Norfolk Light Rail and Transit

[jbhay]

I'd never pay a premium to live near the rail line, if anything you should get a discount.

I like trains as much as the next white male, but I'm realistic about it. Sure, it'd be *GREAT* if everyone rides the thing so I get the roads to myself, but I think others probably have the same opinion.

Are there example cities you could point to where paying a 'premium' is in place? I agree with your discount stance; would obviously persuade people to live in TOD and thus make light rail successful, but whose to say they will ride it once they live there. Can't force people on the train, but charging for parking spaces may help?

The way Hampton Roads is laid out, a key to making light rail successful would be to effectively boost the funding for bus transit. I'm sure some of you have heard of Bogota, Colombia's TransMilenio. Highly successful bus system that has feeder buses to bring people to the main transit system. I can hear the complaints now, about riding somewhere to ride somewhere, but the options are limited when it comes to methods of getting people to ride the Tide who aren't in walking distance to the lines. Thanks sprawl.

[virginia pe]

The way Hampton Roads is laid out, a key to making light rail successful would be to effectively boost the funding for bus transit. I'm sure some of you have heard of Bogota, Colombia's TransMilenio. Highly successful bus system that has feeder buses to bring people to the main transit system. I can hear the complaints now, about riding somewhere to ride somewhere, but the options are limited when it comes to methods of getting people to ride the Tide who aren't in walking distance to the lines. Thanks sprawl.

Although HRT doesn't talk about it yet, they already have plans in place to re-design all of their bus routes in the areas served by light rail. Once LRT is in place, there is no need for buses to run east-west along I-264. The busses will run north-south to transport people to the LRT stations.

[varider]

Busses need to start running later, more frequently, and have better connections. Most busses run every 30 minutes to an hour. That is unacceptable. Currently about 1.5 million people ride HRT each month. Imagine how much more would ride if it were more convenient. In a dream world, HRT busses and trains would run every 5-10 minutes. I bet ridership would double.

Edited July 9, 2009 by varider

[Telmnstr]

Wrong. The state is kicking in $20M of the cost.

So? It's still overpaying for an asset, using money which doesn't exist. Our nation is in debt enough as it is.

[Telmnstr]

Are there example cities you could point to where paying a 'premium' is in place? I agree with your discount stance; would obviously persuade people to live in TOD and thus make light rail successful, but whose to say they will ride it once they live there. Can't force people on the train, but charging for parking spaces may help?

The way Hampton Roads is laid out, a key to making light rail successful would be to effectively boost the funding for bus transit. I'm sure some of you have heard of Bogota, Colombia's TransMilenio. Highly successful bus system that has feeder buses to bring people to the main transit system. I can hear the complaints now, about riding somewhere to ride somewhere, but the options are limited when it comes to methods of getting people to ride the Tide who aren't in walking distance to the lines. Thanks sprawl.

I was wondering if maybe light rail isn't going to be useful in preparing people for the decline of their living standards. People might loose cars and the ability to afford them, as the jobs vanish from the corporate greed and mismanagement of the country.

I can't point to anything. I know others have stood up with examples where these light rail lines were built and no one rides them. I also see comparisons to places which we are not. People point to places like Portland which is full of new age hippy types, and lots of heroin addicted homeless kids. So light rail might work there. But this isn't there.

In America's history isn't ownership of land considered wealth and power? All these urbanite people buying condos and crap at price premiums where they own zero land.

You all saw the MIT stuff right? Nano grooves cut into the lithium ion battery material. 35 fold increase in recharge time. Now the limiting factor of charging electric vehicles is the 200 amp service coming to the residential house. Recharge your car in the time that it takes to fill a tank full of gas. Time to market is < 2 years. When there is demand for electric vehicles technology will take off.

[Telmnstr]

Engine Engine Number Nine, on the New York Tranist Line, If my train goes off the track pick it up pick it up pick it up.....

Some older overweight security guy said I couldn't be in there as it's private property or something. I didn't raise a fuss, I had my pictures. Should of made up a story that my dad owns the prime contractor, just to mess with the guy :-) That or debate that it's a public street in the city. Regardless, there wasn't any "no trespassing" signs that I saw and the end of the area facing york was wide open.

Are there going to be two sets of rails?

Larger versions on my flickr.

[varider]

Are there going to be two sets of rails?

Larger versions on my flickr.

Great pictures! Yes, the whole line is double tracked.

[varider]

http://hamptonroads.com/2009/07/light-rail...et-could-change

With light rail set to run through the city late next year, Norfolk and transit leaders are evaluating what role the free NET shuttle service will play in moving people around town.

The NET bus is a downtown circulator that now runs close to where light rail is being built.

Possibilities for the NET's future include extending the downtown service into Ghent, reducing or eliminating weekend service downtown, and moving from free to charging a small fee. The options were discussed Tuesday at the City Council's transportation committee.

"I think the role of the NET is changing," City Manager Regina V.K. Williams said.

The NET turned 10 earlier this year. Mayor Paul Fraim suggested contacting NET riders as well as business leaders from downtown and Ghent to hear what they want from the service and whether they'd be willing to pay a fare. He offered a 25-cent fee as a starting point for discussion.

[ronsmytheiii]

Great pictures! Yes, the whole line is double tracked.

Didnt look that way here:

http://picasaweb.google.com/ronsmytheiii/S...425241410194306

[ronsmytheiii]

and also driving by the Newtown park and ride location, the last house was demolished, now all is left is the Moose lodge:

[johnk812]

Do you really think it's going to be that big of a deal? I'm not excited about the train. The *only* benefit I could see is being able to ride it to the oceanfront to go to flipper mccoys, and then the benefit is just avoiding the lack of parking at the oceanfront. Then again, given a big enough place I could just build my own personal arcade of decent size.

I'd never pay a premium to live near the rail line, if anything you should get a discount.

I like trains as much as the next white male, but I'm realistic about it. Sure, it'd be *GREAT* if everyone rides the thing so I get the roads to myself, but I think others probably have the same opinion.

It's not like the train is going to take people from $120K jobs to $500K condos.

I still say we all chip in and pay like 100 homeless people to hang out on it on the opening days.

Wow! You are just delightful!

[Telmnstr]

Wow! You are just delightful!

There has to be a contrarian voice here. These forum folks would let the city councils give the taxpayers money straight to the developers in bulk to build them a skyline :-)

ohhh yea BTW:

----------------------------

Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 5:07 PM

To: 'Downtown Norfolk Civic League'

Subject: FW: Kirn library time capsule

NEWS RELEASE

3400 Victoria Blvd. Hampton, VA 23661

Ph: (757) 222-6000 Fx: (757) 222-6195

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Contact: Tom Holden, Public Affairs Manager

July 15, 2009 Office: 757-222-6183; Cell: 757-676-2616

Time Capsule Found At Kirn Library!

Opening planned for 11 a.m. Thursday

Norfolk, Va. - A time capsule has been found during the demolition of

the Kirn Memorial Library, and it will be opened at 11 a.m. Thursday,

July 16, to find out whats inside.

The object was sealed in a concrete vault on May 18, 1962 and buried

on the library grounds at the corner of City Hall Avenue and Bank

Street. Demolition crews for S. B. Cox Inc. found the container amid

ivy and bushes while tearing down the building to make way for a

light rail station.

The vault, which was marked with a metal plaque, was opened Wednesday

afternoon and a sealed, stainless steel box was found inside. The box

was removed and will be held in the library overnight.

The metal box will be placed on a table on the sidewalk in front of

the new Norfolk Main Library, 235 E. Plume St., on Thursday and

opened.

Edited July 16, 2009 by Telmnstr

[mlsimons]

http://hamptonroads.com/2009/07/light-rail...et-could-change

Ok, so there is this fella who's always posting comments on the pilot who I always disagree with, but this time he goes on a wild tangent about how the free NET should be tossed...so I had to post his comment and my reply...

Submitted by Wm D Tabor DDS on Wed, 07/15/2009 at 11:34 am.

Of course they should all be scrapped. Nothing should be continued beyond a possible start-up period if it must be subsidized.

Every subsidy is a bribe to get someone to do a thing a rational person would not do. If people had to pay the true cost of using transit, they would not. When we bribe people to do irrational things, each irrational act invisibly reduces the efficiency of the marketplace, degrading overall prosperity.

The benefits of a subsidized transit system are very visible, but the much larger harm is more hidden, in the form of shifted costs, lost opportunities (think what the money spent on light rail could have done elsewhere) and mis-allocated resources. Further, a subsidized public system precludes a more efficient private sector alternative which might otherwise arise. As a general rule, all subsidies and incentives do more harm than good when fully examined for externalities.

My response:

"RADICAL RIGHT WING PHILOSOPHY

Submitted by mlsimons on Fri, 07/17/2009 at 1:26 pm.

Wow Doc, maybe you're right, everything that's subsidized we should cut off or charged so that they break even...so lets lock all public bathrooms in the city and put a $2 charge at the door in order to enter, how bout the interstates, we can put tolls on all entrance ramps to ensure everyone pays their way, cause Lord knows those things aren't cheap...how bout putting a toll on the sidewalk in front of my home, I only want people who can afford to live in my neighborhood able to walk on my sidewalk so lets make the toll quite high. I'm sorry but your radical philosophy on subsidized=evil is not supported by any textbooks or modern economic literature. Every American city offers public transit b/c its discriminatory and counterproductive to not. Its saying, "only those with enough money to drive are allowed to have access to jobs." Or let me rephrase: "ONLY THOSE WHO HAVE MONEY TO WORK ARE ALLOWED TO WORK"...railing against public transportation is the most elitist right-wing stance to take, you should know better especially working in a major metropolitan area like Norfolk."

[vdogg]

Those are really great pics Tel and yes, light rail will be double tracked for the entire length of the project.

[varider]

This is from 2004, I guess when HRT was searching for federal funding for LRT..

http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geu8Hsq2xKXzwB...lk_LRT_2006.doc

Here's something I found different than many estimates for employment in downtown norfolk.

[CaveMaN]

Larger: Here!

Larger: Here!

[ronsmytheiii]

The Military Highway access road will close from Curlew Drive to Sellger Drive as early as today and continue through Oct. 2 for light-rail construction.

Motorists are encouraged to use Corporate Boulevard or Kidd Boulevard as alternative routes.

Traffic will be reduced to one lane in each direction on Boush Street between Freemason and Bute streets beginning as early as today for about two weeks.

Crews will work to relocate utilities in preparation for light-rail construction.

http://hamptonroads.com/2009/08/one-norfol...educed-one-lane

[Telmnstr]

So will the light rail cars have water wings? Or free snorkels for all the passengers?

Bwahaha

[jbhay]

Wow. I did not think of this.

Hopefully all these utility projects where they're tearing up the roads are addressing this problem and upgrading downtown's drainage issues.

If not, light rail may have some problems on a rainy day.

The pictures of the flash floods on pilotonline.com today depicted unfortunate scenes like the ones posted above. Something definitely needs to be done about that.

[varider]

It would have been cool if they could have built the light rail underground from Monticello to Harbor Park. If light rail was up and running, that flooding could have ruined the LRV's and shut down transit service which would be horrible for people riding it that were trying to get home after a long day at work

Edited August 13, 2009 by varider

[ronsmytheiii]

shut down transit service which would be horrible for people riding it that were trying to get home after a long day at work

how was that different from yesterday?

Only the disney monorail could have run in that, or perhaps the ferries....

Edited August 13, 2009 by ronsmytheiii

[Telmnstr]

I saw someone ask HRT about the flooding that occours on York Street, and the fact that the train tracks are at street level. The response from HRT was they will just stop running service.

[varider]

^ Now that would be retarded. Your telling me in 25 years when 50,000+ ride rail in HR, it could be shut down because of a thunderstorm? There has to be a solution.

[vdogg]

^ Now that would be retarded. Your telling me in 25 years when 50,000+ ride rail in HR, it could be shut down because of a thunderstorm? There has to be a solution.

Actually, that is the only option with service at grade through a flood zone. They could have elevated it, but that would've added substantially to the cost.

[CaveMaN]

Hopefully all these utility projects where they're tearing up the roads are addressing this problem and upgrading downtown's drainage issues.

If not, light rail may have some problems on a rainy day.

They're upgrading utilities, meaning water, sanitary sewer, and sewer force mains. They haven't altered any of the storm drainage piping along the rail path I don't think, at least in the downtown itself.

I don't really see the huge issue with this type of flooding, it's bound to happen here at some point... people should plan for it and act accordingly, meaning dont park your vehicle in a spot you know is prone to flooding, and don't drive through 10' of water in a sedan... This is kinda what we should come to expect from living at 8 feet above sea level in an area that was historically marshland. There's just nowhere for all the runoff to go when it comes down at that high of a rate...

If you were downtown during it you would have seen water shooting up through all the storm drain structures because the flow in the pipes was just too high. I think we were lucky that there wasnt a strong southwest wind & an incredibly high tide...combine those factors with a high rainfall intensity, and that's when serious issues happen.

York Street looked pretty bad, brambleton had a lake on it, and Boush street was a warzone...took me over an hour to get home...from waterside drive! I enjoyed watching it from my balcony though once I got home...brambleton was an utter mess-