a half to complete. This will be the first new high-rise construction in downtown Greensboro since 1990. Apparently the parking issue has been resolved as well which may explain why the hotel has less rooms and is taller than the first proposal. The hotel may sit atop a parking deck.

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/07/20/article/bond_authority_moves_hotel_deal_forward

http://www.digtriad.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=145502&catid=57

[cityboi]

Further confirmation that the hotel will carry the Wyndham name.

http://www.myfox8.com/news/wghp-story-greensboro-downtown-hotel-100721,0,4792413.story

[DCB]

Interesting. The rendering in that video doesn't show the building fronting Elm St. so it looks like they're looking to build it on the site of the parking deck behind the Elm St. Center. That could go a long way towards revitalizing Davie St. and would also flesh the skyline out slightly by adding a bit more depth to it. This would also be the first mid-rise built in that area since the King Cotton (also a hotel, incidentally) was torn down back in the 70s.

Edit: Looking at the pictures right now, it looks like it will be about the same height or just slightly shorter than the King Cotton was.

[cityboi]

Interesting. The rendering in that video doesn't show the building fronting Elm St. so it looks like they're looking to build it on the site of the parking deck behind the Elm St. Center. That could go a long way towards revitalizing Davie St. and would also flesh the skyline out slightly by adding a bit more depth to it. This would also be the first mid-rise built in that area since the King Cotton (also a hotel, incidentally) was torn down back in the 70s.

Edit: Looking at the pictures right now, it looks like it will be about the same height or just slightly shorter than the King Cotton was.

yes it will be just a little shorter than the King Cotton Hotel which use to sit across the street from this hotel site. The King Cotton was around 12 or 13 stories. I'm excited the hotel portion will front Davie Street too. It wll be interesting to see the final tower design. I did notice the shape of the foot print on the basic floor plan kinda matches the King Cotton. I understand why they didnt use the King Cotton name because they needed a national luxury brand. Having an upscale brand luxury hotel there will help attract further investment along Davie Street. Now if we can just get the News & Record to move out of downtown LOL They are taking up WAY too much real estate along Davie Street which is a big factor in why Davie Street is dead. Also a historic commercial row of buildings with unique architecture burned down in a major downtown fire back in 1985. Some of those buildings had very large interior spaces too. Davie Street was like a mirror image of South Elm St. It would be nice if the News & Record moved their operation on the old main post office site but a local church purchased that entire property which borders Dudley Street, East Market Street and Pastor Anderson Way.

There is some hope for development on the north end of Davie near the cultural center Kotis is trying to sell he lot at the corner of Davie and Friendly for a mixed-use mid-rise project. Governors Court condos are located just east of that lot.

[cityboi]

here is a follow up interview on the planned 10-story downtown Wyndham luxury hotel. It appears as though the project has passed another hurdle clearing the state board. The bond committee at the state level agrees that the project is viable and gave their support for it. Now it has to go back to the county. It is expected that the hotel will be open in the summer of 2012. Construction should take 18 months.

http://www.news-record.com/multimedia?pluid=646&playNowId=4656&pllimit=15&ploffset=0&plkwds=&plterms=&plsort=&plclass=&plstart=&plend=

[cityboi]

The hotel project passed another crucial hurdle tonight. The county voted (7 to 2) in favor of the hotel tonight. The Vice President of Wyndham Development also confirmed the hotel will be called The "Wyndham Greensboro" and will be in the same league as its other upscale luxury hotels in major cities across the country. I can't wait to see the updated renderings. It will be the first luxury and urban Wyndham hotel in North Carolina. While Raleigh/Durham has a Wyndham hotel, its not a luxury hotel and is an airport hotel.

"The developers were on hand Thursday to argue for their project — and they brought a secret weapon. They introduced Steve Miller, senior vice president for development for Wyndham Hotels and Resorts. He said Wyndham would not only manage the new hotel but would invest up to $1.5 million in the project and make it the Wyndham Greensboro, a corporate stamp given to only 100 hotels worldwide."

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/09/16/article/commissioners_pass_downtown_hotel_project

there is a typo on the WFMY page. It says it will open in 2013 but actually will open in 2012.

http://www.digtriad.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=147990&catid=57

[cityboi]

The News & Record has now changed their tune. The editorial staff was skeptical about the project at first but now they have come out to endorse it. I think what sealed it in people's minds that the hotel will be viable is when the senior vice president for development for Wyndham Hotels and Resorts, Steve Miller came to Greensboro and said they have done the numbers and know the hotel will be successful. On top of that Wyndham is investing up to 1.5 million towards construction and It will be the Wyndham Greensboro. Not a Wyndham Garden hotel or a Wingate. Only about 100 hotels world-wide have the Wyndham upper tier name so its a pretty exclusive hotel and not many cities have one.

I think many people questioned the success of the planned hotel because the numbers at the other big downtown hotel, the Marriott looks dismal. While there are thousands of hotel rooms in Greensboro, there aren't as many luxury hotel rooms in the city. There are only three upscale/luxury hotels in Greensboro (Grandover, O'Henry and Proximity). I don't count Embassy Suites. Luxury hotels serve a different market than the low to mid-range hotels. In fact the vacancy numbers at the upscale hotels in Greensboro are lower than the mid-range hotels. The Wyndham will be the second luxury hotel in Greensboro and the first in the core area of the city with significant meeting space. The Wyndham will have more meeting space than the O'Henry and Proximity combined. On top of that the Wyndham will be steps away from the restaurants, bars, nightclubs, museums and other entertainment venues. The Wyndham name alone is a big draw. All these factors are the reason this hotel will be more successful than most in the city and as the economy begins to pick up a little by the time this hotel opens in 2012, it should be even more successful. This is why Dennis Quaintance and Mike Weaver (owners of the O'Henry and Proximity) are so concerned. The Wyndham Greensboro will clearly have the competitive edge over their hotels. Greensboro should be lucky because other cities, in North Carolina, Durham and Fayetteville, are asking for incentives (public money) to build their urban hotel projects. While the government is involved in the Greensboro project, no public money will be used. I did notice while Durham will use public money for their 4-star 165 room downtown hotel project, the developers there are also seeking Recovery Zone Facility Bonds like the developers in Greensboro are doing. Durham plans to convert the high-rise Suntrust building into a luxury hotel. Like in Greensboro, people in Durham are questioning the hotel's viabiltiy there and local hoteliers are against that project.

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/09/20/article/editorial_a_timely_endorsement

This is the Empire and Regency Room at the Elm Street Center. It will serve as conference/meeting space for the Wyndham Greensboro. The proposal does call for the Elm Street Center to be remodeled as well because it will be a part of the hotel. So i'm not sure if they are going to remodel the Empire and Regency Room. They look great already.

Empire Room

Regency Room

I'm pretty sure they are going to redo the exterior though. I hope so.

I couldn't help but notice that the Benton Convention Center in Winston-Salem looks similar to the exterior of the Elm Street Center

[LesterA]

Anyone have any idea if the project will raze the elm st. center so the ten story hotel will on the corner of elm and feb 1 with the parking deck facing davie st., or if they are just going to raze the parking deck so they can build a new parking deck with the hotel tower on top of that?

Just curious.

[cityboi]

Anyone have any idea if the project will raze the elm st. center so the ten story hotel will on the corner of elm and feb 1 with the parking deck facing davie st., or if they are just going to raze the parking deck so they can build a new parking deck with the hotel tower on top of that?

Just curious.

They are just going to raze the old deck behind the Elm Street Center and build the hotel tower in its place. As for parking, there will be no new parking deck as a part of the project. Instead the hotel will utilize surface parking on property adjacent to the hotel on Davie and there will be valet parking as well (parking in existing decks a few blocks away). However the city has identified the corner of Washington and Davie Streets as a potential site for a new parking deck (not directly a part of the hotel project). That site is extremely close to the hotel site and is also across the street from the depot. The parking deck would likely include street level retail and would be designed to look like a building and not a parking deck.

It would be nice if they would build a deck beneath the hotel. Then we would be looking at a 14 or 15 story tower. But building the deck as a part of the project would then drive the cost up. Its all about making the numbers work so that this project is feasible.

[LesterA]

Thank you.

I am glad they are saving the building. I wonder if they will change the 1960's facade back to its original or like you've intimated, redo the facade in more of the style of today, though considering its still in the historic district, whatever facade they choose should technically complement the character of elm st. Hopefully the hotel will also influence the street scape of davie st, like a wider pedestrian friendly sidewalk and lamp posts like that on elm st.

Also, is the city still planning on having street level retail/commerce with the new parking deck?

[LesterA]

Scratch the last question... You've already answered that.

[cityboi]

You are welcome. I would hope that they will redo the facade of the Elm Street Center. Its too modern for that part of South Elm Street any way. It wouldnt look right for the Elm Street Center and the hotel tower to be to be two different architectural styles and based on the past two renderings of the hotel, they are going with the historic look. The last rendering does show a new facade but that was the rendering that shows the tower on top of the Elm Street Center.

[cityboi]

Wyndham shows its committment to Greensboro. Wyndham also indicated the PGA event played a role in thier interest in putting a luxury hotel in the Greensboro market. But they also said the increased amount of new retail,cultural ammenities and new companies like FedEx, HondaJet and Mack Trucks played a major role.

http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/10/02/article/wyndham_sees_future_in_downtown

[gman430]

Looks like I might be right afterall:

A group that hopes to build a luxury hotel downtown won’t be able to secure $26 million in tax-exempt bonds this year that backers had counted on to move the project forward.

Source: http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/11/20/article/hotel_planners_can_t_meet_deadline_for_bonds

[cityboi]

Looks like I might be right afterall:

A group that hopes to build a luxury hotel downtown won’t be able to secure $26 million in tax-exempt bonds this year that backers had counted on to move the project forward.

Source: http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/11/20/article/hotel_planners_can_t_meet_deadline_for_bonds

They didn't have all their ducks in a row before the deadline. Actually they can still secure the bond if the lame duck congress extends it before the end of the year through 2011. Over on Ed Cone's blog Mr Kaplan states if they can't get the bond money in time they will still proceed forward with this project and look at other ways to finance the hotel.....sorry citylife its not dead (I know you want it to be). It may be delayed a little but not dead We've been through this twice where the project was believed to be dead but the developers have always adapted to the challenges and have over come the road blocks. No doubt its a set back. But this set back doesn't kill the project. The hotel developers never said the project would be dead if they didn't secure the bonds. Clearly the bonds would help keep the interest rates down and save the developers a lot of money which is why their focus was on securing the bonds in the first place. This does mean the hotel probably won't open by the summer of 2012.

Mr Kaplan's quote on Ed Cone's blog:

"We continue to believe a hotel will be successful in combination with the Elm Street Center, would be great for downtown, and will create much needed jobs. As I have always said, getting the financing and negotiating the right deal is the most difficult part of any big project like this. At present the bond markets are in a bit of a shake out. We do not think we can get the deal done by year end but continue to work on the financing. If the legislation is not extended for the recovery bonds, we will look at other ways of developing the project."

My take on this is that if congress doesn't extend the bonds before the end of the year its likely this project won't get built with the help of these kind of bonds. Say goodbye to the American Recovery Investment Act once the GOP takes over the house in January. The good ole GOP. They don't want to extend people's unemployment benefits but they want to extend tax cuts for the rich. Extending tax cuts for the rich and extending unemployment benefits both cost the federal government money. But I guess they believe rich people need money more than poor and middle class Americans. Everything they do is so backwards which is why this country got in this big mess in the first place.

[gman430]

they will still proceed forward with this project and look at other ways to finance the hotel.....sorry citylife its not dead (I know you want it to be).

They will proceed forward only if they are able to get financing. What if they can't? Oh and I never said I wanted the project dead. I just don't feel like seeing taxpayer dollars (and yes a bond is that as the money has to come from somewhere) used to build private projects when this country has a deficit over one trillion dollars. I also am very suspicious about the developer's statements. We had a hotel project here that was supposed to have all the bells and whistles where a local developer like Mr. Kaplan claimed everything was fine and dandy when in fact it wasn't. Construction started in 2007, one story got built, and the project has been stalled ever since early 2008. I don't want to see the same happen in Greensboro with an eyesore sitting in the middle of downtown.