Baseball in Charlotte, which will happen?

[Guest]

As a lowly designer I have little knowledge of law practices, but is there anything Reese and Diehl can do to actually keep this thing from breaking ground.

[Andyc545]

Its a roofless 10k seat capacity structure, how long do you expect it to take. Honestly if the buildling is recessed into the ground as many are, the thing that would take the longest is the site work and grading, and street rerouting/removing. If they started soon april 09 is very possible for it to be operational, with street improvements still in the works.

[Guest]

Of course they would continue to play in fort mill until it was finished, did anyone ever question that fact.

I am just saying that it is very possible for it to be done in a year and 8 months. Allow me to put it into perspective for you. The much larger, more complicated, and indoor venue we call the bobcats arena was built in a little over two years. It broke ground in July 2003, finished July 2005, and offically opened October 21st 2005. The Bobcats arena was rated one of the top arenas in the NBA, and is built to NBA standards. The roof alone added a couple months to the structure, as did rerouting the road, and the escavation for the bottom sections.

The Knights Stadium is a minor league ballpark with half the capacity, no roof and an outdoor experience. Being an outdoor stadium there will be less HVAC, less wiring, less need for amenities, and less complications, it is completely possible. Did I mention no roof? Lets not forget that the Knights have a plot of land that was previously cleared to be a park, and minimal escavation/grading to do, as that the ballpark may or maynot be partially below grade.

[ES Charlotte]

It would take much longer than a few months. Like I said earlier in the forum, they would continue to play in the old stadium until it finishes being built, like the Bobcats/Hornets did. The earlier completion date quoted was for the 2010 season, but that doesn't even look like it's going to happen.

[dubone]

Right. I thought that was common understanding for this discussion. The Knights themselves are saying they believe a 4/2009 opening is back in the cards. They are trying to get the remaining contractual stuff done fast, and then they will work to get the construction timeline coordinated toward that date.

http://charlotte.bizjournals.com/charlotte.../02/story6.html

Based on a comparison of 2 years for the Bobcats, I think it is then reasonable for a minor league baseball stadium to meet that date.

[uptownliving]

I beleive they have already contracted with an architect and construction firm to go ahead and do all the design documents a few months ago...so they will be ready to break ground very soon after they get the rights to the land.

[Mobuchu]

Either way, we should see things moving forward soon. I'm just glad life will be returning to 3rd ward. Although I wish the baseball site could be sold for development, it will be nice to get this project off the ground.

As a lowly designer I have little knowledge of law practices, but is there anything Reese and Diehl can do to actually keep this thing from breaking ground.

[Guest]

You have to give Jerry some credit for being a dreamer, but he is just starting to become a whiny, stubborn, and spoiled brat. It takes some serious single-mindedness to sue because you didn't get your way.

On a side note, I would love for Charlotte to have a major league team someday, but I'd rather the knights pay 35mil for their stadium than the city pay 1B for Jerry's Dome. Additionally I am 100% for the revitalization and rebirth of the brooklyn neighborhood, which would not be possible with a huge 35k seat dome in the middle of it. The last thing charlotte needs is to lose another 4 blocks to a major sports arena, however I can easily live with two.

[dubone]

That was a major point of irony when the conservatives on the city council were supporting Reese. The current plan is for a privately funded stadium, bus Reese planned for the city and county to let him keep all or most of the future taxes in all of 2nd Ward. Not only do private sources fund the stadium, but they are instantly developed into a project that provides property tax and sales tax revenues. That goes for both 2nd Ward and 3rd Ward. And the only thing they had to give away to get the land was some percentage of ownership for the arts projects which wouldn't be going anywhere for decades. So they gave away something of no real value in order to get the land extra land, which will have considerable tax benefit value. All they had to do to get it to happen was to give a cheap lease for use of the land.

[cowbreath]

Right. I thought that was common understanding for this discussion. The Knights themselves are saying they believe a 4/2009 opening is back in the cards. They are trying to get the remaining contractual stuff done fast, and then they will work to get the construction timeline coordinated toward that date.

http://charlotte.bizjournals.com/charlotte.../02/story6.html

Based on a comparison of 2 years for the Bobcats, I think it is then reasonable for a minor league baseball stadium to meet that date.

[New Name]

I would hope they could meet it. Our team here in Northwest Arkansas is scheduled to begin play in 2008. With our stadium not even starting construction yet I think they must have a lot of up front planning done. April 2009 should be no problem for you guys.

[Guest]

You can't just leave us hangin like that.

[New Name]

You can't just leave us hangin like that.

[Raintree21]

City and county officials are holding a public forum tonight at 6:30 p.m. at the Government Center.

[Andyc545]

City and county officials are holding a public forum tonight at 6:30 p.m. at the Government Center.

[Raintree21]

News 14 has an article (crappy though it may be) as well that says one of the sticking points was who would pay for public safety during events. The city worked out a deal with the Charlotte Knights, who will organize and pay for 75 percent of those costs. The Knights have also agreed to handle construction if the county can provide cash to cover the budget shortfall. Guess they don't want another Bobcats Arena SNAFU with the OT costs of CMPD directing traffic. At least they're thinking ahead.

[ES Charlotte]

And to add to that, still seems they can get it done by 2009! This is good. Looks like they don't want to play around with it and just do it! The next step is taking care of the financial portion, pending on tonights input.

[Guest]

I'll be there most likely anybody else going to be there?

[Raintree21]

It's pretty much decided that we will have the minor league Knights downtown, which I'm happy with, but just thought I'd share this map posted in the sports forum by dgreco that I thought was pretty interesting. It shows us where all of the other locations of MLB teams are and how close we would be to other competing markets. Wish there was one made up of all of the minor league teams.

[uptownliving]

As expected Meck Co Commision approved the Development agreement with the Knights. With this agreement approved the Knights can immediatly start doing soil sampling on the site to determine how much remediation will be necesary to make it environmentally safe.

Also at the meeting the Meck Co replentished the Third Ward Park Bonds to their full amount. They put $370K back in the fund that had been spent on design and grading at the current site. This means that the full $19.37M will be available for Third Ward Park at the new site.

If you want to read the full Development Agreement with the Knights it is posted here:

Some highlights:

-Mecklenburg County has to approve the archtectural drawings before construction can begin.

-Knights will pay upfront for the $8M infrastructure improvements which will be refunded by Meck Co begining in 2010. This is what you hear in the media referred to as the "economic grant"

Infrastructure Improvements that are part of the "economic grant":

-Sidewalks, drainage, lighting that are in the immediate area of the stadium

-Water and Sewer connections for the site

-Widening, Lighting, Resurfacing Mint St between MLK and 4th

-Restriping Mint between Trade and 4th

-Construction of Bulb Outs and Parking on MLK between Mint and Graham

-Closing connectors and resurface and restripe Graham from MLK to 4th.

-Wideing, resurface, restripe 4th from Railroad tracks to Mint.

-Closing 3rd Street

-Installing concreate pavers and vertical granite curb

In addition the Knights will pay for the Baseball Stadium and will cover all cost overruns with one exception: site remediation. The Knights will pay for up to $2M in site remediation...it is expected to only cost $1M.

Next step will be the lease agreement expected to come before Meck Co Commision in September. The Knights will pay $1 per year for the stadium site. In addition they will pay at least $651K in taxes to Meck Co each year.

[Raintree21]

Glad to see one more obstacle is out of the way but I hate that they can only do street improvements for the most part. They can't really do any kind of site clearing or begin construction until October. That is going to give them about 1 1/2 years to do all of the construction if they want to open up in time for the start of the 2009 season. Cutting it a little bit close it seems.

And of course, Jerry Reese was still their ranting and raving: "Major League Baseball is coming to Charlotte, whether you want to accept it or not. It may not come to uptown, but plenty of cities and counties in the Charlotte region would be happy to have a major-league stadium."

[dubone]

I'm fairly confident that Reese's case will be tossed, as the bond money isn't being used for baseball. That was the only stipulation in the referendum, not that the county couldn't work with baseball ever.

Good luck to RalDurChapBurlingGreensWinsHighSalisStatesvilleburyPointtonborotonelHillhameigh on their MLB team. We here in Charlotte, know an MLB team wouldn't be successful here for another decade.

Also, I love that opponents are calling that infrastructure 'paying for baseball' and all that. Streets and sidewalks are basic thing that local government provides everywhere! Meanwhile, these streets and sidewalks are part of the big plan to support all the development going into S Tryon and 3rd Ward. Baseball doesn't really need but one thing thing to be done, closing 3rd, and restriping 4th and Mint to accommodate. But the other things are being done for the good of the city/county at the only practical time to do them, when they are being torn up for a development. These street and sidewalk changes will benefit significant numbers of commuters and downtown residents and visitors that may never go to a baseball game. They are public responsibilities anyway. All that needed to be done was speed those changes up from a slow trickle over the coming decades. But if the Knights are fronting the money, and getting paid back with a trickle, then that is even more of a benefit to the public.

[uptownliving]

LOL...good ole Jerry Rease. He presented a "new" park plan at the meeting last night...Saying the County could keep the current site. Tear down the Duke Power parking deck it doesn't own and put it underground with a park on top. And then a linear park could be created all the way up 3rd to Tryon St. Of course Jerry didn't offer a way for the County to pay for his idea...just that it was superior to anything else out there. A little late to be talking about grand plans especially when you have no funding to back it up.

[Charlotte_native]

LOL...good ole Jerry Rease. He presented a "new" park plan at the meeting last night...Saying the County could keep the current site. Tear down the Duke Power parking deck it doesn't own and put it underground with a park on top. And then a linear park could be created all the way up 3rd to Tryon St. Of course Jerry didn't offer a way for the County to pay for his idea...just that it was superior to anything else out there. A little late to be talking about grand plans especially when you have no funding to back it up.

[dubone]

I'm drawing up a plan to put an Olympic Village at Trade and Tryon. With Olympics coming here in 2020, we'll need to put the Olympics in the heart of the city. I'll be needing $10-20 Billion to take out the buildings on each block fronting the Trade and Tryon intersection. I will also need funds to make a large traffic circle, a la Arc de Triomphe, around the Olympic village.

Whether we like it or not, the Olympics are coming to this area, and we don't want RalDurChapBurlingGreensWinsHighSalisStatesvilleburyPointtonborotonelHillhameigh to get it, do we? By turning this plan down, you are turning down the Olympics! LISTEN TO ME DAMMIT! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! I'M GETTING A LAWYER! HOW DARE YOU TURN ME DOWN!