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John McCain for President

Charlotteman

By Charlotteman
in The Coffee House

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erdogs Burg

erdogs

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I would agree if it were an isolated incident, like Obama's 57 states gaffe. however, McCain regularly makes such misstatements, at a rate of nearly once a day. That speaks to his lack of understanding of the situation in Iraq.
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monsoon Gigalopolis

monsoon

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You just disproved your own assertions, the offenders didn't go back in after we left. I would also imagine the reason we pulled out was because they were stabilizing, although I doubt each situation is the same. Neither you or I know what happened in each case, so all we can do is speculate at best.
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erdogs Burg

erdogs

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Haha, no. "We" have not pulled out as there are as many soldiers in Iraq as their have ever been. It was the other members of the "coalition" that finally saw the foolishness of this war and pulled out. If anything this is proof that occupation is self serving. It doesn't accomplish anything.
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erdogs Burg

erdogs

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Yes these European countries who have sat back and allowed us to defend them all these years because they couldn't or wouldn't do it themselves, yet when we do something they don't like, they turn like rabid dogs on us. While we had sanctions against the Saddam regime, France and Germany decided to skirt the sanctions just to make money, yet they deride us for this? Part of the reason the sanctions didn't work against Saddam is because of these same countries, our allies, right! You can sit there and believe Europe is some utopian society if you want, but the fact is they have used our good will and one way friendship to build themselves up. The U.S. is not the new Roman Empire, that my friend is the European Union. Ask yourself this, if the U.S. would pull all our forces out of Europe, how loud would they cry? We are not the enemy to the world! We have shed enough blood for others to not be lectured by these same people on how we should defend ourselves. 200,000 or more Germans turned out for Hitler as well, a great man that does not make! This billboard many Americans and now Europeans have turned out for is nothing but a mirage of substance. "Hope" is an old line he stole from both Carter and Clinton, nothing new there. Obama may be your Messiah, but to me he's just another golden idol.

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monsoon Gigalopolis

monsoon

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^The Europeans are not are enemies. I realize the Bush administration tried to paint them this way because they would not support his war, but our real enemies in this world are certainly not in continental Europe. They support our policies far far far more than any other region on the planet except for Japan. You might have completely missed they too are putting pressure on Iran and are supporting the "just" war in Afghanistan.

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Charlotte_native City

Charlotte_native

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It amazes me how well the Bush folks and their supporters have made so many in the US view Europeans as somehow 'against us' or some horrible socialist liberal population. Just like they have made one half of the population hate the other half because they are loony left liberals or ivory tower elitists. Boiling all of this down into simpleton terms and sides just makes finding and building solutions more difficult. From a world view it is embarrasing, on a local level it is terribly frustrating and mind-boggling. We have initiated very bad foreign policy under Bush -- the evidence is in front of us every day -- so we can't act surprised and upset when the world doesn't line up to support us.

The fact that the Europeans are welcoming Obama as they have doesn't show anything negative, rather their hope that we will return to being the ray of hope in the world rather than the big bully to be feared. It is scary how many Americans are happy with how we've behaved. I have no desire to cow down to anyone, but I believe diplomacy is a better method of achieving what you want and need over force. I believe this was known as speaking softly but carrying a big stick. Unfortunately for the last 7 years we've lost sight of the way we succeeded for so many decades. You only use force as a last resort but you let everyone know that you could and will only if necessary.

Note that the world didn't turn their backs on us for Afghanistan, most believed, and still do, that this was a reasonable and necessary use of force. Iraq, quite a different story.

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monsoon Gigalopolis

monsoon

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Don't underestimate the power of "The Big Lie". All of the major TV networks, have worked very hard to give equivalency to McCain during Obama's trip while minimizing the real news by continuing to harp on "the surge". When somehow McCain's visit to a supermarket in Bugtussle where he kisses someone on the head is treated the same as a visit to Berlin where 200,000 Germans came out to hear him speak, I smell conspiracy to obscure the issues being cooked up in the corporate board rooms. Opinion repeated enough with disclaimers all of a sudden becomes fact.

Americans unfortunately are all too willing to forget what has really happened with the last 8 years of GW Bush, and when they hear enough times that Obama was against the Surge, the Surge was Good, this is what they remember forgetting the real facts at hand. It's the same kind of thing that got John Kerry pasted for doing his duty in Vietnam while GW Bush got cheers for using family connections for skipping out on it. The big news this week was "who is the riskier choice". This was a question that was asked of a few thousand people without defining risk. Now the news has hammered that to the point that people think voting for Obama is risky Expect more of the same nonsense over the next few months. It's the reason the Iraq war became a debate over Freedom Fries. Gee we were going to show the French. Never mind we were getting ready to kill 100,000+ Iraqis. That moral debate never happened.

Just this morning Tom Brocaw (who is one of the inventors of the modern Big Lie) interviewed Obama on Meet the Press, reads a NYTimes article by David Brooks, one of opinion, and then goes after Obama as if it was fact. "Why didn't you take the opportunity to spell out a major platform....." as if this was something he was supposed to do in Germany. Obama was there fortunately there to address it, in part by pointing out the technique, even not letting Brocow interrupt him which he tried to do, and when Obama was done Brocaw didn't follow up. Then the next thing that Brocaw does is say, "....opinion has it that you need a VP that has strong national defense experience..." i.e. You are not strong on national defense. Nevermind the alternative is calling for endless war and has supported GW Bush on every war move since day one. geez.

So by the time November rolls around expect McCain to be elected. This is what the corporate media wants and they are working very hard for this goal.

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Justadude Burg

Justadude

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^ Perhaps not JUST because they speak well, but the ability to mend fences with Europe is going to be a key factor in the performance of our next President. Rather than simply criticize Europe or dismiss Obama's abilities as irrelevant, the McCain camp would be better off highlighting his own diplomatic skill by arranging similar events for him.

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Charlotte_native City

Charlotte_native

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I'll compare this to being in Europe a couple of years ago during the anniversary of 60 years after Armistace Day. W took a trip to Europe and had to be shuttled around as if he were in Baghdad because the people were protesting everywhere he went. Some even became very violent. Funny thing, we'd watch American news from stateside at our hotel -- no mention of this anywhere -- just nice little photo ops with Bush laying wreaths at graves, etc. From out of our window we'd see thousands carrying placards with his front and profile pictures that read 'George W. Bush - Terrorist'. I brought one of these home to prove it. European news covered his whole trip including the protests, our news organizations (including the so-called 'liberal' ones, ignored the protests completely and saved us from having to know how tarnished our reputation is around the world).

If we now of a potential leader who brings out throngs of happy and enthusiastic people, FANTASTIC. We won't get any where being proud of being the school-yard bully who eats Freedom Fries and is glad that others in the world hate us. Better to have Obamas crowd than grenade throwers in Georgia

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monsoon Gigalopolis

monsoon

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I guess it was a matter of time but John McCain, the guy who suggest that he will be different, will bring change, has gone negative with his campaign in exactly the traditional GOP way. He is running ads that blame high gas prices on Obama and also says Obama wants to lose the war in Iraq to get into the White House.

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Justadude Burg

Justadude

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The concept behind the ad was to lump Obama in with Hilton and Spears as frivolous, narcissistic celebrities. Of course the real message is that Obama voters are nothing more than a tabloid fanbase.

Personally I find the ad, like the attacks on Germany, quite uninspiring and in particularly poor taste considering it contained no real statements on policy (other than sweeping accusations). As a moderate, independent voter this turns me off, and frankly makes me think somewhat better of Obama than before -- clearly the guy has no major weaknesses if the best his opponents can do is make ridiculous connections between him and pop stars.

After the past 4 or 5 elections I don't think the political process can get any slimier, so I'm not shocked by this. But it is very sad when a national hero (and I think of McCain as that) stoops to such a juvenile and trifling level on such a grand stage.

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