Jacksonville P&C Discussion Thread

[wolfdawg54]

I hope the NFL concert that is going to happen on Thursday really does well. It will be a plus for the city if it is successful.

[Fruit Cove]

it went pretty well i would think considering i watched a little bit of it... i might of missed it but i didnt see the "show case" of our city as announced. it was more like....heres jessica simpson in jax....and that was it. anyway its still nice to be anounced nationaly.

[Urban_Legend]

I didn't want to make a new topic on this, so I thought I'd just post it here:

The

[bobliocatt]

Tailgaters turned railgaters

By CHRISTOPHER CALNAN

The Times-Union

Visitors to Jacksonville's sports complex district may soon be able to trade in their tailgating chairs and charcoal grills for a different kind of experience.

Instead, tailgaters could become railgaters, relaxing before and after ballgames and other events in old railroad cars refurbished with all the comforts of home. That is, if a developer's proposal to convert a couple dozen railroad cars into hospitality condominiums near Alltel Stadium stays on track.

The project, called Adams Street Station, would be patterned after a similar and highly popular venture outside a football stadium in Columbia, S.C., for fans of the South Carolina State Gamecocks, developer Randy Evans said.

Evans, the president of JR Evans & Associates LLC and a former CSX Transportation executive, is developing the project for a group of four Jacksonville-based investors.

The 2-acre site is on Adams Street, about 300 yards from Alltel Stadium, Evans said.

The railroad cars, which will come in three sizes, would be outfitted with plumbing, heating, air-conditioning and more. They'll be on tracks, but wouldn't be mobile.

Evans plans to be open in time for the Gator Bowl in January. Prices would start at $195,000 and reach the low $300,000s, depending on the size and location.

Owners would also pay for common area maintenance, security, landscaping and other costs.

"The station will have a feel that you're in a real place," he said. "One of the goals is make Alltel Stadium a real destination. This is another piece in the puzzle for getting new investment and new activity down there."

The Downtown Development Authority has already approved Evans' preliminary plans. He's scheduled to submit his final plans to the DDA today.

But Evans' group has already bought the railcars and is now refurbishing their exteriors. The interiors will be custom made to the specifications of each owner at the Adams Street site.

The railcars would be placed, side by side, around the perimeter of the property with a paved parking lot in the center, according to a site plan.

Evans said he's marketing the condominiums to businesses as a place to entertain clients. They're also marketing them to individuals and groups.

Each railcar will include its history, such as where it was made and what railroad owned it, Evans said.

Unlike the Columbia project, called the Cockaboose Railroad, the Adams Street Station railcars will be connected by a station platform, making it easier for visitors to enter and exit the cars.

Also, the Adams Street project would be available for more than just football games. That's because of its proximity to Metropolitan Park, Veterans Memorial Arena and the Baseball Grounds of Jacksonville.

Evans estimates that 240 events take place in the area of Jacksonville each year.

In 1990, 20 South Carolina football fans paid $45,000 apiece for converted cabooses set on a rail spur 60 yards Williams-Brice Stadium in Columbia. The Cockaboose Railroad now has 22 cars and waiting list of potential buyers.

One of the owners was offered $220,000 for his caboose last year, ESPN.com reported.

Columbia lawyer Paul Degenhart, 57, one of the original owners, bought his caboose with a brother and two friends.

In addition to tailgating, he now uses the caboose for business meetings and other functions.

Degenhart said Thursday only four or five owners have sold their cabooses in the first 14 years of the Cockaboose Railroad.

"I think it's unique," he said. "A lot of people feel if you give it up you couldn't replace it. People become attached to them, and they're fun. It enables you to tailgate in just a nicer setting."

A handful of copycat projects have developed similar sites near the stadium, Degenhart said. And he helped develop another caboose project at the University of Louisville.

Degenhart said such projects could be successful with professional teams as well as the college setting.

"I know there are a number of places where if you had access it could work," he said.

christopher.calnanjacksonville.com, (904) 359-4404

This story can be found on Jacksonville.com at http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stor..._16725190.shtml.

[93sportie]

I'm glad this project is still on track.When I first read about it,awhilebackI thought it to be a real unique idea,especially for this area around the stadium.Every time I drive around down there I try to visualize exactly where this location is.I thougt they said under the Hart Bridge ramp area.What property could that be?Underused industial or surface parking,I haven't seen it.

Many a project like this,you here about,sounds great,then they just dissapear from the radar screen.I hope to see it.

Springfield since 1998

[bobliocatt]

This project is along Adams Street, just SE of Alltel Stadium, directly under the N-S ramps that connect the MLK Expressway to the Hart Bridge Expressway. There used to be run down old metal warehouses and an industrial storage yard at that site.

[bobliocatt]

From the Jax Daily Record:

City Notes

[Urban_Legend]

I've given up on the whole Brooklyn thing. And I think it's very snobby and dumb for them to turn down the Skyway in a heartbeat. Whatever happens over there, I'm not gonna worry about it. I just don't wanna hear Riverside people complaining about the low ridership of the Skyway, since the key to the whole system involves extending it.

And I like that Rail-Gating project. That's a novel idea, and I hope people will still rent trains after the Superbowl.

[Urban_Legend]

Lerner to get historic funds

by Bradley Parsons

Staff Writer

The JEDC is asking the City Council to loosen the purse strings on the Historic Preservation Trust Fund for the first time since the City began to rethink the way it encourages historic redevelopment.

The Jacksonville Economic Development Commission has already approved Kimmick Corporation to receive a $400,000 grant from the fund, which has sat untouched for the past three months. The money, which still requires Council approval, would help turn the Lerner Building at 20 West Adams St. into loft apartments and commercial space. In June the City replenished the nearly empty fund with $3 million from an aborted development deal on Laura Street.

Having gained temporary relief from a zero balance, the JEDC began to reevaluate the way it handled the fund. The review is still underway, but in broad terms the City wants to ensure the money is invested into projects that return the most and wants to dole out the fund in loans instead of grants.

But after sitting out the downtown development game for more than three months, the fund

[wolfdawg54]

And I like that Rail-Gating project.  That's a novel idea, and I hope people will still rent trains after the Superbowl.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think that this will be neat because it is so unique that no other city will have this. It is something that will define the image of our city. Great idea!

[DavePaulk]

At first I was skeptical about the rAdams Street Station, but after reading that article it seems like a really great idea. I guess I was just unclear about what would actually go into the railcars.

[TheUrbanCore]

I was at first questioning the price point. The article published the starting prices in SC, and the relevance is nil. The only thing the projects have in common is a stadium and a railcar.

After thinking more about it, if you're using it as a corporate hospitality suite, its a good investment. A suite at alltel is a lot more over time and you've got no asset.

Hope everyone weathers the storm.

[Fruit Cove]

Rendering released for $500 million Southbank project

A rendering has been released illustrating what a $500 million project would look like that's proposed for Jacksonville's Southbank.

It calls for the construction of six buildings -- including three 35-story towers -- bringing 1,500 residential units, a public riverfront park, retail shops and a 28,000-square-foot grocery store, the developer said.

"This is really a city within a city," said Steve Pardo in August. Pardo is a principal owner in Riverwalk Hotels, LLC, who said he submitted his project plans for San Marco Riverwalk for city approval. "It will provide all the public and private amenities for those who live there residentially."

Plans call for the eventual demolition of the Radisson Riverwalk Hotel, the Chart House restaurant and about 2,000 square feet of office buildings standing on the 17-acre site at Riverplace Boulevard and Prudential Drive. "We intend to operate the hotel through 2010 and beyond depending on market conditions," Pardo said adding he plans to do a multimillion-dollar renovation to the 21-year-old hotel.

The office buildings will be torn down after the Super Bowl in February, Pardo said. His company is negotiating with the 20-year-old Chart House to open in one of three planned restaurant sites.

The project's three construction phases are expected to take seven to 10 years to complete.

If all goes smoothly, his company will begin construction in spring 2005 on a nine-story hotel with 200 rooms and 6,000 square feet of meeting space, Pardo said. "We have not finalized the franchise but it will be a four-star hotel," he said.

The boutique-style grocery store will be located on the ground floor of the 28-story tower in 2007 or 2008, he said.

Construction on the first of three 35-story condominium towers would begin January 2006, Pardo said in August.

Workers removed wooden beams and decorations in June from the former Crawdaddy's restaurant that closed in early 2002.

JOHN PEMBERTON/The Times-Union

While the construction schedule would depend on market conditions, Pardo said his company plans to begin building a second residential tower in January 2007, located riverfront near Riverplace Boulevard. The final two towers that will require the demolition of the Radisson Riverwalk Hotel won't begin until the other structures are built.

The towers will sit on top of parking garages which will be hidden by town houses to create a small-town feel, Pardo said. The retail shops will be on the riverfront. "It'll be boutique shops, which will create an extension of San Marco," he said. "The street will be lit to create a quaint, picturesque atmosphere."

[bobliocatt]

^That will look pretty nice on the Southbank, along with San Marco Place, The Strand, The Peninsula, Riverpointe, & the Haskell project. However, on that rendering it appears that the hotel tower is a lot taller than 9 stories.

[Urban_Legend]

I like what I see. I'm hoping that the streets have an urban feel, and that the towers have good interaction with Prudential and Riverplace Drives. I hope they can break ground ASAP!

[vicupstate]

^That will look pretty nice on the Southbank, along with San Marco Place, The Strand, The Peninsula, Riverpointe, & the Haskell project.

[vicupstate]

St. Joe withdraws plan for JEA land

Utility now plans to market riverfront property and negotiate with individual companies.

By MATT GALNOR

The Times-Union

The St. Joe Co. is withdrawing its proposal to redevelop JEA's former Southside Generating Station after the company and utility couldn't agree on financial terms.

JEA is now planning on marketing the 25 acres of downtown riverfront property and negotiating with individual companies to strike a deal, JEA board Chairwoman Marty Lanahan said.

"I can assure you that wonderful property will not be vacant forever," Lanahan said.

This latest development comes a year after JEA received elaborate proposals from both the Haskell Co. and St. Joe, after narrowly a national search down to the two local companies. JEA has never been happy with the financial offers and wants to get close to appraisals of between $27 million and $29 million.

Last fall, St. Joe offered about $6.5 million and Haskell about $8 million, and JEA told both to come back with better offers. In May, Haskell's financial backer, New York-based Midtown Equities, bumped the offer to $25 million.

JEA, however, said it couldn't get Midtown to come to the table for two months and cut off talks, moving on to St. Joe. Financial discussions weren't moving along with St. Joe either and the company on Friday chose to back off.

"We still believe that redevelopment of the property -- if properly conceived, executed and financed -- would be a tremendous community asset," Bob Rhodes, St. Joe executive vice president wrote to JEA.

Both Haskell and St. Joe had planned for a mixed bag of residential and retail buildings, with offices and park land sprinkled in.

Construction cannot begin until after the Feb. 6 Super Bowl anyway, because the site will host the NFL Experience, a family oriented, football-themed extravaganza. The Super Bowl could be an ideal marketing opportunity for JEA to get potential developers interested in the property, Lanahan said.

[bobliocatt]

I had no idea that Haskell's plans had fallen through. That's unfortunate because they had a pretty good urban layout and were going to fit 1,400 units on that 25 acre site. I wonder how badly polluted parts of the site might be?

[Urban_Legend]

Here's a nifty update! A nice new business has opened up!

Ieyasu opens today

[bobliocatt]

Orchid nightclub opening delayed

Despite delays, owners of the Warehouse on Bay Street said Orchid will open, possibly in early 2005.

by J. Brooks Terry

Staff Writer

Though originally planned for a late summer opening, owners of the Warehouse on Bay Street said Orchid nightclub won

[wolfdawg54]

Rendering released for $500 million Southbank project

A rendering has been released illustrating what a $500 million project would look like that's proposed for Jacksonville's Southbank.

It calls for the construction of six buildings -- including three 35-story towers -- bringing 1,500 residential units, a public riverfront park, retail shops and a 28,000-square-foot grocery store, the developer said.

"This is really a city within a city," said Steve Pardo in August. Pardo is a principal owner in Riverwalk Hotels, LLC, who said he submitted his project plans for San Marco Riverwalk for city approval. "It will provide all the public and private amenities for those who live there residentially."

Plans call for the eventual demolition of the Radisson Riverwalk Hotel, the Chart House restaurant and about 2,000 square feet of office buildings standing on the 17-acre site at Riverplace Boulevard and Prudential Drive. "We intend to operate the hotel through 2010 and beyond depending on market conditions," Pardo said adding he plans to do a multimillion-dollar renovation to the 21-year-old hotel.

The office buildings will be torn down after the Super Bowl in February, Pardo said. His company is negotiating with the 20-year-old Chart House to open in one of three planned restaurant sites.

The project's three construction phases are expected to take seven to 10 years to complete.

If all goes smoothly, his company will begin construction in spring 2005 on a nine-story hotel with 200 rooms and 6,000 square feet of meeting space, Pardo said. "We have not finalized the franchise but it will be a four-star hotel," he said.

The boutique-style grocery store will be located on the ground floor of the 28-story tower in 2007 or 2008, he said.

Construction on the first of three 35-story condominium towers would begin January 2006, Pardo said in August.

 

Workers removed wooden beams and decorations in June from the former Crawdaddy's restaurant that closed in early 2002.

JOHN PEMBERTON/The Times-Union

While the construction schedule would depend on market conditions, Pardo said his company plans to begin building a second residential tower in January 2007, located riverfront near Riverplace Boulevard. The final two towers that will require the demolition of the Radisson Riverwalk Hotel won't begin until the other structures are built.

The towers will sit on top of parking garages which will be hidden by town houses to create a small-town feel, Pardo said. The retail shops will be on the riverfront. "It'll be boutique shops, which will create an extension of San Marco," he said. "The street will be lit to create a quaint, picturesque atmosphere."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That looks absolutely incredible. I can't wait to see it fully constructed on the Southbank. Also, I am disappointed that the plans have fallen through with the JEA center. That is not good news for the city.

[Urban_Legend]

Some Interesting City Notes:

The paving work between the stadium and the ball park continues and some light poles are expected to be installed this week. They

[bobliocatt]

Barnett deal waiting on Humana outcome

by J. Brooks Terry

Staff Writer

While the City works to resolve one failed deal, another project can

[bobliocatt]

IMO, the city, Langston, & the Fund, should work together to build a 5 to 10 story garage large enough for all three the old theater site, on the SW corner of Adams & Laura Streets.

As long as it has street level retail and a respectful architectural design, it shouldn't be a problem. Being infull, it would also help frame the corner in an urban oriented fashion as well as generate extra pedestrian activity by providing more retail space in the heart of downtown.

[vicupstate]

IMO, the city, Langston, & the Fund, should work together to build a 5 to 10 story garage large enough for all three the old theater site, on the SW corner of Adams & Laura Streets. 

As long as it has street level retail and a respectful architectural design, it shouldn't be a problem.  Being infull, it would also help frame the corner in an urban oriented fashion as well as generate extra pedestrian activity by providing more retail space in the heart of downtown.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I completely agree. Once the Fund investigates the situation, I am convinced they will realize that additional parking will be needed in some form or fashion. The city just needs to bite the bullet and build a garage. Once it is in place, the Barnett and Laura Place Trio projects will make sense and property values in the entire area will rise significantly.

From your earlier post about talking with Langton, he was close to securing parking in an EXISTING garage. Was that the impression you got, or did I misunderstand?